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General Exalted Thread

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So I may be playing an Exalted game for the first time, and I'm starting to play around with character builds. Is it just me, or do all of these Solar charm trees have absurdly imbalanced ability prerequisites? Every set seems to have a couple charms that require one dot, maybe a couple more that are two or three, and then two dozen that require five dots. Are you really supposed to be building characters this min-maxed and focused without any secondary abilities? This is even for ones that are marked as being low essence requirements.
 
Solars tend to be extremely good at one thing, very good at a couple others, and adequate at several more, with a lot of gaps in their individual skillset. Lunars make much better generalists, but they don't spike as high.
 
It pays to remember that Exalted are meant to be exceptional people. It's not minmaxing to make a character with some 5's on their sheet, it is if anything entirely expected; those talents probably played a big part in why they Exalted in the first place. That and luck, at any rate.
 
slybrarian said:
Are you really supposed to be building characters this min-maxed and focused without any secondary abilities? This is even for ones that are marked as being low essence requirements.
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In short, yes, for multiple reasons.
1) Exalted is supposed to be played as part of a party (though solo campaigns have and do exist). As a party, you're supposed to cover each other's weaknesses, and that's kind of difficult to do if everyone can just do everything. Your combat guy is likely not (or at least, shouldn't) going to be great at social stuff or research, just as the party's sorcerer isn't going to be fantastic in melee combat. The system for Solars is designed to create gaps, not fill them, in order to promote party play.
2) In lore, while Solars can do anything, they can't do everything. It's part of why they were all tied to the Lunars, who are far more generalist in nature, because they would fill any gaps the Solars had. It's part of why Solars look almost instinctively to forming "Circles," groups of five Solars (who are hopefully all of different Castes) because that way they can ensure that they have every situation possible covered.
3) (This only applies to 3rd Edition, so if you're looking to play a 2nd Edition game, just ignore it): Solars are encouraged to heavily specialize in what charms they have in two ways: Caste/Favored Abilities (which provide BP and XP discounts, thus incentivizing a player to only purchase dots and charms in those 10 abilities) and the Supernal Ability, which even more heavily focuses the Solar in the direction of one ability particular by removing the Essence requirements of charms for that ability. That's a huge benefit, all charm trees go up to at least Essence 3 and others all the way up to Essence 5, so with something like that your Solar can start out as the absolute best swordsman at character creation, or the absolute best nerd, and all at the cost of versatility... but then again, if you're playing in a party, and your party members have your back, you don't really need to be versatile yourself, so long as the party itself is.
 
As a side-note, even two characters (I'd say Solars but the example I had in play was a Solar and a Dragonblood) who had the same basic focuses (Martial Arts, Crafting, side-order of Medicine). But because they came at them from different directions the result was two characters who complemented each other's methods.

One loved the martial arts and built his own styles, capable of crushing almost any adversary but comparatively poor in defense and prone to expending all his essence in massive combos. The other was a utilitarian who mixed a few practical styles for a cheap and effective style and had excellent defenses, so each covered for the other.

Both could produce amazing individual artifacts, but on major projects one could produce grandiose miracles of magitechnology on short notice while the other could produce stable and reliable, if low-key, solutions.

One was a battlefield surgeon, patching up wounded before they died (and explored the esoteric effects of higher-order essence use, pushing the limits of what an Exalt could do). The other delivered artificial limbs or plain regenerated lost bodily organs (and crafted an entirely new species).


Sometimes what a character does is less important than how they do it.
 
I did an editing pass on my Szoreny document, and it turned out to be enough to be worth an up-issue to v1.04. So here's the patch notes for this version.

docs.google.com

Szoreny (EarthScorpion Charmset)

“After all, what is more enviable than happiness? And if I can cure myself of envy I can acquire happiness and become enviable. The man who has double my salary is doubtless tortured by the thought that someone else in turn has twice as much as he has, and so it goes on. If you desire glory, you ...
docs.google.com docs.google.com

Article:
2020-12-03
  • Document up-issued to v1.04
  • Small tweak to the phrasing of REFLECTION UPON INSIGHT so it tells you both what they expect and desire. Increased cost from 3m to 4m to compensate for the extra information.
  • Added the Limit clause to NO-SLEEP NOOTROPIC to give player characters more ways to muck themselves up by abusing drugs. Go Szoreny!
  • Swapped the order of FOX TONGUE RUMOUR and COLOSSAL FALSEHOOD PRANA in the tree so Fox Tongue Rumour comes first, after consideration of their relative power level and utility.
  • Added a new charm, REMEMBER ME, for Szoreny's compassionate heart would rather a foe survive, beaten and bloodied and knowing he won, than die immediately.
 
preview of a thing I hope to do on the Unconquered Sun


Who Is The Unconquered Sun?
Who is The Unconquered Sun?

