[X] Bless Petitioner for Sacrifices - Expend some of your DE to empower those who come to your shrine or pray to you in exchange for more offerings. Current Skills that can be blessed: Astrology.
-[X] Expend 5 DE on petitioners
[X] Calm Waters - You calm the waves and direct the currents for those under your care, ensuring the boats that travel your surface are safe and see greater success in their endeavors. Costs: 5 DE
If you need a craft or art you do not have for a multi-skill project, you have to negotiate with someone who does to complete it. Perform is actually a social-fu. The more perform skills you learn, the more likely you are to have a second skill bonus applied to your interactions, and the less likely the other spirit is to have the same benefit. A theoretically all-perform and awe spirit could at least convince any other spirit (nay, practically any other living creature) to have a child with it. They would, of course, suck terribly at everything else and have to near-constantly commune with other spirits for protection or punishments, but that's sort of the price you pay for being Aphrodite (if my Greek myth isn't too rusty, I do believe Aphrodite did just that several times, using her charms to convince other gods to punish mortals she didn't like).
Though I assume occupying all his shrines would be much harder now? Or is that a textbook case of "His compels forced him to continue past the point where he should have given up"
It was partly the FT's compulsions, partly the dangerously straightforward awe contest rules. A smarter FT would, after being rebuffed (or thinking ahead, before being rebuffed) present Harzi with a crafted gift, which would twist the situation around some to favor FT more, rather than stupidly initiating a physical confrontation where he could lose it all.
A trickster or capricious spirit, even as a member of a pantheon, could ignore the rules and initiate fights freely for the purpose of crippling others, but most spirits can't start a fight with the head of the pantheon unless the head of the pantheon starts it first.
In any situation where two spirits use mortal combat to fight for dominance and one of them is dispersed, there is an opportunity for the winner to smash one or two shrines, depending on how lucky they are, how far away the other guy's shrines are, and how stiff mortal opposition is. If the 'dragon' only has one shrine, protected by naught but nature, then it's shit out of luck if the 'cultural hero' can reach it and win a final check to desecrate against the dispersed dragon.
If you need a craft or art you do not have for a multi-skill project, you have to negotiate with someone who does to complete it. Perform is actually a social-fu. The more perform skills you learn, the more likely you are to have a second skill bonus applied to your interactions, and the less likely the other spirit is to have the same benefit. A theoretically all-perform and awe spirit could at least convince any other spirit (nay, practically any other living creature) to have a child with it. They would, of course, suck terribly at everything else and have to near-constantly commune with other spirits for protection or punishments, but that's sort of the price you pay for being Aphrodite (if my Greek myth isn't too rusty, I do believe Aphrodite did just that several times, using her charms to convince other gods to punish mortals she didn't like).
What reasons are there to pick a Performance Skill besides Awe for your first? Is Perform(X) more useful for non-spirit interactions than plain Awe is?
You can choose to break engagement, but if the other spirit isn't amenable to it you'll have to convince them to hear you out. You can take advantage of compulsions to force them to go to social-fu, so there's a fair number of ways for the enterprising Loki not to get stabbed in the throat when he gets stuck in a fight he can't win.
What reasons are there to pick a Performance Skill besides Awe for your first? Is Perform(X) more useful for non-spirit interactions than plain Awe is?
Performance is a tool used in non-violent (rarely it can be used for violent encounters) tests of dominance and as an opening check in negotiation, alongside Awe. Even if a spirit has Awe 10, both spirits will add one performance skill the other spirit does not have to their check, with a fallback of 'spirit with the highest mutual perform gets to add half of theirs' (this means if you have more performs and more points in performs, you're more likely to win dominance checks and get an edge in negotiations).
Awe is used in a wider variety of encounters regarding legend gain, awesome display DE gain, and a cowing advantage in violent encounters.
Some performs have other uses that are situational to their type (you will recall instrument performs could be used to create magic), but all social performance skills are useful when engaging non-violently with other spirits. Whether your dance is tailored to seduce, or your song is a rhyme describing your friendship with your trading partner, it will be useful to impress the other side.
Unless, of course, the other side can do what you can do, too (can't use performs you have in common). Singing a masterful love song isn't as impressive to that spirit with the resounding baritone who could craft a song of equal beauty, and an exhibition dance only garners appraisal, not enchantment, from an equally accomplished dancer.
EDIT: Almost forgot, Awe does have one issue. It makes it harder to lead larger pantheons.
