I'm not going to kowtow and change my perceptions of the game for acceptance - I have my opinions and if I'm the only one who holds them (I am not) then that is enough for me. I am not yearning for any form of community acceptance, the most I would ask for is some honesty.

What I see is quotations from canon being the only argument you and others accept, while honest thought is rebuked in full.

In so far as how I write, that's just how I write, it's my literary voice. I've always written that way - I don't see why it should be questioned. I've seen plenty of poor writers on forums and I don't lambast them. I see SLL and I don't berate them. I just see it as yet another attempt to make personal attacks with a then shred of deniability to the contrary. The constant response that exists only to undermine credibility or redress my words is the only reason I'm even posting at this point. I'd really rather be allowed to slip back into the shadows at this point - but I can't do that when people continue to show posterity a false image.

But that's not the only argument they made? Stop painting yourself as a martyr, and people will stop being annoyed at you for misrepresenting their arguments.

Alright, obvious statement here: they claim that on top of not fitting with ANY of the rest of canon, not fitting with the thematics of the Titanmachy, that it is not interesting, that it cripples interesting stories involving the sub-souls as it stands, that it doesn't add anything to the game, and that it in fact subtracts interesting things in favor of...nothing in particular that is actually usable for an ST/writer. (You can find the actual posts saying this in more detail within the last 5 pages of this thread.)

Address the criticisms or just stop posting without having content other than lies about what other people are saying.

And by this point, I'm starting to think you're being intentional, because the posts that did more than talk about canon were posted, you were pointed to them, and then you just pretended they didn't exist.
 
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What I see is quotations from canon being the only argument you and others accept, while honest thought is rebuked in full.

Death of the Author is a valid and powerful system of analysis, but requires that the analysis be grounded in the written word. In fact, I would say that if you're analyzing a work via Death of the Author, it is even more paramount that every single conclusion you come to can be supported by the work itself because otherwise, it is literally worse than meaningless as an analysis. The less you accept the author as being definitive, the more you must hold the text as sacrosanct. Otherwise, you're not providing any analysis, you're just providing an unsubstantiated opinion of "This is how I would have done things" and demanding that people take it as more valuable than their own.

And like it or not, contrarian readings are based heavily on Death of the Author. The more contrarian the reading, the more you need to use the work itself to justify it. You can of course bypass that by going "well I play a completely different setting with minimal points of congruence" but at that point your statements become somewhat... useless?
 
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What I see is quotations from canon being the only argument you and others accept, while honest thought is rebuked in full.
The people who disagree with you are instead looking at the things that were actually written in the books and significant chunks of the inspiration for Exalted - that being mythology - and basing their idea of what the fallen creators of the world should be on that. The Greek pantheons are one of the more accessible examples. Go read up on the Titans and the Titanomachy if you're not familiar with them. You might notice some distinct, intentional parallels.
Wow, so many quotes from canon.
 
I'm not going to kowtow and change my perceptions of the game for acceptance - I have my opinions and if I'm the only one who holds them (I am not) then that is enough for me. I am not yearning for any form of community acceptance, the most I would ask for is some honesty.
No one is asking you to change your opinions dude. We are asking you to explain them and back them up, instead of just saying that everyone else is wrong. That's it. The bare minimum of making a point. Explain and give reasoning.

What I see is quotations from canon being the only argument you and others accept, while honest thought is rebuked in full.
Then you are willfully ignoring half of the post you are being quoted in. We are entirely willing to vary drastically from canon (see the entirety of ES's work) as long as it is acknowledged that that different approach isn't actually canon. This is the thing you seem to have an issue with, because you keep stating your own opinions as if they were the cold hard facts of the book.

In so far as how I write, that's just how I write, it's my literary voice. I've always written that way - I don't see why it should be questioned. I've seen plenty of poor writers on forums and I don't lambast them. I see SLLs and I don't berate them. I just see it as yet another attempt to make personal attacks with a then shred of deniability to the contrary. The constant responses that exists only to undermine credibility or redress my words is the only reason I'm even posting at this point. I'd really rather be allowed to slip back into the shadows at this point - but I can't do that when people continue to show posterity a false image.
I'm going to be honest here, the way you write comes off as condescending and dickish in this setting. It wouldn't if you were writing a book, but this is a much less formal place. I don't know you except from your posts, so you could be an incredibly nice and open guy, but that doesn't come across here. Someone pointing that out isn't an attack anymore than someone saying that you don't have to wear a full suit to watch a movie with close friends is an attack.

