XCOM and the other rebel forces are so totally outclassed by ADVENT that I do not believe it's worth even thinking about them. The most recent update demonstrates that they will at best force us to waste time, effort, and mental stability pulling them out of the fire repeatedly. If we begin to seriously threaten the Ethereals I have no doubt at all that they will stop sandbagging and obliterate the resistance forces in short order.
Not necessarily. There are still those Ethereals who want to do an uplift, who are probably holding the guys who would want to do that back. They also have to recognize the threat, and then actually pin down the Resistance. ADVENT's misinformation campaign blaming deaths from the Ethereal sacrifices on the Resistance may actually come back to bite them on that front, too, making it harder for anyone to tell what the Resistance is actually doing, or how much of a threat they actually are. ADVENT is not necessarily the exact same as the Ethereals, either. I somehow doubt the human collaborators have the ability to command battleships or anything like that. So no Rods from God without permission, probably from an Ethereal.

Moreover, XCOM and the other factions, particularly EXALT, have been stealing Ethereal tech for decades. If we could give them better tools for analyzing it, they'd potentially have the capacity to build themselves into a force able to go toe-to-toe with ADVENT within a fairly short period of time. Same with better comms abilities, as previously stated. It's not like the Resistance factions have nothing to bring to the table, even if most of it was stolen from ADVENT. The Templars have learned a lot of psionic tricks, as have some of EXALT, apparently.

You also seems to making your judgement of how outclassed the entire Resistance is purely on the basis of a single settlement that seems to be in the middle of Bumblef*ck, Nowhere. Probably not the best place to use as representative of all the Resistance.

I believe I am firmly in the "we need more data before we can say anything definitive about any faction's odds" camp at the moment. We really need to stop trying to assume we actually understand what the situation looks like from a glance at the entire plane and a single encounter with an outpost. It's clear that the Resistance isn't doing so good. It remains to be seen, however, if they can actually recover from that, with our assistance or without. We need more data before we can start eliminating options with any degree of confidence.

Edit: I think we should at least try and learn why the Resistance is doing so poorly. If it's something we can easily help them with, that could turn things around. If it's not, then we don't help.
 
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I think any military solution needs to focus on achieving and maintaing orbital supremacy. Victories on land aren't really significant when your opponent can just throw kinetic kill vehicles at your stuff.
 
Ethereals and ADVENT are a part of interstellar ftl capable empire.
There is no realistic method for XCOM to win other than convincing ethereals to leave them be.
 
XCOM and the other rebel forces are so totally outclassed by ADVENT that I do not believe it's worth even thinking about them. The most recent update demonstrates that they will at best force us to waste time, effort, and mental stability pulling them out of the fire repeatedly. If we begin to seriously threaten the Ethereals I have no doubt at all that they will stop sandbagging and obliterate the resistance forces in short order.
I was not speaking about ADVENT vs XCOM. I was speaking about ADVENT vs Jade and XCOM vs Jade. If Jade does succesfully oust ADVENT and etherials, and takes over, directly or via proxy, without talking to XCOM and other rebel forces first, they'll end up opposing her. And it will be completely reasonable for them to do so. And it will also be completely meaningless, because Jade is benevolent. So, this will be creating meaningless suffering, and it will be entirely on Jade.

Even if XCOM was completely outclassed and had no chance of victory even with our help (and no, the last update does not show that, as this is not an XCOM base) in form of supplies and technological boosts, talking to them would still be worthwhile.
No. No oaths of fealty. We fought about them enough when it was Sidhe. Treating mind control like candy is how the Ethereals and XCOM became the ethical sinkholes we're fighting about right now. Also completely unnecessary, because:
Then you should also be opposing using AIs. There is a very strong difference between Sidhe (a young teen in a vulnerable state of mind) wanting to bind herself to us personally, and an adult fully cognizant representative with incredible autonomy (because no, we won't be able to regularly check up on them) swearing an oath of loyalty to their sovereign.
Once we figure out more about ADVENT's cyberwar capabilities we can replace this entire proposal with "Deploy an AI with an appropriate skillset".
The situation will not be solved with cyberwar. The situation will end up with a conventional (in the sense that there will be physical fighting in the streets) war. An AI won't be able to obtain human resources, which will be needed, with anything approaching the efficiency of established rebel forces.

