Pretty sure Domnica's Mantle also involves rewriting the memory of the person who exalted. So it's not exactly a clean resurrection or anything, and involves an Artifact N/A.
General Exalted Thread
- Location
- United States
Domnica's Mantle isn't resurrection though, it's something that bypasses reincarnation and gives you a new body. The no resurrection rule is there so that death has meaning, if your character kills someone out of pique, or accidentally kills a loved one, they're dead. Maybe they still sort of exist as a ghost, but they're not alive. Maybe you clone their original body and shove their ghost into it to animate it, but they're still dead and they're animating a flesh puppet.
Graypairofsocks
What is Grammar?
- Location
- earth
For someone to come up with this idea several things are needed:
Knowledge that demon summoning exists. This is an easy requirement.
You also need knowledge of how time interacts with it. You need to know that the demon takes action 5 days before the spell is cast. This is not that likely to be common knowledge in the realm, since there aren't that many dedicated demonolgists (rather than dabblers).
You need to know the existence of a obscure necromancy spell, White Bone Emissary, and that it provides instant communication. The person who created this spell is Ma-Ha-Suchi, and we don't know if he taught anyone else the spell. He definitely isn't about to teach it to the anyone from the Realm.
Now someone knowing all these things, doesn't mean that they would come up with the idea. That an idea is simple to understand, doesn't mean that it will easily be discovered.
There are other difficulties in pulling it off.
To make it work you also need a Demon that won't randomly be summoned by someone else, and that you know the identity of. The demon may be summoned by something else. The chance of this happening is less if it is a higher circle, but Dragonblooded can't summon those. If the Demon is a more obscure type then it is less likely to be summoned by someone else, but that means it's also less likely for the sorcerer to know about it.
The demon in question has to be staying in one place so that the necromancer can notice that it is being summoned, and you may need to tell it what you are trying to do.
Ok.
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azoicennead
Overly-Affectionate Zombie Squad
- Pronouns
- He/They
First, you've underestimated the value of the hundreds to thousands of years of accumulated research on demons that the Realm has. Seriously, if decent portions of any sorcerer's libraries survived the Shogunate, you're looking at potentially thousands of years of knowledge. Frankly, this would probably be something that first happened in the First Age (which also brings up the problem of this not being Usurpation-OK, but whatever).
(Really, unless whatever exploit you're thinking of absolutely requires something from after the Usurpation happened, you should assume that the First Age abused the fuck out of it.)
Second, you've underestimated the value of foreknowledge for any organization, especially a nation. If the fact that demons act before they're summoned is known, lots of effort (which can reasonably be a personal project for multiple centuries) is likely to go into figuring out how to exploit that fact.
Third, apparently Ma-Ha-Suchi is the only necromancer who went "gosh, I sure wish I could cast Infallible Messenger"? Nah, dude. Also, propagation is very much a thing, regardless of the desires of the origin.
Fourth, you don't need an obscure demon; a useless summon works just a well, and an obscure and useless summon provides the benefits of both; further, as mentioned, I'm pretty sure there are ways to prevent other people from summoning your demons.
Fifth, demons are super bribable. No need to put lots of effort into talking them into it when you can just bribe them into doing what you want.
Graypairofsocks
What is Grammar?
- Location
- earth
That's what I am talking about
It's not an easy 10 min resurrection like in D&D. Using it carries other consequences, and it takes time.
- Location
- The end of all things
Indeed, this is a very obscure and hard to discover—
"Hey! Demon! What was being summoned like?"
RedV
Refuelling
- Location
- Right here
Wouldn't the demon think the five day gap is normal and not mention it?
Graypairofsocks
What is Grammar?
- Location
- earth
The question you gave as an example, would probably result in them telling you how they feel about being summoned. About whether they like it or not. The question that needs to be asked is how the summoning works.
What happens when a Demon is summoned is something like falling into a trance and walking toward their destination. its not clear if they are aware of the passage of time during this. The important bit is that this happens 5 days before they are summoned, However that might not necessarily get conveyed If the demon doesn't know about the time taken, or doesn't think to mention it.
The demon summoning spell is being casted from sundown to midnight. It may be possible for the sorcerer to get the incorrect idea that the demon starts its journey at sundown and arrives at midnight.
Demons and mortals don't always speak the same language. If one isn't fluent in the others language then info can get lost.
- Location
- The sixth circle of Hell (second on weekends)
- Pronouns
- She/Her
The fact that it takes 5 days to cross Cecelyne no matter how fast you go is not a particularly obscure one. Because, you know. Anyone who's ever been there can tell you so. The Heptagram certainly knows such things, and there's zero chance of the High First Age not knowing because they're the ones who put Hell where it is.
White Bone Emissary is a clone of IM, therefore it takes five days to teleport across Cecelyne just like a cherub (and everything else). Problem solved; case closed.
White Bone Emissary is a clone of IM, therefore it takes five days to teleport across Cecelyne just like a cherub (and everything else). Problem solved; case closed.
- Location
- Spain
Honestly i prefer to just make demon summoning take ten days. (that is, that you get your demon ten days after calling for it). It makes the whole process incredibly inconvenient, which is a plus in my book. Summoning is already too good anyways.
(If you want nearly-instant servitors, use elementals).
(And if there are methods in place to detect the summoning, that gives ten days for the authorities to find you. Another plus).
The fact that demons start traveling five days prior to the summon in a weird acausal way is because demon summoning existed in the game before Cecelyne, and the five days rule, did. So, as i see it, is just a weird patch and i can ignore it.
(If you want nearly-instant servitors, use elementals).
(And if there are methods in place to detect the summoning, that gives ten days for the authorities to find you. Another plus).
The fact that demons start traveling five days prior to the summon in a weird acausal way is because demon summoning existed in the game before Cecelyne, and the five days rule, did. So, as i see it, is just a weird patch and i can ignore it.
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Graypairofsocks
What is Grammar?
- Location
- earth
It's outright stated the first age knew about the 5 day limit.
They also apparently derived some technology from it.
- Location
- Spain
DotFA is only marginally better than RotSE, and people here mostly ignore it.
And more generally:
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Bursting Eagerness Soul
Threadwalking Rating Machine
- Location
- Wisconsin
@Graypairofsocks just take it as a setting conceit that time travel doesn't work in the exact same way that there's a setting conceit of "the apocalypse already happened" and you'll have a lot less trouble with it.
- Location
- Singapore
Are we allowed to make homebrews of 2E artifacts? I mean, now that its moved on to 3E.
- Location
- Denmark
- Pronouns
- She/Her
actually forbidden by sv's constitution to make 2e artifacts
writing them is punishable by death
writing them is punishable by death
- Location
- Singapore
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Reading the Constitution is also punished by death, I hear.
... okay, Accelerator, that was clearly sarcasm.
Yes, you are allowed to make homebrew of 2E artefacts. Most of this thread is still operating in 2e, or at least weird twisted massively houseruled 2e hybrids. But even if it wasn't, there'd be nothing stopping you from making content for older editions.
I wonder, does this make SV's staff subsouls of Cecelyne?
- Location
- Denmark
- Pronouns
- She/Her
haha what no THAT'S SILLY DON'T BE STUPIDI wonder, does this make SV's staff subsouls of Cecelyne?
*hides silver sand*
None of that means that they were able to abuse the nature of the limit. Any more than the fact that we have technology based off of quantum mechanics means we can send FTL messages using quantum entanglement.