As a closing bit, you had to take the time and make the effort to get rid of the rest of my post that you quoted. The post that pointed out all of the things that you could be doing to show your "honest thought" that isn't just making random claims. You only left the part that you could make look like a personal attack. So stop trying to play the victim by twisting everyone else's words to fit your narrative.
 
Might end up needing the help of this thread as I go on with Oh, F&#$, I'm Exalted. Suggestions on books to look at for area lore would be helpful, along with possible ways things can go wrong for the SI would be great.

I like Creation as a setting, but I really haven't been fully involved with any game that was set there for very long, sadly.
 
Might end up needing the help of this thread as I go on with Oh, F&#$, I'm Exalted. Suggestions on books to look at for area lore would be helpful, along with possible ways things can go wrong for the SI would be great.

I like Creation as a setting, but I really haven't been fully involved with any game that was set there for very long, sadly.

Standard advice for anyone doing that - Scavenger Sons and Games of Divinity, both for 1e (but setting books, so they're cheap while still usable). Scavenger Sons is a good broad overview of Creation and its locations (and still the best detailed coverage of Nexus to date), while Games of Divinity covers gods, elementals and demons.
 
Standard advice for anyone doing that - Scavenger Sons and Games of Divinity, both for 1e (but setting books, so they're cheap while still usable). Scavenger Sons is a good broad overview of Creation and its locations (and still the best detailed coverage of Nexus to date), while Games of Divinity covers gods, elementals and demons.

Think I might have both of those on my drivethru account as Digital things from my KS backing. I'll have to check. Obviously, the SI won't have the knowledge I'm getting while researching for the fic itself.
 
Might end up needing the help of this thread as I go on with Oh, F&#$, I'm Exalted. Suggestions on books to look at for area lore would be helpful, along with possible ways things can go wrong for the SI would be great.

I like Creation as a setting, but I really haven't been fully involved with any game that was set there for very long, sadly.


Which Direction are they in? A general recommendation would be 1E Dragonblooded for an overview of the Realm, which'll matter regardless of your location. Otherwise, you're going to have to be more specific about some of your plans if you want help.
 
Which Direction are they in? A general recommendation would be 1E Dragonblooded for an overview of the Realm, which'll matter regardless of your location. Otherwise, you're going to have to be more specific about some of your plans if you want help.

I have them relatively close to Nexus. Meaning about a day's ride after they Twilight Noped away from the Wood Aspect DB that tried to kill em.
 
I have them relatively close to Nexus. Meaning about a day's ride after they Twilight Noped away from the Wood Aspect DB that tried to kill em.

Well, Manacle and Coin and Masters of Jade both detail the Guild in different ways. I've heard people wax poetic about Scavenger Sons though I'd never gotten round to it.
 
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Has anyone written or know of a decent story about Sidereals? I be happy to read anything on them and already dug through most of the canon stuff.
 
Has anyone written or know of a decent story about Sidereals? I be happy to read anything on them and already dug through most of the canon stuff.
Do you seek a Canonical Sidereal only story, or it can be a Crossover/mixed circle(Even with crossoverish stuff) story?

I can help with the second, not so much with the first.
 
Do you seek a Canonical Sidereal only story, or it can be a Crossover/mixed circle(Even with crossoverish stuff) story?

I can help with the second, not so much with the first.
I'm cool with anything.

I'm a bit sad that there is almost no stories about Sidereals spending time in Yu-Shan. I think seeing the city of gods from a Sidereal point of view would be amazing. Even if its about a Sidy doing paper work all day and occasionally getting into kung-fu battle over paperwork.
 
I'm cool with anything.
The only thing I can think of was that MLP:FiM crossover where Pinkie was a Joybringer (and secretly been one all along), Twilight was a Twilight, and Celestia was the goddess of dawn and dusk, tasked with running the docks where the Daystar spends nights.

There's also Jumpchain, but that's more of a writing prompt. I don't know if anyone has done more than short snippets using the various Exalted jumps, though there are some quite long-running Jumpchain stories.
 
Has anyone written or know of a decent story about Sidereals? I be happy to read anything on them and already dug through most of the canon stuff.
There's a series of stories on the Freedom Stone that have some serious Sidereal PoV presence that I enjoyed reading and think captured a lot of good Sidereal themes. The Pivot Child is focused on a circle of Solars on the Blessed Isle and the forces that manipulate them - Iselsi Navia is, in my opinion, a preeminent example of how to write an Iconic Chosen of Secrets. The Locust Crusade has half the main characters being Sidereals as well.
 
This is the thing you seem to have an issue with, because you keep stating your own opinions as if they were the cold hard facts of the book.