And this assumes that ADVENT cyberwar capabilities, which are psionics based, do not outclass ours.

Summarizing my points:
1) If we want to solve situation long-term for the betterment of humanity, we will need to either contact and negotiate with etherials from the position of strength, or utterly destroy them in a war
2) A necessary step towards achieving long term solution is minimizing the amount of humanity's resistance to our intervention. This necessitates talking to rebel forces
3) We do not have personal time now or in the near future (measured in terms of tens of months at least) to solve the situation on this plane.
 
You implied they do at least some non-combat things. They clearly have science and engineering teams, and they seem to work as the logistics and coordination center for all the other groups
You mean how they R&D and build combat equipment? How they coordinate combat missions? Those aren't exactly great examples of non-combat activities.
Note that I consider Jade focusing on the war in the plane preview perfectly proper. There was no reason for her to consciously think about e.g. their relief efforts and helping independent settlements, if XCOM do that.

Hunter academies and associates are not that different from XCOM. Worse in some ways, as XCOM at least does not use child soldiers, and is not (notably, at least from my recollection) racist. Better in some others, as grimm don't seem to be sapient.
At least in the source material, Huntsman academies admit students at 17 and train them for 4 years before they are supposed to see any unsupervised or prolonged combat. The main cast being thrown into war wasn't part of the system, but of the metaphorical chess game between Ozpin and Salem.
Seeing as how Jade distinguishes the three faunus that mom helped get into combat schools as teenagers compared to the group of children, I think this applies to Ignition as well:
It turns out most of the children don't even know what their Semblances are yet, nor are they sure how they're supposed to use them. A few of them will be going to non-combat schools and don't even have unlocked Aura.
You have only slightly better luck with the teenagers. While three of them do know how to use their Semblance
As to racism, while it's wide-spread in the academies, it isn't institutional. And I'm pretty sure that XCOM has a "shoot first" policy against any alien species that they encountered so far, which is a form of racism. Imagine a sectoid wanting to join XCOM and tell me with a straight face that they'd consider it.

We, frankly, don't have time for a long term personal occupation of this plane. We have, on our plate:
  1. MGLN
  2. PMMM
  3. Magi
  4. Earthland
While I agree with MGLN and Magi, I'd like to point out that Neph convinced Jade that Kyubey was pretty much neutered. Since she doesn't know about the rest of his race, we have no IC reason to consider PMMM "on our plate".
Siofra isn't "being actively mind-controlled" anymore, she has a mental block. Since she predicted we'd have to ramp up for years before dealing with Calypso had she won and enslaved Siofra, we can't realistically call dealing with Earthland deities "on our plate" either.

So, if we feel the need to deal with XCOM plane, or, really, any other plane we are not currently already involved in, my proposal would be to delegate. Find a stable mature individual of upstanding moral qualities. Extract an oath of fealty from them, possibly a conditional one / one with an expiration date. Give them royal grade artificial vessel with all the bells and whistles, a replicator (I forgot how they were called), an intelligent device, some way to communicate with us across planes if possible and a goal. Let them deal with that.
The plane I'd most like to involve ourselves with would be Thedas, since Neph set us a time-limit for that, and freezing the plane gives us only a few months extra.
We can't bring people apart from our friends across planes, and most of our goals aren't really something we can pawn off on someone else:
  • planeswalk to people under darkspawn attack to save them and earn their worship as a saint
  • retrieve artifacts inside the Fade before it "becomes a lot more dangerous", scan the Fade to "greatly improve your own enchantments", try whether the Fade being a dreamrealm allows Neph to manifest
  • learn their style of magic
  • let Agneyastra scan certain creatures, libraries, ...
have been stealing Ethereal tech for decades. If we could give them better tools for analyzing it
Agneyastra's scanners can analyze neither Elerium nor alien alloys properly, and that's what most of their tech is made of. Besides, if we had the proper tools, don't you think Agneyastra would reverse-engineer things faster than XCOM? Tech/information assimilation is one if her specialties, after all.