He is Sol Invictus. Foremost of the Celestial Incarnae. King of Heaven. Emperor of The World. Lord of the Sky. The Great God of The Sun. Avatar of Heroism.

He is the Golden Panoply. The Spear. The Shield. The Horn. The Wreath.

He is The Illuminator. The Savant Supreme. The Giver. Who teaches the arts of Being and Becoming. Who instructs both the high and the low. Who separates man from beast. Who gives mortals agency and reason.

He is The Defender. The Encircler. Who Girds the World. Who protects his kingdom and himself.

He is The Destroyer. The Slaying Bolt. The Devourer of Darkness. The Doom of The World.

He is Ignis Divine. The Invisible Light. The Bright Flame of the Day. The True Solar Essence that permeates the universe.

He is the Shards of The Solar Exalted, incarnate in his Chosen. The Dawn. The Zenith. The Twilight. The Night. The Eclipse.

He is the Abandoner and Abandoned. Who turned his face from Creation. Who forsook his Chosen and their madness. He Who Repents. Who torments himself in secret. Who brought an age of sorrow, great and terrible.

He is the Redeemer and Redeemed. Who turned his face back to Creation. Who brought his Chosen back to the world. He Who Hopes. Who restores the world in secret. Who brings an age of heroism, great and terrible.

He is all these things and more.
 
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It's honestly interesting to see the assumptions new players bring into Exalted. And not a little sad that one of those assumptions is often "I'm not allowed to be cool, why is this game assuming my character is a top-tier badass."
 
Unfortunately I feel that's an issue that will be impossible to get rid of completely, since in my experience, the biggest hurdle of that is people envisioning all the Cool Things they want their character to be able to do, which the game does technically permit!

... If they buy the right Charm, and often the ones people really want are pretty deep in at Higher Essence, so even if objectively speaking even in chargen your character is a stone cold badass at their chosen field compared to almost everyone around them, you can see exactly what they don't have and so you feel your character is lacking regardless.

This isn't even taking into consideration the issue that some players feel they're fighting with the mechanics in regards to letting their characters do the things they want to do.
 
Manic Dogma said:
It's honestly interesting to see the assumptions new players bring into Exalted. And not a little sad that one of those assumptions is often "I'm not allowed to be cool, why is this game assuming my character is a top-tier badass."
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I mean, that's kind of the opposite of what my problem is. In fact, it feels like the charm requirements are pushing me not to be a badass because they're so high (and locked behind other unneeded charms) that I can't really grab a couple outside of the core focus. There's no reason to make the requirements all or nothing instead of having a spread, and frankly the tree setup is getting some serious wide-eyed as well.
 
slybrarian said:
I mean, that's kind of the opposite of what my problem is. In fact, it feels like the charm requirements are pushing me not to be a badass because they're so high (and locked behind other unneeded charms) that I can't really grab a couple outside of the core focus. There's no reason to make the requirements all or nothing instead of having a spread, and frankly the tree setup is getting some serious wide-eyed as well.
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Now I'm kind of curious, what is your supernal/highest abilities and what specifically are you not able to get that makes you feel like you can't be badass?
 
I'm gonna have to echo Gazeteer's question, 'cos I've never found ability scores of all things to be a barrier. Any given Ability-based Exalt can trivially have three or four abilities at 5 without an ounce of 'minmaxing', and a handy spread of dots elsewhere, and that's more than enough to cover a given PC's badass bases and have some spare for pure fun character building stuff. Like a few dots of Craft [baking] or something. Attribute Based Exalted can have a little more trouble filling out their dice pools, but their charms are...well, attribute based, so it doesn't really matter so much.
 
I'm not doubting the issue, honestly. Some of the Solar charm trees flow like garbage, which is easy for me to forget since I have two better designed splats to focus on.
 
I mean, I'm not gonna say the Charm trees are organised perfectly (though I'd argue the Dragonblooded trees are worse organised than any of the Solar ones). But their issue seems to be that there are charm trees at all given the phrasing.
 
