So, just checking, the question is invalid? I'll remove it then.
We'll need to think of a question to use the crown on the potions for, then.
Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Crossover Fantasy
We'll need to think of a question to use the crown on the potions for, then.
Yes the crown cannot be used to ask 'how do I become better at X'. Asking about books related to X, as in the question about textbooks is a potential workaround.
Lasting that long seems like more than a two dot recipe can handle.
Not sure if permanence would really help that much either in the rhetorical sense. Maybe it looks less like drugs, but now it's a bigger deal and beyond the scope of their local magical expert.
Harry could probably at least envision something that fills your need for sleep for a week, but a potion that permanently or annually satisfies it is a bit much for him to speak on.
If it's allowed we should exploit it, but from a meta perspective even that limitation raises the question of why Molly couldn't just fill a notebook with effects she wants and get all canon recipes by asking how to achieve them with alchemy one page at a time.
Which defeats the point of the ruling stopping us from just doing whatever ritual of our tier we want at an increased difficulty.
Do I like the idea of being a broken super alchemist? Absolutely. But if it's a balance problem to get it with no effort than it's still a balance problem with this approach.
Maybe we could ask to see someone else solving the problem, and then get some sort of cost reduction on the research that doesn't completely eliminate the cost? Seems like it could be a far way to control the crown's interactions with this topic without completely making it useless or breaking the game.
Edit: should have refreshed before posting.
@DragonParadox is the idea I outlined here viable, or should we entirely avoid trying to cheese the crown this way?
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I removed that part of the vote, as it was ruled invalid. I'll have to think about what to use it for, crown vise. Maybe looking for some ancient alchemical knowledge (might be shenaniganed into finding more samples of Old Realm, maybe), or some questions related to sleep (and oneiromancy - we do need a teacher for Rosie to keep studying).
You are probably right. It should be within the scope of Alchemy 4, though. That's the point where you get "slow aging to 1/10th of what it normally is" and other major biomancy stuff.
Catching up...
All Devouring Depths is a 5 dot scenelong charm that turns an area 10*Essence yards radius(currently 40 yards wide at E2) around you into a bubble of water for 2m. And that bubble always moves with you.
With BSM, it means that if you activate it, you get a -1DC buff and x3 speed multiplier.
Not to mention that if you dissolve into the water with RVD, its that much harder for your opponents to have a target if they are incapable of throwing big AoE attacks.
Huh. Only 1 of 3 of the Tier 1 votes appears to be of any real use.
Mega superglue is pretty useless against its intended target; we have explicitly seen naagloshi use batwings to fly, which dont care about feathers. Not to mention that the only skinwalker we saw in canon was a Senior Council-class spellcaster. The idea that a Tier 1 alchemical product would have any efficacy against him is unlikely.
And Aerosol is so situational as to be at best, a niche solution. Not something you buy at chargen.
Also, I'm really shocked that people did not take the Painkiller and Ability boosting potions.
Even if we thought Molly didnt need it immediately(and Molly does), Lydia did.
Seriously, people.
At least most of the Tier 2s appear to be useful recipes.
Not much to comment here.
Will be.
The actual all-terrain speed hack there?
All Devouring Depths is a 5 dot scenelong charm that turns an area 10*Essence yards radius(currently 40 yards wide at E2) around you into a bubble of water for 2m. And that bubble always moves with you.
With BSM, it means that if you activate it, you get a -1DC buff and x3 speed multiplier.
Not to mention that if you dissolve into the water with RVD, its that much harder for your opponents to have a target if they are incapable of throwing big AoE attacks.
*looks at winning vote*
Huh. Only 1 of 3 of the Tier 1 votes appears to be of any real use.
Mega superglue is pretty useless against its intended target; we have explicitly seen naagloshi use batwings to fly, which dont care about feathers. Not to mention that the only skinwalker we saw in canon was a Senior Council-class spellcaster. The idea that a Tier 1 alchemical product would have any efficacy against him is unlikely.
And Aerosol is so situational as to be at best, a niche solution. Not something you buy at chargen.
Also, I'm really shocked that people did not take the Painkiller and Ability boosting potions.
Even if we thought Molly didnt need it immediately(and Molly does), Lydia did.
Seriously, people.
At least most of the Tier 2s appear to be useful recipes.
Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
@DragonParadox can you add the "Mu -" name at the start?
Also what do you guys think of the world of Mu?