I never said anything I've been going on to be canon other than to say that the mechanics and the themes of the setting are not in alignment. The first thing I said was that perfect defenses are not a win for good storytelling - none of the comics in the books or without show Solars nuking 10-15 Dragonbloods with perfects and then dying to empty mote pools. The Usurpation Dinner says nothing to Perfect Defenses and Surprise Negators, nothing of poison immunity or shaping immunity, nothing of punching Sidereals into Malfeas so they have to wait 10 days before they can come back and aid their conspirators. That was the first thing I spoke to - that the mechanics and the themes of the game are broken and do not communicate.

My flaw is that I spoke from confidence and passion - which was misconstrued as preaching canon and being neckbread about others inability to read what is in the book. I've explained that some authors have written one thing and others have written others - I simply followed one rabbit hole and others another, then over ten years debating it in forums or with friends, refined my own understanding of the setting. I've said I "disagree" and "here is what I think/feel" - I think that was read as "No, the book says this - you all are blind". I think there are some great writers and some deep minds on here, I don't accuse anyone of being blind, I only think we allow the setting to be a little less complicated than maybe it should be sometimes. Allow the setting to exist in a lesser form because it was written - I mean the Perfect wants to build 1000 factory cathedrals in canon, that's pretty shity writing. People will not even talk about Halta they hate it so bad. Many of the weak parts of the writing, we recognize them, but we make excuses for them. Over time those excuses become canon through the echo chamber - I think that's part of what I'm getting at. TAW, ripping out bad canon by the throat and putting something better it - that's what the community should do all the time. Let something better be the new canon. If you think mental-disorders in world-bodies is a better way to run with Yozi, that's cool. I'd just like to see another option be acceptable. If someone wants to run Core Lunars over TAW, that's cool, you can tell different stories - the option exists and most accept both. Freedom and choices, that's good, I just don't want to see the community be too hidebound or close their eyes to other reinterpretations of the setting.

I am sorry if it was taken that I was speaking to canon. Only my own personal canon - only another way to play, only my preference. I'd still want others to be able to play mental-disorder Yozi. I enjoy them from time to time, I just hate memes and inso giggle giggle death death as a Yozi.

you could be an incredibly nice and open guy

My students tell me that I'm their favorite teacher and that I'm nice all the time. My coworkers often remark on how nice I am. I have not made more than one personal attack in this thread, and that one was made to point out that a personal attack was made and getting gaslighted about receiving personal attacks.

I am speaking very openly, I have not veiled my opinions or hidden my motives. I understand the lack of tone, but their is some human-bias to see a differing opinion as hostile.

I am very stiff, formal and judgmental. In real life people seem to not mind that - or my humor smooths the edges. I am sorry that I have not done that here - I've never been one to use humor online. Humor is a peculiar thing with me, generally I hate canned humor and memes - cliches are my bane.

So stop trying to play the victim by twisting everyone else's words to fit your narrative.

Play the victim, I'm playing at nothing - I however, have about twelve people twisting my words. I didn't twist anything, I simply cut a snippet of your text out to point to the personal attack, no one needed to read the meat of your argument again or be confused to what I was speaking to. Less is more. To accuse me of twisting words is laughable, considering the situation, but then I doubt anyone within the community would see it that way. I'm arguing with their buddy, so I'm intrinsically the bad guy. One need only look at the posts getting 37 likes talking about nothing or laughing about some joke, while an outsider drops a charm set or a game invite and gets one or zero, it's obvious that a close clique exists within the Exalted thread. I just don't want to see that prevent growth and vibrancy within the fandom - or force newcomers to melt with the groupthink for acceptance, stunting the flow of new ideas and development.

Example: Words in my mouth...

Alright, obvious statement here: they claim that on top of not fitting with ANY of the rest of canon, not fitting with the thematics of the Titanmachy, that it is not interesting, that it cripples interesting stories involving the sub-souls as it stands, that it doesn't add anything to the game, and that it in fact subtracts interesting things in favor of...nothing in particular that is actually usable for an ST/writer.

I've told plenty of stories, for highly discerning players, for several years now - I have only heard praise for my representations of the Demon Realm. Kobold_Bard, I don't recall his name on here other than that the avatar is Princess Celestia, he has espoused recently on r/Exalted that my ST skill is high caliber. dal_segno, a mod of r/Exalted, would also corroborate that I am able to tell very interesting and entertaining stories with just such a formula as has been professed as impossibe in the above quote.

