I think that at some point "let's break open the Black Vault, what can go wrong?" plan is almost certainly going to be enacted. And then we'll have to deal with Solar Marcone and possibly his lunar mate Harry Dresden. Also quite possibly our father exalting, because Knights of the Cross are likely selected using similar (if not the same) mechanism as the one built into exaltations.
Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Crossover Fantasy
- Location
- Germany
I kinda doubt Michael would exalt.
He has his Sword and his faith and that is enough. No need for a magical superweapon grafted to his soul.
This could be after he puts the sword down, if this happens here. Or if we are forced to heal him enough for him to count as a creature of darkness.
- Location
- Germany
Eh, "retired hero" is not really the kind of thing Exaltations go after.
I really think he's doing a very solid job right now and it would take very exeptional circumstances to either make him triumph in a way that attracts a Solar Exaltation or fail/die in such a way that he would seriously consider taking the deal for an Infernal/Abyssal one.
Most likely he will just remain a heroic mortal with an OP-artifact and a good bit of True Faith.
Given that he is guided by big D Destiny to keep the world working, he could be a Sidereal. A retired hero choosing "war and pain" over "peace and comfort" is very much an example of a solar exaltation. Him surviving grievous wounds to keep fighting the good fight could attract a lunar one.
Still, this is all speculative until and unless we stand before the Black Vault ready to open it and survive the process.
And I just got an idea on how to start getting there - Molly realized that Mantles are kinda very similar to, if lesser than exaltations. We could use that realization and, after finding the Ankou, ask for the location / way to find the oldest Mantle. There's a non-zero chance this would point us in the direction of an exaltation. Possibly the first ever exaltation. Which, come to think of it, might be a prototype of an an alchemical kept in stasis deep in the remains of Autochtonia.
1)Too powerful I think.
Something that can subvert not one but two Fae Court Ladies and Mab's handmaiden to boot is definitely a lot more powerful than the ancient vampires that serve as one of the cutoffs for DPoE
2) Molly Exalted during the events of Proven Guilty, which is Year 6 of the timeline.
In canon, Maeve was killed in Year 12.
So 6 years.
Of course, dont expect events to follow the canon timeline.
Dresden might not end up as Winter Knight here. The Red Court might fall to Act of Molly rather than Act of Dresden.
Events might accelerate.
The fluff of the spell makes it clear that it only applies to lesser wicked things.
Things weaker than ancient vampires for example. Weaker than other Exalts, than the greatest Black Spiral Dancers, than Maeljin Incarna, than Malfeans.
So I suspect that Nemesis and the Walkers should ignore it just fine.
That said, it does count lineages as disparate as Maeljin Incarnae and Malfeans as among things that were potential targets.
So it doesnt really care what the source of the power that makes you a wicked thing is.
Just that you are.
Ergo expect it to work on lesser Outsiders, assuming they are independent entities and not teleoperated drones.
Oh sure, I agree.
But I assume that when you are an army, even a fraction of the true power of an Exaltation would be a regular war winner, else Enma-O's mooks would not have bothered to carry it around. The fact they still got bodied by Mab's forces in spite of that is a pretty clear indicator of who's the Big Cheese.
1)While the mythic lore from the Nepalese monks suggests that the Dragonblooded might have been a thing here, I suspect the Black Vault either isnt native to this setting, or it was opened ages ago and its contents are in different universes from this one.
The very fact that Usum found himself in the NeverNever is proof that Exaltations arent limited to mortal reality.
2)Michael is Claimed.
Celestial Exaltations dont happen to people who already possess significant supernatural power, like DBs and akuma.And dude bears a Sword of the White God.
I would assume this was much the same reason why Mab was comfortable with the Infernal Exaltation being that close to Lloyd Slate; dude was claimed by a Mantle, and there was no room for two supernatural powers, and Winter is not so weak that it can be displaced. Same reason I doubt anyone with a Fallen coin can Exalt; Fallen angel calls dibs.
3)Plus, I dont really think the QM has set up the story to deal with writing almost a thousand Celestial Exaltations running around.
But thats a Doylist argument.
- Location
- Germany
I would agree on the Winter Knight's mantle, but Coin and Sword are both not bound as deeply, people can and have dropped either of them.
I suspect if someone like that came into a situation where they would normally Exalt, they might have the conscious or unconscious choice to drop the divine instrument and exalt normally.
