Having skimmed this thread every now and again and scanned it to see if anyone's answered it, and come up empty-handed, I have to ask: What's the best way to get into Exalted? I was in one game that died, and never really wrapped my head around the 2E mechanics fully, and while I know a good deal about the broad strokes of the setting I'd like to know more, and actually try and put a system in my head (though I don't know which edition) and since this is the general thread I feel like I should ask in here.
Try Qwixalted which is a rules light version based on the Exalted 1e quickstart with things from 2e added in. It's been streamlined and here are some other changes that have been done:
  • Excluding Flurries - Only one attack per turn, nWoD style.
  • Simplifying Combat - No DV penalties, just move and attack on your turn.
  • Reducing the "Whiff Factor" - Exalts always roll at least 1 die, and a missed attack grants a bonus to the defender's next roll.
There are currently two versions to choose from.
 
Having skimmed this thread every now and again and scanned it to see if anyone's answered it, and come up empty-handed, I have to ask: What's the best way to get into Exalted? I was in one game that died, and never really wrapped my head around the 2E mechanics fully, and while I know a good deal about the broad strokes of the setting I'd like to know more, and actually try and put a system in my head (though I don't know which edition) and since this is the general thread I feel like I should ask in here.

Depends on what you're looking for in Exalted.
 
Didn't write it exclusively, but still considered it as much 'his baby' and vital enough to the gameline and "understanding the groundwork of Creation" he essentially spearheaded plans to put it into print before other more traditionally-gameable supplements, in what was otherwise regarded as "White Wolf's Kung fu fantasy game."

So yeah, I have no compunctions about assigning his name to it anymore than most people grant Sidereals largely to be Jenna Moran's, regardless of the other authors involved.

I just went by the lack of a Grabowski credit among the authors of the book.
 
Having skimmed this thread every now and again and scanned it to see if anyone's answered it, and come up empty-handed, I have to ask: What's the best way to get into Exalted? I was in one game that died, and never really wrapped my head around the 2E mechanics fully, and while I know a good deal about the broad strokes of the setting I'd like to know more, and actually try and put a system in my head (though I don't know which edition) and since this is the general thread I feel like I should ask in here.

Fluffwise, everyone here talks about how the best place to start is Scavenger Sons and Games of Divinity. As for actual game mechanics, you've got a choice between 1st edition, 2nd edition, 3rd edition if you have it, or trying to do something with Kevin Crawford's Godbound.
 
Yeah, that's not what happened. Just because something you liked got cut doesn't mean they didn't understand the significance of it, it means they wanted a different direction or thought the thing you liked was dumb. People can disagree with you on what is important, Dif, and not be idiots for it.
If they wanted to take a different direction back then, it seemed to me that this direction was away from the sort of details that shapes societies, particularly low-tech ones.
 
Having skimmed this thread every now and again and scanned it to see if anyone's answered it, and come up empty-handed, I have to ask: What's the best way to get into Exalted? I was in one game that died, and never really wrapped my head around the 2E mechanics fully, and while I know a good deal about the broad strokes of the setting I'd like to know more, and actually try and put a system in my head (though I don't know which edition) and since this is the general thread I feel like I should ask in here.
You will get wildly different answers. Second Edition is non-functional without houseruling it heavily, I've heard terrible things about 1e combat, but can't speak personally. My primary experience is Second Edition and Third Edition. Third Edition is actually functional, but veered away from a lot of the stuff in previous editions, is fairly complex, and has serious PR issues because the Devs have no idea how to talk to people, resulting in a lot of hate for it. Having played it for awhile now, I can say Third Edition is the most mechanically functional and least annoying to play, unless somehow everyone lies about how bad First Edition was in actual play. But if you're looking for stuff like the tail-end of 2.5, look for good houserules in 2.5, because 3e dropped a lot of the sci-fi trappings and removed some of the more prominent metaphysics (rightly so, in my opinion, because some of those ideas were friggin' toxic). Third Edition is also more low-powered, in 2.5 the only beings that matter are the Exalted and certain immensely powerful beings do to how its combat system and persistent defenses work. 3e has the Exalted still being very powerful, but less 'only Exalts matter'.

I recommend Third Edition's system, period, because it is the best Exalted system we've ever had, and if you want to homebrew in the old 2e fluff like little gods in everything or sci-fi aesthetics, you can do that pretty easily.

