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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

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uju32 said:
We wouldnt? WoG is that if we built a smartgun and used Hollow Mind Curse on it, we get bonuses.
4 dice is already better than the average shooter.
Dex 4 + Firearms 0 + Laser targeting device + Demon bonus dice would still put us firmly in the upper tiers of gunplay.
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Even before all of that, just going off raw stats, it would still be useful to have a gun in some situations. Simply being an obvious ranged threat will make many potential enemies act cautious.
 
9 dice isn't even mortal maximum.

It would be impressive...for mortals.

Who are not a metric you should measure yourself against, unless you have no standards as an Exalt or any serious supernatural.l

Edit: At that point we might as well have bought Firearms 5, the Wicked City gun charm and Transc Anathema. But we didnt.
 
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Valkhir said:
So the plan was... to deter those who would try to specific entrap an Infernal by firing upon someone we are protecting, or surrounding us...To use 4 dots + whatever Hollow Mind gives?
Yeah, I can't support that in any event.

4 dice is exactly average, but we aren't speaking in situations where that would be useful, and I don't expect the Hollow Mind demon to give more than 2, maybe 3 dice
I am expecting the laser to just be some sort of Aim action related thing, which we...are not good at.

Edit: But my biggest gripe is still, even above how I dont favour this path of exp spending...
We bought a Melee, Craft and Occult focused character. I don't like moving away from it for what I see as no great benefit we couldn't do elsewhere.
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1)Yes it was.
A heavy pistol deals 5L. A heavy revolver deals 6L. Our Demon Weapon deals Strength + 2, which is currently 6L.
Its even worse if that pistol is benefitting from Transcendent Anathema or Green Sun Wasting, which means its dealing Agg.

And a firearm is an obvious threat that must be taken into account.

2)There is a difference between a dip to shore up a weakspot and a dive into a respec.

Every Celestial Exalt who could did a dip into Sorcery to buy Demon of the First Circle and possibly Counterspell. Didnt make them sorcery focused. Harry Dresden has carried a revolver since Storm Front. It doesnt make him any less a Occult and Investigation focused character. Charity is Michael's armorer and his principal sparring partner. When we went to Arctis Tor she loaded for melee.

She still wields a shotgun at home.

And frankly, given that Splintered Gale is one of the charms that we will be aiming for, we are eventually going to need 1-2 dots of Firearms anyway. Because our clones will be reliant on our Attributes and Abilities, and wont be able to channel Excellencies to fight anyone who attacks them.

Earth-Destroyer said:
Anybody worth shooting is not going to be hit by a measly 9 dice.
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......
The Capriocorpus by Dresden. Grevane by Carlos.
Both Kemmlerite necromancers. Both over a hundred and fifty years old, with the experience thereof.
Both killed with pistols by bogstandard wizards with no ordinary shooting skill at the time.

Happened in Dead Beat. IC, I think its still less than a year ago.
 
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[X] Lydia's background, see if you can get her to talk about her family more
-[X] Lead into the conversation by asking what attracted her to our dorky baby brother.
 
DragonParadox said:
A small note Hollow Mind Possession on its own does not give the device any more demonic enhancements, just an AI. If you want your stunner to shoot bolts of lightning you are going to have to make it a Gadget.
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Nono, Hollow Mind Possession + Electric Devil Caress (this is the name I think?) and you can make a moving robot out of junkyard scrap.
The gun will have to be a fetish through either sorcery or Devil Refining Cauldron. Dresden has a fetish, what do you think Bob is?
uju32 said:
People in melee range can catch these hands. Dudes on top of buildings with sniper rifles, in cars doing drivebys, or even flying in the sky throwing flaming monkey poo(real case!) require other solutions.
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what??? we were talking about pistols, no?
Or just get either hellish wind blast charm, or one that just conjures weapons outright.
uju32 said:
We can either be superfast, or learn to fire magic lasers, or make a gun.
With the benefit that the gun wont stand out the way that a magic laser will, if you're trying to stay a little covert, and is a relatively cheap dip.
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besides obvious blasty charms and need to go fast anyway, weird wounds like from lasers or lightning blasts get buried much easier into beaurocracy then bullets.
 
uju32 said:
1)Yes it was.
A heavy pistol deals 5L. A heavy revolver deals 6L. Our Demon Weapon deals Strength + 2, which is currently 6L.
Its even worse if that pistol is benefitting from Transcendent Anathema or Green Sun Wasting, which means its dealing Agg.

