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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

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BoredMan said:
I didn't say that it doesn't matter when. What I said was that your elaborated reasons for being against doing it now rather than later could be used to deny them every time until it's 'appropriate' but that there wouldn't be such a time by your apparent standards this March but they are going to be answered this month regardless because they are on the Plan Vote so this reasoning of yours isn't justification to not do it at any particular point in time during the current month.


Degorium's reasoning for wanting to do the free action now rather than potentially several real life months later is my own
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My point is that if no order is more appropriate IC than any other than it doesn't matter when we do it. OOC time for it is just time for us to chew on something we won't use until later anyway.


BoredMan said:
We can't do everything at once due to time and essence constraints and what you seem to be asking for is that we make Arcs even more drawn out instead of of leaving some newly discovered plot threads for later because of how drawn out some of our Arcs have been.
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I'm not suggesting we draw things out more; I'm talking about the ordering of the things we'll do anyway because we voted for them.

By putting similar synergistic stuff together we can build on what we're doing in one slice of the arc and not need to double back as much. There's an overhead cost to task switching.


BoredMan said:
What opportunity(s) would we be missing out on by coming back to the make a movie plotline later this month instead of doing it right here and now?
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I think we'll do a better job organizing things if we put these things together at once. Just establishing all of these people together in a cohesive plan saves us time and effort compared to needing to come back and reorient later.

What we're doing now is like making a list of chores to do in town, then doing them in a random order. Go to the store and buy eggs, leave for the gym, come back to the store to get bread, go to see a movie, then back to the store to get more stuff.

It's hard to tell what the best approach would have been without seeing the other side of the action*, but it's pretty likely we'll forget or ignore stuff as a simple function of context switching.



* Beyond basics like not having our experts involved in organizing things from the beginning.
BoredMan said:
When you say general task do you mean different AP actions that are related in location and or objectives? You are going to have to explain this because what you seem to be suggesting, that we combine similar AP actions to make multi Arcs, would make those Arcs feel even more drawn out rather than giving us a breather in between.
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What I mean is that we've already voted to do a set of things involving a topic at a location. If we do it together then we can account for all the pieces and won't need to come back for the change after we've done a big adventure.
 
[X] Alchemical goods, no doubt useful, but who knows who they might trade it to afterwards or what they might be able to deduce about your art
 
BronzeTongue said:
My point is that if no order is more appropriate IC than any other than it doesn't matter when we do it. OOC time for it is just time for us to chew on something we won't use until later anyway.
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Another words you'd never bother to include it anywhere for this Month though it's on the list for March so not doing so at any particular point is questionable with the logic you've laid out and arguing against it with your reasoning is just plainly illogical as it can be applied every time during March until DP writes it in anyway after all other actions listed have been exhausted and so it ends up in March just pushed back for reasons that became irrelevant the moment that plan vote won with them on it.

I don't see the point is applying this logic of yours if all your actually doing is pushing them back to later in the month anyway at which point those reasons you've expressed for not doing them now should still apply.

Perhaps then the most important reasons to do or not do them now rather than later in the month would be non-objective in nature as the objective reasoning falls flat due to the reality of the situation. No listed action for this month involves Thorned Namshiel, for example but that question is going to be asked this month anyway.

At any rate I've given my non-objective reasons already so if you have any..

BronzeTongue said:
I'm not suggesting we draw things out more; I'm talking about the ordering of the things we'll do anyway because we voted for them.

By putting similar synergistic stuff together we can build on what we're doing in one slice of the arc and not need to double back as much. There's an overhead cost to task switching.
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BronzeTongue said:
I think we'll do a better job organizing things if we put these things together at once. Just establishing all of these people together in a cohesive plan saves us time and effort compared to needing to come back and reorient later.

What we're doing now is like making a list of chores to do in town, then doing them in a random order. Go to the store and buy eggs, leave for the gym, come back to the store to get bread, go to see a movie, then back to the store to get more stuff.
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Double back.. it should be 2 AP either way.

I struggle to see what notable loss in time or efficiency is being taken by coming back to the create games action later when the movie shouldn't be finished by the end of the month anyway. Not that I'm saying their wouldn't be any but at this point I think it's a matter of preference much moreso than factually loosing out on anything notable regarding brand building.

BronzeTongue said:
It's hard to tell what the best approach would have been without seeing the other side of the action*, but it's pretty likely we'll forget or ignore stuff as a simple function of context switching.

