Tacit Ronin vs. The World II: KRAUN Jewels

[hYGP]

Good catch. The Hlin and the tanks both move 4 units/turn and Conventionals don't suffer a penalty for moving and shooting. Let's have them move forward and then alpha-strike Inko. I'm updating the plan.

Edit: I decided to have the Tanks fire the normal shells, given the Corrosive ones have -1 damage compared to the normal ones' +0. I'm open to changing it back to the Corrosive ones if people want to.

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Few more things: Fire Arges and keep range at greater than 10 units from the Kaiju line, dunno about whether we wanna let the Quetzcoatls or Hellhounds in; if we let them join in their survival rates drop like a rock.

Edit: This is, of course, assuming that Inko is alive enough to point a finger gun at our air force; throwing in the Quetz and the Hellhounds may add enough firepower to justify their addition. Additionally, mention that if Inko goes down that they reprioritize firepower to another Kaiju, probably Endo.

Yeah. Come to think of it, you're probably overdue for some new Elites. I think most of your remaining Hellhounds have survived long enough... remind me when you've killed all these kaiju.


Got it spot on.
Superheavies, however... I'm not actually certain on that front, since your only shooty superheavy can't fire period on the same turn it moves. I may have to figure that out as well.

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I'm pretty sure either way Hlin is fine, even if the plan has to be changed to 32 units away. Hlin loses one stat point when the Barrier Shield is up, but three units should be enough anyway. For superheavies in general though, I'd expect that they'd be rolled like a Jaeger in the sense that they take a movement penalty (insane mass makes moving the turret stupidly difficult due to inertia or whatever).

 

[Highwind]

Few more things: Fire Arges and keep range at greater than 10 units from the Kaiju line, dunno about whether we wanna let the Quetzcoatls or Hellhounds in; if we let them join in their survival rates drop like a rock.

Edit: This is, of course, assuming that Inko is alive enough to point a finger gun at our air force; throwing in the Quetz and the Hellhounds may add enough firepower to justify their addition. Additionally, mention that if Inko goes down that they reprioritize firepower to another Kaiju, probably Endo.

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Done. Also, I just counted and we have 25 D10s pointed at Inko, and that's just from the Conventionals. Something is bound to do some damage. Hopefully multiple somethings.

 

[LostDeviljho]

since your only shooty superheavy can't fire period on the same turn it moves.

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we should really fix this at some point, btw.

 

[hYGP]

Done. Also, I just counted and we have 25 D10s pointed at Inko, and that's just from the Conventionals. Something is bound to do some damage. Hopefully multiple somethings.

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Are they 25 damaging D10s? I'm also mildly worried that that we might not get enough damage on Inko to safely put him out of commission. Either way though, it's probably our best option.

[X] Highwind

 

[Highwind]

Are they 25 damaging D10s? I'm also mildly worried that that we might not get enough damage on Inko to safely put him out of commission. Either way though, it's probably our best option.

[X] Highwind

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They're all using +0 damage bonus ammunition, which is pretty much the best we have at this range.
*checks the City Forces sheet*

Though we could change the Hellfire+ missiles the helicopters are shooting for the Crackers, they have 2 AP but don't cauterise wounds. Unless anyone objects, I'll do just that.

 

[hYGP]

They're all using +0 damage bonus ammunition, which is pretty much the best we have at this range.
*checks the City Forces sheet*

Though we could change the Hellfire+ missiles the helicopters are shooting for the Crackers, they have 2 AP but don't cauterise wounds. Unless anyone objects, I'll do just that.

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Yeah, Crackers are a good idea. One question though: Are the Quetzs firing lasers or missiles? If they are firing missiles, are they firing Cracker or Hellfire?

edit: the Navy might also be in range, so there's a potential other source of firepower. Also, what happened to our mortars? Are they with the tanks?

double edit: Our RX-class might be, but I dunno if it's deployed or not

 

[Highwind]

Yeah, Crackers are a good idea. One question though: Are the Quetzs firing lasers or missiles? If they are firing missiles, are they firing Cracker or Hellfire?

edit: the Navy might also be in range, so there's a potential other source of firepower.

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The Quetzals don't have Cracker Missiles on their sheets, so I'm assuming we're stuck with Hellfires for them. Other than those, you might as well start calling that Kaiju Polly, because it's getting all the Crackers it wants. Or rather, doesn't want.

