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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Crossover Fantasy
This one we cannot buy, it's part of the Fivefold Courts charmset, and we can only buy 1 and 2 dot charms from it.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
Why do you keep harping on this??? Everyone knows that. That isn't the point in buying a ranged option it never was.
It has a single target option it just depends on how we leverage it were we to buy SandStrike. It pains me that you don't see a genuine need for a player character to have a reliable ranged option and not be all meele all day.
[X] Plan: courtly debut v2
Then just vote for the base charm when the time comes, easy, as Yzarc says, that allows for less potential vote splitting right now for all that could be interested.
We already have a line of sight attack option that is capable of knocking people unconscious in one hit if we use our occult Excellency we don't need another one that can't even do that. Just because we never use mind him manipulation for it doesn't mean it can't do it. I mean seriously mind hand manipulation if we used it as an attack even if it only does bashing damage still does nine base before bonus dice bashing damage in a single hit and we can do grappling that would have 20 dice behind it.
The reason I have a problem with sand strike blast in particular is because a normal person has a not insignificant chance of just outright dodging it we throw six dice a person with literally average dexterity and slightly above average Athletics could dodge it or vice versa. It literally comes off as a waste of essence simply because we're not going to hit with it that often if ever. If anyone is willing to spend any level of Supernatural resource to dodge they're getting out of the way.
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fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
I made things clear in the link.
Edit: Or I thought that I had. I don't know why every link that I make pointing to this thread turns into a link to the Hell of the third act breakdown.
Reposting
Base difficulty 5 Perception + Occult roll. No dodge chance just soak however many successes we roll. Molly has perception 3 Occult 5 with Occult being a key skill. So right out of the box that is an average of 4 damage.
But of course there no reason not to cast wet so raise that to 4.8.
But we also have All things betray which is scene long charm reducing all Perception DC's by 3. Which mins out the DC at 3 well adding two more dice. So damage is now 7.
But we can also spend another essence on occult exilancies doubling our base dice so 12.6 damage.
But we can also get The Pentacle and the Scepter (••••) reducing the cost and DC of all ancient sorcery by 1. Which helps the other spells but for Death of Obsidian Butterflies means the damage now goes up to 14.
Of course there are other ways we can raise the damage more, but those are the most accessible and likely to be the case every time we use it.
Sandstrike blast is cheaper but uses Dexterity + Athletics. Athletics is not a key skill.
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BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
The point of a reliable ranged option isn't to knock people out. Most of the time we aren't looking to do that either.
A "normal person" wouldn't have access to supernatural resources. It cost one mote to turn then can be spammed for the scene as needed without ammo issues. It sounds to me like you don't really care for a ranged option in general. Which is probably why you keep bringing up the sword.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Range is more important for people scard of getting hit. In the last few combats Molly has actively wanted enemies to target her rather than anyone else.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
I'd want to as well. The topic isn't really being broached even though the same issues originally brought up for the base charm persist.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
Some instances in which a range option would/would've benefited us greatly-
I meant normal as in possessing less than 12 Health levels on average on a good roll of mindhand manipulation we can do 19 dice of bashing damage Supernatural still get knocked out when they take that much smashing damage if it fills up their whole track they're unconscious and we can kill them at our Leisure or not.
You keep saying that but that would have killed the Dresden we were more than 60 M away from him and being grappled we would have needed to somehow completely Escape being grappled and turn around back to our enemies and fire this Spear and it would have to be the spear to not kill Dresden in that moment and Miss completely because anything with more than six dice is going to be able to dodge that shit we would have paid one Essence to do fuck all and done nothing anyway. This is what I don't get even at difficulty 5 that's still only yields three fucking successes for a six dice pool any creature or Supernatural that has any level of interest in not being hit by shit we fell at them is going to completely avoid that and it would be right to and completely able to Lydia's Bolt is only good Because of Her Excellency.
We would have to close distance anyway because we can't hit anybody with the goddamn thing or are we using it as a fucking grenade and it is a grenade because it's just as indiscriminate and deals less damage and we still be paying one Essence for it so why don't we just get grenades. This all adds into we can only attack once per round we don't have multi attack whether that be Alchemy or otherwise so we'd be spending our one attack around to do fuck all.
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fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Do Naruto shadow clones give you a similar feeling of moral quandary?
That's what I really don't get about sandstrike blast we are not in any position to leverage it into being useful more than being a grenade because we can only attack once per round so if we're attacking already why wouldn't we just have a Grenade on hand if we're that worried about it because you can throw a grenade in one action. None of the plans that include it include the Athletics Excellency which would be needed to make this attack worthwhile against slightly skilled Mortals or Supernaturals which are the main people that were going to be trying to use it against. Nor they giving any evidence to state that a 60 Meter range option is worth anything despite us being able to literally being able to move anywhere from double to three times that distance in one round. So it's just a grenade that cost Essence at that point as far as Effectiveness goes if we wanted to do anything other than ping uselessly to the ground next to anyone that has enough care to spend a single willpower to dodge an attack and have a dice full greater than five and completely ignore supernatural abilities that might make that completely irrelevant anyway.