* Beyond basics like not having our experts involved in organizing things from the beginning.
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The last action taken was to start making a movie the suggested action by you is to follow up right after with expanding upon that to start working on a brand/franchise. The concepts are simple enough that I don't see forgetting or ignoring important facets as something to be concerned about.

You are definitely right in saying that the supposed loss in coming back to this later is rather vague. It may not in actuality be notable enough to warrant any regret or second thoughts after the fact. I think that is more likely than not in this case considering the actions in question.

BronzeTongue said:
What I mean is that we've already voted to do a set of things involving a topic at a location. If we do it together then we can account for all the pieces and won't need to come back for the change after we've done a big adventure.
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Doing that would drag Arcs out for the reasons described in the post you're responding to, exasperating the issue you described of Arcs feeling exhausting/drawn out since while it would be a matter of opinion it is a fact that we'd still be doing the movie action in more detail with another AP action tied to it.

And I mean, it's a forum format. If people forget relevant concepts and ideas for the action later on you can just go back and quote it like I immediately asked you to for your Hungry Earth Splendor when we got back around to the portal defense action, then Azais reposted it in the very next post.

The background stuff your alluding to is mostly off-screen stuff anyway and the movie shouldn't be being launched anytime soon it's in the earlier stages of development so it's not like I'm arguing we should launch the Squidgame Netflix series without the pink outfits to go alongside it at the time of release.
 
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Well if we're talking about pacing I really thought it would be more along the lines of an interlude. In between our business in South America and going after the people in the Never Never or Bob or even the construction of the god. Just an hour and a half in in our Workshop after a shower where it's nice and cold so the water never really goes away asking these questions and taking notes and then when the then when our Essence refilled getting to work doing whatever activity would come next because these questions are largely expository so taking a quiet moment in between two events makes perfect sense at least to me.

That's at least what occurred to me that's why I didn't pose it with an activity I meant it to be kind of an expository quiet moment that might inform a future action but the turn is already decided so having that information to go over and think about while the quest continues would be helpful a very least in my mind.
 
Yog said:
I understood it to mean that it is possible to delegate it to a clone. But the actions were placed in prime molly section of the plan (I checked).
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...It caused some confusion when you put SGI then Evil Bob right under that subsection because I don't think anyone read that linked post and thought you meant anything other than having a clone do it. I know I didn't.
 
BoredMan said:
...It caused some confusion when you put SGI then Evil Bob right under that subsection because I don't think anyone read that linked post and thought you meant anything other than having a clone do it. I know I didn't.
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I just quoted the plan, and the plan had it like that because I copied the option directly from what @DragonParadox presented as options here. I did put it i to the prime Molly section of the vote though. And yes, I realize now how this could confuse people. My apologies. If this is being done as an SGI action, though, there's a free slot in prime Molly's calendar.
 
Yog said:
I just quoted the plan, and the plan had it like that because I copied the option directly from what @DragonParadox presented as options here. I did put it i to the prime Molly section of the vote though. And yes, I realize now how this could confuse people. My apologies. If this is being done as an SGI action, though, there's a free slot in prime Molly's calendar.
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Yeah, penciled that in as SGI because it used the tag.
 
Yog said:
Sorry about the confusion caused. I'll be sure to remove the tags in the future, instead of just relying on the vote structure. Well, it's going to be interesting following Sophia around.
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I should have been more clear about what they meant too, but right now I think a bunch of people voted for the plan on the reasoning that it put a clone on that job so I can't change it
 
Vote closed.
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Jan 16, 2025 at 1:31 PM, finished with 24 posts and 7 votes.
  • [x] Alchemical goods, no doubt useful, but who knows who they might trade it to afterwards or what they might be able to deduce about your art
    [X] Money, you have plenty of it and no doubt the ghouls will have some use for it, though they might hesitate to share their most ancient of secrets for such a mundane price
    [x] Balefire weapons, the least palatable offer, but also the most likely to get full answers out of them. Everyone can always use more weapons
    -[x]On the condition that they tell us which enemies they plan on using their newfound fortune on.
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Arc 15 Interlude 8: The Map and the Monster New
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    • The Map and the Monster ​

    11th of March 2007 A.D.

