The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up

Investigate the Sea?

  • Yes

    Votes: 592 80.3%
  • No

    Votes: 145 19.7%

  • Total voters
    737
Technique for getting some? We have those Goliath ships. They sip at suns.
That's just plasma, this is something we've been told several times is "essence."

We don't know what it is, I already stated my belief that it was the C'tan's original food.

At the moment our only means of getting some is to use the technique to create Solis Oblitaum, which draws out some essence so it can be turned into plasma fuel.
 
I have come up with a great idea.

Ok, so Solis Obliatum is rare. Rare enough that powering reactors with them is impractical. But that's just the thing, it's just impractical, not impossible. If we really wanted to we theoretically could.

What if we used a Solis Obliatum reactor to power a Psychic Cannon? An anti-daemon weapon powered by anti-Chaos energy. It would be extraordinarily powerful, maybe enough to permakill particularly weak daemons outright. Given the expense of Solis Obliatum such a configuration would be one of a kind, but it'd be a hell of an ace in the hole.
 
40k, dude. Humanoid form works in 40k just fine. And prepare to be very surprised, for I will now show you the only known Dark Age Titan.
Castigator - Warhammer 40k - Lexicanum
That was one unique and weird.

It might be a property of the 40k physics that humanoid walkers make sense, but I find it far more likely that Titans effectiveness is in large part a result of Mechanicus faith.

Even if DAoT design were more humanoid (for some reason), they were certainly not as humanoid as it is possible to make them. The Link is what makes psy titans so powerful compared to mundanes, losing some on base performance or cost to maximize it seems very likely to be worth it to me.

What low hanging fruits?
Oh dear, where to begin...

Avalanche Shrub looks perfect for surface mining, and very easily controlled (just kill the shrub, and all of it goes), so should be OK to export.
Camo Crocs for camouflage research and to lessen our losses to them by learning to counter it (Giant Mosquitos can do that easy).
Razorgrass could result in fields that infantry can't pass without a lot of of work and firepower, in which PA troops should be able to move easily. Excellent against the Orcs.
Ammut Crocodiles eat the souls of our people, so we really should research them for better counters.

And that's from just few of a regions info posts. Not all of them or even any Omakes.

Edit: Also aren't there those void creatures that feed on stars to research?

And it costs us nothing to not be a bitch about this, we get progress towards a favour equally if we ask or don't ask, if anything we'll get more for not being a stingy asshole and just going for it.

Being generous has been turning out to be really effective for us, I don't see any reason to stop.

And yes there's is probably something worse we could be getting information on, who is the patsy, what is it doing, information on the Destroyer's unique abilities all of these are potential options, but Ahra is the one with the least knows about him at the moment so he's got priority in my mind.
? What part of asking them what they need the most and giving it to them is any less generous then giving them what we think they need? I am pretty sure that its the other way around.

They know far more then us what is needed.

I agree that Ahra is likely a priority, but Eldar would know better then us, and there might well be something more important that we do not know about.

Somehow I doubt that a Titan they were researched for is going to interfere with the link, not to mention that there's zero indication that form is going to affect the connection

Knights are plenty humanoid, anyway.
We got a psy throne mechanicum, not any titans or knight titans it was meant for. If it was meant for any.

Hmm, I wonder if we could use it for psychic ECM warfare... let them taste some scrapcode for a change.
 
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It might be a property of the 40k physics that humanoid walkers make sense, but I find it far more likely that Titans effectiveness is in large part a result of Mechanicus faith.
It's really not Mechanicus faith. All 40k Titans are humanoid. Orks and Eldar are the only other Titan users and both are humanoid. Tau too if their Battlesuits count as Titans. It's just a 40k thing.
 
I have come up with a great idea.

Ok, so Solis Obliatum is rare. Rare enough that powering reactors with them is impractical. But that's just the thing, it's just impractical, not impossible. If we really wanted to we theoretically could.