Fights that drag on for more than a set number of rounds or reach certain conditions lead to votes on how to continue, though depending on your spirit's personality it may automatically press for parley as early as it's first taken wound. If you've planned an attack, you can set a number of situations to broach parley in. If your spirit is especially devious, you may be offered the chance to be dishonorable and sucker punch the other guy if you can get the parley to work.
You certainly won't be the only trickster god in the wide world, though you may encounter spirits who are naturally peaceful that will broach the topic very quickly. You may be the only trickster you see for a while, but pacifist spirits are a possibility.
He fought a one-two-32/8ths-manwoman war against a god two godsa pantheon and ended up at the point where just meeting him and not being summarily obliterated was considered a legendary feat. He scared the hell out of people who who had never even heard of him.
Y'all remember the days when we hesitated to have Harzey win a critical battle by picking up Inferno because it might make him a little crazy? Hah hah- *sob*
[X] Roil Waters - You bend the waters to your command against your enemies, sending larger waves at the settlement near you, or creating deadly sprays and whirlpools that will capsize any boat they dare put upon the surface of your waters. Costs: 5 DE
[X] Calm Waters - You calm the wavesand direct the currents for those under your care, ensuring the boats that travelyour surface are safe and see greatersuccess in their endeavors. Costs: 5 DE
Perform is actually a social-fu. The more perform skills you learn, the more likely you are to have a second skill bonus applied to your interactions, and the less likely the other spirit is to have the same benefit. A theoretically all-perform and awe spirit could at least convince any other spirit (nay, practically any other living creature) to have a child with it. They would, of course, suck terribly at everything else and have to near-constantly commune with other spirits for protection or punishments, but that's sort of the price you pay for being Aphrodite (if my Greek myth isn't too rusty, I do believe Aphrodite did just that several times, using her charms to convince other gods to punish mortals she didn't like).
A trickster or capricious spirit, even as a member of a pantheon, could ignore the rules and initiate fights freely for the purpose of crippling others, but most spirits can't start a fight with the head of the pantheon unless the head of the pantheon starts it first.
Hmm, capricious spirit meaning Spirit of the Wild(known), dualistic Fear/Faith spirits(known), suspicious animal aspects(known, snake) shapeshifter(theory), insanity aspects(theory) and I'd theorize an achievement unlock title?
To be the rule breaker and violator of norms is a powerful role, but they don't usually do well. Aside from a certain Monkey.
So I'd guess along the way there we'd need to pay expensively to do rule breakings, until we reach the end of the chain and the price is being an inherently taboo spirit.
In any situation where two spirits use mortal combat to fight for dominance and one of them is dispersed, there is an opportunity for the winner to smash one or two shrines, depending on how lucky they are, how far away the other guy's shrines are, and how stiff mortal opposition is. If the 'dragon' only has one shrine, protected by naught but nature, then it's shit out of luck if the 'cultural hero' can reach it and win a final check to desecrate against the dispersed dragon.
You can choose to break engagement, but if the other spirit isn't amenable to it you'll have to convince them to hear you out. You can take advantage of compulsions to force them to go to social-fu, so there's a fair number of ways for the enterprising Loki not to get stabbed in the throat when he gets stuck in a fight he can't win.
Classic battle of wits. Tricky to provoke for a spirit, since we'd need to figure out their point of view and then exploit it while still true to our own compels.
Dangerous road, especially considering Loki's final flyte.
Performance is a tool used in non-violent (rarely it can be used for violent encounters) tests of dominance and as an opening check in negotiation, alongside Awe. Even if a spirit has Awe 10, both spirits will add one performance skill the other spirit does not have to their check, with a fallback of 'spirit with the highest mutual perform gets to add half of theirs' (this means if you have more performs and more points in performs, you're more likely to win dominance checks and get an edge in negotiations).
Nifty, so I'm guessiing Innovators could 'cheat' at this by inventing new instruments and learning them(discarding older music forms to clear out slots) to always have the advantage?
Hmm, important question: Do other skills have the ability to augment legend gain? Using poetry, art or dance to boast about your accomplishments seem like they might help, if not necessarily as kickass as Awe.
Or could it go like:
1) Do awesome thing.
2) Roll Awe for Legend.
3) Compose song/dance/art about awesome thing.
4) Roll Awe for Legend for the act of significant creation.
If it does work like that I wonder if a pure performance spirit might rent their services out to other spirits, to make art or music of their achievements so they get a second awe roll, and mooching off the Legend gain on the art for the artist.