You also seems to making your judgement of how outclassed the entire Resistance is purely on the basis of a single settlement
No, he's basing it off Jade's look from Eternity where she found out that the Ethereals are deliberately letting XCOM survive. She suspected it after the first look and got confirmation on the second.
 
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While I agree with MGLN and Magi, I'd like to point out that Neph convinced Jade that Kyubey was pretty much neutered. Since she doesn't know about the rest of his race, we have no IC reason to consider PMMM "on our plate".
I admit to only vaguelly remembering, but wasn't there an issue with witch population and magic girl population sustainability?
Siofra isn't "being actively mind-controlled" anymore, she has a mental block. Since she predicted we'd have to ramp up for years before dealing with Calypso had she won and enslaved Siofra, we can't realistically call dealing with Earthland deities "on our plate" either.
Ok, fair enough.

The plane I'd most like to involve ourselves with would be Thedas, since Neph set us a time-limit for that, and freezing the plane gives us only a few months extra.
We can't bring people apart from our friends across planes, and most of our goals aren't really something we can pawn of on someone else:
  • planeswalk to people under darkspawn attack to save them and earn their worship as a saint
  • retrieve artifacts inside the Fade before it "becomes a lot more dangerous", scan Fade to "greatly improve your own enchantments", try whether the Fade being a dreamrealm allows Neph to manifest
  • learn their style of magic
  • let Agneyastra scan certain creatures, libraries, ...
Dragonage might need doing but... When? We have too much on our plate as it is.
Agneyastra's scanners can analyze neither Elerium nor alien alloys properly, and that's what most of their tech is made of. Besides, if we had the proper tools, don't you think Agneyastra would reverse-engineer things faster than XCOM? Tech/information assimilation is one if her specialties, after all.
We also know that Agneyastra is under a mental filter that prevents her from discovering immortality, and might also block other things (I have strong feelings about Earth being one of the blocked topics).
 
I admit to only vaguelly remembering, but wasn't there an issue with witch population and magic girl population sustainability?
This?
Home could use some safer soul-cleansing techniques, Reds are kinda scrawed since their cleansing is harder despite being so effective.


Dragonage might need doing but... When? We have too much on our plate as it is.
We can freeze it after JS if we want. Visit it after Nanoha has mind shields?

Though, if we would be planeswalking to aid people all the time, there is no feasible way to take Nanoha and Sidhe with us for that.
 
As to racism, while it's wide-spread in the academies, it isn't institutional. And I'm pretty sure that XCOM has a "shoot first" policy against any alien species that they encountered so far, which is a form of racism. Imagine a sectoid wanting to join XCOM and tell me with a straight face that they'd consider it.
This looks like trolling.

XCOM has a "shoot first" policy against the alien species they have encountered so far because the alien species they have encountered so far have been hostile. If they encounter a new kind of alien then they would probably assume that the new alien is hostile and attack but that would be because the Ethereals control the local space, alter genetics to create new creatures and have pulled tricks like that before. It wouldn't be because they believe all aliens are inherently inferior to humans or nonsense like that.

Racial discrimination and racial prejudice are also not the same thing e.g Laser hair removal is much easier for white people than black people because their skin reacts differently to light. People use Tibetan mastiffs to hunt bears rather than chihuahuas because Tibetan mastiffs are actually better at hunting bears. Note I'm not defending any self serving bullshit like white supremacy. To be specific discrimination against aliens would not be racism it would be speciesism.

Sectoids are a genetically engineered slave race completely brainwashed by master psychics that know what they are doing. The possibility that one would want to join X-COM is exceedingly remote. The probability that one would want to join X-COM and it not being a trick by the Ethereals is practically 0.
 