We haven't deployed the navy because they're always a bit too far for their guns to reach us. This might have changed now that we have a Type-RX Mura, but we've already deplyed and are engaging the enemy, meaning it's a bit too late to expect them to contribute now.

 

[LostDeviljho]

...A Thought.

If a single Destroyer can mount one Longspear... could a proper Battleship mount several?

 

[Highwind]

...A Thought.

If a single Destroyer can mount one Longspear... could a proper Battleship mount several?

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I like the way you think. A proper battleship should be able to mount at least two, maybe three Longspears. The real problem should be the power source and we already have Hypercompact Fission Reactors and the relatively miniaturized Polaris.

 

[hYGP]

...A Thought.

If a single Destroyer can mount one Longspear... could a proper Battleship mount several?

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I think you miss the bigger application: If a Destroyer can mount an RX-11, can't it also mount an EXB-03 Surround Barrier Shield? With sufficient numbers of torpedoes, barrier ships, and a resupply ship, we could have (relatively) safe shipping again!

 

[Highwind]

I think you miss the bigger application: If a Destroyer can mount an RX-11, can't it also mount an EXB-03 Surround Barrier Shield? With sufficient numbers of torpedoes, barrier ships, and a resupply ship, we could have (relatively) safe shipping again!

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They don't protect against a Kaiju just swimming under you and eating a chunk out of you. They're against Ranged attacks only.

 

[hYGP]

They don't protect against a Kaiju just swimming under you and eating a chunk out of you. They're against Ranged attacks only.

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Well, yes, but most shipping is intercepted by stuff under Cat IV. With sufficient torpedoes and possibly the creation of depth charges, we can totally blow the shit out of any Kaiju underwater with large convoys.

(the biosphere will suffer pretty badly from all the Kaiju Blue spilled, but it kinda already did, so, uh.)

 

[Highwind]

Well, yes, but most shipping is intercepted by stuff under Cat IV. With sufficient torpedoes and possibly the creation of depth charges, we can totally blow the shit out of any Kaiju underwater with large convoys.

(the biosphere will suffer pretty badly from all the Kaiju Blue spilled, but it kinda already did, so, uh.)

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Let's make a fleet of Hypersonic Atomic Aerial Cargo Planes instead. The enemy can't hit you if you're too fast to catch!

 

[Nixeu]

...A Thought.

If a single Destroyer can mount one Longspear... could a proper Battleship mount several?

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Depends on the recoil and air pressure disturbances it causes. I have been informed that some ships in WWII (the Musashi, to be specific) couldn't fire their main-guns and AA at the same time, since the overpressure would break the ship. Recoil forces could also be similar.

Unless, of course, we fire in the opposite direction at the same time. That would negate the recoil, I think. Or rip the ship in half. One of the two.

...What? I'm a wannabe chemist, dammit, not a nautical engineer!

I like the way you think. A proper battleship should be able to mount at least two, maybe three Longspears. The real problem should be the power source and we already have Hypercompact Fission Reactors and the relatively miniaturized Polaris.

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Eh. Unless they have a reload-time, if the forces involved would break the ship, then having more than the ship can use would be superfluous. Of course, we do have better materials than they had in WWII for building ships. But then again, Jagdarium has those issues with immersion in water...

Like I said, I'm not a nautical engineer. But I'm sure we can solve our problems with the proper application of SCIENCE! Possibly by researching new materials with few problems with water immersion. Maybe we could derive something from Kaiju materials? Something for the research list, anyway.

 

[Highwind]

Depends on the recoil and air pressure disturbances it causes. I have been informed that some ships in WWII (the Musashi, to be specific) couldn't fire their main-guns and AA at the same time, since the overpressure would break the ship. Recoil forces could also be similar.

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On the one hand, Imperial Japan's Navy had shit metallurgy and gunnery compared to most other coubtries when Musashi was built, so our battleships could probably handle that level of recoil. On the other hand, a single Longspear has so much recoil that a tank the size of the Heimdal needs to be locked down to fire it.

Either way, it's worth looking into of only because battleships are cool.

 

[Nixeu]

On the one hand, Imperial Japan's Navy had shit metallurgy and gunnery compared to most other coubtries when Musashi was built, so our battleships could probably handle that level of recoil. On the other hand, a single Longspear has so much recoil that a tank the size of the Heimdal needs to be locked down to fire it.

Either way, it's worth looking into of only because battleships are cool.