Using Archery as an example since I'm looking at it right now, why do you need "Force Without Fire" before "Accuracy Without Distance"? Or "Sight Without Eyes" before that? They don't engage the same mechanics or themes. Same thing with the chain of "Flashing Vengeance Draw" - "Hunter's Swift Answer" - "Finishing Snipe." There's some that are more obvious where they do things like "free attack on crashed enemy" followed by "do that but at longer range" but others it's not clear why there needs to be a prerequisite at all.
 
slybrarian said:
I mean, that's kind of the opposite of what my problem is. In fact, it feels like the charm requirements are pushing me not to be a badass because they're so high (and locked behind other unneeded charms) that I can't really grab a couple outside of the core focus. There's no reason to make the requirements all or nothing instead of having a spread, and frankly the tree setup is getting some serious wide-eyed as well.
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I've got to admit that I don't really get why you feel this way. Yeah, you've got a point about some Charm trees being poorly structured, but there are plenty of powerful effects that don't require heavy investment. For example, here are some Essence 1 Charms I think are really useful, but only require an Ability rating of 3 or less (meaning you have access to them at chargen even if you don't spend bonus points):
  • Keen (Sense) Technique - Each one of these only has a single prerequisite Charm and they provide some seriously useful sensory abilities.
  • Trance of Unhesitating Speed - Shoot a bunch of arrows at once. Again, only one prereq.
  • Heaven Thunder Hammer - Arguably the best Decisive damage enhancer in the game, with only a single prerequisite.
  • Craftsman Needs No Tools - Makes it so you don't need tools (duh) and allows you to finish projects at super speed. No prerequisites.
  • Seasoned Criminal Method - A bunch of passive effects that help with committing crimes. No prereqs, only needs a single dot of Larceny.
  • Flawless Pickpocketing Technique - Be so good at stealing stuff that you just auto-succeed against normies and get a huge bonus against important people.
  • Subtle Speech Method - Hide secret messages in everyday conversation, very useful in social scenes.
  • Harmonious Academic Methodology - One of the opening Lore Charms that gives you free successes to rolls and grants at least one additional specialty per story.
  • Wound-Mending Care Technique - One of the opening Medicine Charms that let's you heal damage with a day of bed rest for the patient. Very useful for a combat-heavy game.
  • Pretty much everything on the first page of Melee Charms - Accuracy booster, damage adder, extra attacks, defense penalty negation. Unless you're a Dawn, 2-3 of these is enough to be a respectable combatant straight outta chargen.
  • Terrestrial Circle Sorcery - Grants access to all wonders of the sorcery subsystem and only needs Occult 3 and no prereq Charms.
  • Thousand Courtesan Ways - Make multiple social actions at once and get a bonus to Appearance.
  • Listener-Swaying Argument - Powerful dice adder for social influence. No prereqs.
  • Harmonious Presence Meditation - +3 dice to all social influence, 1m discount on all social Charms. Lasts for a scene, but can be left up indefinitely at a slightly higher cost.
  • Ox-Body Technique - Extra health levels, scales with Stamina and can be bought up to (Resistance) times.
  • Wind-Racing Essence Infusion - Grants a variety of bonuses to mounted combat, but what I've found much more useful is that outside of combat your travel speed gets about 7 times faster. 2 prereqs, so it takes a little more investment than most stuff on this list, but still only needs Ride 3.
  • Mastery of Small Manners - Instinctive understanding of cultural norms that prevents botches, can exploit people that have an Intimacy of respect to a culture.
  • Perfect Shadow Stillness - Reroll a Stealth attempt, but you get to keep the 10s from the first roll.
  • Easily-Overlooked Presence Method - As long as you don't do anything crazy, people won't notice you. No prereqs, only Stealth 3.
 
Thanks, that's actually a really helpful list. I'm probably just overthinking things and feeling a little overwhelmed by the combination of the huge list of charms and being used to picking and choosing specific abilities without worrying about trees etc.
 
slybrarian said:
Thanks, that's actually a really helpful list. I'm probably just overthinking things and feeling a little overwhelmed by the combination of the huge list of charms and being used to picking and choosing specific abilities without worrying about trees etc.
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A good way to handle that is not worry about the stuff you don't need right now. The charms section is big but the only one you actually should have a general grasp on the entire tree (and by this I mean you don't have to read the whole thing line-by-line and plan your whole build out, just get some overall ideas and note which ones seem fun to you) is your Supernal Ability, your character's main specialty. For your first time playing you can safely ignore everything Essence 2 and up in every other tree. The normal XP rewards give you a Charm every other session, so get your starting complement of powers and focus on getting familiar with those and then the ones you slowly add as you play won't be so overwhelming.

By the time you hit Essence 2, you should have a better idea what kinds of things you enjoy doing, and you should be more comfortable reading a bit deeper into those charm sets.
 