[X] Roil Waters - You bend the waters to your command against your enemies, sending larger waves at the settlement near you, or creating deadly sprays and whirlpools that will capsize any boat they dare put upon thesurface of your waters. Costs: 5 DE
[X] Calm Waters - You calm the waves and direct the currents for those under your care, ensuring the boats that travel your surface are safe and see greater success intheir endeavors. Costs: 5 DE
Okay, so, having heard more about it I do hope that we can do some Performance eventually.
I'm not sure what the logic is behind doing both at the same time? I mean, for one that costs all of our DE, and for two...what exactly do we gain from it? I mean, they already fear us, it says so in the start, and so we should establish ourselves as actually being able to help people.
@Powerofmind , what would that vote even look like, mechanically?
Went back and read some of the stuff from Amber Age in preparation for an Omake idea i had, and a few things come to mind:
1. Holy shit i forgot how good the writing was; so congrats @Academia Nut even months afterwards that quest can make me completely forget about the class i'm supposed to be paying attention to
2. @Powerofmind a few questions:
-Is the non-inherent trait cap just 1 + shrine, like the skill cap?
-Assuming this isn't too spoilery since you said we'd learn those mechanics over time, would Harzivan have picked up any extra inherent traits by the end if AA used your new system? ...actually, Harzivan didn't even start with any traits, i dont think...hmmm...
-Would you be willing to share the success/modifier mechanics? I remember those being hidden in AA and going over some of the updates looking at all the rolls (especially contested ones) to try to figure out how much each skill added and what the thresholds for success levels were
-Assuming i manage to get this omake i have in mind written before Thanksgiving break distracts me, do you intend to index any omakes yourself or would you like me to manage an omake list like i did for AA?
Edit: forgot a question i had: Again assuming its not too much of a spoiler, how will you be handling combined elemental traits, as well as the odd traits like Automatic <x>, personal inspiration, and dual avatar, as far as the trait line limit goes?
Okay, so, having heard more about it I do hope that we can do some Performance eventually.
I'm not sure what the logic is behind doing both at the same time? I mean, for one that costs all of our DE, and for two...what exactly do we gain from it? I mean, they already fear us, it says so in the start, and so we should establish ourselves as actually being able to help people.
@Powerofmind , what would that vote even look like, mechanically?
Already described earlier. We'd be roiling the waters to show our displeasure at those who fear us, and calming it for those who give offerings. Think protection racket. Pay up in worship and nobody will beat you up. Don't and you might wind up beaten up.
Basically, think of it this way: Calmed waters aren't very obvious on their own. People would largely be vaguely thankful but think little of it. Roiled waters would have people praying to alleviate it, but if we only pick Roil, we can't.
Already described earlier. We'd be roiling the waters to show our displeasure at those who fear us, and calming it for those who give offerings. Think protection racket. Pay up in worship and nobody will beat you up. Don't and you might wind up beaten up.
Basically, think of it this way: Calmed waters aren't very obvious on their own. People would largely be vaguely thankful but think little of it. Roiled waters would have people praying to alleviate it, but if we only pick Roil, we can't.
After reading the discussion and giving the matter some thought, I've changed my vote to the roil/calm waters combo.
Currently we don't have any sort of real cult, meaning we need to do something highly visible to get things started. Since we don't have an avatar and can't communicate with the humans our options are limited. Stirring up the ocean and then visibly calming it down once the prayer gets flowing is pretty much the best "Hey, someone's here. Will calm ocean for prayer."-ad we can manage.
Currently we don't have any sort of real cult, meaning we need to do something highly visible to get things started. Since we don't have an avatar and can't communicate with the humans our options are limited. Stirring up the ocean and then visibly calming it down once the prayer gets flowing is pretty much the best "Hey, someone's here. Will calm ocean for prayer."-ad we can manage.
People, don't go too deep into the planning. We are a new spirit, who knows very little of humans and their weird ways. I propose we play it like a curious kid would, at least in the beginning. After that we'll see where things evolve.
Professional credit thief tends to annoy people. Zeus didn't go around claiming every little random happening in the world as his own or pose after every successful seduction, but lightning bolts are still freakin' cool.
Hmm, important question: Do other skills have the ability to augment legend gain? Using poetry, art or dance to boast about your accomplishments seem like they might help, if not necessarily as kickass as Awe.
Some skills do consolidate or upgrade, and there are limited means of increasing your cap, the easiest (and the one you'll avoid the longest) of which is raising Tier.
Okay, so, having heard more about it I do hope that we can do some Performance eventually.
I'm not sure what the logic is behind doing both at the same time? I mean, for one that costs all of our DE, and for two...what exactly do we gain from it? I mean, they already fear us, it says so in the start, and so we should establish ourselves as actually being able to help people.
