General Exalted Thread

[Dark Ness]

Probably not: the Yozi's system works due to their connection with demons and the fact that they have invested part of themselves into Lillun. It's more possible for a Sidereal to be able to do what the Deathlords do, but that probably requires binding your hun soul to part of the Neverborn, which invovles killing yourself (thus no longer a Sidereal) and, well, becoming a deathlord. Oh, and dedicating yourself to the cause of the Neverborn. After all, the Neverborn can take away the ability for the Deathlords to exalt people.

It's more resonable for a Sidereal to pull a Jade Prison mark 2, though that should be hilariously difficult.

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Honestly, I think getting a Monstrance is the easiest way to do it. You simply need to find an Abyssal capable of learning Call the Black Sun and get them to cast it for you. Then, you can take the Monstrance, trap a Solar inside it, and then kill them. Voila, you have an captured Exaltation!

Now, this is still very difficult, but I think it is not on the same level as the other options. And looking at the lore, the orginal Monstrance was explicitly designed to allow it's maker (also the bearer of the Exaltation) to cause a specific mortal to exalt. Now, it had obviously gone through some design changes since then, but I would give it a reasonable chance at working.

 

[Cosar]

Honestly, I think getting a Monstrance is the easiest way to do it. You simply need to find an Abyssal capable of learning Call the Black Sun and get them to cast it for you. Then, you can take the Monstrance, trap a Solar inside it, and then kill them. Voila, you have an captured Exaltation!

Now, this is still very difficult, but I think it is not on the same level as the other options. And looking at the lore, the orginal Monstrance was explicitly designed to allow it's maker (also the bearer of the Exaltation) to cause a specific mortal to exalt. Now, it had obviously gone through some design changes since then, but I would give it a reasonable chance at working.

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Until a Neverborn comes and takes it. Nevermind the whole making another agent of the apocalypse.

 

[Nonagon]

I wonder if the Yennin get to know their 10 dads, or if they do dad stuff with them.

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The fact that there's mention of a "cat's-cradle of clan bonds" implies that there's a lasting family connection of some kind there. Might not be as close as a typical father-child relationship, though.

Questionable canonicity or no, its still around and out there, and the lack of women being directly mentioned at all and merely implied to be part of this weird thing strikes me as uncomfortable, especially considering how it smacks of begging the group to become embroiled in both in-game and out-game talk about sex politics (which Exalted and this particular writing team have an Extremely poor reputation with) and trying too hard to do the Strange World thing by aping the surface impressions of mythology and giving no guidance on the effective Use or Meaning underlying the material beyond charitable interpretations of "I think what this means is..." or "no one would use this to justify being a creeper", so when it filters down into the fanbase it simply comes across as unnecessary and fetishistic.

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What's the unnecessary and fetishistic thing here? What am I supposed to read this and come out with that's so horrible? I ask this because I don't want to strawman your argument unfairly.

 

[EarthScorpion]

Big fan of this idea.

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Exaltation is an unfair lottery, that the Exaltations themselves are weighted dice that favour certain deeds over other ones that fall within their remit, and the rewards are entirely out of proportion to the deeds that one does.

Keris' Exaltation likes the little people, the ones who know little of luxury or power. It likes runners, athletes and people who take joy in the moment where you cast yourself from a roof hoping to grab the drain pipe - or else fall. It wants people who have little who have the drive to seize more. There have been great princes trained for the subtle knife and the arts of low war, who know much of poisons and its applications that it has passed over even though they arguably deserved an Exaltation for their potential and their accomplishments.

Sasi's? Sasi's looks for the compassionate and the dreamers, and those feel in their hearts that there's something wrong with the way society is ordered right now. It's... probably not too pleased that its current host is mainlining Cecelyne, SWLIHN and TED - but that's what you get when the Exalted use their "I'm a hero" card and change and grow past how they were when they were Chosen.

(Merela's is fond of pig-headedness and tsunderes)

 

[Aleph]

Keris' Exaltation likes the little people, the ones who know little of luxury or power. It likes runners, athletes and people who take joy in the moment where you cast yourself from a roof hoping to grab the drain pipe - or else fall. It wants people who have little who have the drive to seize more. There have been great princes trained for the subtle knife and the arts of low war, who know much of poisons and its applications that it has passed over even though they arguably deserved an Exaltation for their potential and their accomplishments.