Alright, Exalted Reincarnated · update: Redid the combat, it was starting to feel too DnD-ish. Pretty happy with how it sits now. I feel like I've finally hit the spot where no more major changes need to be made, and that the rest is just dialing and fine tuning.

I'm currently hoping to get a Beta version of Solars out by the end of the month. I'm marking them as Beta because, being the first Exalts to be written, I expect the charms to be rougher and less-well formed than the later Exalts, so I will want to go back and redo them at some point to bring them up to the same standard.
 
As part of one of the games I'm currently in, Dragonblooded excellencies got rewritten as functioning mostly like Infernal excellencies (they don't lose Terrestrial (Ability) Reinforcement for whatever reason). To support this it was necessary to write a statement of what each element was about, in order to determine when the First (Elemental) Excellency is applicable.

Well, since I did the write ups I thought I might as well share them. Underlined words are intended as keywords (I know it's italics in the Infernals sourcebook but underlining was clearer for me to read. I'm getting old).

Air: The element of Wind Master is impulsive, evasive and can be quickly roused to the tumult and fury of a storm. Mela teaches the value of dreams but also that one must understand them before they can be attained. Air permeates Creation and feels that that truth and reason should do the same. Those who feel the sapphire essence of the Elemental Dragon of Air are creative and eloquent in their approach to life and death, preferring optimisation and improvement over crude methods deemed 'good enough'. Detached from the mundane, they are masters exploring the intricate and of communicating their results. Characters may apply this Excellency to any actions in which they seek perfect solutions, or delve into theories. Intentionally seeking a limited result or protecting the status quo makes this Excellency inapplicable.

Earth: The element of Urwl is enduring, calm and when it finally moves it crushes opposition with dreadful finality. Pasiap teaches the value of ambitions but also of the hard work required to fulfil them. Earth is the foundation of Creation and it takes the responsibility for maintaining its stability. Those who feel the ivory essence of the Elemental Dragon of Earth are precise and methodical in their approach to life and death, preferring planning and tradition over improvisation or impulse. Resilient in mind and body, they are patient in warfare and solid in what they construct. Characters may apply this Excellency to any actions in which they seek a permanent solution or a deliberate approach. Intentionally seeking a short-term stop-gap or a casual engagement makes this Excellency inapplicable.

Fire: The element of the Great Garda is driven and restless, constantly testing anything that constrains it's desires. Hesieh teaches his devotees to be zealous in the pursuit of their ideals. Fire is the protector of Creation and it is committed to burn all that threatens it. Those who feel the crimson essence of the Elemental Dragon of Fire are passionate and aggressive in their approach to life and death, preferring to act in the heat of emotion and on faith rather than waiting and potentially seeing opportunity pass them by. They are inspirational in their efforts to purify themselves and those around them, banking their faith until they can strike decisively. Characters may apply this Excellency to any actions in which they take extreme measures or act on strong emotion. Intentionally acting cautiously or insincerely makes this Excellency inapplicable.

Water: The element of Oceku is fluid but mercurial, patiently eroding obstacles or smashing them aside. Daana'd teaches persistence in the face of adversity but also moderation in focus. Water is the cleansing force of Creation and it adapts to reach every secret corner. Those who feel the ebony essence of the Elemental Dragon of Water are both practical and unconventional in their approach to life and death, acting as both explorers of frontiers and the lifeblood of a community. They are innovators, as likely to challenge an obstacle as to flow around it, changing their approaches with every new trial. Characters may apply this Excellency to any actions in which they shift their methods or transform a situation. Intentionally resisting change or complicating a situation makes this Excellency inapplicable.

Wood: The element of Mindful Forest is generous and flexible, growing around it's adversaries until they cannot compete. Sextes Jylis teaches that steady progress triumphs but also to enjoy the pleasures of the path not the destination. Wood is the ecology of Creation and its fertility benefits from careful pruning. Those who feel the malachite essence of the Elemental Dragon of Wood are sensual and expansive, reacting to problems by seeking co-operative solutions. They are optimistic in their approach to life and death, seeing experience and maturity as balanced by the cycle of rebirth as mattering more than any one part of this process. Characters may apply this Excellency to any actions in which they integrate solutions or nurture others. Intentionally going against natural processes or simplifying a problem makes this Excellency inapplicable.
 
I've talked about how Bureaucracy should have more meaningful Charms. Putting my money, or at least my writing, where my mouth is here. These are for Solars.

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God-King's Call
Cost: 4m; Mins: Bureaucracy 3, Essence 1
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: None
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: Deft Official's Way

A Solar queen commands her subjects as effortlessly as she commands her own hands and feet; by her matchless power and intellect an entire nation becomes an extension of her body.

