Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

Exalted explicitly count as mortals. So Molly is some powerful mortal.
I mean, Yes and No, Exalted are mortals with divine rocket engines strapped to their souls, but Exalted terminology tends to refer to "Mortals" as anyone not possessing an exaltation of some sort. Usum has also regularly remarked to Molly how she is above Mortals in every way.
 
According to Lash they can go as far as a White Court vampire or similar, a being that still has free will, even if they are under some other influence.
If she's already talking about it, how about Fey Ladies?

The Lady is the most human-ish of the triad, could she use her remaining free will to pick up a Coin?

And if she could, would that remove the Lady's Mantle, or leave her with a double-template?
 
We can't actually. We can grant boons, but we can't do actual trades fueled by / supported by an exchange going both ways.

[X] Explain more of what you are, your inner world and your power to grant spiritual boons
-[X] Empathy excellency
-[X] Present it as a journey of discovery. You are still learning what you are and what you can do. And developing new capabilities.


We can actually give such boons without people entering our service. It's good for others to know that we can do it. There are several reasons for that:
1) We (I) don't need (only) yes-people. We also need competent advisors who can tell us "no, you are wrong and are being stupid" without fearing their immortality going away
2) We (I) want to use the IDU and other empowerment charms on people who don't directly work for us. Allies, friends, family even. Friends of friends.
3) We (I) don't want to have every empowered by us person to be considered our servants. If only to be able to conceal servants within the non-servant population.

And yeah, I think Order of Cauldron is not stupid, and they know that Molly is not an average mage.
We don't want to use IDU on people without the benefits of Mercy in Servitude though.

Awakened Po is a curse, not a blessing for most purposes, we are just supressing most of the bad parts.
 
You are still learning what you are and what you can do. And developing new capabilities.
This feels like giving our enemies info they don't need. They can infer some things but they don't actually know if the stuff Molly does is newly gained or things she could always do.

Anyone we use IDU on will actually have to serve though in some capacity because otherwise MiS won't take effect to counter the flaws.
 
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One long term goal I hope Molly finds as a seeker of Mysteries is the 'Source' of the laws of magic. Even if you define magic as a self reinforcing The Laws seem too… specific to just be 'How Magic Naturally Works'. I suspect some kind of being inscribed them into the world Great-Curse style, perhaps a powerful Exalted even if there was one in the dawn of this age.
 
[X] Explain more of what you are, your inner world and your power to grant spiritual boons
 
Is it a choice?

Did canon Molly have a choice about the Mantle of the Winter Lady?
We know she was still very human afterwards.

Yes, the Mantles of the Ladies cannot be forced on someone, but even if they could no full blood fey at all could ever carry a Coin, they just are not human enough to count for the loophole that allows the Fallen within the Coins to act, they are unfit vessels.
 
We don't want to use IDU on people without the benefits of Mercy in Servitude though.

Awakened Po is a curse, not a blessing for most purposes, we are just supressing most of the bad parts.
That's arguable. Would people not under MiS suffer more drawbacks? Yes. Are there situations where they will happily said such drawbacks? Also yes. Like, straight up, if this is up to me, Murphy and all non-corrupt SI members get an IDU upgrade and Chicago gets an actual police force capable of handling street-level magical crime.
This feels like giving our enemies info they don't need. They can infer some things but they don't actually know if the stuff Molly does is newly gained or things she could always do.

Anyone we use IDU on will actually have to serve though in some capacity because otherwise MiS won't take effect to counter the flaws.
I can see your argument, sure. I was trying to somehow explain "why didn't you tell us sooner?" or something like this. But, ok.

[X] Explain more of what you are, your inner world and your power to grant spiritual boons
-[X] Empathy excellency
 
Is it a choice?

Did canon Molly have a choice about the Mantle of the Winter Lady?
We know she was still very human afterwards.

For changelings who are born, it is a choice to either become fully mortal or become fully fae, which is not reversable once they commit to it.

However for Lily, Sarissa and Molly it was forced upon them. Lily the changeling was forced to become the Summer Lady and fully fae despite not deciding to become one due to the Mantle. Molly was forced to become the Winter Lady by the Mantle since Sarissa become the Summer Lady because of Lily's death in canon despite them not wanting or expecting to become the Ladies. Neither of them had any choice and simply had to endure the consequences of becoming the Ladies due to the mantles choosing them.
 
[X] Explain more of what you are, your inner world and your power to grant spiritual boons
 
Like, straight up, if this is up to me, Murphy and all non-corrupt SI members get an IDU upgrade and Chicago gets an actual police force capable of handling street-level magical crime.
...and the CPD gets a literal inner demon as excuse to give in to their worst impulses or even fall into berserker rages.

Shadow Soul is no joke, neither is Fire Soul, which every use of Black Wind provokes.

This is literally as bad as the werewolf-FBI cases from Dresden Files canon.
 
One long term goal I hope Molly finds as a seeker of Mysteries is the 'Source' of the laws of magic. Even if you define magic as a self reinforcing The Laws seem too… specific to just be 'How Magic Naturally Works'. I suspect some kind of being inscribed them into the world Great-Curse style, perhaps a powerful Exalted even if there was one in the dawn of this age.
As far as I remember they are much more general than what White Council considers "Laws". You don't get wrecked only by killing humans with magic - anything you do has an effect on you. It just depends on how much you care about what you are doing. Harry by the time of the latest books considers any amount of collateral damage as acceptable, as long as there are no fatalities. Which can potentially kill more people indirectly.