Sasi's? Sasi's looks for the compassionate and the dreamers, and those feel in their hearts that there's something wrong with the way society is ordered right now. It's... probably not too pleased that its current host is mainlining Cecelyne, SWLIHN and TED - but that's what you get when the Exalted use their "I'm a hero" card and change and grow past how they were when they were Chosen.

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Keris's, on the other hand, is very happy with her, and maybe thinks she could stand to do a bit more parkour but gets constant thrills from how she goes zoomzoomfast around the sea so often.

It is going to love Shuu Mua so much, and may fight any attempt to get the Adorjani running magic out of it, to the point of going for the throat when they try to go after its "ignoring gravity" Charms.

Lytek: "Okay, let's see about fixing you."
Exaltation: "nuh uh! don't wanna!" *runs away to Exalt another street rat*

 

[Dark Ness]

Until a Neverborn comes and takes it. Nevermind the whole making another agent of the apocalypse.

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Placing a Solar Shard inside a Monstrance is NOT enough to convert it to an Abyssal shard. See Dimming the Light for what it takes to convert a Solar into an Abyssal, and in the Abyssal Splat book it talks about how Solar shards were converted onto Abyssal ones. Sure, maybe if you took it to the Mouth in the Underworld the Neverborn could snatch it, and they (more accurately, the Deathlords) will likely send people after if they find out, but they can't just straight up switch it to Abyssal, especially if it is in Creation. If they had that much power, that they could just grab an Exaltation captured in Creation and immediately convert it, then they would have already won.

 

[azoicennead]

Because that's just how humans are?. Of course that in a bronze age setting is there going to be sexist societies. Thinking otherwise is absurd.

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Why? What is the basis for the sexism?
Why would it persist when an ill-tempered person of the oppressed sex can spontaneously become a super-soldier and fuck up all kinds of shit?
Why should this be included in the setting of a game that is played by people who are not in the Bronze Age? What does it add to the setting that can't be added by something that's not sexist?

 

[Broken25]

Why would it persist when an ill-tempered person of the oppressed sex can spontaneously become a super-soldier and fuck up all kinds of shit?

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But are Exalts common enough for that? Like, in the realm there is a 1/10000 proportion between Exalts and mortals, and that proportion is significatively worse everywhere else. The propotion is, again, worse in people without known Dragonblooded ancestors. Is it really that rare to imagine that there are patriarcal societies somewhere in a world bigger than Earth?

Why should this be included in the setting of a game that is played by people who are not in the Bronze Age?

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Why should slavery, racism, or ethic cleasing included in a game played by people who are not in the Bronze Age?

 

[MJ12 Commando]

What's the unnecessary and fetishistic thing here? What am I supposed to read this and come out with that's so horrible? I ask this because I don't want to strawman your argument unfairly.

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I figured they had like, weird artificial wombs instead of, you know, giant bukkake parties to make supermen. Like, I assume that was the actual intent because the nation of Bukkake sounds like it'd be off for even people who thought haunting and seduction ghosts were a great idea. I mean, I'm not the biggest fan of Exalted 3e's treatment of sex and sexuality as people well know but I think that the Volivat thing is about 99% incredibly bad PR.

 

[azoicennead]

But are Exalts common enough for that? Like, in the realm there is a 1/10000 proportion between Exalts and mortals, and that proportion is significatively worse everywhere else. Is it really that rare to imagine that there are patriarcal societies somewhere in a world bigger than Earth?

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Are you going to answer the questions I asked? Like:

Why? What is the basis for the sexism?

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[Broken25]

Why? What is the basis for the sexism?

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The same ones that in real history, perhaps? Exalted asumes that humans there think and act more or less like real people, with the exception of Exalts and another such supernatural beings, and Exalts are really, really rare.

Like, just for an example imagine a tribe that worships a single male god, and that starts believing that males are superior. Or the inverse, if you prefer. That's a thing that could perfectly happen somewhere in Creation.