What if we used a Solis Obliatum reactor to power a Psychic Cannon? An anti-daemon weapon powered by anti-Chaos energy. It would be extraordinarily powerful, maybe enough to permakill particularly weak daemons outright. Given the expense of Solis Obliatum such a configuration would be one of a kind, but it'd be a hell of an ace in the hole.
Mixing up different ill understood warp techs sounds like a terrible idea.

With fundementals, doable. But thats a long time away.

@Durin
1. Can the repair nanites be used on Hives, or be made to?
 
Its just not a good fit for us, augmentation research aside.
I'm curious, could you describe a society for which it would be ideal? I feel that you're just fundamentally opposed to TW so the fact you imply its the right fit for someone interests me.
What low hanging fruits?

The Illusion pines we're not using? The Carniflowers we're also not using what biologis research have we done in the area of actual biology have we done and has been overwhelmingly useful and useful so we could pass it onto the psykers for them to do?
I think the problem is that Biologis actions are fundamentally research actions, that means that usually we have to take further actions to implement it. Doing research now, before we start taking actions about how to best implement TW means that we don't have to worry about reworking the whole system after we've already implemented.
So I'd suggest that TW are actually a low hanging fruit, as any other research will add additional actions to our backlog to implement.
Now whether that means that its a good choice or a sour apple is a different question.
1) So would a 5 year old kept in statis for 40 years be an unacceptable candidate?
1b) What about if they were on a ship that got lost in the warp for a century?
 
It's really not Mechanicus faith. All 40k Titans are humanoid. Orks and Eldar are the only other Titan users and both are humanoid. Tau too if their Battlesuits count as Titans. It's just a 40k thing.
Orcs work due to WAAGH and are basically idols of their gods, Eldar Titans are Wraiths as I understand it, so they are piloted by Eldar soul(s?), and Battlesuits are overgrown Power Armor. "Powered Combat Exoskeletons" I believe wiki says.
 
I'm curious, could you describe a society for which it would be ideal? I feel that you're just fundamentally opposed to TW so the fact you imply its the right fit for someone interests me.

I think the problem is that Biologis actions are fundamentally research actions, that means that usually we have to take further actions to implement it. Doing research now, before we start taking actions about how to best implement TW means that we don't have to worry about reworking the whole system after we've already implemented.
So I'd suggest that TW are actually a low hanging fruit, as any other research will add additional actions to our backlog to implement.
Now whether that means that its a good choice or a sour apple is a different question.

1) So would a 5 year old kept in statis for 40 years be an unacceptable candidate?
1b) What about if they were on a ship that got lost in the warp for a century?
1. Subjective not objective, the issue is the byproducts from Juv Nat mess with the process, so anyone who has many can't go though it.
 
Mixing up different ill understood warp techs sounds like a terrible idea.
Only if you send it into battle without proper testing. Otherwise, if we stick the two pieces together and properly test it, it should be fine. Lack of proper understanding hasn't stopped the Mechanicus from whipping out awesome pieces of tech over the last 10k years so why stop now?

Like, yeah, might turn out to not work, but could also turn out to be perfectly safe. Just gotta test it.
 
I'm curious, could you describe a society for which it would be ideal? I feel that you're just fundamentally opposed to TW so the fact you imply its the right fit for someone interests me.
Callamus needs them badly. They have a great lack of SM grade elites, due to massive attrition. They will implement them extensively to allow their numbers to recover I believe.

Quartus will not, Secundus also won't.

So I'd suggest that TW are actually a low hanging fruit, as any other research will add additional actions to our backlog to implement.
The 12 year option that we have right now is to determine their strengths and weaknesses and make some prototypes. That's all. We would still need many years to set up production, training, doctrine, etc.
 
Only if you send it into battle without proper testing. Otherwise, if we stick the two pieces together and properly test it, it should be fine. Lack of proper understanding hasn't stopped the Mechanicus from whipping out awesome pieces of tech over the last 10k years so why stop now?