The amount the magic actually screws you over seems to depend on how much you care about doing something in the first place. If you were a pacifist in general and didn't want to harm people but did it to protect someone the effect would be much more pronounced for you than for someone who already was an asshole. Sociopaths/Psychopaths most likely don't suffer much in the way of contamination at all. Because they don't much about hurting people more than they care about breaking a chair.

White Council also has ample tools to deal with lawbreakers without executing them left and right. They just don't want to spend the effort and manpower needed for it. And frankly they don't have the manpower. Not without greatly changing their recruitment policies and expanding by a lot.
 
how much you care about what you are doing. Harry by the time of the latest books considers any amount of collateral damage as acceptable, as long as there are no fatalities. Which can potentially kill more people indirectly
They still feel to specific and consequence based to just be a 'Habit Forming' aspect of magic, especially when there are a few more things that should be dark magic under that logic which isn't…. Like using magic to torture, as long as you aren't killing, mindbending, or flesh warping, you can pull an emperor palpitie on innocent civilians at will and be 'clear' of dark magic. Feels like there really is something more fundamental here.
 
Like using magic to torture, as long as you aren't killing, mindbending, or flesh warping, you can pull an emperor palpitie on innocent civilians at will and be 'clear' of dark magic. Feels like there really is something more fundamental here.
I'm pretty sure it still screws you over. White Council just doesn't care about it as much as about the other applications of magic. Again they don't have the manpower to deal with it. The Seven Laws are just the things that Council has the will to enforce and is willing to fight for. Even at a detriment to their current position. Everything else they are willing to sweep under the rug as long as you are not rocking the boat too much.

If they were doing a more general magical laws thing there would be only two:

1. Don't do fucked up things with magic because it can lead you to a self reinforcing loop where you do more of that shit later until you can't stop.
2. Don't even think about Outsiders or doing anything with or for them.
 
Like, straight up, if this is up to me, Murphy and all non-corrupt SI members get an IDU upgrade and Chicago gets an actual police force capable of handling street-level magical crime.
Unfortunately if Murphy and SI were to swear loyalty to Molly that is very problematic with their intimacies and job. Unless Molly gets herself or someone who works for her elected Mayor or similar position.
 
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Unfortunately if Murphy and SI where to swear loyalty to Molly that is very problematic with their intimacies and job. Unless Molly gets herself or someone who works for her elected Mayor or similar position.

That is an interesting thought... would a mayor be 'in charge' enough of the local police to trigger MiS? I am inclined to say no since technically the police does not answer to the mayor in anything but funding, the mayor cannot formally tell a police officer what to investigate on the basis of their obligations of an officer of the law. I think the D.A. might do it if you want to go to something local.
 
That's arguable. Would people not under MiS suffer more drawbacks? Yes. Are there situations where they will happily said such drawbacks? Also yes. Like, straight up, if this is up to me, Murphy and all non-corrupt SI members get an IDU upgrade and Chicago gets an actual police force capable of handling street-level magical crime.
Won't enlightenment be a better alternative to IDU? It's nowhere near as powerful to start with but it is much more flexible and has an added bonus of not risking to reenact Jekyll and Hyde.
 
@Yog When it comes to street level crime the police are more hampered by a lack of knowledge then power. A well trained mortal with a gun able to call backup is actually fairly threatening to most street monsters. The problem is escalation. Most street level monsters answer to some higher power who the cops can't deal with.

Basically if we empower SI and organize them it turns into a war rather than just better policing.

Edit: To be clear maybe we can empower them enough to win that war, but it would be a war. Unless say we use a fairy favor to get a Queen to publicly acknowledge that Mortal police have the authority to enforce mortal law as they are charged to do my the taxes payers.
 
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breathlessly. "No more hiding from monsters for me
Did she not notice suddenly being a master of psychic invisibility?

I think she'll change her tune a bit once she has the opportunity to hunt. Even without max buffs she should be able to slip around the city, pop up into good vantage points, and kill anyone she seriously wants to below the weak elder level.

She's not being overlooked anymore, just not granting her targets permission to notice what kills them.
"So what are we going to tell Anna and the others?" The something of the earlier excitement had faded from her voice. "I could say I'm a late bloomer but A that sounds really weird when you say it aloud like that and B I feel like you now, darker magically. Are you OK talking about Sanctuary stuff and awakenings or... how do you wanna do this?"
… oh yeah, we haven't said anything to them on this.

Which is actually pretty hilarious; not only did a whale join a group of krill, they actually thought she was a jumbo shrimp the whole time. :V
 
Did she not notice suddenly being a master of psychic invisibility?

I think she'll change her tune a bit once she has the opportunity to hunt. Even without max buffs she should be able to slip around the city, pop up into good vantage points, and kill anyone she seriously wants to below the weak elder level.

She's not being overlooked anymore, just not granting her targets permission to notice what kills them.

… oh yeah, we haven't said anything to them on this.

Which is actually pretty hilarious; not only did a whale join a group of krill, they actually thought she was a jumbo shrimp the whole time. :V
When describing Molly power level a good vague way to put it is "The Yama Kings are jealous of my power and authority"
 
[X] Explain more of what you are, your inner world and your power to grant spiritual boons
-[X] Empathy excellency



Honestly, I think it's time to spend some time after this on the Alphas and the other factions of Chicago after this. Basically finally meet Marcone
 
Basically if we empower SI and organize them it turns into a war rather than just better policing.

Edit: To be clear maybe we can empower them enough to win that war, but it would be a war. Unless say we use a fairy favor to get a Queen to publicly acknowledge that Mortal police have the authority to enforce mortal law as they are charged to do my the taxes payers.
Clearly we need to dump all authority and problems on Murphy.
 
Honestly just providing the members of SI with some classes on the truth of the supernatural and the ability to call on us or some of our agents for support would probably go a long way.
 
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