It still needs some edits and quality dropped halfway towards the end due to inspiration drying up but what are your thoughts?
Also what do you guys think of the world of Mu?
It still needs some edits and quality dropped halfway towards the end due to inspiration drying up but what are your thoughts?
VOTE
[X] Once in a while (Can stay up without penalty for important events)
RATIONALE
Could is not should.
I dont believe the social friction raised with our family and friends is worth accelerating some projects.
Molly's last year of life has been one long episode of illicit drugs almost ruining her life and actually ruining the lives of some of her friends. There's very little chance that she's going to convince Michael and Charity and Rose and Dresden that there's absolutely no longterm ill effects from chugging wakefulness potions like Mountain Dew.
And there are in-quest consequences from them having questions about our judgement and moderation.
Like for example, Dresden's willingness to teach, or let Bob teach.
Furthermore?
I dont like the roleplaying questions raised by Molly essentially going all better living through chemistry either.
With her rapid growth in power, maintaining touch with the human condition becomes more important than ever.
Keep the drugs for actual crisis situations.
Thats my two cents.
EDIT
Shorter version:
[X] Once in a while (Can stay up without penalty for important events)
RATIONALE
Could is not should.
I dont believe the social friction raised with our family and friends is worth accelerating some projects.
Molly's last year of life has been one long episode of illicit drugs almost ruining her life and actually ruining the lives of some of her friends. There's very little chance that she's going to convince Michael and Charity and Rose and Dresden that there's absolutely no longterm ill effects from chugging wakefulness potions like Mountain Dew.
And there are in-quest consequences from them having questions about our judgement and moderation.
Like for example, Dresden's willingness to teach, or let Bob teach.
Furthermore?
I dont like the roleplaying questions raised by Molly essentially going all better living through chemistry either.
With her rapid growth in power, maintaining touch with the human condition becomes more important than ever.
Keep the drugs for actual crisis situations.
Thats my two cents.
EDIT
Shorter version:
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Ok, next stop, find a way to make more hours in the day, literally this time, I'm sure we can do it.
This works, don't worry.
[x] Yog
We got the formula because we were AP starved, we are not going to turn back on the finish line when we have a way to have more AP.
The way the AP is given, it is not going to slow down the quest but actually speed it up, we don't get more actions, we get more out of one or two actions, this is not going to require more updates given the kind of actions it is restricted to.
Lasting that long seems like more than a two dot recipe can handle.
Not sure if permanence would really help that much either in the rhetorical sense. Maybe it looks less like drugs, but now it's a bigger deal and beyond the scope of their local magical expert.
Harry could probably at least envision something that fills your need for sleep for a week, but a potion that permanently or annually satisfies it is a bit much for him to speak on.
If it's allowed we should exploit it, but from a meta perspective even that limitation raises the question of why Molly couldn't just fill a notebook with effects she wants and get all canon recipes by asking how to achieve them with alchemy one page at a time.
Which defeats the point of the ruling stopping us from just doing whatever ritual of our tier we want at an increased difficulty.
Do I like the idea of being a broken super alchemist? Absolutely. But if it's a balance problem to get it with no effort than it's still a balance problem with this approach.
Maybe we could ask to see someone else solving the problem, and then get some sort of cost reduction on the research that doesn't completely eliminate the cost? Seems like it could be a far way to control the crown's interactions with this topic without completely making it useless or breaking the game.
Edit: should have refreshed before posting.
@DragonParadox is the idea I outlined here viable, or should we entirely avoid trying to cheese the crown this way?
You can certainly use questions to find who knows certain recipes, but there is no guarantee the names would be recognizable, much less actionable, same as for any shot in the dark search for magical lore.
We werent AP starved.
Are you willing to risk Dresden shutting down the sorcery training pipeline if he has questions about our judgement in using what we learn from him wisely?
Dresden is not Bob. He has concerns.
The whole reason why we learned Alchemy instead of Summoning and Warding was because Dresden had concerns about our judgement, and we'd have had to risk trying and failing extra rolls to convince him. And the man has lingering trauma about women who got info from him from Kim whatsherface in Fool Moon and Susan in Grave Peril.
Are you going to risk fights with Rosie over this?
Or Charity? Or Michael?
The drug issue was the major issue why Molly left home the first time, and ended up on a cross in Arctis Tor.
We'd be tromping all over the trauma buttons of a significant section of our monkeysphere.
And risking loss of some training options if we roll badly. As well as social issues.
