What should your focus for the rest of the Quest be?


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Lets get those stupid autoloaders over with.

[X] Plan: Building Up A Fleet And Lining It UP--Gun Version

Then in good conscience, I ask you to return your vote to the Gun version.

Not because I do not think my arguments are sound, as I have given them, but because it seems clear to me that we both value Autoloaders very differently: you higher than any other Research, me somewhere in the bottom six or seven, if certainly not at the bottom (what with, for instance, Military Servo-Skulls being cool but useless, and Weird Ships being an active if very funny trap, the STC being a clear sign that we need to further automation before we even bother with it, etc, etc.)

And so I cannot say that somehow we will find a time wherein or evaluations on this matter cross and meet in amity, not unless we've rather narrowed down the Research section considerably.
This.
Lets just get it over with.
...

I hate it so much when you're making a good point but it goes against my OCD.

But fine.


[X] Plan: Building Up A Fleet And Lining It UP--Mx. Automatic Version

But if you rip another chance at this away from me, I will not be so nice next time
Remember, automation is a deep rewarding tree.
We can do autoloaders now to get it off your mind and then mine the gold vein that is automation deeply without you having the autoloaders-ocd driving you insane with every AP we have to plan.
 
So, I was going through the maps in Sub-Sector K'ali A'shi, and I noticed the Larantia system uhhh...

That star system is not natural. Like at all. There is no way four planets perfectly timed intersecting orbitals around one star without crashing into one another or getting pulled out of orbit over time.

There's some major nonsense going on in that system and I really want to know what's going on over there.
 
But if you rip another chance at this away from me, I will not be so nice next time
Bluh. Yeah IMO autoloaders are now or never. I'd prefer automation now and autoloaders never, but maybe I should just vote for auto-loaders now so we don't have this argument again next week.

Nah, I'll argue against it then, for whatever I think is more important that time too.

[X] Plan: Building Up A Fleet And Lining It UP--Mx. Automatic Version
Standarised autoloaders only apply to ships designed in the turn after they get researched doing both autoloaders and new ship designs is not a optimal order of taking actions
Except we just designed the ships that don't require autoloaders? All of the ships we have left to refit would benefit.
 
Bluh. Yeah IMO autoloaders are now or never. I'd prefer automation now and autoloaders never, but maybe I should just vote for auto-loaders now so we don't have this argument again next week.

Nah, I'll argue against it then, for whatever I think is more important that time too.
Lets just get the autoloaders over with.
There will always be something more important than them, if we don't do them now we'll always have this same stupid discussion.
Delaying automation a turn costs us 1-2 Destroyers, imho a very acceptable price to be done with autoloaders discussion.
 
All the way back at the start when we were freaking out about how good Standardization was, @HeroCooky said that doing it once would make the next time doing it cost more.
Yeah, it does. And that action was created with the understanding that you would, maybe, grab 2~3 things and never touch it again for eternity.
What is a Citadel Defense Station packing?
More guns. :V
Is this automation now produces 2 per turn or automation goes from 1 to 3?
The latter.
 
THREE Destroyers a turn?

So we go from 1 to 3 destroyers produced. I'd assume the next would be +3 giving us 6 destroyers produced.
Assuming the increase holds steady we'd be producing 36 Fleet Points of Destroyers by the 6th upgrade, meaning we'd produce as many destroyers as a full action.

But given that each research seems to also be increasing in AP cost I'd assume it would take us 20 AP to get to Tier 6 Automation.
 
So I was thinking about how Voxx Primus produces 4 Cobras a turn, consistently, and I'm pretty sure it's the Imperial equivilent of Automation. Except instead of the Wussies creating a safe environment and technological improvements making it easier to churn them out, it's just, "Choose to kill this many hundreds of thousands of workers a year overworking to constantly produce more Cobras."

Which means that if we get up to three Destroyers, we will almost be matching Voxx Primus' production, which isn't bad when they have a pop of 700 billion.

Also, because I was curious, I wanted to see to what extent we could imitate the Cobra.

Cobra Imitation Trial

Length - 1.500 Meters (+1)
Width - 300 Meters (+2)
Acceleration 7.6 Gravities (+1)
Armor - Thick Double Hull (-1? This is higher than what we can put on a Destroyer, which makes me think that that's what Mass-Produced Alloying does, gives you an extra sector)
Shields - Double Array (-1? Ditto, Armor and Shields are the two categories where they honestly seem to have us beat straight out)
Weapons - 4x60m Torpedoes (-2 DP? We don't have this exact thing, but that seems like the best bet), 1x Repeating Macro-Cannon Turret (???)
Equipment - Armored Prow (-1), Mass-Produced Alloying (???), Superior Gravimetric Engine Calculations (-1), Old-Bitten Design (???), Cradle of Heroes (???)