Like, yeah, might turn out to not work, but could also turn out to be perfectly safe. Just gotta test it.
By terrible idea I meant that it will almost certainly not work, get only minimal benefit even if it does, and I would bet on it blowing up. Like combining it with the Banishment Runes.

We need at least fundamentals of psychic cannon I believe. Feel free to ask Durin if you want to know what Tranth thinks.

Y4 - Implement Technology (Pulse Rifles): Planning
Could I interest you in this instead?
Djinn Skein Gladiatoria
This is an advanced virtual reality landscape into which vast numbers of people can be easily plugged in combination with a simulation rig that creates sensory feedback, physical stimuli etc. The result is one of the best training tools in existence, allowing for soldiers to gather combat experience in near total safety and for workers to be prepared for dangerous tasks.
Should benefit all of our forces. All of them. Also we do not yet know what the fundamentals of Impalers would allow, or the bonuses Heated Impalers might give.
 
Having done the maths I have concluded that it is significantly more worthwhile to do all 4 General Implement Tech immediately as opposed to 3 Implement Other, and have made the appropriate adjustments to my plan.
 
Oh dear, where to begin...

Avalanche Shrub looks perfect for surface mining, and very easily controlled (just kill the shrub, and all of it goes), so should be OK to export.
Camo Crocs for camouflage research and to lessen our losses to them by learning to counter it (Giant Mosquitos can do that easy).
Razorgrass could result in fields that infantry can't pass without a lot of of work and firepower, in which PA troops should be able to move easily. Excellent against the Orcs.
Ammut Crocodiles eat the souls of our people, so we really should research them for better counters.

And that's from just few of a regions info posts. Not all of them or even any Omakes.

Edit: Also aren't there those void creatures that feed on stars to research?

Its a pity we don't do much surface mining on Avernus or off it and very easily controlled? Only if Maximial can figure out a means to stop it from breeding and spores going everywhere.

Psycic camouflage as I understand it to say nothing of the fact that we've already got incredible camoflage (basic scout alone) and the crocs have never contributed significantly to our casualties.

Possible.

Its soul research nothing about that is simple. If that was intended as an example of low hanging fruit it doesn't work well. As for counter measures don't get eaten they're giant crocodiles.

? What part of asking them what they need the most and giving it to them is any less generous then giving them what we think they need? I am pretty sure that its the other way around.

They know far more then us what is needed.

I agree that Ahra is likely a priority, but Eldar would know better then us, and there might well be something more important that we do not know about.
Because what they need can best be described as everything. They don't have enough time or farseers to do everything and as we know all the major priorities figuring out what bit of everything we do so they can focus on the other things seems.

There's no need for them to specifically say do this, they're fine with anything. If there is something they need to focus then they will ask.

Orcs work due to WAAGH and are basically idols of their gods, Eldar Titans are Wraiths as I understand it, so they are piloted by Eldar soul(s?), and Battlesuits are overgrown Power Armor. "Powered Combat Exoskeletons" I believe wiki says.
No Eldar ones are titans piloted by Eldar twins.

As for battlesuits they're now in the knight size range so I don't know it it counts any more. In canon at least.

The 12 year option that we have right now is to determine their strengths and weaknesses and make some prototypes. That's all. We would still need many years to set up production, training, doctrine, etc.
Ok first why are you assuming they even need training or doctrine, we're not exactly unfamiliar with them and we're not trainning tolddlers and teenagers like with hunters and marines and second why is this a bad thing?

Determining what they can do lets us use them in a proper fashion if they're completely useless except for research then we can use them for research if we can use them in other areas then we can use them in other areas.

You just seem ideologically opposed to us touching them since your arguments seem to boil down to making statements about thunder warriors which we won't know until we do the research, but if we don't do the research then we won't know.
 