The juice is not worth the squeeze.
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- Location
- United States
[X] Once in a while (Can stay up without penalty for important events)
We have IC confirmation that Molly, who is the closest to the drug trauma, hasn't conceptualized this potion as drugs. It's officially and in Molly's mind a super coffee. You are fear mongering. If anything, ability boosters, which you have no problem with, are far closer to drugs (steroids) than this.
JayTar
Idea briefcase
[X] All the time (Gain 2 AP which can be used to double up on Actions with multiple AP progress)
Doesn't seem close enough to drugs to worry me. The idea that this would the line too far seems silly to me.
It's not like our powers have ever hurt us before. The amount of friction this would put on our socials should be minimal. No harm is being done to anyone.
Doesn't seem close enough to drugs to worry me. The idea that this would the line too far seems silly to me.
It's not like our powers have ever hurt us before. The amount of friction this would put on our socials should be minimal. No harm is being done to anyone.
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I think the issue @uju32 is referring to is more how others will react to the thing not how Molly will. Molly has the advantage of being the alchemist who makes the super coffee, she knows its fine in the same way someone who designed a nuclear powerplant knows how safe it is, Harry had the skillset to understand this but not the bone deep conviction and Michael and Charity have neither, that is why there is an option to persuade them.
Which is why I plan to do two things:
1) Offer the coffee itself to Michael and Charity. This is important. This makes it 110% clear to them that Molly fully and absolutely believes that this is safe. It's not something she's trying to sneak past them. It's not drugs. Molly might be mistaken about her creation (in their mind), but she wouldn't maliciously try to poison her parents / hook them up on drugs. This solves the issue of trust with our parents.
2) Share the recipe with Harry (and Bob, obviously). This is an independent verification that Molly is not mistaken about what she has made.
Essentially, I am covering both "Molly knows this stuff is bad and lying" suspicion and "Molly is mistaken about what she made" fear angle. Did the idea come through ok?
At this point, I am getting incredibly annoyed at this expression of yours, you constantly use it to pretend things are more dangerous than they are, pointing out problems that only exists in your head and nowhere else and constantly refusing anything interesting out of paranoia.
This is a potion to gain more AP, it was sold as a way to gain more AP, people voted for it to gain more AP, refusing to use our source of AP when we can offer a perfectly valid answer to *concerns* and show that is not the horrible problem you paint it as is giving up right at the finish line, it is frustrating, annoying, really goddamn repetitive in how often you do it, and fear mongering to boot.
As yog said Molly isn't seeing them as drugs, she is extremely persuasive, she can explain to others.
You think Dresden is going to stop our training? That's absurd, not only is he biased into listening to us at that point, we can use these little things called arguments to explain to him what it is we have and how it works.
Molly's family? Michael will listen, Charity is the potential problem and we can explain to her too.
Rosie? What the hell does she has to do with this? She is a friend but she's not always with us, she won't even learn about this, and again we. can. explain.
Frankly, you would think Molly doesn't have any ability to social if we listened to how defeatist you are in any arguments being able to explain the situation, despite several proofs to the contrary.
JayTar
Idea briefcase
Since we are going to just be to talking to them, then there is no reason not to try.
The worst that could happen is that they say that they don't think we should use them, at which point we would probably agree not to.
But not even bringing up the topic at all seems silly. It could be no big deal at all.
The worst that could happen is that they say that they don't think we should use them, at which point we would probably agree not to.
But not even bringing up the topic at all seems silly. It could be no big deal at all.
How much time, effort, and money does it take to brew potions?
Because another vote we'll probably be making is "who do you share the goods with?"
That too, thanks for pointing it out, there is abolutely no reason to give up before we even try.
What Molly thinks does not determine how the rest of the world thinks.
This has been evident from the first time she used mind magic on her friends. Or Dresden's reaction to the Neverborn ritual we carved into the ground.
Furthermore, she literally has no supporting evidence here. There's no sorcerous FDA.
Just a trust me.
She didnt even learn these recipes from Bob, she saw them in a dream.
Dude, nobody doubts that Ability boosters are combat drugs.
They arent steroids, they are more like the go pills that the military issues to pilots and special forces. The difference is that she isnt chugging them on a regular basis, and as such they are much easier to justify as an in-extremis measure when going into combat where she might die, or a crisis situation.
That is the same status I place this thing on: an in extremis measure we use when its important.
Much easier to justify to our family and friends.
Less likely to damage our social relations.
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