Though I don't think Michael would do that under most circumstances.
I don't think it'll apply as a categorical thing, but I'd it does I think it'd work for the lesser outsiders. Even if they're remote controlled, whatever is doing it can only put it sliver of itself into the act. Maybe we can't cow the guy behind the mask, but the fragments of their attention are smaller per individual drone.
Infernal exaltations being buried deep under modern hells tracks with ExvsWoD lore - they weren't in the Black Vault.
That denarians can't exalt without dropping the coin is likely true. That Knights can't is arguable. The Sword is basically Ally N/A on their Stat sheet, sorta like having a Sidereal exalted being really invested in your well being.
Mantles are significantly tighter bound to the person that a Sword is.
The counter example seems to be that we are likely assembling a circle already, so allies and teammate NPCs are likely within design specifications of the quest. The numbers could be dealt with by saying that parallel Earths in the NeverNever all count as one world, and that exaltations can select people on other worlds.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Honestly, this is all speculation and metagaming. We don't know how DP set up the cosmology, and we don't even know IC that other Exaltations exist. For now, I'm interested in solving the problems that are in front of us while building up our power base. Everything else can wait.
And, if we really wanted IC information on Exaltations, there's an easier way to do that, since Lash basically confirmed that her original copy knows exactly what we are, and we know exactly where her coin is. Just ask what either she specifically or the Denarians in general know about our power. They're old enough to remember when Exalts were going around and doing stuff, so they'll know enough that getting the information from them directly via Crown will be a good primer on the nature of Exalted and their place in the setting.
And, if we really wanted IC information on Exaltations, there's an easier way to do that, since Lash basically confirmed that her original copy knows exactly what we are, and we know exactly where her coin is. Just ask what either she specifically or the Denarians in general know about our power. They're old enough to remember when Exalts were going around and doing stuff, so they'll know enough that getting the information from them directly via Crown will be a good primer on the nature of Exalted and their place in the setting.
- Location
- Norway
For much the same reason, I think that would be a waste of a perfectly good Exaltation.
One of the functions of both the Exaltations and the Swords of the Cross is getting humans to a level where they can fight millennia-old supernatural nasties.
The Exaltations do this by stuffing the humans full of immense amounts of dragon-suplexing, ocean-punching, nuke-dodging superpower.
The Swords do almost the opposite, saying to dragons "No, you get down and fight on my [bearer's] level. See how you like being a squishy meatbag that gets hurt for once."
It's redundant to put both of those in one person.
Vote closed, let's see how this goes.
Considering how aware of the supernatural the carpenters are, that might have been deliberate. Your true name from your own lips is a big deal, and doesn't need to be shared all at once, so a nick name that doesn't give away the first part of it is a simple and useful security precaution.
Technically calling her Maggie or Kat would also work, but adding another completely unrelated name isn't going to hurt anything. Considering Charity's everything I wouldn't be completely surprised if she went max paranoia for her firstborn.
- Location
- Germany
The top two were intended to go together by most voters.
Doubt it myself.
Celestial shards dont ask in Ex2. In Ex2WoD RAW, Lunar and Solar shards dont ask; Abyssal shards will arrange your murder and then possess you, and while Infernal shards will ask, if you decline, the attached demon murders you before moving on. None of these seem like things the protections afforded a Knight would allow.
If they'd dropped the Sword or passed it on, sure they'd be candidates, but while they bear the Swords?
IMO, its safe to say no.
Besides, Celestial shards are not going to contest the White God for one of his Champions.
Denarians otoh are basically Fallen akuma as long as they hold the Coins. And akuma are classically not eligible.
If they'd already dropped the Coin, or only had a shadow in their head, I assume they'd be candidates, but once they take up the Coin I'd say the Fallen has called dibs.
That might work. We'll see I guess.
The Infernal shards also roused to activity once other Celestial Exaltations were in the world.
By that measure, once Usum's shard was first wielded by the Raksha of Lanka, and then later by Enma-O's lot, all of the remaining 50 or so Infernal Exaltations would have been active.
If we had 50 Infernal Exaltations flying around this planet, I flatout guarantee that the world would be unrecognizable.
No, Uriel is Ally NA.
The Swords are closer to a mirror of the Denarian coins, only with the restriction where they only use as much power as is necessary to level the battlefield, however much or little that is.
We have seen the Swords actively take a hand where necessary.