Have you seen the true face of god? No, angels are sent, or demons in this case - acting on his order/whim or not. I like the idea that we are too small, as young exalts, for such Powers to feel our presence. I like the idea than an Exalt has room for growth and will be different at 1-100-1000 years of age. I know many look back to vampire and hate on the idea that ancients were basically untouchable gods that played their power games with the pawns of their childer, I liked that. Different strokes.
 
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The Silver Scoring Knife( Artefact )
Cost:
4m
Aspect: Lunar; Capacity: 20m; Charge: 1m for every lethal health level of damage inflicted

This moonsilver blade is based off those that some Western cultures used for ritualistic scarring, with a wide flat blade. The owner of this knife can use it to cut flowing patterns over a patients chakras, causing wounds that close in silvery, gleaming, scars by making a Dex+(either Linguistics or Craft(Air)) check at Difficulty two, which deals three lhl. While doing so, for the cost of four motes, you can raise one of the patients physical attributes by one, as a training effect. One one attribute can be raised per scarring session

For each lhl the knife inflicts, it gains one mote.


I have no idea what rating this would be. or if it is balanced. Or if it makes sense. First home brew, though, so that has to count for something.
 
no one needed to read the meat of your argument again
Rereading a post is useful when someone is actually responding to the points made in it.

My flaw is that I spoke from confidence and passion
And also ignorance of things you criticize.
I mean, unless you think things like attempted suicide, being sentenced to death, depression, and a guy strapping a bomb vest to his girlfriend as a contingency (let me be clear: none of these are played for laughs at all) are part of a "silly" show.

And admitted possibility of misinterpretation. Wow, so horrible.

I've told plenty of stories, for highly discerning players, for several years now - I have only heard praise for my representations of the Demon Realm.
Given that your response to criticism seems to be saying that people like the canon version because they're stupid, I'm not surprised.

Oh, right, you're the guy that thinks having more than 14 dice in a pool probably involves system abuse. I remember you!
 

I stand by what I said in that thread 2 years ago. You want 64 dice, cut Creation in half, paranoia combat games - I want growth and story driven sagas. To each his own.

Herculean vs 'Pierce the Heavens, Gurren Lagann'

Anyone jumping in, I'd encourage you to read the thread. There is a lot in there.

Given that your response to criticism seems to be saying that people like the canon version because they're stupid, I'm not surprised.

People that do not improve on what they are given are not working hard enough. If average is 100 IQ, then that leaves a lot of stupid people - a lot of people who can not compute a multi-threaded story. It's not an insult, its fact, there are a lot of stupid people in the world. You are free to believe I'm one of them if you wish. I would disagree, but I'm open to debate on most things.
 
To be fair, assuming a baseline of Attribute 5 + Ability 5 + Applicable Specialty 3 for doing anything kind of skews the system into horrible escalation spiral. "Creation's Greatest Archer/Martial Artist/Swordsman" should be character concepts in and of themselves, not minimum proficiency requirements for character concepts that aren't related to combat.
 
To be fair, assuming a baseline of Attribute 5 + Ability 5 + Applicable Specialty 3 for doing anything kind of skews the system into horrible escalation spiral. "Creation's Greatest Archer/Martial Artist/Swordsman" should be character concepts in and of themselves, not minimum proficiency requirements for character concepts that aren't related to combat.
Dex 4, Melee 4, Swords 2 and a moonsilver reaver daiklaive is 15 dice, and that's clearly not trying to break the game.
 
Dex 4, Melee 4, Swords 2 and a moonsilver reaver daiklaive is 15 dice, and that's clearly not trying to break the game.
Subtracting 3 dice from the pinnacle of mortal and non-elder exalted skill does not change the fact that someone with Dex 4, Melee 4 and a 2 dot specialty is someone that is insanely specialized in skill with a blade. With that weapon, they are only a hair less skilled than the most legendary swordsman on earth that you care to name.

Dex 4, Melee 4, Swords 2 + an accuracy-focused artifact sword isn't breaking the game. Establishing that as the "you must be this skilled to participate" minimum for games is what breaks the game.
 
Herculean vs 'Pierce the Heavens, Gurren Lagann'
False dichotomy; my Dragon-Blooded Outcaste (that I've shared a bit about in this thread) can take most Lunars one on-one and broke the arm of the last assassin who came for her and threw him through a wall, but most of the game has been about Chiming Minaret running away from her problems, doing political manipulation and spiraling down the slippery slope. This doesn't make my experience universal, but I don't think your dichotomy is valid or descriptive of any attitude towards the game you will find here; violence is a tool to achieve your problems, but 2e combat is so shitty and boring that no one here wants to make it an actual goal. :V
 
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