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Oh, aye. And I suspect it's a solvable issue. Maybe something involving Barriers? Use small barriers to absorb the kinetic force of the recoil, and convert it to heat? Could even get some of the energy used back, if we used that heat to produce electricity. I don't think overpressure is as big a deal with rail-guns, though I could be wrong.

Edit: Depends on what kind of magentic propulsion we're using, precisely, as it turns out. Rail-guns are distinct from coil/gauss designs, and have more overpressure (though not as much as a normal gun). We could probably make a coil or gauss rifle fairly easily, given that we throw plasma long-distance. If we're not already.

 

[Fyrstorm]

So, before I address any action plans, I'm gonna explain the Type-RX setup (and also fix some stuff I've noticed regarding it).

The Type-RX upgrade for the Murasame-class does not provide it with a nuclear reactor for its weapon like the Heimdal has. Instead, the onboard Railgun is powered via an array of high-density capacitors, which are charged up by the ship's (enhanced) generators. Thus, while it can operate a railgun, it can't run something like a Barrier Shield, at least not for very long.

As for the fixing? Well, technically the RX-11s on your Type-RX and Rail Batteries are a little inferior to your Heimdal's RX-11, in terms of hit-probability, damage, and armour-penetration. As such, while I'm not gonna fully upgrade them, I will boost them a little, and rename them something else.

Therefore, Type-RX units and Rail Batteries will mount this weapon:
- RX-12 'Pilum' Railgun: (n x) 1d10+1 Impact damage. +2 Damage. AP 2. Range 20/30/-. Hits on 5+. Benefits from Arges

Essentially, the Pilum is a cut-down successor to the Longspear, designed to trade raw damage and penetration for more consistent accuracy (max range hits on 6s instead of 7s) and rate of fire (kinda-- Pilum-equipped units don't have to spend a turn locking down before they can fire).

There! Problem fixed!

But then again, Jagdarium has those issues with immersion in water...

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Jagdarium's main issue (aside from its cost) is that high-pressure environments and heat sinks weaken its compressive strength. It's a very good material for land use-- especially in hot, dry climates-- but not for aquatic use. Which, given that the main Breaches (not the Helens Breach) are both at the bottom of the ocean, is... a little unfortunate.

That's not to say you can't try and research some sort of armour that doesn't have the pressure intolerance, or possibly a coating to help lessen environmental pressure on the material-- because you totally can.

 

[hYGP]

especially in hot, dry climates

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Does Mount Saint Helens count as a 'hot, dry climate'?

The Type-RX upgrade for the Murasame-class does not provide it with a nuclear reactor for its weapon like the Heimdal has. Instead, the onboard Railgun is powered via an array of high-density capacitors, which are charged up by the ship's (enhanced) generators. Thus, while it can operate a railgun, it can't run something like a Barrier Shield, at least not for very long.

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Given that we have an RX-class gun not powered by a nuclear engine, how difficult does our R&D team think building a aerial vehicle mounted RX-class would be? If it is possible, would it be better or worse than Hellfires?

One last question too: How long is a turn in seconds, roughly? Because I think there might be an issue where we can kill Iblis in literally one attack with a +40 circumstance bonus to Agility (due to traveling some crazy number like 60 units a turn (assuming a turn is about six seconds, that's 1000m/s, about as fast as the Blackbird flew, not even pushing things with NASA rocketplanes) with the help of BigAss Rocket Booster TM​) in a Charge, but I dunno.

 

[LostDeviljho]

how difficult does our R&D team think building a plane mounted RX-class would be?

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infeasible. The recoil alone would knock it out of the sky.

 

[hYGP]

infeasible. The recoil alone would knock it out of the sky.

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Alright, fair enough. I'll edit that to ask an aerial vehicle to carry RX-class weaponry.

 

[LostDeviljho]

Alright, fair enough. I'll edit that to ask an aerial vehicle to carry RX-class weaponry.

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it would really only work on something with a nuclear generator, and we're not putting those on anything short of a superheavy. Whiiich we can't do yet because we don't have a drive system that could hold a superheavy in the air.

 

[Fyrstorm]

Does Mount Saint Helens count as a 'hot, dry climate'?

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Well, it certainly doesn't count as a cold, damp climate, since the Breach there is spewing out heat and radiation, and it's a good distance from the ocean.

