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General Exalted Thread

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And here's Kerisgame 47. Keris has picked up a couple of permanent scars from her little run-in and makeout session with Adorjan (I'm fluffing that her anti-Crippling Charms are good, but not that good - the touch of a Primordial avatar while its full attention is focused on you is mythic plot-level stuff). She's also going a little bit mad fleshcrafter. Heh. And I really am quite smug about the internal logic of her plans, which occurred to me at about the same time they occurred to her, and with a very similar reaction (minus the blood).

Because, after all, her only source for Small mutation leaves them sickly and weak-boned. So counteract that with Exalted healing. Her source for that is herself and Testolagh. So sympathetically link in her build (so they're not child-like and neotenous anymore) and his toughness to counteract the weak bones! It balances! And then she can harmlessly extract a bone sample using her root-hands and work it into the artifact as a DNA template that it copies the mutation package from!

That this also accidentally an entire corps of owlriders who could be described as genetically her and Testolagh's children is an unanticipated side effect she won't see coming until it's too late. :V

The usual bonus features:
EarthScorpion: Incidentally, what Keris found in that house?
EarthScorpion: It was indeed the "fallout shelter" of a bunch of mortal Gens nobility, and they locked themselves in so they wouldn't get sick.
EarthScorpion: But the disease got in somehow. Maybe one was already sick. Maybe the gods brought it in.
EarthScorpion: So it's the "safety bunker" of a bunch of Gens nobility.
EarthScorpion: That means it's a few rooms, but - and here's the big thing - it's a few rooms of normal lower-upper class life. There are books. Childrens' toys. Normal clothing. The family heirlooms brought down to be safe. Jade coin hoarded.
Aleph: : (
...
EarthScorpion: Sigh
EarthScorpion: You realise
EarthScorpion: this is the first set of children's toys that are actually making their way into her inner world.
Aleph: Nonsense!
Aleph: She put knives in there! And balls!
Aleph: Well, rocks.
Aleph: And there are loads of ribbons!
EarthScorpion: ... sigh. It really is telling that Keris herself doesn't know what a more normal childhood is like.
Aleph: Certainly explains a fair bit about Krisity family dynamics.
EarthScorpion: And it's not like angyalkae have childhoods really, either.
EarthScorpion: Dulmea treated them basically like young angyalkae at first, but then she found that they didn't have inborn knowledge.
EarthScorpion: So she tries to teach them things, as she would teach a newborn assassin chosen to be raised with her house.
EarthScorpion: This is more successful with some than others.
Aleph: *understatement award*
EarthScorpion: Haneyl loves being sat down and shown how to do things and getting to act like an adult and learning tea ceremonies.
EarthScorpion: ...
EarthScorpion: she insists on tea ceremonies with her demons at court
EarthScorpion: oh haneyl
EarthScorpion: twisting children's tea parties
EarthScorpion: by banishing your demons if they do the ceremony wrong
Aleph: Rathan is also learning to like it now that he understands what Dulmea actually wants him to do, because when she's teaching him she's paying full attention, and praising him when he gets it right.
EarthScorpion: Yes, Rathan has got so much easier for Dulmea to handle now he's like a tiny person rather than a crying thing.
Aleph: In fairness, he is still a crying thing. He's just also a tiny person.
...
EarthScorpion: Huh
EarthScorpion: So, if we apply the same logic to the Sasi souls we know about as the Keris ones.
EarthScorpion: The Lawmaker is... sigh. Her need to be in control.
Aleph: Oh, Sasi.
Aleph: And the shadow is her decadence budget.
EarthScorpion: While the Shadow is her self-indulgent, kinder, gentler side, who likes to be happy - but who also likes other people being happy.
Aleph: Donald: "I approve of this woman."
EarthScorpion: The Shadow... sigh, therefore actually likes Keris a lot.
Aleph: Keris is very nice to be around if she loves you, you love her and you like people being happy.
EarthScorpion: ... heh. I think she's romantically attracted to Keris, but not sexually. If she could get out, she'd just want to snuggle with her, but would sneak out whenever Keris and Sasi got huggy because she doesn't want to get between either of them and make them unhappy.
EarthScorpion: Hmm. Control freakery. Self indulgence and cowardice. What's a third axis of Sasi's nature?
Aleph: Curiosity.
Aleph: Keris: "Look! A puzzle!"
EarthScorpion: Hmm. So that means that, yes, the Lawmaker also gets forethought and planning.
EarthScorpion: So there's... heh, a curious, collector, artistic soul along the way. Maybe from SWLIHN, the bits that the Lawmaker hasn't taken to control and dissect.
Aleph: Well, is she likely to get more than just three? Keris has eight, technically.
Aleph: ... will have.
EarthScorpion: Well, Sasi's control freakery is tied into her planning.
Aleph: Yeah, just wondering if there are any other sides to her.
Aleph: ... hmm.
EarthScorpion: Hmm. Her relationship with the Realm for one
Aleph: There may be a- yes.
Aleph: The Realm, and her family.
EarthScorpion: And then a separate mourning one.
Aleph: Her, hmm. Sense of loss.
EarthScorpion: Her anger and the way she gets when she snaps might be part of the Realm one, but it might be a separate hidden one that's dormant most of the time, but then explodes.
Aleph: Oh, Sasi.
Aleph: Cecelyne and "sudden rage". Hah.
Aleph: That may get on with the Lawmaker's planning and how she does not like surprises.
EarthScorpion: And because she has a lot of rage that she had to learn to force it down because she was just a mortal and had to hide it.
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Estro said:
Is this halfway fucked by exalted standards, or EP standards (which is generally not bad, once you have a character. If you don't, prepared to spend a couple hours on far too complex maths and looking up seven bazillion pieces of gear)?
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WoD is essentially proto-Exalted, system-wise. They're both Storyteller. WoD tends to have saner prerequisite paths for abilities (like, straight line made of five dots saner, most of the time), somewhat more complicated dice mechanics (but nowhere near Exalted 3e level complicated!), essentially the same Attributes.
Now, nWoD is kinda weird, in a neo-Storyteller kind of way: everything is rolled at Difficulty 8, which is scary, and the to-hit/to-damage roll is merged (in a weird way, so that now your Strength governs how accurate your blows are), and the way Merits/Backgrounds/Flaws work is very asymmetric.