@Powerofmind , what would that vote even look like, mechanically?
Experimentation and capriciousness. Even if it goes over especially poorly, it will, at least, look like you are a mischief spirit or fickle spirit who requires appeasement.
Went back and read some of the stuff from Amber Age in preparation for an Omake idea i had, and a few things come to mind:
1. Holy shit i forgot how good the writing was; so congrats @Academia Nut even months afterwards that quest can make me completely forget about the class i'm supposed to be paying attention to
2. @Powerofmind a few questions:
-Is the non-inherent trait cap just 1 + shrine, like the skill cap?
-Assuming this isn't too spoilery since you said we'd learn those mechanics over time, would Harzivan have picked up any extra inherent traits by the end if AA used your new system? ...actually, Harzivan didn't even start with any traits, i dont think...hmmm...
-Would you be willing to share the success/modifier mechanics? I remember those being hidden in AA and going over some of the updates looking at all the rolls (especially contested ones) to try to figure out how much each skill added and what the thresholds for success levels were
-Assuming i manage to get this omake i have in mind written before Thanksgiving break distracts me, do you intend to index any omakes yourself or would you like me to manage an omake list like i did for AA?
Edit: forgot a question i had: Again assuming its not too much of a spoiler, how will you be handling combined elemental traits, as well as the odd traits like Automatic <x>, personal inspiration, and dual avatar, as far as the trait line limit goes?
1. I know, right? I occasionally distracted myself reading over old posts to find exploitables to patch up.
2.
-No, and that's not exactly the skill cap either.
-There are means of acquiring more inherent traits. Harzivan... almost definitely would have picked up at least one or two. Inherent traits supercharge a particular traits' effect on a spirit's actions and form, so even if you develop a ritual that gives you inherent traits, you can't add too many before they start crowding you with compulsive behavior, or worse, contradictions.
-I will note that I like exploding dice. As long as you're not rolling huge heaps of dice, 20's will explode for most everything. When the number of dice you've got for a particular action goes too high, I'll switch off to actions that only roll two or three times at most. I use a % DC system, so 80% success, 60% success, etc. if you have to do better than the bottom 20%, that means your roll has to be greater than or equal to 6 (a roll of at least 6 occurs 77% of the time on 2d10, inside the 80% success range). I won't get especially specific with skill values and modifiers, but basically unless you have an excellency, you will not auto-success most actions of moderate difficulty even with skill 10.
I intend to handle indexing myself in the Amberpedia.
Any trait that remains on your character sheet counts against your trait limit unless it's marked inherent. Additional Avatar X is written in one time, so regardless of giving you 11 avatars, it only costs 1 trait. All chimeric body traits are considered additional elements of chimera, and so are not considered 'traits' in a normal sense. Elemental affinities and combined affinities are all individual traits. You can't be god of the sea, the sky, the sun, the moon, all the individual colors of the rainbow and the rainbow, the earth, stone, gems, fire, volcanoes, wind, storms, rain, ice, snow, etc., etc. at the same time. Automatics I'm on the fence even including. They were partly responsible for the near-geometric appearance of Harzivan's growth in the middle and near the end, and with the increased appeal of strategic discounting, the incentive to get them isn't as large as before. I may include some extra type of 'dream' trait that has an effect on the outside world during quiescence, but I'm not committed to that yet.
And it's past 4 because I was responding to stuff! Locked!
Vote tally: ##### 3.21
[X] Calm Waters - You calm the waves and direct the currents for those under your care, ensuring the boats that travel your surface are safe and see greater success in their endeavors. Costs: 5 DE
[X] Bless Petitioner for Sacrifices - Expend some of your DE to empower those who come to your shrine or pray to you in exchange for more offerings. Current Skills that can be blessed: Astrology.
-[x] Expend 2 DE on petitioners No. of votes: 2 MrGazzer, nixter
[X] Roil Waters - You bend the waters to your command against your enemies, sending larger waves at the settlement near you, or creating deadly sprays and whirlpools that will capsize any boat they dare put upon the surface of your waters. Costs: 5 DE No. of votes: 1 sidestory
[X] Inspire Petitioner
[X] Roil Waters No. of votes: 2 Van Ropen, egexxx
[X] Bless Petitioner for Sacrifices - Expend some of your DE to empower those who come to your shrine or pray to you in exchange for more offerings. Current Skills that can be blessed: Astrology.