Given that we have an RX-class gun not powered by a nuclear engine, how difficult does our R&D team think building a plane mounted RX-class would be? If it is possible, would it be better or worse than Hellfires?

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If you mounted the Pilum on any sort of airframe you have right now, the recoil from firing it would probably sheer the wings off, if not shoot the gun straight through the middle of the plane's fuselage and out the other end. So... not really an option. A coilgun might be better, but even so the power requirements and stability issues would mean you'd need a superheavy.

However, in terms of damage output, your Railguns are superior to your missiles. They're just massive, power-guzzling guns that weigh a bloody ton and have ridiculous recoil.

Alright, fair enough. I'll edit that to ask an aerial vehicle to carry RX-class weaponry.

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You could manage arming a hovercraft with a Pilum, currently. It's probably skid back like a hockey puck when you shoot, and it wouldn't get that high off the ground (certainly not enough to reach AC and count mechanically as flying) but it'd survive more than one shot.

One last question too: How long is a turn in seconds, roughly? Because I think there might be an issue where we can kill Iblis in literally one attack with a +40 circumstance bonus to Agility (due to traveling some crazy number like 60 units a turn (assuming a turn is about six seconds, that's 1000m/s, about as fast as the Blackbird flew, not even pushing things with NASA rocketplanes) with the help of BigAss Rocket Booster TM) in a Charge, but I dunno.

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Hm. 1 Unit/round is ~18 KPH, a unit is 100 m, and it takes 180 rounds to move 18 kilometers, then technically it would be about... 20 seconds? I usually speed things up in combat, so it's kinda vague and wishy-washy and generally a bit less than that.

Also, there's no way in hell that Orbital Velocity is going to count as Agility during Space Combat. Trust me, it'd cause way too many problems. I'm basically scratch-building the mechanics for Space Combat as is.

 

[hYGP]

Well, it certainly doesn't count as a cold, damp climate, since the Breach there is spewing out heat and radiation, and it's a good distance from the ocean.


If you mounted the Pilum on any sort of airframe you have right now, the recoil from firing it would probably sheer the wings off, if not shoot the gun straight through the middle of the plane's fuselage and out the other end. So... not really an option. A coilgun might be better, but even so the power requirements and stability issues would mean you'd need a superheavy.

However, in terms of damage output, your Railguns are superior to your missiles. They're just massive, power-guzzling guns that weigh a bloody ton and have ridiculous recoil.


You could manage arming a hovercraft with a Pilum, currently. It's probably skid back like a hockey puck when you shoot, and it wouldn't get that high off the ground (certainly not enough to reach AC and count mechanically as flying) but it'd survive more than one shot.


Hm. 1 Unit/round is ~18 KPH, a unit is 100 m, and it takes 180 rounds to move 18 kilometers, then technically it would be about... 20 seconds? I usually speed things up in combat, so it's kinda vague and wishy-washy and generally a bit less than that.

Also, there's no way in hell that Orbital Velocity is going to count as Agility during Space Combat. Trust me, it'd cause way too many problems. I'm basically scratch-building the mechanics for Space Combat as is.

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About that hovercraft: Would it be a superheavy?

Uh, if a round is about 18 seconds, that makes things absolutely horrific/insane. Scratch 1000m/s, just going supersonic implies traveling 62 units a turn. It also does wonky things like make our Quetzcoatls have a stall speed around 62 mph, but luckily, dropping everything down to about 6 seconds a turn seems to solve the basic stuff. (it totally doesn't solve the fact that SR-71 achieved Orbital Velocity in atmosphere and so did the X-15, but that's a problem for future!Fyrstorm)

I gotta say this though: Thanks for putting in all the work on the Air and Space Combat systems! I know we won't be able to get to it for a while, but it really is great that you take the time out of your life to write this up custom system up for people on the internet to play with.

 

[Highwind]

it would really only work on something with a nuclear generator, and we're not putting those on anything short of a superheavy. Whiiich we can't do yet because we don't have a drive system that could hold a superheavy in the air.

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Yet! We don't have a drive system capable of holding a Superheavy in the air yet. But we will.

Soon. Ish. Probably. When we get the second city for sure.

 

[LostDeviljho]

Yet! We don't have a drive system capable of holding a Superheavy in the air yet. But we will.

Soon. Ish. Probably. When we get the second city for sure.

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Once we kill Anaklusmos and get gravity drives. Not actually very confident in allegorica-based aerial superheavies.