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I feel like you'd need to have Dooku brought low enough to rely on some nonhumans for a fair bit first, given his prejudices, but I'd be keen to read that story :)

Got an idea for an ST-era story to get a little into non-human views of the FO and the Imperial legacy in general. In my head, the rampant xenophobia of the regime should galvanise quite a lot of people, at least once the invasion gets underway.
 
I mean Dooku could have been a good character as a disillusioned Jedi, turned Sith but he was barely written as anything more than some glorified Christopher Lee reference, that the ROTS novelization had to make him some of bizarre supporter of the values that basically define the now Legends Empire. I think if the work was put in you could do more with him There was one 'interesting' story about General Grievous that went of the premise what if Coruscant was too 'successful' resulting in the deaths of Palpatine who Grievous believe was only the Supreme Chancellor, Anakin and Obi Wan, along with Dooku. Dooku here is a true believer, and Grievous is basically the Legends version where he was brainwashed, and basically takes up a CIS with legitimate cause.

Zhang Jiao said:
Nah, the prequels benefited from Palpatine; Dooku is overrated and is nothing more than a pawn that was played right to the end.
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It's not so much the prequels didn't benefit from Palpatine as it was, the lengths used to justify him as some form of chessmaster, relied on a lot of character's being particularly stupid than any supposed brilliance on his part, despite their being plenty of red flags not to trust the man. For Dooku in particular, he should know that Palpatine did have a role in killing off his former Padawan, mind you for whatever reason Dooku leaves ten years earlier before the Battle of Naboo in canon. It's not that Dooku is overrated per se as it is the prequels and sequels had a really bad habit with bad guys that could be best described as under or poorly utilized filler Dooku, Maul, and Grievous where just there for lightsaber fights if we don't count any supplemental material, with Phasma and Hux as their spiritual successors.
 
I don't mind; Palpatine was great as a "Manificient Bastard."

The problem?

He's literally brought back for... what? So he can say some cheap lines in TROS and then die by "All the Jedi" or something.

And his fanbase is annoying.

Like, they seem to think he's the best villain of Star Wars or the best villain period.

IMHO.

No, I think Palpatine should've stayed dead by his own hubris and miscalculation.
 
Eh Evil sorcerer space emperors never stay dead the first time they are killed and sith after returning after they were utterly defeated was old hat long before Maul's return in the second clone wars series was so Palpatine's return never bothered in either old or new canon.

I fully expected he would return and I fully expected he would fail it was just a matter of how he would fail to pull a comeback.

Ming the Merciless though would so disappointed in Paplatine's performance.
 
The real core issue is still that Palpatine's story rear-ended a story which already had the core ingredients it needed, and was almost entirely handled by verbal exposition.

Actually, the only way TRoS seems to know how to do anything is to exposit someone's backstory. How to do anything with Rey? New backstory. Poe? New backstory. How to turn Kylo good? The Leia thing but also retcon some things about his backstory. Finn isn't really handled, but the main thing that happens in his story is Jannah, who is really just her backstory. Even Luke and Leia are handled largely by giving them more backstory.

I'm genuinely curious as to whether the old "those last two stories? Well it was me, all along!" has ever worked.
 
I certainly don't disagree that Palpatine's return shouldn't have been in the third sequel film but in a separate productions be it books, comics, games or TV.

I would have loved to have Palpatine mocking the first orders failures while gloating to the heroes of his own story who came to confront him but we sadly won't get that.
 
I was happy with the theory that Palps was a vindictive spirit who was corrupting Kylo from the DS2 remains and influencing/helping Snoke.
 
On that front...

I've been going through ideas for The First Order for my ST rewrite and I've been thinking of cooler ideas for its head instead of just using Thrawn or reinventing Snoke (the latter because a major inspiration for my rewrite already did that and I figured I'd go crazy instead of treading old ground). A possible idea, which could blend in with other ideas, is that the First Order pulled a Boys from Brazil and cloned an "heir" for Palpatine. Just to make it clear, it's not Palpatine, it's essentially his son who the First Order treats as it's Prince. Now I've got a couple of idea percolating with which to add to that base but is that idea cool or eye rolling at it's base?
 
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MagicMan333 said:
On that front...

I've been going through ideas for The First Order for my ST rewrite and I've been thinking of cooler ideas for its head instead of just using Thrawn or reinventing Snoke (the latter because a major inspiration for my rewrite already did that and I figured I'd go crazy instead of treading new ground). A possible idea, which could blend in with other ideas, is that the First Order pulled a Boys from Brazil and cloned an "heir" for Palpatine. Just to make it clear, it's not Palpatine, it's essentially his son who the First Order treats as it's Prince. Now I've got a couple of idea percolating with which to add to that base but is that idea cool or eye rolling at it's base?
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You got my interest, that sounds tasty and interesting, another concept could be that this Palpaprince is different in regards to his father as he is a far more openly aggresive and militaristic man, and maybe you could have it that he likes certain alien species he deems sufficiently good for the galaxy.
 
MagicMan333 said:
On that front...

I've been going through ideas for The First Order for my ST rewrite and I've been thinking of cooler ideas for its head instead of just using Thrawn or reinventing Snoke (the latter because a major inspiration for my rewrite already did that and I figured I'd go crazy instead of treading new ground). A possible idea, which could blend in with other ideas, is that the First Order pulled a Boys from Brazil and cloned an "heir" for Palpatine. Just to make it clear, it's not Palpatine, it's essentially his son who the First Order treats as it's Prince. Now I've got a couple of idea percolating with which to add to that base but is that idea cool or eye rolling at it's base?
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Most important question: how many eyes does the Prince have?
 