A bronze age world where everybody gender equality is respected everywhere would be completely SoD breaking.

 

[MJ12 Commando]

Is "closeness" a trigger for an Exaltation? I doubt it. For all we know, the Exaltations don't care about distance at all.

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Given that we know (knew?) that Exaltations at the moment of Exaltation are far more powerful than starting Exalts, and they were designed as weapons in a war against god-titans, I would suggest that closeness probably is something the Exaltation evaluates, simply because it would greatly improve combat performance.

 

[Dif]

What's the unnecessary and fetishistic thing here? What am I supposed to read this and come out with that's so horrible? I ask this because I don't want to strawman your argument unfairly.

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If you managed to read the rest of my post afterward and didn't glean any of that from it, you've already drawn your own conclusions about the validity of what I am trying to say here, so attempting to convince you otherwise under the illusion we're having a fair discussion would be a waste of both our time.

You either get the reason this is an issue, or you don't.

 

[Broken25]

Given that we know (knew?) that Exaltations at the moment of Exaltation are far more powerful than starting Exalts, and they were designed as weapons in a war against god-titans, I would suggest that closeness probably is something the Exaltation evaluates, simply because it would greatly improve combat performance.

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Hmmm. You mean, that it would help to Exalt the closest soldier to continue fighting after a Exalt dies in battle? But that would make necessary to have squishy mortals fighting in the battles of the primordial war.

 

[Chehrazad]

I figured they had like, weird artificial wombs instead of, you know, giant bukkake parties to make supermen. Like, I assume that was the actual intent because the nation of Bukkake sounds like it'd be off for even people who thought haunting and seduction ghosts were a great idea. I mean, I'm not the biggest fan of Exalted 3e's treatment of sex and sexuality as people well know but I think that the Volivat thing is about 99% incredibly bad PR.

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Volivat is obviously the Grineer.

This means that Ysyr must be the Infested and Prasad must be Corpus.

Now we only need the Tenno.

 

[EarthScorpion]

Now we only need the Tenno.

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That's the Dragonblooded. Teamwork ninjas who show up and murder everything, who went and betrayed and murdered a ruling elite who really liked ostentatious gold bling.

 

[Chehrazad]

That's the Dragonblooded. Teamwork ninjas who show up and murder everything, who went and betrayed and murdered a ruling elite who really liked ostentatious gold bling.

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Good point, I've drawn that parallel before honestly.

Okay: Ysyr is the Corpus, Volivat is the Grineer and the Wyld of course, is the Infested.

 

[azoicennead]

The same ones that in real history, perhaps? Exalted asumes that humans there think and act more or less like real people, with the exception of Exalts and another such supernatural beings, and Exalts are really, really rare.

Like, just for an example imagine a tribe that worships a single male god, and that starts believing that males are superior. Or the inverse, if you prefer. That's a thing that could perfectly happen somewhere in Creation.

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And what happens when they run into one of the plethora of female gods and other spirits, and their god gets his ass kicked? Or the inverse?

 

[Nonagon]

I figured they had like, weird artificial wombs instead of, you know, giant bukkake parties to make supermen. Like, I assume that was the actual intent because the nation of Bukkake sounds like it'd be off for even people who thought haunting and seduction ghosts were a great idea. I mean, I'm not the biggest fan of Exalted 3e's treatment of sex and sexuality as people well know but I think that the Volivat thing is about 99% incredibly bad PR.

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Given the mention of a "formula" my assumption would be that the women drink some magic juice that makes it so reproduction works sort of like how societies that believe in partible paternity think it works. So Alice drinks it regularly, it does some magic bullshit to her insides, and after she has sex with all ten of her husbands, she gets pregnant with their kid. At least, that's probably how I'd run it if I was GMing a game set there.

I feel like straight up artificial wombs is a little out of theme with Ex3's more mythic stuff, even if you go for a good gloss of paint on them.

 

[Broken25]

And what happens when they run into one of the plethora of female gods and other spirits, and their god gets his ass kicked? Or the inverse?

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I am getting tired of this. Your position (IE, that men are women enjoy equal rights everywhere in creation) is inane.

Look, discuss this with ES if you dare.

