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The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up
- Thread starter Durin
- Start date
Should we Put foreward a proposal to have a response ready once the warpstorm ends?
By that I mean we have already decied on
1. the diplomatic corps (joint representant or one per institution or one per World or etc.)
2. a destination (one of the nearby systems we learned of out of the DE archives)
3. presents/information and/or demands/warnings to share/give
4. support (with or without cost) the diplomats are alowed to barter with.
5. support the diplomats should request.
so that the expediton can start imediatly.
Opinion?
So Olaf want to double our trade leavy. That is to much.
I would agree to a lower increase.
By that I mean we have already decied on
1. the diplomatic corps (joint representant or one per institution or one per World or etc.)
2. a destination (one of the nearby systems we learned of out of the DE archives)
3. presents/information and/or demands/warnings to share/give
4. support (with or without cost) the diplomats are alowed to barter with.
5. support the diplomats should request.
so that the expediton can start imediatly.
Opinion?
So Olaf want to double our trade leavy. That is to much.
I would agree to a lower increase.
[X] Oppose Vananheim's proposal on grounds of unconstitutionality
[X] Support Muspelheim's proposal
Passing unconstitutional edicts because one of the Governors has to drum up domestic support is terrible precedent.
[X] Support Muspelheim's proposal
Passing unconstitutional edicts because one of the Governors has to drum up domestic support is terrible precedent.
HanEmpire
Delicious
Agreed, but we need to give some sort of concession right now or else Olaf will look bad and end up losing political standing.
Is there any way to pay for this new Trust Institution without breaking the Constitution?
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Best to ask @Enjou he wrote most of it.
- Location
- Berkeley
So, couple things.
Maintaining our quarantine is a high priority. However, we should probably mention that we dedicate significant resources to that already, and our track record for maintaining a quarantine is actually quite good.
I agree that we don't want to screw up the constitution over this. Having read through the constitution, we do not have a lot of wiggle room, especially if we're going to follow the spirit as well as the letter of the law. It can't be a tax or a tithe at all.
We could offer to include something like it our out of the warp storm plan. Basically include something like trade between systems must go through screening and containment procedures as deemed necessary by the Trust at the system's expense.
Maintaining our quarantine is a high priority. However, we should probably mention that we dedicate significant resources to that already, and our track record for maintaining a quarantine is actually quite good.
I agree that we don't want to screw up the constitution over this. Having read through the constitution, we do not have a lot of wiggle room, especially if we're going to follow the spirit as well as the letter of the law. It can't be a tax or a tithe at all.
We could offer to include something like it our out of the warp storm plan. Basically include something like trade between systems must go through screening and containment procedures as deemed necessary by the Trust at the system's expense.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
My main quwerry is why this is nessecary?
Do they really think we can stop a multi thousand kilometer snake with quarantine procedures?
I don't think there are any ships that big in 40K with the exception of a cron tomb moon, battle moons and 1 or 2 craft worlds.
Do they really think we can stop a multi thousand kilometer snake with quarantine procedures?
I don't think there are any ships that big in 40K with the exception of a cron tomb moon, battle moons and 1 or 2 craft worlds.
- Location
- Alice Springs, Australia
yes it is
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
So does this even have a chance of passing, or is he just hoping we'd ignore it?
Most likely he is counting on us being desperate enough for Vanaheim's good will that we (as the party that stands to lose from this edict) would convince some of the others to switch their votes.
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- Location
- Australia
If Inquisition,Admech and Avernus vote in favour it's still short one vote of the required supermajority.
So unless at least one of the planets opposing changes it's mind it won't.
They need to somehow find four additional votes for it.
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So it's a desperation move by a politician on his way out.
*sigh*
Why does Olaf have to be so stupid?
After he gets blocked in his efforts to look tough it becomes vanishingly unlikely he will be able to maintain his post whatever he does.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Thus we need to offer him a better out.
- Location
- Australia
Something like this might work, but it needs to apply to every planet not just Avernus.
Even though in practice it will only be us paying for a "Systems are fully liable for any diseases/invasive species in outgoing space traffic and are subject to punitive fines" policy or similar, it shouldn't be explicitly stated as such.
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- Location
- England
At some point in the future Averneus will not be the only death world in the trust. This precedent is probably smart for then, as it means no constitutional changes will be necessary.
I say we vote for Olaf's proposal, but quietly tell everyone voting against it not to change there vote under any circumstances.
I don't think we can. What he wants to do is use Trust Law to punish Avernus that is against the spirit of the constitution for good reason, specifically because it allows a majority of the trust worlds to push around single worlds. That is a dangerous precedent that will cause ill will and conflict in the Trust in the long run.
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- Location
- Alice Springs, Australia
it is both an escape mechanism and a possible method of colonization, mostly an escape method
- Location
- Australia
[] Oppose Vananheim's proposal on grounds of unconstitutionality
[] Support Muspelheim's proposal
[] Counter-Proposal to Vanaheim: Planetary system governments must pay damages, either monetary or in-kind, for any diseases or invasive species that leaves that planetary system and spreads to another within the Trust. Payment will be decided in the usual way for a dispute between two systems(5 randomly selected high judges not from those two systems. In the scenario that one planet affects more than one other planet, each planet is decided as a separate case for the purpose of finding judges not connected to the case.)