Random question, what was the plane whose time seemed very disjointed compared to the others? Because that would be a detriment to make any long-term strategies there (if we leave for a week and don't know if it's going to be a day or a decade, for example).
Adhoc vote count started by Filraen on Feb 16, 2019 at 9:15 AM, finished with 260 posts and 27 votes.

  • [X] Channel Blue.
    -[X] Receive feedback from Agneyastra on possible low-risk strategies.
    -[X] If no good plans are forthcoming, retreat while the parasite droids are destroyed. Self-destruct them only if the Hunter comes too close or doesn't shoot them.
    -[X] In case of retreat, continue looking for outposts where Parasites can steal non-essential technologies, especially soul scanners.
    [X] Have the remaining four Parasites self-destruct, then fly away yourself.
    [X] Make sure that the Hunter gets as little of your tech as possible, then fly away.
    -[x] Use techniques that let the Hunter keep thinking the spider droids belonged to the group he was hunting.
    [X] Loop around to behind the Hunter, exit the Stalker, fly up, and fill his general area with a Celestial Lance or nine. Unless his flesh is made of solid alien metal, which you sincerely doubt, he should die eventually. As long as you stagger your shots, glowing gold light should block his view of the surrounding area until after you've hit him with yet another Celestial Lance.
    [X] set everything within a couple kilometers on fire. Not with linker core magic though. Cast Pyroclasm.
    [X] Fly the Stalker to within 400 meters of the Chosen Hunter and telepathically speak to him.
    -[X] Ask him if he can point you to the Seeker's fortress, you want to talk to her about stealing your Space Princess bit.
    --[X] Offer him eighty Parasites to hunt for the directions, and letting the humans flee. Given as the Hunter seems to be a bit of a thrill-seeker, having a horde of killer droids chase him seems like the sort of thing he'd enjoy. It's not like he has the best track record of obedience anyway; you think the Ethereals would barely bat an eye if he "accidentally" let yet another group escape.
    -[X] If he wont stand down, have your parasites self destruct, stow the stalker and leave.
    [X] Loop around to behind the Hunter, exit the Stalker, fly up, and fill his general area with a Celestial Lance or nine. Unless his flesh is made of solid alien metal, which you sincerely doubt, he should die eventually. As long as you stagger your shots, glowing gold light should block his view of the surrounding area until after you've hit him with yet another Celestial Lance.
    -[x] Channel Black on the off chance it helps. You're not sure if it will, but if there's a color suited for making things stay dead it would be that.
    [X] Loop around to behind the Hunter, exit the Stalker, fly up, and fill his general area with a Celestial Lance or nine. Unless his flesh is made of solid alien metal, which you sincerely doubt, he should die eventually. As long as you stagger your shots, glowing gold light should block his view of the surrounding area until after you've hit him with yet another Celestial Lance.
    -[x] Channel Blue and spoof his senses make him think that he was taken out by a surprise XCOM task force.
    [X] Have the remaining four Parasites self-destruct, then planeswalk away yourself.
    [X] Have the remaining four Parasites self-destruct, then planeswalk away yourself.
    -[X] Back in the Forest of Sorrows, talk with Vaynel (and the rest if they have woken up, and Sigurd if he has returned) explaining the situation and asking what she would have been the best course of action.
    [X]Get out of the staker far enough away to no give away the existence of the stalker.
    -[X]Channel Blue and talk to hunter in the Alien language to buy time.
    -[X]Well talking to him prepared a sleep spell and use it on him. Anything good enough to work on you in the past is worth using on enemies.
    --[X]Once he is asleep go and deep scan him and take his stuff.
    [X] Channel Blue.
    -[X] Receive feedback from Agneyastra on possible low-risk strategies.
    -[X] If no good plans are forthcoming, retreat while the parasite droids are destroyed. Self-destruct them only if the Hunter comes too close or doesn't shoot them.
    -[X] In case of retreat, continue looking for outposts where Parasites can steal non-essential technologies, especially soul scanners.
 