If they wanted to take a different direction back then, it seemed to me that this direction was away from the sort of details that shapes societies, particularly low-tech ones.
I deleted that post, actually, because I realized I didn't want to have that discussion.
 
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Okay, then are you willing to discuss your current post? Such as:
3e dropped a lot of the sci-fi trappings and removed some of the more prominent metaphysics (rightly so, in my opinion, because some of those ideas were friggin' toxic).
Could you expand that? I vaguely recall mentions of Infernal powers being conceptually toxic* (not sure if that was your post), and the recent talk of misapplying Little Gods for making high[er]-tech equipment, but you seem to have more to say on the topic than you did?
Third Edition is actually functional, but veered away from a lot of the stuff in previous editions, is fairly complex, and has serious PR issues because the Devs have no idea how to talk to people, resulting in a lot of hate for it.
Heh, an understatement, it seems.

* == No, not in the sense of Kimbery doing damage.
 
Okay, then are you willing to discuss your current post? Such as:
Could you expand that? I vaguely recall mentions of Infernal powers being conceptually toxic* (not sure if that was your post), and the recent talk of misapplying Little Gods for making high[er]-tech equipment, but you seem to have more to say on the topic than you did?
Honestly, not really. I don't like Little Gods because they were always handled badly and I feel like they're likely to just veer into the same stupid directions of 'if my sword has a god in it, I can wake the god of my sword and have a powerful god friend making my sword awful'. It would be an interesting bit of background of Creation if people wouldn't metagame it. But they do so, in very consistent and obvious ways. And so I think that the idea itself is unsalvageable, because something about 'there is a god inside my sword' encourages people to want to 'wake it up'. Now, a living spirit of a sword isn't a bad thing. But the little gods are not supposed to be that. You can get the same 'I wield a living weapon' from artifacts in 3e. My Night has a paranoid starmetal dagger that is constantly whispering paranoia and sadness to him, and this is a thing I support people doing, having their artifacts with personality. But I dislike the idea of the way to get this being that there is a little god inside your weapon telling it to be a sword, and you can somehow wake it up. I think it's super dumb, and has weird effects in the fanbase, it's not worth the wordcount that would take to make it clear that it's just a quirk of Creation's laws of physics and not a thing that you can game, and I'm glad its gone.
Obviously, a lot of people disagree with me, but it's easy enough to homebrew in for individual games that I don't think any counterargument is worth the problems it caused and the effort it would take to fix.
 
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I think I agree with the problem you're pointing at, Fenrir, but I disagree with where you're assigning the blame. Little Gods were a thing in 1e, and this problem wasn't around back then, so far as I know. It's a 2e thing, and I think it's a consequence of 2e's bad habit of over-rationalising and systemising everything.
 
I think I agree with the problem you're pointing at, Fenrir, but I disagree with where you're assigning the blame. Little Gods were a thing in 1e, and this problem wasn't around back then, so far as I know. It's a 2e thing, and I think it's a consequence of 2e's bad habit of over-rationalising and systemising everything.
I think Wonders of the Lost Age is the case in point here.

WotLA often gets assigned much blame for completely warping the perception of the setting - regardless of your feelings on 'magitech,' it was one of the first books in the new edition, purported to be a "big book of magical items," and instead of being Oadenol's Codex and presenting the default state of most magic in Creation it focused on a corner case of technological magic, setting a completely different tone. Gunzosha Armors were supposed to exist, but they weren't supposed to be the normal Artifacts presented up-front.

But WotLA introduced nothing new. Pretty much every item in its page is a port for 1e. Why is it assigned blame for negatively affecting the game, then? Because 1e had scattered bits and pieces of this magitech throughout its many books, usually inserting them in lists of Artifacts which included other "styles" of Artifacts, and usually in themed lists - often in Aspect Books. They were one thing among many.

WotLA instead collected all these scraps, gathered them in one book, systemized "the way they work" with their specific (and terrible) rules for crafting, repairs and maintenance, and made that book the first Big Book of Magical Items of the edition. And that's how it screwed it up.

In the immortal words of Megamind, "What's the difference? Presentation." I wouldn't be surprised if something similar happened with the little gods; they went for almost two full editions barely mentioned, and then from one day to the next they were everywhere, with custom Charms affecting or using them and obligatory references in the fluff of homebrew Artifacts. Not sure where it started, though.
 
In my mind, it's not so much little gods, which work perfectly well in an animist setting.

It's the Least Gods, where every bit and scrap of matter has its own spirit, and they immediately become the standin and reason for fantasy physics.
 