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Its soul research nothing about that is simple. If that was intended as an example of low hanging fruit it doesn't work well. As for counter measures don't get eaten they're giant crocodiles.
Doesn't need to be anti-psychic countermeasures. Could be that they're allergic to cat urine, so all we need to do is spray cat urine everywhere to keep them away. Just as an example. Besides, don't need to study their soul eating to make use of them. They'd be very potent anti-daemon terror weapons.
 
It's not like we're going to be integrating those rifles right off the bat. If there's some good in Impalers after research, we'll leave some, if there's not, and I doubt there is, we reequip.
Even then Impaler research would likely benefit Midgard etc.

Doesn't need to be anti-psychic countermeasures. Could be that they're allergic to cat urine, so all we need to do is spray cat urine everywhere to keep them away. Just as an example. Besides, don't need to study their soul eating to make use of them. They'd be very potent anti-daemon terror weapons.
A pretty absurd one too, but I can't disprove this is a possibility, though again, I doubt they've ever been a major or leading cause of death compared to other things.

Depends, Crocodiles are really hard to tame IRL, it has to be done individually for each croc. Augmetics may change that, but I won't be getting my hopes up, since laser T-rex and lightening Triceratops quite a ways away from om nom soul eaters.
 
I don't think anything said it was not meant for normal Knights.
Psi-Throne Mechanicum
A version of a Throne Mechanicum designed to be compatible with psykers, provided by the Eldar. This Throne and its linked psychic circuitry are designed to allow a Knight's pilot to channel their powers though the Titan to greater effect, though only the most powerful of psykers can draw real use of of it.
I am pretty sure that it could work with them, but they would be so few and elite that it would be a waste not to design one for their unique needs I believe.

Its a pity we don't do much surface mining on Avernus or off it and very easily controlled? Only if Maximial can figure out a means to stop it from breeding and spores going everywhere.

Psycic camouflage as I understand it to say nothing of the fact that we've already got incredible camoflage (basic scout alone) and the crocs have never contributed significantly to our casualties.

Possible.

Its soul research nothing about that is simple. If that was intended as an example of low hanging fruit it doesn't work well. As for counter measures don't get eaten they're giant crocodiles.
What spores? There is nothing about them reproducing by spores.

We do not yet know if psychic, and considering how good camouflage some Earth animals have, its probably not I think. We have excellent camo already, but this would likely allow us to make it far cheaper (if not psychic in nature).

What soul research? Feeding habits, how they identify targets, countermeasures, do they have natural predators that we could imitate to discourage them, etc.

Because what they need can best be described as everything. They don't have enough time or farseers to do everything and as we know all the major priorities figuring out what bit of everything we do so they can focus on the other things seems.

There's no need for them to specifically say do this, they're fine with anything. If there is something they need to focus then they will ask.
Good for them, I still don't see how not asking is in any way better. Also, they have their own seers with their own talents, it is better for them to direct us to divinations Rids is suited for that their own cant do easily, then just diving anything and everything that we think they need.

Ok first why are you assuming they even need training and second why is this a bad thing?

Determining what they can do lets us use them in a proper fashion if they're completely useless except for research then we can use them for research if we can use them in other areas then we can use them in other areas.

You just seem ideologically opposed to us touching them.
Ofc they would need training, why wouldn't they? Space Marines do, Last Hunters do, Assassins do, any base humans do, there is no single human force that could be just sent into combat after equipping them without a massive waste.

Never said that its useless, was correcting a misconception that they are a low hanging fruit (would need 12y and done). Do pay attention to what I am replying to please, or you are likely to misunderstand what I was trying to say.

And yes I don't like them much, but if they are effective use of resources I will happily vote for them. I am just pretty sure that they aren't.

No. To know what Tranth thinks we don't ask Durin, we do the Feasibility Study: Idea action.
Not for a complete answer, we cant even do a feasibility study yet. Just if he thinks that it has a chance of working or not, at a first glance, was the intent. Because I am pretty sure that the answer would be "Hell no."