    It was said the R'hani were so old that the very language in which their name had first been spoken was gone from the earth, that their ancestors had seduced holy men who sought the desert for the nearness of God or laid with Djinn for strange and arcane powers that burned in their blood. Though given that their principal occupation through all the years that the Council had good records of was as information brokers it's hard to tell how much of that was truth and how much fabrication. Marketing was a lot older than TV after all. Sophia pushed the vial of malcoffee across the table to the darkened side where a pale arm, maybe a little too long fingered picked it up for a taste. Eyes bright as a jackal in moonlight widened in... Surprise, appreciation? It was hard to tell without a good look at their face. It was times like this that Sophia misses power that she had technically never possessed, the full power of the Crown, but she was the way the hand tightened jealously on the glass before setting it back down with practiced care of one long accustomed to inhuman strength.

    The R'hani didn't speak English, or at least he choose not to, speaking instead in Latin, though with an odd turn of phrase that hinted at an age great enough to recall it when it was yet a living tongue, or at the very least learning it from one such. "Goods are satisfactory. What do you hunt?"

    "Corpse-lord, ancient, they say none such dwell in this land. I happen to know from a very reliable source that 'they' are mistaken. Impress me with your knowledge child of Lamashtu."

    "Assuming I knew about a thing like that why would I feed a pretty thing like you to an old demon, just for the thrill of staking your corpse after they send it back writhing with their will?" The ghoul challanged.

    "I would not go alone..."

    "Nor would he be," the ghoul leaned over the table his eyes filled with something Sophia did not expect, genuine concern. "You know the Ten in the Scriptures yes, stir this one and this land will be as if facing an Eeeventh."

    A part of Sophia wanted to play dumb and ask if he meant Commandments. "I don't wish to tempt God, but I have faith he would not allow it and I have faith in my allies to be the instrument of that fact."

    "Why wake that which has laid beneath the baren sands for so long?" the lore broker asked, gleaming eyes unblinking.

    "Because he has already begun to move."

    The ghoul actually laughs. "It's been moving for three hundred years ever since the Englishman," his face twisted into an oily smile as he looked to Dina. "Only now does the Council notice?"

    "The Council notices many things jakal," as threats go it's not very subtle, but then judging by the way the lettering on her bracelets begins to glow cherry red it's probably not meant to.

    "I'll take that as a 'yes' then," the ghoul answered with a dismissive snap of his jaws. Then he pushes a hand drawn map across the table. "That is where the Englishman found it, where it lay for years beyond knowing. A skilled seer might find its trail if they do not go mad." The ghoul shruged, the gesture a little rtoo fluid as he if had extra joints in his arms. "If you go mad from what you have no buisness finding it, fair?"

    Sophia considered the map for a moment and more than the map. It was a brutal way to look at it, but not, she was forced to admit unwaranted. "Fair."

    Who do you bring in to examine the ancient tomb?

    [] Molly Prime

    [] Lydia

    [] Tiffany

    [] Write in

    OOC: Olivia is not availibile, she already has a lot on her plate this month.
     
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    • BoredMan said:
    Another words you'd never bother to include it anywhere for this Month though it's on the list for March so not doing so at any particular point is questionable with the logic you've laid out and arguing against it with your reasoning is just plainly illogical as it can be applied every time during March until DP writes it in anyway after all other actions listed have been exhausted and so it ends up in March just pushed back for reasons that became irrelevant the moment that plan vote won with them on it
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    You're being weirdly aggressive about this. I don't have a particular problem with the questions, but prioritizing firing off something we won't use for a month seems odd to me.
    BoredMan said:
    Double back.. it should be 2 AP either way.

    I struggle to see what notable loss in time or efficiency is being taken by coming back to the create games action later when the movie shouldn't be finished by the end of the month anyway. Not that I'm saying their wouldn't be any but at this point I think it's a matter of preference much moreso than factually loosing out on anything notable regarding brand building
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    It's more a matter of setting things up all at once and accounting for them together. The AP spent is the same, but task switching as a player base tends to make us lose track of things.

    The more things we try to do at once the more it pays off to be organized about doing them.


    BoredMan said:
    The last action taken was to start making a movie the suggested action by you is to follow up right after with expanding upon that to start working on a brand/franchise. The concepts are simple enough that I don't see forgetting or ignoring important facets as something to be concerned about.