See the final battle of Changes, when Murphy was literally channelling an Angel. Or Dresden choking Nicodemus to unconsciousness, with Fidelacchius straight up countering Anduriel's attempt to interfere.
Allies and friends yes. An Exalted Circle no.
A group of Exalts is way, way more than the sum of its parts, and gets the same sort of focus.
Molly is a short form of Margaret.
Winning Vote
Arc 2 Post 46: Threading the Needle
Threading the Needle
22st of July 2006 A.D.
"Wait..." you trail off, unsure how to ask this. Bob doesn't seem to be a formal sort of spirit, but somehow joking around does not seem fitting either, fun as it has been to tease Harry. "Bob, you were struggling to remember right now weren't you, that's... someone did that to you didn't they?" And now the bit you are worried about, he was struggling to remember necromancy. "Is that part of you still around with all those pierces dark and struggling to remember what you know."
This time Bob does not speak at once, but kind o sizes you up and not in the way he had done at first meeting: "You know sphinxes would hate you with all this guessing. To answer the question, no, someone did not do this to me. I did it, I did not want to remember that part of my... life I guess, it's not technically true, but I still feel that you fleshy sorts are being a bit presumptuous claiming the word." The humor feels forced and his eyes do not glimmer.
He'd done it to himself... Sometimes, not often, but sometimes you wish you did not understand as much as you do now. You cannot even imagine how desperate he must have been for peace to have done that to himself. A spirit of intellect cutting off a part of its mind would be like a bird tearing off one of its wings.
"He might still be around, there's about a hundred years of... memories, thoughts, emotions, of twisting " Bob explains, grasping for words. "If you meet him try to fight him on this side of the veil and don't try to get fancy. That would be the time to conjure a firestorm boss."
Harry nods, he looks troubled, but not surprised. "I'll take care of it," he promises
On your way up the stairs he explains what he knows about what he calls 'Evil Bob', though you doubt his former mater Kemmler himself calls him that. The dark alter ego had apparently managed to entrance and almost kill Harry when he had commanded Bob to remember, though later by the use of his name and the bond between them Harry had been able to get Bob back to his senses.
No wonder Bob had wanted to be rid of the thing, if an invocation of Name suppressed it then it was basically its own thing already, like a parasite growing inside him.
"So that's all I know, didn't even know Bob had cut his evil side out until now, just thought it was locked away after..." As the trap door creeks open Harry suddenly stops, eyes widening. "Stars and Stones."
"What?" you ask urgently
"The dead man, the one that was with Katrina, I thought it might be one of the Black Cort, an old one that can bear the sun, but I just thought of what else it could be, Evil Bob in a zombie suit."
"Could he he used as a sacrifice?" you ask with a tinge of unease at how easily your mind had gone there, but only a twinge. "The thing tried to kill you!" you exclaim as much to those doubts as to the ones you can see writ on Harry's face.
Though Harry does not look entirely convinced he answers. "I don't think so, spirits are not alive or dead, they either are or they are not."
"Well OK, then let's see what Gard and Lydia think about all this..."
***
As it happens Gard mostly thinks this is a headache she didn't ask for, though she seems almost philosophical about it. She mutters something in Ye Olde Norse that sounds less like a curse and more like acknowledging some truth of the world. You'd ask her that she means but Lydia...is not doing well.
As soon as she hears the name Mab she freezes, then as you start to explain what you had guessed about both how Arwan had come to his state and what Katrina was planning her breath goes shallow as she looks around the living room. From the sheer terror in her eyes you would not be surprised to know she is about to throw herself at the door or a convenient window.
You're not the only one to notice. Mouse wraps himself around her ankles as she starts to rise, almost tripping her in the most fluffy of ways only to turn his head with an innocent look. 'Who me? I could not possibility be trying to keep someone from doing something silly?' the expression seems to say.
"I have to... I have to go..." she falls silent looking between you and Harry. "You're not going to sell out dad to Queen Mab are you?"
"Mab isn't paying me anything so I can hardly sell anyone," Harry tries to make light of the situation. "What do you know about Mab?"
"The bits you just said, about how my father used to serve her though not from love, but then by the wisdom of Kemmler he escaped her, that she hunts him ever since. The Grey Heir told me, told me what to look for in the library to confirm it, that is why I trusted her, if someone's former master helped my dad get out of durance vile than they must have been trustworthy."