It's probably possible to run Exalted using either version of WoD ST, but one would need to convert all those Charms, which is a huge task.

Estro said:
As some one who is trying to get into Exalted, this is very much true. The only other game system I've tried to get into (Eclipse Phase) is alot more welcoming. The current debate about Solar Doombots is a great example, as I have only the vaguest idea what's going, and that's mostly due to my knowledge of what the feth a doombot is.
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Hmm. I actually thought you received a reasonably warm welcome here (as in, the posts addressed by the community to you). Are you in search of a game system or a game setting? Either way, this seems to be getting into non-Exalted territory; is a general discussion and comparison of various systems and settings thread something that would be appropriate (after all, that's a very broad topic)?
 
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vicky_molokh said:
WoD is essentially proto-Exalted, system-wise. They're both Storyteller. WoD tends to have saner prerequisite paths for abilities (like, straight line made of five dots saner, most of the time), somewhat more complicated dice mechanics (but nowhere near Exalted 3e level complicated!), essentially the same Attributes.
Now, nWoD is kinda weird, in a neo-Storyteller kind of way: everything is rolled at Difficulty 8, which is scary, and the to-hit/to-damage roll is merged (in a weird way, so that now your Strength governs how accurate your blows are), and the way Merits/Backgrounds/Flaws work is very asymmetric.

It's probably possible to run Exalted using either version of WoD ST, but one would need to convert all those Charms, which is a huge task.