And a firearm is an obvious threat that must be taken into account.

2)There is a difference between a dip to shore up a weakspot and a dive into a respec.

Every Celestial Exalt who could did a dip into Sorcery to buy Demon of the First Circle and possibly Counterspell. Didnt make them sorcery focused. Harry Dresden has carried a revolver since Storm Front. It doesnt make him any less a Occult and Investigation focused character. Charity is Michael's armorer and his principal sparring partner. When we went to Arctis Tor she loaded for melee.

She still wields a shotgun at home.

And frankly, given that Splintered Gale is one of the charms that we will be aiming for, we are eventually going to need 1-2 dots of Firearms anyway. Because our clones will be reliant on our Attributes and Abilities, and wont be able to channel Excellencies to fight anyone who attacks them.


......
The Capriocorpus by Dresden. Grevane by Carlos.
Both Kemmlerite necromancers. Both over a hundred and fifty years old, with the experience thereof.
Both killed with pistols by bogstandard wizards with no ordinary shooting skill at the time.

Happened in Dead Beat. IC, I think its still less than a year ago.
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Yeah I mentioned even mortal heavy hitters can be you know squishy secondary powers aren't always a thing sometimes you can throw down fireballs doesn't mean your fireball proof for instance.
 
Goldfish said:
Even before all of that, just going off raw stats, it would still be useful to have a gun in some situations. Simply being an obvious ranged threat will make many potential enemies act cautious.
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This.
People have to respect the threat. They arent going to stand out in the open, taking their time to aim at you if you are shooting back.
They arent going to attempt to rush you and your party with impunity when you are putting shots down range.

Ranged firepower is useful for more than just immediate kills.
It shapes the battlefield.
Wwind said:
what??? we were talking about pistols, no?
Or just get either hellish wind blast charm, or one that just conjures weapons outright.
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Yes, we're talking pistols.
People are recorded to have done triple digit yard shots with a 1911 .45; the videos are up there on Youtube. When you're rolling Dex 4 + Laser Sight 1 + Demon 2 + Stunt 2, you are very close to what the theoretical max dice pool for an unassisted human could be.

Ive considerd the weapons charm, but it doesnt fit our current theme atm.
Also, it costs 12 XP for a 3 dot charm.
I cant justify it yet as an expenditure.
Wwind said:
besides obvious blasty charms and need to go fast anyway, weird wounds like from lasers or lightning blasts get buried much easier into beaurocracy then bullets.
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The opposite.

Bullets are mundane. Dead bodies with bullets in them are a workaday event for homicide investigators, assuming there are any bodies. Corpses who have weird energy beam damage or exotic poisons or (god forbid)radiation are Interesting. They draw investigators. CDC sends investigative teams to see if there is a risk. Doctors write articles about them and submit to NEJM.

I mean, Im here for Flight + Superspeed charms.
But lets not fool ourselves.
 
If you want to shoot serious-face agg bullets those re going to look like radiation on any bodies recovered, or at least they are going to look more like radiation than any mundane cause of death.
 
DragonParadox said:
If you want to shoot serious-face agg bullets those re going to look like radiation on any bodies recovered, or at least they are going to look more like radiation than any mundane cause of death.
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I'm happy with a regular muggle handcannon, though probably something with a bit more capacity than Harry's revolver. No need to shoot nuclear hatefire bullets, or whatever they would be when fired as part of using a Charm.

And it's not like a regular firearm can't punch far above its weight class in some situations. Making or purchasing silver or steel bullets wouldn't be overly difficult or expensive, and they will ruin all sorts of beasty's days.
 
are there powers that let you see an approximation of some of someone character sheet? Cause I'm pretty curious what mouses is like.
 
uju32 said:
People have to respect the threat. They arent going to stand out in the open, taking their time to aim at you if you are shooting back.
They arent going to attempt to rush you and your party with impunity when you are putting shots down range.