-[X] Expend 4 DE on petitioners
[X] Calm Waters - You calm the waves and direct the currents for those under your care, ensuring the boats that travel your surface are safe and see greater success in their endeavors. Costs: 5 DE No. of votes: 6 Dirk93, notanautomaton, codeRR, Downstreamer, paintedspear, Erehwon
[X] Bless Petitioner for Sacrifices - Expend some of your DE to empower those who come to your shrine or pray to you in exchange for more offerings. Current Skills that can be blessed: Astrology.
-[X] Expend 5 DE on petitioners
[X] Calm Waters - You calm the waves and direct the currents for those under your care, ensuring the boats that travel your surface are safe and see greater success in their endeavors. Costs: 5 DE No. of votes: 14 Abby Normal, Olgol2, masterofmadness, pheonix89, Kingofbooks, Void Stalker, Walkin' Man, kyuden, Shard, PrimalShadow, Edkose, Arbit, Ando Owen, Darkcrest
[X] Calm Waters - You calm the waves and direct the currents for those under your care, ensuring the boats that travel your surface are safe and see greater success in their endeavors. Costs: 5 DE No. of votes: 1 The Laurent
And Roil/Calm wins with 24 votes. Even if all the disparate blessing votes were counted together, that's still ahead. I can confidently say this is a majority win.
[X] Roil Waters - You bend the waters to your command against your enemies, sending larger waves at the settlement near you, or creating deadly sprays and whirlpools that will capsize any boat they dare put upon the surface of your waters. Costs: 5 DE
[X] Calm Waters - You calm the waves and direct the currents for those under your care, ensuring the boats that travel your surface are safe and see greater success in their endeavors. Costs: 5 DE
Which first?
10 - Both at once!
Roil
5
Calm
13
Do something cool?
4
Something happened...
Response of the People
11
Chance for additional event, become especially wary of you
Something curious occurs?
10!+10!+10!+3! = 33!
Well then.
You opt to learn, rather than decide whether magnanimity or jealousy are good or bad without testing. The first thing you do is channel the waves and currents, playing with the wooden things by pushing and pulling them about apart from the peoples' efforts to direct them, or otherwise completely deadening the waters around your holy place, making it exceedingly difficult to move the wooden things. Aside from the entertaining noises the people make, you enjoy this game for the small bursts of energy you receive as they flit about their wooden things and gesticulate by the rocky shore.
You swiftly discover the name for the wooden things; boats, from the way the people say their words. They are boats! You feel exceedingly clever at the discovery.
As the moons wax and wane, your experiments continue. You try to hit one of the boats to your rocks, but your efforts to rile the waves aren't great enough. Despite that, you still feel more refreshed from the act than you were before you'd done it. Curiouser and curiouser.
You give up on sinking the boats, but, biding your time, cleverly buck one badly enough that a person falls into your shoal! Their head swiftly strikes a stone, and they stop moving, floating limp on the water. Nearby, on the shore, another person wails and tries to wade into the sea before several others restrain them. You see another liquid taint your waters, and recognize it from the fish-eating fish. Blood. Humans also bleed! How novel!
Still curious as to how this will play out, you halt the currents around the limp person, allowing the boat to get close enough that the people inside can lift it out. They return it to the wailing one, but from your vantage, you don't see it start to move again. A great deal of energy passes to you for a time after the act, but the boats now carefully avoid your shoal, where your power is greatest.
Maybe you're done experimenting for a while.
Your next act comes much later, during the Long Night. With the moon full to bursting, you stretch your powers as far as they will go to calm the straits. You call the waves to heel and the currents to rest until all the waters under your domain are perfect and still. You feel an energy, different from when you'd played with the people, as the night sky and the moon are reflected perfectly on the surface, filling even the sea with stars and a second moon. You lose yourself in trying to decipher it...
And then the wailing person is standing at the water's edge, babbling loudly and throwing off others as it comes closer. In a burst of motion, it leaps into the shoal, and swims towards something you know is at your center, at the bottom of your Holy Place.
[] Push it back out. The last person who entered your shoals so deeply died. You hadn't meant to do that, you should stop this one before they also die!
[] Kill it. The last person who entered your shoals died, and you will help this one along. Maybe you'll garner more energy from this one's death as well?
[] Let it closer. Your waters have free floating ice, and are terribly cold during the Long Night. Even the natural life here is scarce. What drives this person so?
This is an event (a considerably rarer event than I ever thought you might get so soon, but que sera, sera). Choosing one path prevents the others from being explored, and this early in your spirit's development, each of these paths can have a powerful, lasting effect.