Why are people arguing XCOM and the Ethereals are morally the same. The Eldrazi showed up because the Ethereals were already immoral dickheads. The Eldrazi just made the Ethereals more targeted in goals, not a shift in methods.
 
Ethereals and ADVENT are a part of interstellar ftl capable empire.
There is no realistic method for XCOM to win other than convincing ethereals to leave them be.

Not anymore~

Random question, what was the plane whose time seemed very disjointed compared to the others? Because that would be a detriment to make any long-term strategies there (if we leave for a week and don't know if it's going to be a day or a decade, for example).

Confirming the ninja: Earthland, but Jade is pretty sure it isn't going to do that anymore,


Why are people arguing XCOM and the Ethereals are morally the same. The Eldrazi showed up because the Ethereals were already immoral dickheads. The Eldrazi just made the Ethereals more targeted in goals, not a shift in methods.

This is basically begging to restart the morality argument. Please don't. ;-;
 
I think any military solution needs to focus on achieving and maintaing orbital supremacy. Victories on land aren't really significant when your opponent can just throw kinetic kill vehicles at your stuff.
Depends on who can authorize the kinetic strikes, and how much they're paying attention to the war. Personally, I wouldn't give ADVENT command access to such things, if I were the Ethereals. Probably not the Chosen, either. I mean, their servants betraying them is not a new thing for the Ethereals, including at least one known Chosen who betrayed them in this setting. And I think even an Ethereal might die if they got hit with a kinetic strike. Plus, they do seem to need humanity alive, at least for the moment, due to how many bodies they go through on a regular basis, so they can't get too crazy with Rods from God.

Those are a common problems with this type of top-down controlled evil empire, honestly. If the guys in-charge are lazy or busy, it can seriously bog down decision-making, and they have to be wary of betrayal if they give their servants too much power. It's not like the Ethereals have absolutely not exploitable weakpoints in that regard.
Ethereals and ADVENT are a part of interstellar ftl capable empire.
There is no realistic method for XCOM to win other than convincing ethereals to leave them be.
Uh...that's not necessarily the case. It sounds like they used to have one, sure. But it's unclear to me if they still have one, or if they're taking their entire fleet and tech base with them wherever they go, based on what's been said in "Written by the Losers". The phrase "The Ethereals once had a major multi-system empire..." seems to indicate they either no longer have an empire, or it's grown much, much weaker.

Either way, though, their entire leadership seems to be either on Earth, or wandering around looking for more species like humanity. And their empire, whatever the size, seems rather likely to be very top-down controlled, with all the power in the hands of the Ethereals. Should we deal with the guys on Earth, it should take the guys who left about an equal amount of time to the occupation to return. So, a couple decades. Assuming they took roughly a straight-line path, of course, but I'd say they'd at least have a few years to prepare.

Given that they can't totally trust their subordinates, and their opinions on personhood, I don't see anyone but an Ethereal being able to order fleets around, though maybe they have subordinates they trust that much. I suppose the guys who left might be able to order a closer fleet to attack Earth from where they are, but they also might not. There are a lot of variables to the current situation, and we don't know most of them, so I see no reason to make any solid conclusions for the moment as to the feasibility of any plan of attack.
You mean how they R&D and build combat equipment? How they coordinate combat missions? Those aren't exactly great examples of non-combat activities.
Note that I consider Jade focusing on the war in the plane preview perfectly proper. There was no reason for her to consciously think about e.g. their relief efforts and helping independent settlements, if XCOM do that.
...Did I really delete all my comments where I say this? I guess I probably did? Yeah, no, I'm aware they're building weapons. I was going to say as much, then deleted the comments. Not sure why, though. Still technically not combat.