Honestly kind of but Naruto himself has proven time and time again he's willing to die for the cause and with his shadow clones despite using them as disposable he's definitely in the mix with them. Then it's revealed that they come back to him essentially their energies are drawn back they all separate like tributaries and then flow back into the stream that is Naruto Prime so you know the moral dubiousness of completely sentient clones made to fight and Scout but are just you and become you once more when they're done is kind of strange.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
Meele doesn't solve everything and Outsiders are immune to grenades besides. Despite how fast we are when we did get free we still weren't able to get there in time and needed literal divine intervention to pull Harry out of the fire. Even if the Outsider did use a willpower to dodge, a ranged attack(s) still would've served the purpose of allowing us to close the distance in time as it would've been occupied with dodging instead of attacking.
That isn't how combat Works they would get to dodge and attack just like how we get to attack and Parry at best one of them would take a slight malus on their attack roll we'd still only be able to attack one and he had multiple on him. Also with Transcendent and anathema which was definitely active at that moment and nearly always is when we're in combat simply because by rage recast is a really good charm grenades do aggravated damage and can kill Outsiders. Murder is meat doesn't care how we kill them only that we kill them
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
These combat balance questions makes me wish that there was a Sidereal Ex V WOD quest somewhere*. I get the impression that Sidereal very rarely engage in combat. Of could a Sidereal invading a hell also likely would not be noticed.
*Of course I just generally wish that my favorite authors had Splintered Gale.
*Of course I just generally wish that my favorite authors had Splintered Gale.
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Ivar
Dark Reaper
- Location
- Russia Moscow
I understand that we are in the middle of discussing plans and leveling up. But I find this new interlude very interesting. Especially Odin's internal reasoning on his roles. But the most interesting thing is of course in the finale, the dragon bloods is almost directly hinted at here. The question is whether the organization of their descendants still exists and whether they guard the remains of the prison?
He isnt. Its more or less ubiquitous among Outsiders. Thats why wizards fear them: their ability to ignore most mortal magic.
We also saw it among some of the Fae, when Aurora's marshal Korrick in Summer Knight noped some of Dresden's magic while posing as an ogre, and in Small Favor, when one of the Fallen outright ate Dresden's full effort at point blank range.
Our PoV character is Dresden, who barely goes outside Chicago, nevermind outside the US.
His experience is not necessarily representative of the setting.
This is a basic spirit charm from Gods and Monsters.
====Deflect Harm said:
Which one?
Because Yog's plan has changed several times.
We dont have our antipoison charm, or a perfect defense, or a ranged attack.
We dont have any means of handling groups of enemies.
Lash has literally no soak if she isnt in Apocalyptic Form; a gangbanger with a stolen Glock could kill her.
More generally?
Our combats have generally been onesided because we have had the luxury of taking the offense.
And even then, Dresden almost died in Vegas.
Every time we have had to react, things havent gone as well.
When Emma-O sent his minions to the city, we lost people, even with the Will of Kakuri fucking around and Eiko literally being here to betray him.
When Seeker came to Chicago and grabbed our friends, we had no good combat options.
We've never had to deal with a combat encounter where we were taken by surprise.
Where anything like the Denarian ambush of the Archive at Shedd Aquarium happened. Or even the ambush of Ebenezar by a Blood Pack with Outsider backup.
We've not run into the Denarians who are currently on our sheet and Lash's as Enemy.
We havent had an Outsider hit team come for us personally.
When Emma-O sent a greater akuma, dude loitered around and left us the initiative.
And frankly, based on combat performance, I suspect you are being a little optimistic about rolling over prepared Denarian warforms. Especially if they have backing from Corporate.
Polonessa Lartessa canonically performed a The City Still Stands type activation near the beginning of Small Favor, and later on survived having a foot wide soulfire-enhanced beam of fire punched through her chest. Ursiel!Genoskwa survived worse and made it out of the Greek underworld. Nevermind Nicodemus and his Artifact NA of Cheating Cheat.
Dresden doesnt go up against the Nickelheads without multiple Swords along to level the playing field.
And the only time he saw someone else do it, it was when they tried to nonlethally capture the closest thing to a god in mortal form still freely acting on the planet.
I think you might be underestimating them a bit on that basis.
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BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
If we are spamming a ranged attack as we draw near I think I'd do a little more than slightly inconvenience it. Harry wasn't being swarmed in that moment it was only the one and the other was being held off by a Hand agent.
Your right about the grenade I forgot about that aspect of ByRageRecast.
You are conflating resistances and immunity. Lord Raith has immunity, including to indirect effects, including to Starborn magic. Outsiders don't have that.
That's not my opinion. That's Lash's in-story commentary on Molly's combat prowess.
Your vote addresses precisely none of your concerns, though. You aren't taking any perfect defense, you aren't taking poison protection charm. More soak with ox body doesn't help those concerns, which I can agree with, at all.
It doesn't help with logistics of defences or hostage rescue either. So it wouldn't help in hostage rescue operations.
We have had several ambushes - the akuma attack on Nora, when we were very low on essence, ambush by Broken Seeker's minion in NeverNever, Black Court vampire's attempt at stealing the Exaltation, and I think I am forgetting others too.