Hmm. I actually thought you received a reasonably warm welcome here. Are you in search of a game system or a game setting? Either way, this seems to be getting into non-Exalted territory; is a general discussion and comparison of various systems and settings thread something that would be appropriate (after all, that's a very broad topic)?
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To note, nWoD no longer has Merits and Backgrounds as separate, and Flaws exist and can be taken, but there's no real incentive to min-max by giving your character horrible flaws in exchange for more XP to spend on other things. So now it's just Merits, of which there are usually a lot, and I admit that the balance is sometimes a little wonky between gamelines/categories. But eh.

And yeah, that is an interesting thing to talk about. Game system versus Game Setting. I sorta like nWoD as a system, but I'm pretty sure there are probably better ones out there. It's just the one I know and it seems to work and not explode my head. It's as a setting that it really delivers for me, IMO.
 
vicky_molokh said:
Hmm. I actually thought you received a reasonably warm welcome here (as in, the posts addressed by the community to you). Are you in search of a game system or a game setting? Either way, this seems to be getting into non-Exalted territory; is a general discussion and comparison of various systems and settings thread something that would be appropriate (after all, that's a very broad topic
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Oh no, everyone was very helpful when they replied to me. It's just I dithered about actually posting here for a while as it was quite intimidating. To put it another way, all my CA posts are usually well received, but the general posting attitude can be rather intimidating (which is why it took me almost a year to post there. I think.)

But this is getting irrelevant, yes.
 
Aleph said:
And here's Kerisgame 47. Keris has picked up a couple of permanent scars from her little run-in and makeout session with Adorjan (I'm fluffing that her anti-Crippling Charms are good, but not that good - the touch of a Primordial avatar while its full attention is focused on you is mythic plot-level stuff). She's also going a little bit mad fleshcrafter. Heh. And I really am quite smug about the internal logic of her plans, which occurred to me at about the same time they occurred to her, and with a very similar reaction (minus the blood).

Because, after all, her only source for Small mutation leaves them sickly and weak-boned. So counteract that with Exalted healing. Her source for that is herself and Testolagh. So sympathetically link in her build (so they're not child-like and neotenous anymore) and his toughness to counteract the weak bones! It balances! And then she can harmlessly extract a bone sample using her root-hands and work it into the artifact as a DNA template that it copies the mutation package from!

That this also accidentally an entire corps of owlriders who could be described as genetically her and Testolagh's children is an unanticipated side effect she won't see coming until it's too late. :V
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Now I want to see Sasi making arch comments about what Keris and Testolagh have apparently been doing together after she sees one of the neo-owlriders. Preferably when both Keris and Testolagh are there, because their combined reaction will be even funnier than their individual ones. Also because I like the image of Sasi breaking down into giggles after simultaneously reducing both of her lovers to blushing, stuttering messes.

I'm curious as to what Sasi's reaction would have been if Keris and Testolagh actually had had sex with each other. Given that Sasi spent most of her life as nobility in a pre-modern aristocracy, I think she might not have the same implicit connection between sexual and romantic fidelity as the average person in a modern Western society.

On a different subject, I'm surprised Keris doesn't seem to have considered either crafting better owls for the owlriders (harder, better, faster, stronger) or creating owl-like demons for them. Not instead of helping fix the riders themselves, especially given her feelings on their situation, but in addition to it.

I'm also wondering if Sasi's po soul has a representation in her Inner World the same way Keris' does, or if that's something unique to Keris. As well, I'm curious as to whether any of her souls bear a physical resemblance to either Keris or Testolagh the way Keris' do to their other 'parents'.

I'd think it should be possible to avoid the "letting somebody with a GET-alike near your souls" problem with inviting other people into your Inner World by including some sort of binding oath in the entry process to the effect of "willing visitors may not use spirit-killers nor have spirit-killers used upon themselves, the owner, any other visitors, or any member of the soul hierarchy of those people so long as they or any member of their soul hierarchy remain within the owner's soul." Or they could go without that oath as a sign of trust, but since I recall the "having your component souls murdered" issue as the reason why direct interactions between Keris' souls and Sasi (or Sasi's souls and Keris) was unlikely, I figured such an oath might make the idea more palatable.
 