"So just to be clear you do not want the mantle?" Gard asks, rubbing her temples.
"I don't want my dad to die and to have to bargain for his life with the queen of the wicked fairies!" For the first time since you got here Lydia raises her voice.
Far from being upset at the show of anger Gard looks... satisfied. Had she been trying to get a rise out of Lydia? Why?
"Well your father has made some questionable decisions, I cannot say I do not understand them, but understanding does not cut the knot. Mab must have her hunter of the dead, now more than ever, but he need not die as you two guessed..." she motions towards you and Harry. "And it does not have to be you. Ankou there are more than one, those who passed into the hands of Winter long ago. Summon and bind one of those and they should be a fair enough match for the Blackened Mantle as you guessed the mind of the Queen of Air and Darkness."
Between you and Harry you had decided that the best way to hide that the Crown could divine Mab's intent was to call it a guess, true Gard would be free to assume that Harry had attempted to summon spirits and contacts, you had certainly been down in the laboratory long enough for both, but the lie that is not explicitly spoken cannot be picked apart. 'Detective work is just a series of educated guesses,' Harry has said, a little flippantly.
He is not looking flippant right now, if anything he looks weary, circles around his eyes and stubble well on its way to being more fifty hour shadow than five o'clock shadow. "We need to find them..."
Who do you scry?
[] Arwan using a keepsake he gave Lydia, it might give you another powerful ally, or if he has been caught the location of the ritual sight... but Harry would have to either break his word, or you would have to incapacitate him before he could speak Mab's name calling her
-[] Write in plan
[] Evil Bob, if Harry's guess is right he's with Katrina, but how do you explain Evil Bob and the connection you have to scry him without revealing Bob
-[] Write in plan
[] Mathews, he is either close to Katrina or he has answers, but you would need to travel all the way to his home and break in to find a focus
-[] Write in plan
[] Write in
OOC: I did not even roll for anyone guessing about the intellectus because it is too fantastical for anyone to even come close to ther truth on such sparse evidence and since you just came out of a wizard's laboratory you are not even the focus of attention.
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That is how I took them don't worry.
Rolls
Talking to Bob
Harry to figure out about Evil Bob in a box
Lydia's willpower
Reading Gard
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
We couldn't use a bit of hair or blood from Cindy for this?
You could try but it would be far from guaranteed to work, she's his granddaughter and even with a child of the target it might not work.
Well we have IDs for most all of the major players.
The table is set.
We go home, get hair or blood from Cindy, then Harry uses it to track him. Unless they're adopted, it should work, just like Chichen Itza was going to murder every member of the Dresden bloodline, and DID kill all of the Red Court.
Or we just ask Cindy for an item of clothing; her grandfather paid for her entire wardrobe.
And she might have gifts on hand; a necklace, a photograph, or something similar.
Or we can pull a picture of Alice, her sister as backup. Social media should provide.
EDIT
Or we can use (an image of) the Mercedes as a focus.
He was a passenger in it earlier today.
The table is set.
Nah we use Cindy.
We go home, get hair or blood from Cindy, then Harry uses it to track him. Unless they're adopted, it should work, just like Chichen Itza was going to murder every member of the Dresden bloodline, and DID kill all of the Red Court.
Or we just ask Cindy for an item of clothing; her grandfather paid for her entire wardrobe.
And she might have gifts on hand; a necklace, a photograph, or something similar.
Or we can pull a picture of Alice, her sister as backup. Social media should provide.
EDIT
Or we can use (an image of) the Mercedes as a focus.
He was a passenger in it earlier today.
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Point of order:
A month ago Dresden used Charity's blood to find Molly in Proven Guilty canon; that was how he realized she was in the NeverNever, and tracked her into Arctis Tor. And in this case, Mathews has been acting in loco parentis for her, strengthening the sympathetic connection.
It should work just fine.
Just that it occurs to me that scrying the Mercedes or, better, Black Rider would probably be even more effective.
Use Black Rider as a focus, and ask the Crown to give us the current location and previous 24-hour movement history of everyone who has been inside the Mercedes ever since we hit it with HMP.
Then cross-reference with Black Rider's movement history.
Still gonna need to go to the Carpenter household, to get Lydia armored up. Molly might get a quick bleach bath in the interim.
QUESTION
Is the Mercedes still at the tattoo parlor?
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