Hell, not even all their R&D is likely to be weapons development (medical advancements, for example), and it's entirely probable not all their coordination is going to be combat missions (infiltration, scouting, smuggling people out of ADVENT-controlled territory, though the first two are definitely more innately linked to combat than the last). Resistance efforts, like any military endeavor, require a lot of logistics and behind-the-scenes work, not all of which is necessarily focused on open, or even guerilla, combat
As to racism, while it's wide-spread in the academies, it isn't institutional. And I'm pretty sure that XCOM has a "shoot first" policy against any alien species that they encountered so far, which is a form of racism. Imagine a sectoid wanting to join XCOM and tell me with a straight face that they'd consider it.
Sectoids, maybe not, but I could see that with a couple other species. Sectoids being able to control minds kinda makes one joining a massive risk for any Resistance movement to take. But they work with the Skirmishers, so them accepting an alien Skirmisher-equivalent doesn't seem entirely outside the bounds of possibility. Might be unlikely to work out, but I could see it happening.
Agneyastra's scanners can analyze neither Elerium nor alien alloys properly, and that's what most of their tech is made of. Besides, if we had the proper tools, don't you think Agneyastra would reverse-engineer things faster than XCOM? Tech/information assimilation is one if her specialties, after all.
Maybe. But they have a decade or two head-start on her, and there's more than one of them. Plus, they have the tools for analyzing and working with alien tech, as seen by the piece of alien tech they made their base. I think a collaborative effort between her and their R&D would likely end up being even more effective than either group working alone. Also, I was more thinking about giving them better computers for faster and better modeling than scanning tools.
No, he's basing it off Jade's look from Eternity where she found out that the Ethereals are deliberately letting XCOM survive. She suspected it after the first look and got confirmation on the second.
Uh...not seeing that in the update. Like, I looked. It says they were sandbagging at first, but nothing about them keeping XCOM around now. I think I vaguely recall a WoG on the subject that backs up you, but it's not in the update. That said, even if you're correct, that doesn't mean XCOM is in as bad a situation as this one outpost, nor that XCOM is entirely screwed and unable to succeed.
This looks like trolling.

XCOM has a "shoot first" policy against the alien species they have encountered so far because the alien species they have encountered so far have been hostile. If they encounter a new kind of alien then they would probably assume that the new alien is hostile and attack but that would be because the Ethereals control the local space, alter genetics to create new creatures and have pulled tricks like that before. It wouldn't be because they believe all aliens are inherently inferior to humans or nonsense like that.

Racial discrimination and racial prejudice are also not the same thing e.g Laser hair removal is much easier for white people than black people because their skin reacts differently to light. People use Tibetan mastiffs to hunt bears rather than chihuahuas because Tibetan mastiffs are actually better at hunting bears. Note I'm not defending any self serving bullshit like white supremacy. To be specific discrimination against aliens would not be racism it would be speciesism.

Sectoids are a genetically engineered slave race completely brainwashed by master psychics that know what they are doing. The possibility that one would want to join X-COM is exceedingly remote. The probability that one would want to join X-COM and it not being a trick by the Ethereals is practically 0.
I dunno. If they're still pulling the same sh*t they did canonically with the chips in brains, or something equivalent, maybe an alien could break the brainwashing, same as a Skirmisher, by yanking the chip, or by a chip malfunction. Certainly, we know the Chosen aren't necessarily loyal, though why one of them turned so quickly on the Ethereals isn't clear. Sectoids are a huge gamble due to their psionic powers, but a Muton, Archon, or Viper, I might see them accepting. Probably only after some serious test to confirm their independence, mind you, but I could see it happening.
Ah. Good to get confirmation that their empire has crumbled, though this raises a number of questions about their infrastructure and ship-building capacity. Maybe they bring it with them, along with their alien armies? Definitely something to look into.
 
Ethereal Plane: Additional Info
Special thanks to @saganatsu, @DB_Explorer, @BunnyLord,@fictionfan, and my five other patrons not mentioned here. @Torgamous and gets an even more enthusiastic "Thank you."