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The Sandman said:
I'd think it should be possible to avoid the "letting somebody with a GET-alike near your souls" problem with inviting other people into your Inner World by including some sort of binding oath in the entry process to the effect of "willing visitors may not use spirit-killers nor have spirit-killers used upon themselves, the owner, any other visitors, or any member of the soul hierarchy of those people so long as they or any member of their soul hierarchy remain within the owner's soul." Or they could go without that oath as a sign of trust, but since I recall the "having your component souls murdered" issue as the reason why direct interactions between Keris' souls and Sasi (or Sasi's souls and Keris) was unlikely, I figured such an oath might make the idea more palatable.
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The best way to do so would probably be a charm that allows you to meditate with a willing person, and you both go into your inner world. The person you brought in would be 'immaterial' for the purpose of interaction, but would be immune to I Hit Spirits charms, and as a consequence can't use charms themselves, since they're basically dreaming and not actually there. Of course, both of you would be sleeping, and unable to react to threats without a surprise negator, and activation of one would snap both back to the real world and cost them a point of temporary willpower from the psychic shock.

Still, the only use of this charm would really be to have ABSOLUTELY secret conversations and or have someone interact with Souls that were patterned off them like Haneyl is for Sasi, so it wouldn't be that useful.
 
The Sandman said:
I'm curious as to what Sasi's reaction would have been if Keris and Testolagh actually had had sex with each other. Given that Sasi spent most of her life as nobility in a pre-modern aristocracy, I think she might not have the same implicit connection between sexual and romantic fidelity as the average person in a modern Western society.
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Well, Realm culture regarding affairs comes into play here, and one of the things that @EarthScorpion can probably speak at more length and in more detail on is the fact that Sasi is "with" Testolagh, and is basically treating Keris as her mistress - which is a totally accepted thing in the Realm, especially if you're the same gender (so there's no chance of bastards) and you keep it discreet.
The Sandman said:
On a different subject, I'm surprised Keris doesn't seem to have considered either crafting better owls for the owlriders (harder, better, faster, stronger) or creating owl-like demons for them. Not instead of helping fix the riders themselves, especially given her feelings on their situation, but in addition to it.
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She did mention "size-boosting hawks" to Melunen. But demons run into the problem that a) there are plenty of flying demons already, and b) demons are Banishable, which tends to prove rather awkward for the owlrider. Part of why she wants some owlriders of her own is because they're an airborne corps not subject to Emerald Banishment making their steed go bye-bye, and who don't trail infernal essence around as much.
The Sandman said:
I'm also wondering if Sasi's po soul has a representation in her Inner World the same way Keris' does, or if that's something unique to Keris. As well, I'm curious as to whether any of her souls bear a physical resemblance to either Keris or Testolagh the way Keris' do to their other 'parents'.
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Sasi's po soul does show up in her Domain, yes. Signs of her reaction to it have also shown up in her behaviour, though Keris has largely missed them because she assumes that if anything, Sasi's po would be like hers - mostly only an issue if you annoy it or something.
The Sandman said:
I'd think it should be possible to avoid the "letting somebody with a GET-alike near your souls" problem with inviting other people into your Inner World by including some sort of binding oath in the entry process to the effect of "willing visitors may not use spirit-killers nor have spirit-killers used upon themselves, the owner, any other visitors, or any member of the soul hierarchy of those people so long as they or any member of their soul hierarchy remain within the owner's soul." Or they could go without that oath as a sign of trust, but since I recall the "having your component souls murdered" issue as the reason why direct interactions between Keris' souls and Sasi (or Sasi's souls and Keris) was unlikely, I figured such an oath might make the idea more palatable.
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Walker of the Yellow Path said:
The best way to do so would probably be a charm that allows you to meditate with a willing person, and you both go into your inner world. The person you brought in would be 'immaterial' for the purpose of interaction, but would be immune to I Hit Spirits charms, and as a consequence can't use charms themselves, since they're basically dreaming and not actually there. Of course, both of you would be sleeping, and unable to react to threats without a surprise negator, and activation of one would snap both back to the real world and cost them a point of temporary willpower from the psychic shock.