Despite everything, they're still a mystery to us, and we don't seem able to match their skill at Armor and Shields, but we can pretty trivially make a faster, wider, longer and better ship for its body. They seem to have a lot of Doctrine-specific tech that's slightly different than what we have, and Old-Bitten Design and Mass-Produced Alloying might even be things that wouldn't be terrible for us to be able to do, though Cradle of Heroes, cost unknown, is against basically our entire design philosophy.
 
Spitting-Cobra Class Flex Ship
-[] Length - 1.600 Meters (+0)
-[] Width - 400 Meters (+0)
-[] Acceleration - 8 Gravities (+0)
-[] Armor - Thin Double Hull (+0)
-[] Shields - One Array (+0)
-[] Weapons - 2x60 Torpedoes 2x (-2 DP), Light Rotary Macro-Cannon (-2 DP)
-[] Equipment - Autoloaders (-2), Tuned Shields (-1 DP), Ship Shrines (-1 DP), Hardened Prow (-2 DP), Superior Gravimetric Engine Calcuations (-1 DP), Lattice Hulls (-2 DP), Prow Spur (-2), Advanced Alloying (-1 DP)

So, just for fun, here's a ship designed to basically do the Cobra's exact tactical role, as carefully replicated as possible[1], within our DP paradigm. It's blatantly a better ship across most, but not all, categories of service.

[1] Like personally, I don't give a shit about ramming, but it's clear the Cobras do!
 
Vote closed
Scheduled vote count started by HeroCooky on Jun 20, 2024 at 1:27 PM, finished with 64 posts and 29 votes.

  • [X] Plan: Building Up A Fleet And Lining It UP--Mx. Automatic Version
    -[X] [Military] Design New Voidship Classes
    --[X] Libra Q
    --[X] Pyxis-Class
    --[X] Lupus-Secondus
    --[X] Saggitarius-S
    ---[X] [Free] Send the new Libra Q, Lupus-Secndus and Saggitarius-S straight to Ultima Sigritta as soon as they are completed and shaken down.
    -[X] The Adherents of the Divine Lines
    -[X] [General] Research:
    --[X] Shipyard Automatization II (0/2)(1 and a Free Research)
    [X] Plan: Building Up A Fleet And Lining It UP--Gun Version
    -[X] [Military] Design New Voidship Classes
    --[X] Libra-Quartus (Libra-Q) Light Carrier
    --[X] Sagittarius-Secundus (Sagittarius-S) Lance Frigate
    --[X] Lupus-Secundus (Lupus-S) Torpedo Destroyer
    --[X] Pyxis-Class High-Grade Scout Sloop
    -[X] The Adherents of the Divine Lines
    -[X] [General] Research:
    --[X] Ship Equipment Standardization - [1 DP Equipment] (0/2)(1 and a Free Research)--Autoloaders
    [X] Plan: Make way for the next Generation
    -[X] [Military] Design New Voidship Classes
    --[X] Libra-Quartus (Libra-Q) Light Carrier
    --[X] Sagittarius-Secundus (Sagittarius-S) Lance Frigate
    --[X] Lupus-Secundus (Lupus-S) Torpedo Destroyer
    --[X] Pyxis-Class High-Grade Scout Sloop
    -[X] [General] Research:
    --[X] Shipyard Automatization II (Action + bonus research action)
    -[X] [Glimmering Research Publishing Institutes] The Academic Initiatives are flourishing, facilitating improvements to the efficiency of research and production. But those involved all agree that there are more opportunities that lie fallow. A collection of proposals have been made to improve the research capabilities of the Glimmering Federation by establishing publishing institutes throughout the Federation that focus on streamlining the communication and dissemination of research. Specifically, too often does critical research go unreported because of the difficulty of communication or the presence of negative results, or it is missed by researchers who aren't aware of what keywords to look for. This is in addition to the difficult of repeating difficult experiments because of vague instructions. These institutes would focus on fixing these problems by creating an integrated research reporting framework and rewarding well-demonstrated negative results just as strongly as positive results. Peer reviewers would be paid for their work, and basic science will be rewarded with prestige as strongly as exciting applied research. With these institutes, the saying "A month in the lab will save you a day in the library" will become a true joke instead of a painful reminder.
    [X] Plan: Prepping the Faith
    -[X] [Military] Militarize The Schools Of Paladins
    -[X] [Faith] The Great Heresies
    --[X] The Adherents of the Divine Lines
    -[X] Write in- Begin the construction of Orbital Defenses around the Ultima Sagritta System. Focus should be on what can support each other and not to overextend, Planning of the Defense Stations should take into account the presence of at least one Sector Battle Group stationed in orbit around Ultima Sagritta for the foreseeable future. If there is time and room left in the budget Ground Base Anti-Orbital batteries should be built. Future expansion will focus on the further depth of the defenses and ability to base, supply, refit, repair, and service a Sector Battle Group in full at the system.
    [X] Plan: A Song For the Future
    -[X] [General] Research:
    --[X] Shipyard Automatization II (0/2)(1 and a Free Research)
    -[X] [Psykana] Sing a Song (Silence II, Perception II, Grounding II, Creativity II, Song III. )
    -[X] Write in- Begin the construction of Orbital Defenses around the Ultima Sagritta System. Focus should be on what can support each other and not to overextend, Planning of the Defense Stations should take into account the presence of at least one Sector Battle Group stationed in orbit around Ultima Sagritta for the foreseeable future. If there is time and room left in the budget Ground Base Anti-Orbital batteries should be built. Future expansion will focus on the further depth of the defenses and ability to base, supply, refit, repair, and service a Sector Battle Group in full at the system.
 