In my mind, it's not so much little gods, which work perfectly well in an animist setting.

It's the Least Gods, where every bit and scrap of matter has its own spirit, and they immediately become the standin and reason for fantasy physics.
I think it's telling that so many people couldn't tell you the difference between the two without looking it up :V (I'm one of them)
 
In my mind, it's not so much little gods, which work perfectly well in an animist setting.

It's the Least Gods, where every bit and scrap of matter has its own spirit, and they immediately become the standin and reason for fantasy physics.

Which was kind of dumb, because Exalted's take on animism is that gods (in general) don't actually do anything. They're bureaucrats who write reports but if you eliminated every God in creation the laws of physics would still exist and function (until a cascade error went unreported in some region causing a system crash).
 
I think I agree with the problem you're pointing at, Fenrir, but I disagree with where you're assigning the blame. Little Gods were a thing in 1e, and this problem wasn't around back then, so far as I know. It's a 2e thing, and I think it's a consequence of 2e's bad habit of over-rationalising and systemising everything.
I think Wonders of the Lost Age is the case in point here.

WotLA often gets assigned much blame for completely warping the perception of the setting - regardless of your feelings on 'magitech,' it was one of the first books in the new edition, purported to be a "big book of magical items," and instead of being Oadenol's Codex and presenting the default state of most magic in Creation it focused on a corner case of technological magic, setting a completely different tone. Gunzosha Armors were supposed to exist, but they weren't supposed to be the normal Artifacts presented up-front.

But WotLA introduced nothing new. Pretty much every item in its page is a port for 1e. Why is it assigned blame for negatively affecting the game, then? Because 1e had scattered bits and pieces of this magitech throughout its many books, usually inserting them in lists of Artifacts which included other "styles" of Artifacts, and usually in themed lists - often in Aspect Books. They were one thing among many.

WotLA instead collected all these scraps, gathered them in one book, systemized "the way they work" with their specific (and terrible) rules for crafting, repairs and maintenance, and made that book the first Big Book of Magical Items of the edition. And that's how it screwed it up.

In the immortal words of Megamind, "What's the difference? Presentation." I wouldn't be surprised if something similar happened with the little gods; they went for almost two full editions barely mentioned, and then from one day to the next they were everywhere, with custom Charms affecting or using them and obligatory references in the fluff of homebrew Artifacts. Not sure where it started, though.
I always did figure it was mostly a 2e problem, but I guess 'unsalvagable' may be an overreaction. It could probably, with proper presentation, go back to how it was. I can't quite want it to, I'm very negatively disposed to the idea still, but I'll grant that my reaction is perhaps overly negative, and assigning blame a bit broadly.
 
Generally speaking, Magitech like that does not have MM bonuses.
I think there are some versions that do get MM bonuses, but they tend to be one dot higher without affecting attunement cost. (As does "Ha Ha, I don't have to muck about with maintenance/repair")
Isn't WoD outright intended to not be a unified setting? It's explicitly a toolbox, isn't it?
Are we talking OWoD, NWoD, NWoD2/Chronicles? Because MES runs one game that involves every splat as playable, but it's a separate continuity from everything else and there's a huge list of patches to get everything playing nice. On the other hand you've got the other games that focus on a single gameline and generally assume that that gameline is correct, because all the PCs and most of the NPCs are Lost, or Forsaken, or Awakened, or Created, or Sin-Eaters, or whatever., and it's kind of assumed that the other splats exist, they're just off doing their own thing somewhere else.
 
Okay, that's informative, thanks.

Then I have a question (also at @Imrix):
Why is it that the book pays attention to things like bleeding, which won't matter for displaying the politics and other grittiness of the world (because most mortals will just die outright), but not to things like populations and logistics and crops and epidemiology and legislation and invention of technologies and all the other nitty-gritty little details that matter both to mortals and Exalts? (Because really, for all the talk of cholera and plague being written up in the corebook, the important bit about them is how they'll spread or not spread depending on hygiene and army movement and all the other things like that, and that will grittily impact those epic battles Exalts with their armies engage in, such as ensuring one doesn't have a combat-ready army anymore.)

Because writing rules for those things is beyond the capacity of the average White Wolf freelancer. The intent is that you take that into account anyway: people behave like people living in a weird environment, with the expected outcomes of people being people. Incidentally, this is why readers bitch about crossbows, triremes and the population of Halta, because people wouldn't act like that, and the less Creation-people act like people, the less well the combination of Stalingrad, Ro3K and Final Fantasy works.