This Charm supplements an attempt to get help from the Solar's subordinates. It allows the Solar to perform the action instantly, simply by wishing for it to occur; the appropriate underlings instinctively know that they are needed and where they need to go to find the Solar. The Solar can call a specific subordinate if she has one in mind, but cannot use this Charm to transmit any instruction beyond "come here for further orders".

Lawgiver Gives Laws
Cost: 6m, 1wp; Mins: Bureaucracy 3, Essence 1
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: None
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: Deft Official's Way

The Lawgivers are aptly named. They truly do excel at crafting legislation.

This Charm supplements an attempt to write rules and regulations. It removes all penalties resulting from unfamiliarity with existing rules or the people being regulated and makes the effort two increments faster on the following scale:

Decades — Years — Months — Weeks — Days — Hours — Minutes — Seconds

Resounding Fatwa
Cost: 7m; Mins: Bureaucracy 3, Essence 2
Type: Simple
Keywords: None
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: Lawgiver Gives Laws

Those ruled by mortal kings often do not know exactly what the law is, or whether they might be breaking it. Those ruled by the Sun-Chosen are more fortunate.

The Solar proclaims a rule, and all subject to the rule become fully aware of it within a few hours. They might hear the Solar's voice in their heart; they might be told by a fellow citizen; they might see it written in the sky. But they become aware of it. Although this Charm does nothing to compel obedience, its use is an intimidating display of power and many will immediately submit to it.

Quicksilver Falcon's Vigilance
Cost: -; Mins: Bureaucracy 4, Essence 2
Type: Permanent
Keywords: None
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisites: Enigmatic Bureau Understanding

The eye of the sun is ever-watchful; those who seek to act against it are generally caught and punished in short order.

Whenever a subordinate of the Solar betrays their Exalted master in a significant way, they must roll (Manipulation + Larceny, Socialize, or Bureaucracy) against a difficulty of the Solar's (Perception + Bureaucracy) / 2. If they fail, the Solar soon becomes aware of their treachery. if there's a plausible way for the Solar to notice or be informed by mundane means, it happens as quickly as possible; if there isn't one, the Solar magically becomes aware five days later. This Charm does not provide many details, but it makes the broad strokes clear.

Kingdom-Encompassing Intellect
Cost: 5m, 1wp; Mins: Bureaucracy 5, Essence 3
Type: Simple
Keywords: None
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: God-King's Call, Enigmatic Bureau Understanding

A kingdom knows more things than any single mortal man ever could. And a Solar monarch can call upon all the knowledge of their kingdom at whim.

The Solar asks a question, which may be as simple or as complex as she wishes. If any of her subordinates are willing and able to answer the question, the Solar immediately becomes aware of them and their answer. Subordinates "questioned" this way perceive the questioning as a sudden moment of divine presence, partly wonderful and partly frightening.

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I wanted to write a Charm that makes your citizens love you fanatically, but in the absence of rules for mundane propaganda and power-consolidation I wasn't sure how to write it. It's not the kind of effect that should just automatically work.

Lawgiver Gives Laws is an updated bit of old homebrew.

Some of the Charms building off of these are pretty obvious, I think. God-King's Call leads to general remote-command stuff, where everyone executes your will so efficiently that they might as well be part of a hive mind. Quicksilver Falcon's Vigilance leads to Charms that let you automatically detect all sorts of stuff, eventually leading to near-omniscience within the lands you rule. Resounding Fatwa leads to literally magical laws, that enforce themselves or brainwash people into obedience or whatever. And so on.

The running theme here is basically governing without governing. Completely automatic and frictionless control of nameless hordes. Like a bureaucratic equivalent to Craftsman Needs No Tools or Contagion-Curing Touch. Automatically ace the finicky parts of ruling so you can focus on the character-driven and plot-relevant stuff.
 
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Should be fixed now. Thanks.

Amazing that that link stood for almost two years without anyone pointing that out. Shows how rarely people dig into homebrew hubs, I guess.
 
Sanctaphrax said:
The running theme here is basically governing without governing. Completely automatic and frictionless control of nameless hordes. Like a bureaucratic equivalent to Craftsman Needs No Tools or Contagion-Curing Touch. Automatically ace the finicky parts of ruling so you can focus on the character-driven and plot-relevant stuff.
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Seems like this sort of thing is putting the cart before the horse. Gotta coherently stat out more of those mundane obstacles before decisions about charms to bypass them can really be meaningful. I mean, imagine trying to assess the balance of a charm like There Is No Wind if the core combat system didn't have any actual rules for range, or how much of a benefit you get from cover.
 
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