700.M42 - 700 BILLION PEOPLE
Once again, the Constitutional Convention is at hand, and with it, hundreds of thousands of representatives, functionaries, bureaucrats, council members, lawyers, priests/esses, soldiers, Kin, and Protectorate members flock to Candle Keeper Station. The halls and sections set aside for this function turn from cavernous empty rooms to a nearly overcrowded bustling city practically overnight.

Minor issues are dealt with over days of screaming matches, legal arguments and inconsistencies are resolved, petitions and interest groups are addressed and dealt with, and a thousand other minor things turn and churn in the political sphere of the Glimmering Federation.

It would be a successful, if not groundbreaking, because of the minor issues solved, Con-Con, as the youth have come to call the event, were it not for two problems that have popped up.

The first and foremost issue revolves around the effort to turn Voxx Primus to the side of the Glimmering Federation. Not because of any dissent in the ongoing undermining and infiltration, many are happy that their ranks upon that world have swelled to nearly 150 million saved souls despite the continuing, if lessening, crackdown on the unfortunates living in the Underhive of the world's capital and the Witch Hunts petering off, but because of one glaring issue: there is no plan on what to do if they succeed in turning this world.

A Hive World is...the less said about it, the better, yet one thing must be said: they cannot be allowed to exist within the Federation. Nobody within the political apparatus seriously considers the continuation of the Hives as something that will happen within the Federation, as nearly every level of them is entirely against either moral, practical, ethical, or religious considerations and sentiments.

And yet, though plans are plenty on what to do to aid the infiltration, there are few plans on what to do with a world housing around ~700 BILLION PEOPLE.

There are some ideas, like pumping the inhabitants of the world full of anaphrodisiacs and letting time do away with the population that cannot be supported should the nearby trio of Agri Worlds not be taken in full and wholly intact at the same time as the Hive World, or shipping the excess populations to Federation worlds (which would come to around 24 billion people per world, meaning it is wholly unfeasible). Some are even proposing the creation of Orbital Rings around selected stars to house the populations while using stellar mass harvested to produce all they need and improve the rest of the Federation.

But none are entirely sure what to do when Voxx Primus is liberated, for 700 billion people are more than 13 times the entire population of the Federation...upon a single world, no less.

[] [Voxx Primuse Afterplan] (Write-In)
(6-Hour Moratorium)

The second issue is that of Kin. Specifically, from sections of the Federation that are demanding that the Yeeni be granted that status through their continued service in the Federation, from their navy to the army, into their perfect record of supplying the levied taxes without any discrepancies, and the fact that no serious societal or special issues have popped up. Detractors, however, are pointing out that those are merely the actions of a Protectorate that takes its role seriously, rather than any proof that the Yeeni are to be elevated to Kin, the wording of the laws pointing out that such a thing would require it to be undeniably apparent to all involved that the Xenos in question are worthy of the elevation.

This, in turn, caused their opposites to declare the ones who had written the laws 'indecisive flip-floppers' who 'wanted their cake and eat it too,' with many calling for the laws to be changed. The opposition, in turn, told them to watch their mouths or they'd get a shoe thrown at them. With tempers flaring, Yeeni live streaming, and Kil'drabi joining in the bickering, it didn't take long for both issues to be split into two votes and halls. It also didn't take long for a member of one hall to try and tunnel into the other when they heard someone talking shit about them.

[] [Yeeni] (Write in your argument about whether they are to be made Kin or not. 200 Words minimum.)
[] [Kin Laws] (Write in if they are to be made more precise or if you want to do something else.)
 
Okay then, I have some ideas here. I think the solution needs to be multi-part.

Despite the, "It's infeasible" argument, I think we actually could at least reduce the population of Voxx Primus by a hundred billion or two through emigration. Maybe more, depending on whether we take more of the Van Zandt Dynasty.

But that still does leave the majority of the population to be dealt with, and for that I think a profusion of space stations across the system would be another plank to be pursued.
 
Could we put in birth-cap laws on Voxx, as sort of a humane way of lower its population that doesn't involve active genocide?

That combined with building separate stations for them would probably lead to the Hive getting a healthier and lower population.
 
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