The disease and bleeding rules in the corebook are to illustrate that "realistic concerns" like blood loss, infection and dying of dysentery are things that matter in the setting, and you only get to ignore it because you have a transcendent divine weapon merged with your soul, the whole "accentuating the pathos of the mortal condition and the glory of the heroism by providing a contrast to each" bit Grabowski is talking about. If nobody in Creation had to worry about dying of the bloody flux, would the fact that you, Exalt, do not have to care even make an impression?

It's just . . . the book doesn't look as if it wants to focus on the realism of the backdrop. It does look like it gives a nod to grittiness in the foreground just in case the campaign involves mortals in the foreground (which it can!). In fact, it seems to me that "design a detailed world with a focus on plausibility and consistency" (Grabowski paraphrased) and "assume the world works, think about why later if you need to" (Moran paraphrased) are two very different approaches, and combining them can be problematic. Note that I'm not saying "it isn't details-only"; I do get that it's a spectrum, but the conspicuous lack of certain things and presence of others gives me (and apparently other people too!) an impression that the game line is much more drama-first on the spectrum.

Oh, please. This isn't difficult. Or are you going to defend the Creation-Slaying Oblivion Kick again?
 
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Which is why I've automatically appended an extra dot onto everything I see in that book in my head, because even as the party crafter fuck that noise.
Unless there's a magitech equivalent of a Citroen 2CV or VW Bug, which were designed so that any idiot with a wrench, hammer, and screwdriver could repair them.
 
Unless there's a magitech equivalent of a Citroen 2CV or VW Bug, which were designed so that any idiot with a wrench, hammer, and screwdriver could repair them.

Probably a few of the utility items or vehicles. It's important to keep in mind though that you won't find such items outside of areas that had been part of some Manse powered high Essence field projection system that lowered atunement costs for various items to 0 for mortals, because otherwise only the elite could afford the Hearthstone and/or Enlightenment necessary to power them.

And, well, you still need that hearthstone and/or atunement motes to make it work.
 
In the interests of posting about Exalted without arguing about it, have this imgur gallery I found of colossal creatures which I think would fit in Exalted pretty much to a T.

 
Because writing rules for those things is beyond the capacity of the average White Wolf freelancer. The intent is that you take that into account anyway: people behave like people living in a weird environment, with the expected outcomes of people being people. Incidentally, this is why readers bitch about crossbows, triremes and the population of Halta, because people wouldn't act like that, and the less Creation-people act like people, the less well the combination of Stalingrad, Ro3K and Final Fantasy works.

The disease and bleeding rules in the corebook are to illustrate that "realistic concerns" like blood loss, infection and dying of dysentery are things that matter in the setting, and you only get to ignore it because you have a transcendent divine weapon merged with your soul, the whole "accentuating the pathos of the mortal condition and the glory of the heroism by providing a contrast to each" bit Grabowski is talking about. If nobody in Creation had to worry about dying of the bloody flux, would the fact that you, Exalt, do not have to care even make an impression?
Is it beyond the capacity of the locally-oft-praised writing team involved in Exalted back before it was given over to the locally-oft-derided Ink Monkeys?

In the interests of posting about Exalted without arguing about it, have this imgur gallery I found of colossal creatures which I think would fit in Exalted pretty much to a T.


Someone miscalibrated the Object-Structure Coefficient, and we need to recalibrate yeddim sizes. Again.
 
Low-rating Ally seems the most straightforward across all editions.
Does it? An Ally 1 is described as a character roughly on the level of a starting character. Seems a bit too powerful for a Half-Caste.

EDIT: Well actually, now that I think of it, that may well be fitting since my character is an Essence 5 Infernal, and thus my darling daughter should be a decent challenge for any Dragon-Blooded she meets. Hmmm...
 
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Does it? An Ally 1 is described as a character roughly on the level of a starting character. Seems a bit too powerful for a Half-Caste.

EDIT: Well actually, now that I think of it, that may well be fitting since my character is an Essence 5 Infernal, and thus my darling daughter should be a decent challenge for any Dragon-Blooded she meets. Hmmm...
Backgrounds can be variable. Like Mentor, Ally is a balance between how powerful they are and how willing they are to help. If your child is weaker than a chargen character but a lot more willing to help, and you don't need to do as much for them in return as you would for a normal Ally, that probably balances the scales.
 
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