It's not like we're going to be integrating those rifles right off the bat. If there's some good in Impalers after research, we'll leave some, if there's not, and I doubt there is, we reequip.
Pulse rifles are right above Impalers. Any Impaler improvements lessen Pulse Rifles value. Its not the end of the world, sure, but its not optimal to look into them now I don't think.
 
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Pulse rifles are right above Impalers. Any Impaler improvements lessen Pulse Rifles value. Its not the end of the world, sure, but its not optimal to look into them now I don't think.
I don't think it would particularly matter when we are looking into them. We probably won't integrate anything for the next couple of turns.
 
Here's muh plan.

[X] Plan Enjou T123

Munitorum
SLOT A - Year 4
-Y4: Implement (Pulse Rifles): Planning

Void Command
SLOT A - Year 5
-Y5: Implement (Repair Nanites): Naval

Administratum
SLOT A - Year 2
-Y1: Technological Improvements: (General)
SLOT B - Year 2
-Y2: Technological Improvements: (General)

Diplomacy
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Nynye Trade (Trade Tau Tech)
-Y2: Make a Request (Ask about what we need to do in order to engage in diplomacy with the penguins to trade for the Navigator fish, if she has any idea what they might want in exchange, and if she's willing to help)
-Y3: Request Information: Curses of the Line of Sanguinius

Arbites
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Counter-Intelligence
-Y2: Greater Psyker Hunting
-- DOUBLE DOWN YEAR 2
-Y3: Focused Psyker Hunting
-Y4: Focused Psyker Hunting
-Y5: Greater Psyker Hunting
-- DOUBLE DOWN YEAR 5
SLOT B - Year 3
-Y3: Integrate Varangian Guard

AdMech
SLOT A - Year 4 (Explorator)
-Y4: Black Ship Protection: Mechanicus
SLOT B - Year 5 (Biologis)
-Y5: Ponder the Annals of Thunder
SLOT C - Year 4 (Fabricator-General)
-Y4: Nano-Forges
SLOT D - Year 1 (Free)
-Y1: Technological Improvements: (Advanced Material)
-Y5: Disseminate Callamus Augmetics

Ministorum
SLOT A - Year 3
-Y3: Belief and Faith: Adeptus Astra Ministorum
SLOT B - Year 3
-Y3: Belief and Faith: Adeptus Astra Ministorum

Astra Telepathica
SLOT A - Year 1 (Ridcully)
-Y1: Greater Divination (Infiltrators in the Trust, and security holes they exploit. Give results to the Inquisition.)
-- DOUBLE DOWN YEAR 1
-Y2: Greater Divination (How Chaos Psykers are targeting our anti-psyker forces)
-Y3: Belief and Faith: Adeptus Astra Telepathica
-- DOUBLE DOWN YEAR 3
SLOT B - Year 1 (Xavier)
-Y1: Mentoring (Alpha)
-Y2: Journeyman Alkahestry
SLOT C - Year 4 (Tamia)
-Y4: Black Ship Protection: Telepathica
-- DOUBLE DOWN YEAR 4
SLOT D - Year 5 (Aria)
-Y5: Technomancy
SLOT E - Free Divination
-Y?: Greater Divination (Arhra - nature of ritual with shards of Khaine)

Personal
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Personal Attention: Technological Improvements: (General)
SLOT B - Year 3
-Y3: Personal Attention: Technological Improvements: (General)
SLOT C - Year 1
-Y1: Getting to know you
-Y2: Construction Expertise (Build Hive (Tarascon, Center Area))
SLOT D - Year 1
-Y1: Spend Time With (Vlad Tepes)
-Y2: Spend Time With (Syr)
-Y3: Write In: Syr Marriage Candidates - Discuss with Syr regarding her marriage options and potentially also arrange for it.
-Y4: Knowing Avernus (QM's Choice)
-Y5: Knowing Avernus (QM's Choice)
 
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