The triad is matrilineal but patriarchal and men give the orders and run the fleets, though some especially vicious widows take their husband's place on the boats if he perishes. These women must resort to exceptional cruelty to win the respect and fear of the men, and there are whispers that many of them form a secret cult who have given themselves utterly to the Pale Mistress.

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The orcamen have ritual spiritual traditions, divided by sex. The females are expected to give reverence primarily to their ancestors, while the men give their first attentions to the sea spirits and the ocean gods. Women are much more solid, dependable and reliable - linked as they are to generations of women before them - while men are fey and whimsical, driven by the tides and by their heart and so better suited for the inhuman ways of spirits.

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Most of the southwestern orcamen live in matriarchal clans split up into smaller family groups. A daughter stays with her mother all her life. If both she and a sister have children she may form a new family group when their mother passes away, but some women choose to stay with their sister's family. Men travel between clans to find a partner, but in some clans they marry and are adopted into their wife's family, while in others the males form a loose, secondary clan who exist in parallel to the main matrilineal group.

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[MJ12 Commando]

I feel like straight up artificial wombs is a little out of theme with Ex3's more mythic stuff, even if you go for a good gloss of paint on them.

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I don't-immaculate conception is a pretty mythic thing, and it makes sense that in the First Age they might have developed something to ease the problem of pregnancy for efficiency reasons. "We want population growth for more prayer but pregnant women don't work what should we do-I KNOW LET'S MAKE SURROGATE WOMBS." Like, it's a sci-fi concept sure but I think whether it's mythic or not is how you sell it rather than if the concept originated in fantasy or sci-fi.

 

[Dark Ness]

I am getting tired of this. Your position (IE, that men are women enjoy equal rights everywhere in creation) is inane.

Look, discuss this with ES if you dare.

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While I am not really involved with this argument, I don't get this. What does a non-canon race of killer whale people have to do with anything?

 

[Broken25]

While I am not really involved with this argument, I don't get this. What does a non-canon race of killer whale people have to do with anything?

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Azo point is that sexism doesn't exist anywhere in Creation.

Therefore, a culture with heavily different gender roles, or a culture where women have to work extra hard to do the job of a male cannot exist.

(And yeah, ES writings are canon, but let's be fair, they have more strenght than canon in this neck of the woods).

 

[Nonagon]

I don't-immaculate conception is a pretty mythic thing, and it makes sense that in the First Age they might have developed something to ease the problem of pregnancy for efficiency reasons. "We want population growth for more prayer but pregnant women don't work what should we do-I KNOW LET'S MAKE SURROGATE WOMBS." Like, it's a sci-fi concept sure but I think whether it's mythic or not is how you sell it rather than if the concept originated in fantasy or sci-fi.

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If it's something people do sometimes, sure, it can have that good mythic resonance. But when everyone in a place stops having normal reproductive sex in order to cum in the Pool of Ardor? That feels super sci-fi-y to me. I guess it's the assembly line nature of it that gets me: this is how everyone in the society has kids, not just some people or sometimes, but everybody, all the time, because if you have normal reproductive sex then your kids will literally not be Yennin. Either the woman never get pregnant, or they never get accidentally pregnant from making the Beast with Eleven Backs.

 

[EarthScorpion]

I don't-immaculate conception is a pretty mythic thing, and it makes sense that in the First Age they might have developed something to ease the problem of pregnancy for efficiency reasons. "We want population growth for more prayer but pregnant women don't work what should we do-I KNOW LET'S MAKE SURROGATE WOMBS." Like, it's a sci-fi concept sure but I think whether it's mythic or not is how you sell it rather than if the concept originated in fantasy or sci-fi.

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Hmm. Yes. Well, if I was playing with the same concept, they'd be... well, LotR Urak Hai. Born from the earth, pulled from muddy wombs - lines untouched by the blood of women, reliant on the fertile clay to bear their lines. Perhaps there's an elemental dragon bound below their lands. Perhaps it's something else that gives such unnatural fertility to their lands.

Regardless, it is the land from which they are born. They spill their seed upon the land and from the seed grow more of their kind.

A society built from the ground up where humans are another agricultural product, reliant on the harvests and the fertility of the land for the harvest of children.