    You are definitely right in saying that the supposed loss in coming back to this later is rather vague. It may not in actuality be notable enough to warrant any regret or second thoughts after the fact. I think that is more likely than not in this case considering the actions in question
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    What we voted to do was to triple down on the movie action. Media blitz had prepping for TV shows and investigating table top gaming applications in it as well. My point is that we essentially voted to start on our next media action without the rest of the resources allocated for it.

    So what we're doing it letting the studio run along working on a broad directive with no knowledge of all the other very relevant stuff we'll be doing whenever we get back to this. They aren't accounting for alien media serving similar purposes that we could stick together as one effort. In a realistic development environment this would result in work getting thrown away or hastily modified when it could have accounted for it from the beginning.


    BoredMan said:
    Doing that would drag Arcs out for the reasons described in the post you're responding to, exasperating the issue you described of Arcs feeling exhausting/drawn out since while it would be a matter of opinion it is a fact that we'd still be doing the movie action in more detail with another AP action tied to it.
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    For my part at least I think part of the drag on is when we get done with something big and come back to some other random task instead of a conclusion. This sort of planning wouldn't completely solve that issue, but at least we wouldn't come home from a long month of high stakes assassinations that spiraled out of control or what have you only to find we still need to do the proverbial dishes.
     
    BronzeTongue said:
    You're being weirdly aggressive about this. I don't have a particular problem with the questions, but prioritizing firing off something we won't use for a month seems odd to me.
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    You've straight up been ignoring what I've been telling you then. Whatever man. I'm being aggressive because on this it's like I've been talking to a brick wall. It's prioritized for this month. Arguing against asking them at any particular point this month seems odd to me. You act as if it's any ask at all when it's a free action that takes nothing away by voting for it and your reasoning provided for not doing so can be applied literally anytime but is made irrelevant because it's going to be asked at some point this month regardless of the fact that we wont be using those answers this month.

    So your seemingly objective logic is inane as fuck and when I explain why you just repeat it like that makes it more sound somehow.

    BronzeTongue said:
    It's more a matter of setting things up all at once and accounting for them together. The AP spent is the same, but task switching as a player base tends to make us lose track of things.

    The more things we try to do at once the more it pays off to be organized about doing them.
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    Nope. Either be less vague or drop it. I already explained why this isn't really an issue. You ignored that statement then repeated yourself with the same generalizing statements.

    And if your wondering what I'm referring to go back and reread my previous post. It's one of the bits that you excluded in your quotes to allow yourself to continue giving vague general statements that don't help anyone understand anything.

    BronzeTongue said:
    What we voted to do was to triple down on the movie action. Media blitz had prepping for TV shows and investigating table top gaming applications in it as well. My point is that we essentially voted to start on our next media action without the rest of the resources allocated for it.

    So what we're doing it letting the studio run along working on a broad directive with no knowledge of all the other very relevant stuff we'll be doing whenever we get back to this. They aren't accounting for alien media serving similar purposes that we could stick together as one effort. In a realistic development environment this would result in work getting thrown away or hastily modified when it could have accounted for it from the beginning.
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    For this month yes. As in during this month. There wasn't a vote to do it all back to back, just within the month. Otherwise we wouldn't have the option of doing them separately.

    These are separate media actions that can be done at once for the goal of building a franchise/brand which is what you're arguing we should've did. Even though doing it all in the same month is still all at once for the same goal merely not back to back. The loss in doing it this way if any is negligible if it'll even be noticeable to the overall playerbase. It's mostly background off-screen actions that your alluding to.

    BronzeTongue said:
    For my part at least I think part of the drag on is when we get done with something big and come back to some other random task instead of a conclusion. This sort of planning wouldn't completely solve that issue, but at least we wouldn't come home from a long month of high stakes assassinations that spiraled out of control or what have you only to find we still need to do the proverbial dishes
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    I gave examples. Stop being vague or stop responding. I've already elaborated on why what your suggesting we do is something we already do with examples given and why us doing things that way makes Arcs take longer not less in the interest of saving time later. As far as I can tell we already do what you are saying we should be as I've literally provided examples of us doing so in more than one instance. Was us killing and dismantling all of Mikaboshi's assets then going into Hell to nuke the Wicked City not us sticking around for longer to do the proverbial dishes after being attacked?

    We are already doing what your saying we aren't doing. What you also want us to do is to double and possibly triple down by doing multiple AP actions that seem related back to back thus making multi-Arcs of similar actions which would exasperate the Arc exhaustion you are telling me is an issue.
     
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