James D. Fawkes
Court Scribe
- Location
- Avalon (Isle of Mists)
The original point being made was that vanilla Artoria could fight Herk without any trouble. Perhaps the original intent in that post was, "OG Saber," and not, "Artoria without a Rin tier Master," but that's what I was responding to, because OG Saber puts up a decent fight in every route, but without Excalibur — which she is usually very judicious about using in FSN, although not always — she very decidedly cannot casually take several of Herk's lives. She has to resort to her Noble Phantasm, because she literally doesn't have enough ways to kill him to take more than a single life. Otherwise, in a battle of attrition, Herk is going to pound her into the dirt eventually.
Like, I can't believe I actually have to say it, but don't underestimate Herakles, guys.
Re: Caliburn, we don't actually know how many lives it would take normally. When Saber and Shirou used it in the forest to take seven lives in one go, they stabbed it into his body before it activates, bypassing the impenetrable skin. We also, for whatever reason, never see Emiya actually using it. It's entirely possible that, like Avalon, he loses his "image" of it after the Grail is dismantled and his connection to Artoria is cut.
The thing about Artoria? If she gets a steady supply of energy, she's mostly self-sufficient. She does benefit a lot from a really good Master like Rin, but even without that, she can keep herself going on her own a lot better than, say, Iskandar can.
Hell, just having Space Ishtar would trivialize most of the enemies.
What I tried to do was introduce logistics and a little more realism to Chaldea's situation. They have a lot of magical energy to throw around, but most of it goes to powering CHALDEAS, SHEBA, TRISMEGISTUS, and other vital functions, because the sabotage hit them hard and it's going to take months to repair all of the damage and rebuild their normal generators. They're not miraculously back up to full functionality less than two months after taking that hard a hit, and so their ability to hold and maintain Servant contracts is diminished.
Chaldea are very much the underdogs in this fight. I think it makes for a more compelling story when the team is soldiering on and still completing their missions while half the facility is held together by duct tape, a dream, and Da Vinci's Noble Phantasm.
Like, I can't believe I actually have to say it, but don't underestimate Herakles, guys.
Re: Caliburn, we don't actually know how many lives it would take normally. When Saber and Shirou used it in the forest to take seven lives in one go, they stabbed it into his body before it activates, bypassing the impenetrable skin. We also, for whatever reason, never see Emiya actually using it. It's entirely possible that, like Avalon, he loses his "image" of it after the Grail is dismantled and his connection to Artoria is cut.
I actually do have to correct one tiny part of this: Kiritsugu is not a good Master. He can provide Saber enough energy to fight, sure, so he's not incompetent, and he's better than Shirou for sure, but the smartest thing he did and the thing that makes her so strong with him as her Master is that he summoned her in Germany, where the Arthurian legend is much stronger than in Japan. Her Luck stat is so low for a reason.
The thing about Artoria? If she gets a steady supply of energy, she's mostly self-sufficient. She does benefit a lot from a really good Master like Rin, but even without that, she can keep herself going on her own a lot better than, say, Iskandar can.
Things would quickly get out of hand if I let things go that way. At that point, there wouldn't be any reason for the team not to spam summon everyone they could, picking up every contract for every Servant to ever appear in the franchise, and not only would the cast bloat beyond belief, there would be almost no tension whatsoever in the combat portions of this story. Every problem would be solvable.
Hell, just having Space Ishtar would trivialize most of the enemies.
What I tried to do was introduce logistics and a little more realism to Chaldea's situation. They have a lot of magical energy to throw around, but most of it goes to powering CHALDEAS, SHEBA, TRISMEGISTUS, and other vital functions, because the sabotage hit them hard and it's going to take months to repair all of the damage and rebuild their normal generators. They're not miraculously back up to full functionality less than two months after taking that hard a hit, and so their ability to hold and maintain Servant contracts is diminished.
Chaldea are very much the underdogs in this fight. I think it makes for a more compelling story when the team is soldiering on and still completing their missions while half the facility is held together by duct tape, a dream, and Da Vinci's Noble Phantasm.