Still, the only use of this charm would really be to have ABSOLUTELY secret conversations and or have someone interact with Souls that were patterned off them like Haneyl is for Sasi, so it wouldn't be that useful.
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Honestly, I may well just have Keris design an Emerald Circle Working that lets her and Sasi meditate themselves into one or the other's Inner World, with the "you're only a dream-avatar" mechanics that entails. Possibly anchored on her ship, in a special meditation room. It can be a downtime project of hers!

(Sasi will almost certainly ask to go to Keris's Domain and quietly deflect her away from asking to go to Sasi's.)
 
@Aleph, did Testolagh just warm his hands by sticking them in fire!?

Malfeas be fucking tough yo.

And Keris seems to catching into the cycle of destruction and usurpation that Exalted has going on. Everything comes to an end eventually, no matter how strong you are, no matter if you're a Solar Queen or a Primordial God-Monster. I wonder if its possible to end it?

And Haneyl is right, Keris does need another terraforming charm. It would make her life so much easier if she could change the local enviroment to better suit her. And the Metagaos one is probably the next one and the one that can offer the best benefit; so many of his charms are improved if they're being used in foliage. Especially his ambush and Stealth charms.
 
Omicron said:
This is honestly a much better analogy than Doombots.
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At least, it would be if there was any real personal consequence beyond "welp, gotta go make more spoons until I've ground up enough Craft-juice to make another clone".

And that assumes you don't make a point of keeping a buffer of enough Craft-juice to use DMP again as soon as your old clone dies.
 
EarthScorpion said:
No, it's not.

Rei would die to a spirit-killing Charm, as she's animated by Lilith's soul. If the doombot led to the Exalt being killed too if the doombot was killed by a spirit-killing Charm (the murderous essence flowing down the metaphysical conduit), no one would be objecting at all.
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Spirit-Killing Charms kill spirits. Them being able to kill humans is your headcanon. They have never been able to kill non-spirits.
 
EarthScorpion said:
No, it's not.

Rei would die to a spirit-killing Charm, as she's animated by Lilith's soul. If the doombot led to the Exalt being killed too if the doombot was killed by a spirit-killing Charm (the murderous essence flowing down the metaphysical conduit), no one would be objecting at all.
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"A character in another franchise used as a metaphor for a mechanic would obey within the context of their franchise this law of a mechanic that" aaaaand I drifted off. This isn't the Versus Debate section.

Hey, how does Ghost-Eating Technique actually work in Ex3?

"If a spirit is slain by this attack, it is destroyed permanently, and the pattern of its Essence is subsumed by the Solar's anima. "

Hmmm. And how does Dual-Magnus Prana work?

"This description occurs the moment the Solar's incapacitated health level is checked off instead of dying, the slain character is revealed to be a perfect double of the Solar. "

Well what do you know.

A spirit-killing Charm does not counter DMP because 1) its application to things that are not spirits is a matter of fiat, and 2) DMP prevents you from dying in the first place, GET serves to make things you actually killed stay dead.

Ghost-Eating Technique does not counter things that prevent you from dying in the first place. It just lets you make the things you do kill stay dead.
 
Peanuckle said:
What sticks out to me is how Haneyl says she'd treat her people better, when just last chapter she genocided them in a fit of rage.