QM's Note: Despite the amount of information Jade seemed to gain from the plane preview, it was still missing some information she should know. I decided to invoke Rule 0 and add in a little extra on top of that for the sake of "setting knowledge not required." Also, I'm locking the vote since I apparently forgot to earlier.



Anyone who opposes the Ethereals automatically gets lumped under the mantle of "Dissident Elements," but that doesn't mean they all get along with one another. The split mostly occurs among the major factions, though. The numerous minor factions tend to get along with everyone simply due to not having much contact with them. It's debatable as to if they should even be called factions.

XCOM is definitely on the friendliest terms with the hundreds of minor factions across the globe, most of which edge closer to simple defensive militia groups. XCOM sends in squads to defend "Resistance Havens," or settlements, whenever they're attacked in force by ADVENT, focusing more on defending civilians than on actually killing the ADVENT attackers. They distribute weaponry directly and help new Havens contact groups capable of providing them with other necessary supplies. XCOM's mobile Avenger tends to spend most of its time chasing various rumors of basic supply caches and intact alien hardware. With so many examples of ADVENT technology available for them to steal, they've entirely discontinued their live alien capture-and-torture research program from decades ago. These days, they "just" torture their enemies to gather important intelligence. They'd probably stop if they had a good substitute and keeping said substitute was contingent on them stopping, or if the two methods were somehow mutually exclusive in some other fashion.

XCOM usually has a couple other sabotage, rescue, or recon missions going at any given time and only perform a single major military operation each 5-7 days. Considering ADVENT spans the entire globe, these victories tend to have a nice local impact, but don't do much to stop ADVENT's overall efforts. Good for morale, but not for the war.

EXALT doesn't provide half as much in the way of direct military support. However, they have tried to take the place of ADVENT's famous gene therapy clinics and medical facilities. They aren't always successful, but at least they've managed to make Meld-based cures to a few different genetic diseases and every STD they know of. They've also dramatically increased the survival rate of cancer patients, although most of those tend to just go for the guaranteed cures found in ADVENT hospitals. Those who have lost body parts can sometimes obtain replacements from EXALT, but there's a rather long waiting list; EXALT can't make their own Meld, or the alien nanomachines perfect for changing humanity, and they need it for practically everything they do.

The Templar... well, they'll sometimes help defend Resistance settlements against ADVENT attack, you'll give them that much. You're not really sure their pseudo-religious counseling can really be looked at as a positive impact, not when the more successful cases so often end up joining the Templar themselves. The Templar tend to stay apart from the rest of the Resistance and look at possible missions through the lens of "Would this help improve those we send to complete it?" They frequently send their members to fight against the countless zombies in Earth's old cities, an endeavor everyone else agrees is pointless. They don't much care; it's good for training the psionic and combat strength of their members, and in the end, that's what they care about.

The Skirmishers have taken on a somewhat odd role within the Resistance. If there's a mission that will involve numerous skirmishes across a longer period of time, you can be assured the Skirmishers can be found there. They've separated themselves from much of the Resistance, but for a completely different reason than their allied Templar: the Skirmishers are hurting. It's hard for them to reconnect to most civilians when their bodies have been drastically changed and their minds wiped of nearly all knowledge of their past life. They retain just enough to let them guess at what they lost in their misguided attempt to selflessly serve a benevolent government. For this reason, they form their own camps and settlements apart from everyone else, viewing their fellow Skirmishers as family and Ethereals as the worst monsters imaginable. Anything that is done to fight said monsters can only help whoever they originally wished to defend.

The Reapers were first born from a few different kinds of "special operations" groups that were horrified when Earth's governments surrendered. Having forged bonds with their foreign allies, they went dark and fled to the wilds, doing what they could to ensure the new ADVENT Coalition couldn't learn of them until they were sure it was actually benevolent. Well, ADVENT wasn't, so they decided to do what they always did best: assassinate or kidnap important officials, incite rebellion, steal important information, scout out hostile areas, and make things explode. You can often find at least one of their masked forms in each of the larger Resistance Havens, but they're usually there to gather information instead of guarding against enemy attacks. They'll help if the settlement is attacked, but that's not what they're there for. The surviving members of the original Reaper groups view themselves as being irredeemably damned through their actions, but they believe the consequences of stopping would damn others.