[] Support Muspelheim's proposal
[] Counter-Proposal to Vanaheim: Planetary system governments must pay damages, either monetary or in-kind, for any diseases or invasive species that leaves that planetary system and spreads to another within the Trust. Payment will be decided in the usual way for a dispute between two systems(5 randomly selected high judges not from those two systems. In the scenario that one planet affects more than one other planet, each planet is decided as a separate case for the purpose of finding judges not connected to the case.)
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@durin - more questions.
1. What would be the estimated annual Throne cost for the quarantine measures?
2. For Muspelheim's deal, what about an alternative tithe where they build a militarized Nomad City (or maybe something a little smaller) set up to serve as a support facility (mobile repair shipyard, ammunition manufactory, etc) which also has bays to carry Flying Fortresses to drop onto worlds. We're likely to end up in a war where we have to attack someone, so that might be pretty valuable. Or is that not practical?
3. Alternatively, what do people think of Muspelheim just transferring some of Vanaheim's debt to them to the Imperial Trust itself as a tithe?
1. What would be the estimated annual Throne cost for the quarantine measures?
2. For Muspelheim's deal, what about an alternative tithe where they build a militarized Nomad City (or maybe something a little smaller) set up to serve as a support facility (mobile repair shipyard, ammunition manufactory, etc) which also has bays to carry Flying Fortresses to drop onto worlds. We're likely to end up in a war where we have to attack someone, so that might be pretty valuable. Or is that not practical?
3. Alternatively, what do people think of Muspelheim just transferring some of Vanaheim's debt to them to the Imperial Trust itself as a tithe?
[X] Oppose Vananheim's proposal on grounds of unconstitutionality
[X] Support Muspelheim's proposal
[X] Counter-Proposal to Vanaheim: Planetary system governments must pay damages, either monetary or in-kind, for any diseases or invasive species that leaves that planetary system and spreads to another within the Trust. Payment will be decided in the usual way for a dispute between two systems(5 randomly selected high judges not from those two systems. In the scenario that one planet affects more than one other planet, each planet is decided as a separate case for the purpose of finding judges not connected to the case.)
Makes sense. Though even if this is passed Olaf is still screwed.
[X] Support Muspelheim's proposal
[X] Counter-Proposal to Vanaheim: Planetary system governments must pay damages, either monetary or in-kind, for any diseases or invasive species that leaves that planetary system and spreads to another within the Trust. Payment will be decided in the usual way for a dispute between two systems(5 randomly selected high judges not from those two systems. In the scenario that one planet affects more than one other planet, each planet is decided as a separate case for the purpose of finding judges not connected to the case.)
Makes sense. Though even if this is passed Olaf is still screwed.
Dark Ness
Rises Where Silence Dies
- Location
- The Primordial Soup
[X] Oppose Vananheim's proposal on grounds of unconstitutionality
[X] Abstain from Muspelheim's proposal
[X] Counter-Proposal to Vanaheim: Planetary system governments must pay damages, either monetary or in-kind, for any diseases or invasive species that leaves that planetary system and spreads to another within the Trust. Payment will be decided in the usual way for a dispute between two systems(5 randomly selected high judges not from those two systems. In the scenario that one planet affects more than one other planet, each planet is decided as a separate case for the purpose of finding judges not connected to the case.)
[X] Abstain from Muspelheim's proposal
[X] Counter-Proposal to Vanaheim: Planetary system governments must pay damages, either monetary or in-kind, for any diseases or invasive species that leaves that planetary system and spreads to another within the Trust. Payment will be decided in the usual way for a dispute between two systems(5 randomly selected high judges not from those two systems. In the scenario that one planet affects more than one other planet, each planet is decided as a separate case for the purpose of finding judges not connected to the case.)
Shard
One and Many
- Location
- Malaysia
[X] Oppose Vananheim's proposal on grounds of unconstitutionality
[X] Support Muspelheim's proposal
[X] Counter-Proposal to Vanaheim: Planetary system governments must pay damages, either monetary or in-kind, for any diseases or invasive species that leaves that planetary system and spreads to another within the Trust. Payment will be decided in the usual way for a dispute between two systems(5 randomly selected high judges not from those two systems. In the scenario that one planet affects more than one other planet, each planet is decided as a separate case for the purpose of finding judges not connected to the case.)
[X] Support Muspelheim's proposal
[X] Counter-Proposal to Vanaheim: Planetary system governments must pay damages, either monetary or in-kind, for any diseases or invasive species that leaves that planetary system and spreads to another within the Trust. Payment will be decided in the usual way for a dispute between two systems(5 randomly selected high judges not from those two systems. In the scenario that one planet affects more than one other planet, each planet is decided as a separate case for the purpose of finding judges not connected to the case.)