Ranged firepower is useful for more than just immediate kills.
It shapes the battlefield.
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I am not sure how this bears out mechanically.

I don't think there is a kind of overwatch mechanic, or suppressivs fire.

You just trade shots while being in various degrees of concealment that isn't affected by being shot iirc.

Edit: At this point we aren't really going to convince each other anyway, though, I think.

One question from me towards a different mechanics.

Do threshold successes from an attack increase damage like in Ex2?
 
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DragonParadox said:
If you want to shoot serious-face agg bullets those re going to look like radiation on any bodies recovered, or at least they are going to look more like radiation than any mundane cause of death.
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Welp.
I guess if we ever have to shoot anyone with Agg in Chicago, we're going to have to lay low for the next couple months.
Because words like radioactive bullet wound attracts serious gentlemen from Fort Detrick, Atlanta, Langley and Quantico.
 
Valkhir said:
I am not sure how this bears out mechanically.

I don't think there is a kind of overwatch mechanic, or suppressivs fire.

You just trade shots while being in various degrees of concealment that isn't affected by being shot iirc.

Edit: At this point we aren't really going to convince each other anyway, though, I think.

One question from me towards a different mechanics.

Do threshold successes from an attack increase damage like in Ex2?
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There are mechanics for a prepared shot being easier and one that you are shooting from behind cover being harder, that is not an issue.
 
Do treshold successes increase damage pool in ExWoD?

So if you have 10 succs to hit, enemy blocks 7, does your damage pool get 3 extra dice? Similar to how Exalted and DV worked?

Or just STR+2 if we use our sword?

Either way Dex would keep being king, it just means that its more optimal to just throw tons of multi attacks at someone at dice level we think would still hit and just hit (STR+2) x number of attacks.

Difficulty doesnt go above 9 anyway.
 
say with mouse being a temple dog and them apparently getting power off thresholds according to jim butcher and mouse having used other sorts of power to make up the difference when he lived with dresden. Two questions dragonparadox you have any quest thought of what those other things are and two when mouse lived in the carpenter house which has probably the strongest or at least top 5 thresholds in the u.s. minimum any idea how that will affect them here? Especially since as a temple dog who were said to be divine guards or whatever it will matter since michaels house later on has literal fucking angels in it not even counting the super threshold from his love and devotion reciprocated through the whole family.
 
Valkhir said:
I am not sure how this bears out mechanically.
I don't think there is a kind of overwatch mechanic, or suppressivs fire.
You just trade shots while being in various degrees of concealment that isn't affected by being shot iirc.

Edit: At this point we aren't really going to convince each other anyway, though, I think.

One question from me towards a different mechanics.
Do threshold successes from an attack increase damage like in Ex2?
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1)Not the GM, so take whatever I say with salt.
That said, V20 has a Maneuver named Cover, to reduce the chance of an attacker getting hit by return fire.
But it increases the Difficulty of the attacker hitting his target by up to +3.

Plus, when you're covering, you're not actually chasing the person running away.
Narratively? That also has an impact.

2)To the best of my understanding, threshold successes dont count towards damage here.
 
So we should do 1 defend action and as many attacks as we can get away with, basically.

If I remember correctly, a defend action defends against one attack, so us dumping attacks is at least as good as a huge dicepool, as the enemy would have to multi action defend as well, and eat those penalties too, but we would have more chances to get through, and would in general do much more damage.
 
Valkhir said:
So we should do 1 defend action and as many attacks as we can get away with, basically.

If I remember correctly, a defend action defends against one attack, so us dumping attacks is at least as good as a huge dicepool, as the enemy would have to multi action defend as well, and eat those penalties too, but we would have more chances to get through, and would in general do much more damage.
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I dont think the QM is looking to be quite that granular, judging by the last set of fights.
Or maybe that will come with time.
Dunno.
Artemis1992 said:
I think they count.
At least I think I've read the rule in V20, I can't check right now.
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Yeah, you're right.
Each threshold success adds +1 die to the damage dice pool.
Page 272.
 
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