The Pilgrims have accepted the various technicians, artists, and charismatic speakers who didn't wish to join XCOM. They try very, very hard to avoid personal combat or risking themselves, using remote drones to put up propaganda posters and only going in person to meet with those who already seemed on the brink. If their drones spot something worth stealing, they tend to inform XCOM or a local Reaper camp.


Honestly, you don't think the Ethereals are likely to stop sandbagging no matter what you give the Resistance or what the Resistance does with it. They might sandbag less and "ensure" that these groups are actually worth all the trouble, but never suffering severe consequences for their harmful actions seems to be ingrained into the Ethereal consciousness. They wholly blame the Eldrazi for their current state instead of accepting that their own projects were responsible for the Eldrazi being summoned in the first place.

...This despite permanently banning any such projects in the future...

Okay, I get that they're aliens and everything, but I think this might count as some sort of species-wide insanity by now.
 
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the Skirmishers are hurting. It's hard for them to reconnect to most civilians when their bodies have been drastically changed and their minds wiped of nearly all knowledge of their past life. They retain just enough to let them guess at what they lost in their misguided attempt to selflessly serve a benevolent government.
Kind of want to attempt a mass recruitment drive for this entire faction.
 
Kind of want to attempt a mass recruitment drive for this entire faction.
Shouldn't even be that hard. We can't cure amnesia yet, but we could probably transfer them to human bodies based on their genetics.

And if etherials are unlikely to stop sandbagging, then my suggestion is to supply all factions (or at least most of them) with artifical vessels. Get at least a few elite operatives royal grade ones, so they could go toe-to-toe with Chosen. Ideally resulting in at least one chosen getting captured, so we could study their bodies (I suspect our methods of bodily enhancement might be widely enough divergent that, based on the scans, we will be able to improve our vessel significantly).
 
Shouldn't even be that hard. We can't cure amnesia yet, but we could probably transfer them to human bodies based on their genetics.

And if etherials are unlikely to stop sandbagging, then my suggestion is to supply all factions (or at least most of them) with artifical vessels. Get at least a few elite operatives royal grade ones, so they could go toe-to-toe with Chosen. Ideally resulting in at least one chosen getting captured, so we could study their bodies (I suspect our methods of bodily enhancement might be widely enough divergent that, based on the scans, we will be able to improve our vessel significantly).

You'll have to argue with Agneyastra IC over that one; you doubt she'd voluntarily agree to it. Even when the Ethereals are clearly in a position to wipe out humanity as it is, she'd still be reluctant to share important Agni secrets, even indirectly.
 
You'll have to argue with Agneyastra IC over that one; you doubt she'd voluntarily agree to it. Even when the Ethereals are clearly in a position to wipe out humanity as it is, she'd still be reluctant to share important Agni secrets, even indirectly.
What grade of vessels would she be willing to give out? And, assuming (only assuming, not asking whether we'll be able to do it), we upgrade the capabilities of royal grade vessels significantly through intelligence we gather from EXALT (meld technology), XCOM (research into alien alloys and other technologies) and other factions, essentially making current royal grade vessels obsolete when compared to the resulting synthesis technology, would she be willing to share current artificial vessel technology?

Or, rather, not technology, but the vessels themselves.
 
Well, someone will eventually have to deal with them. Maybe if mom gets a tissue sample, she can develop a way to get rid of them en masse?
Reminds me of Southpark:
"Whatever you do... ...don't kill the Zombies!"
"What? I can't hear you! I'm too busy killing Zombies!"
"No, don't kill the Zombies! We can cure the living dead, but we can't cure dead dead! So if you kill the Zombies, they stay dead dead! Everything will be all right as long as no ones out there killing Zombies!"
 
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