One of those things you just don't talk about, I guess.
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Note that she was specifically shown as being heartbroken about that, and cried about their loss, and admitted that sometimes she gets so angry that she burns things around her and then she gets upset that she's burning her things, which makes her burn more things, and pretty soon her emotions have gone completely out of control and half the Marsh is on fire.
Haneyl said:
"I... I just get so angry sometimes," Haneyl whispers. "I get so angry and than I burn the things I like and I don't mean to. And then I get sad and the things burn even worse. And... and all my horsies are gone. I... I didn't want to hurt them!" She starts to sob again, little wet noises which aren't accompanied by fire this time.
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It also wasn't rage, so much as her having a massive chibi-crush on Ligier, and some deep-rooted issues about how Echo gets to go out and help Keris and play with her outside and do things with her, and then Echo got to be around Ligier first, and he even applauded, and she didn't care at all and Mama knew Haneyl liked him and still showed him Echo first...
Haneyl said:
Haneyl swallows and gulps. "I... I want to help you, mama," she whispers. "I want to... to get to do things. Like Echo does. You play with her all the time outside. Whenever you have to do fighting. I... I... I think you love her more than me."
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... and she is, basically, only six or seven years old. Mentally speaking. And kind of lonely, to be honest, because her only peers are her siblings (who she fights with a lot), and Keris spends a lot of her time out in Creation, and of the grown-ups she idolises - Sasi, Ligier and the Shashalme - only two know about her, and only one really cares. I would not be at all surprised if she treasured her collection of letters from Sasi's Lawmaker, as a peer her own age (ish) who isn't related to her and is friendly. Except now even those are gone, because they burnt in the fire and she can't get any more until Keris is around Sasi again.
 
Peanuckle said:
What sticks out to me is how Haneyl says she'd treat her people better, when just last chapter she genocided them in a fit of rage.

One of those things you just don't talk about, I guess.
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And she had something of a breakdown over that as she realized she's stuck with the same issue that Echo has where her power hurts people she cares about regardless of whether she wants it to.
 
Aleph said:
... and she is, basically, only six or seven years old. Mentally speaking. And kind of lonely, to be honest, because her only peers are her siblings (who she fights with a lot), and Keris spends a lot of her time out in Creation, and of the grown-ups she idolises - Sasi, Ligier and the Shashalme - only two know about her, and only one really cares. I would not be at all surprised if she treasured her collection of letters from Sasi's Lawmaker, as a peer her own age (ish) who isn't related to her and is friendly. Except now even those are gone, because they burnt in the fire and she can't get any more until Keris is around Sasi again.
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Aww... Poor dear. I wonder if other Third Circle Demons have the same problems, or does their connection to something greater and their Second Circle Demons let them socialise more.
 
Omicron said:
"A character in another franchise used as a metaphor for a mechanic would obey within the context of their franchise this law of a mechanic that" aaaaand I drifted off. This isn't the Versus Debate section.

Hey, how does Ghost-Eating Technique actually work in Ex3?

"If a spirit is slain by this attack, it is destroyed permanently, and the pattern of its Essence is subsumed by the Solar's anima. "

Hmmm. And how does Dual-Magnus Prana work?

"This description occurs the moment the Solar's incapacitated health level is checked off instead of dying, the slain character is revealed to be a perfect double of the Solar. "

Well what do you know.

A spirit-killing Charm does not counter DMP because 1) its application to things that are not spirits is a matter of fiat, and 2) DMP prevents you from dying in the first place, GET serves to make things you actually killed stay dead.

Ghost-Eating Technique does not counter things that prevent you from dying in the first place. It just lets you make the things you do kill stay dead.
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The point
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The Daystar
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Yu-Shan
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Creation
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The Underworld
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Oblivion
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Your head
 
greensun said:
Aww... Poor dear. I wonder if other Third Circle Demons have the same problems, or does their connection to something greater and their Second Circle Demons let them socialise more.
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It's less the connection and more that she can't leave the Domain. And the only things in there are: a) Keris's other souls, of which only three talk and two are annoying rivals, and b) things she or Keris's other souls have created. Other 3CDs have all the other 3CDs in Malfeas to talk to/war against/ally with/work alongside/get crushes on/etcetera.
 
Yeangst said:
The objection to Dual Magnus Prana isn't a mechanical one, it's a narrative one. It's inclusion in the standard charmset implies that Solars can create their own artificial, temporary, Solar Exaltations.
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That's, heh, in addition to the mechanical problem of "We can't kill this dude unless we can kill his doombot, then find where he's hiding somewhere in Creation and kill his next doombot, repeat this as quickly as possible and hope that we can, at some point, get him fast enough that he actually dies instead of another doombot. It is entirely plausible this is actually impossible because he can make spoons faster than we can hunt him down somewhere in an area larger than the total landmass of Earth.".
 
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