MagicMan333 said:
On that front...

I've been going through ideas for The First Order for my ST rewrite and I've been thinking of cooler ideas for its head instead of just using Thrawn or reinventing Snoke (the latter because a major inspiration for my rewrite already did that and I figured I'd go crazy instead of treading new ground). A possible idea, which could blend in with other ideas, is that the First Order pulled a Boys from Brazil and cloned an "heir" for Palpatine. Just to make it clear, it's not Palpatine, it's essentially his son who the First Order treats as it's Prince. Now I've got a couple of idea percolating with which to add to that base but is that idea cool or eye rolling at it's base?
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I went with Snoke being the Last Inquisitor, who played off various Moffs and such against one another as the First Order built itself up. The idea of a "Prince Palpatine" sounds very interesting though. Would there be much cult stuff around him? Might he be something more of a warrior Sith in the Lord Kaan mould?

Actually got way into what the FO's rise in the Unknowns might've looked like, a while ago:

There were longer-settled worlds among the "Throne Worlds", the core systems of the First Order, but Gorothad's relative youth meant that it was held up all the more proudly. It had been colonised by the Empire only half a century before – not that it had been uninhabited. The nonhuman natives had been subjugated, their submission coming after millions of deaths, and the survivors put to work building fortresses and cities. From there, with a new name, the planet rose to become a bastion of Imperial power, unseen by the wider Galaxy.

The secret conquests and colonisations which built Gorothad and worlds like it were a part of Operation Inheritance. Old Emperor Palpatine had planned even for the downfall of his Empire, and decreed this secret campaign to build a territory to which he could withdraw, to carry on the struggle.

As it turned out, the struggle outlived the Emperor, but nonetheless Palpatine's successors made use of the future Throne Worlds. While Operation Cinder was decreed, a select group of Imperials retreated to the Unknowns, and found a shadow empire waiting for them. There they regrouped, licked their wounds, and began to rebuild. All the while, they watched their victorious enemies, now the New Republic, and waited for the chance to pay back their defeat.

New Stormtrooper legions were raised along the lines devised by General Brendol Hux and quickly given their baptism of fire. The Unknown Regions were full of backwater worlds and primitive societies, and the rising First Order fell upon these with controlled savagery. Millions were enslaved to toil for its industrial machine, and families had children torn away from them to be raised as Stormtroopers in their turn.
 
MagicMan333 said:
On that front...

I've been going through ideas for The First Order for my ST rewrite and I've been thinking of cooler ideas for its head instead of just using Thrawn or reinventing Snoke (the latter because a major inspiration for my rewrite already did that and I figured I'd go crazy instead of treading new ground). A possible idea, which could blend in with other ideas, is that the First Order pulled a Boys from Brazil and cloned an "heir" for Palpatine. Just to make it clear, it's not Palpatine, it's essentially his son who the First Order treats as it's Prince. Now I've got a couple of idea percolating with which to add to that base but is that idea cool or eye rolling at it's base?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I've toyed with the idea of Princess Rey myself, at least her being forced into it by a brief but 9/10th's rocky, 1/10 Heartwarming or as close to you get to it relationship, with Evil Granddaddy PTSD-afflicted and emotional wreck Palpatine.

With a 'Imperial Prince' chances are your going to run into some issues. Their going to be far more vulnerable powerbase wise, their not a decades old seasoned politician even taking into account the sociopathy and ability to wield the force of Palpatine. Second their Empire may or may not have to denounce the actions of their predecessor, even if it is just for PR, remember the Empire has several actual genocides to their name even outside of Alderaan, how do you 'realistically' drum for such a state is going to be an issue considering the Empire was as pointlessly evil as you could get and when out of their way to do horrible things than function as a state.

Next up force user training, are they going to be trained as Sith, with possibly all of the downsides that come from it, especially if they are not given much in the way of some of the more politically oriented Sith of old. Are they going to go down some crazy paths with their training, also who is their teacher and are they still around. There's stuff to work with, as far this idea goes, but there's also a lot to consider. It's not even a stupid idea, since the FO could have been decent antagonists if they written better, and given coherency, and not shafted for Palpatine's cult.
 
I still like the idea of Rey Nobody of the Resistance too much to go with an ancestry. Also, I don't need to jump through any hoops to explain how she came to be on Jakku, I just need to make her life difficult in the course of going on missions with her friends and facing off against the First Order. Currently digging into that with a story where she begins to properly study lightsaber Forms.

One thing I do want to rework is Zorii though. I like how she plays onscreen, but don't want to get into the "Poe was a drug dealer" thing. Could she perhaps be a seller of info? A Resistance spy and/or a former freelancer who sees the way things are going and opts to pitch in on the Resistance's side?
 
The only way I think the drug runner thing could work for Poe is if he was working undercover doing a point break type thing.
 
Palpaprince would work best as a powerless figure head fought iver by Moff "Regents" as they use him to give themselves legitmacy
 
tankdrop24 said:
The only way I think the drug runner thing could work for Poe is if he was working undercover doing a point break type thing.
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Particularly as the whole "son of Resistance heroes, wanting to live up to their example" thing was so solid to begin with. For that matter, they could've just had Zorii be a Resistance contact.

Been reading some more of the comics, and I'm really hoping we get something that lets Rey have an identity of her own again. Maybe something where, after the main events of TRoS, she goes and gets herself a Kyber crystal, reckoning with who she now is along the way.

In happy news:
 
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