- Pronouns
- He
I'm pretty sure it's just Flarestone and the temp dude. Everyone else isn't that great at magic to be any help.
Fire Emblem: Last of the Manakete
- Thread starter SoaringHawk218
- Start date
- Fantasy
- Pronouns
- He
Maybe is because of the fact that my intro to the game is FE Awakening, but I now have the awkward idea in my head of Arty's descendant just falling in love with Ryza and Ryza just frozen in shock.
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I hate to bring real-world politics into this, but IRL that's only been inevitable when at least some perpetrators of the genocide in question are still actively trying to perpetrate it. Basically every Western nation-state and most other modern states of significant size or age would have been burned to the ground if that were the case.
And if you're saying the Academy would try to perpetrate the genocide: Some might, but most would recognize that the Marble Hall has nowhere near the social capital required to get away with murdering an honored guest of probably the second-most-powerful noble on the continent. At best, they'd have a war against Leto's alliance that the Empire refuses to interfere with. At worst, Leto and the Emperor don't get a chance to intervene before other wizards of the Marble Hall excommunicate or execute the assholes who murdered a talented applicant to make a single cool tome.
Ryza isn't some random wyrmling wandering into the lion's den—she's a wyrmling sponsored and protected by Archduke Leto, who has allies within the Marble Hall and armies without. Killing Ryza or stealing her dragonstone would be close to the same level as kidnapping Artemis, and the Empire knew they needed disposable intermediaries to get away with that.
Ryza is a child, and the books are just books. At best, you're asking Ryza to do the rough equivalent of reconciling quantum physics and relativity from her third-grade science class and some physics textbooks her father kept around. At worst, it's impossible to do what we want to do without understanding human magic. And what we want to do involves replacing or remaking human magic, so the worst-case scenario seems likelier than the best.
Learning from human mages is a good idea. Studying Ryza's parent's scrolls is a good idea. Studying Ryza's parent's scrolls instead of learning human magic is a terrible idea.
Because we wouldn't have any allies while heading to the Academy, nor are knights ever at risk of ambush. From the very same enemies you're afraid will attack us on the road, in far greater numbers to counteract our more numerous allies. The difference isn't that only one option has Ryza entering a region whose people who would gladly kill Ryza and ransack her pockets for her dragon stone if her existence was revealed. The difference is that only one option has her entering a region etc etc repeatedly.
Though realistically, we're going to repeatedly do that regardless of our immediate choice, because the Empire is an obvious threat and Ryza doesn't like that. So this whole argument is kinda moot.
"Dude, no. I changed your diapers. I changed your grandma's diapers. Find someone your own age, not just someone who looks your age."
[X] You will take Archduke Letoro up on his offer, despite Artemis's reservations. A deer in the claw is worth three in the forest, after all, and it will give you a place in the world. It will be a challenge, having to adjust to what human society seems to expect, but you trust Artemis to ensure that you're treated fairly. Hopefully you'll be able to keep the fighting part of your role to a minimum, or at least point it at deserving targets.
Consider the major factors for replacing Dragonstone as a source of human magic:
1) Why can't humans naturally use magic like Manakete can? We know some humans are better or worse at some kinds of magic, so its not just the tools doing all the work.
Our existing notes will not be able to address this question, because they are written by Manakete, for Manakete. Simply lacking the innate ability to touch magic at all will not be a question addressed, because it would not be a question encountered.
The Academy has to have invested significant preexisting work into the whys and hows of magic, and humans not innately being magical is a question that should come up often.
2) How does Dragonstone contribute to human magic? We've heard of a substitute in Beast stones, but how does just a bit of stone fragment work to enable casting?
Our existing notes do mention that Dragonstones can be used to pass magic down, but that is supposed to be used by another Manakete, and used whole.
For obvious reasons, the Academy has experimented extensively in the construction of casting foci, and if we don't want to waste however many centuries reinventing the wheel and use up Dragonstones in experimentation, we're going to need what they know.
3) How would the substitute perform compared to Dragonstone?
Even if a substitute exists, if its not cheaper or more effective, there'd simply not be a way to make people use it. For obvious reasons a dragon acting on her own is simply not going to be able to get performance testing and assessment by human spellcasters, nor getting useful feedback.
1) Why can't humans naturally use magic like Manakete can? We know some humans are better or worse at some kinds of magic, so its not just the tools doing all the work.
Our existing notes will not be able to address this question, because they are written by Manakete, for Manakete. Simply lacking the innate ability to touch magic at all will not be a question addressed, because it would not be a question encountered.
The Academy has to have invested significant preexisting work into the whys and hows of magic, and humans not innately being magical is a question that should come up often.
2) How does Dragonstone contribute to human magic? We've heard of a substitute in Beast stones, but how does just a bit of stone fragment work to enable casting?
Our existing notes do mention that Dragonstones can be used to pass magic down, but that is supposed to be used by another Manakete, and used whole.
For obvious reasons, the Academy has experimented extensively in the construction of casting foci, and if we don't want to waste however many centuries reinventing the wheel and use up Dragonstones in experimentation, we're going to need what they know.
3) How would the substitute perform compared to Dragonstone?
Even if a substitute exists, if its not cheaper or more effective, there'd simply not be a way to make people use it. For obvious reasons a dragon acting on her own is simply not going to be able to get performance testing and assessment by human spellcasters, nor getting useful feedback.
- Location
- Spain
[X] You will take Archduke Letoro up on his offer, despite Artemis's reservations. A deer in the claw is worth three in the forest, after all, and it will give you a place in the world. It will be a challenge, having to adjust to what human society seems to expect, but you trust Artemis to ensure that you're treated fairly. Hopefully you'll be able to keep the fighting part of your role to a minimum, or at least point it at deserving targets.
I don't think we can run away from the Dragonstone thing. No matter how much she hates it, Ryza's going to spend her life meeting people using tomes and magical tools. Is she going to be staring at every book runs across, wondering if it's her father? Doing something about it might well end up being one of Ryza's major life goals, up there with finding more Manaketes. But it's guaranteed no human is going to spend their entire life on replacing Dragonstone as a magical ingredient, even if it is rare. I suspect this is a situation where if we want something done about it, we'll have to do it ourselves. Yes, it might involve a more dangerous course, but if taking the easy way was our highest priority, we'd spend the next thousand years in the castle playing cards with Artemis's descendants.
Anyway, the knight thing continues to be deeply problematic to me. If we can limit it to the lives of Artemis and her dad, it's a little improved. Anything involving binding any children we may have is a total nonstarter. I notice that Artemis said her father might negotiate these points, not that they were guaranteed, and we'd need to have that in writing. Or, y'know, not agree to be someone's servant in the first place and have to deal with a solid century of killing strangers in battle and political BS.
I have a mental image of us taking the third option to remain a commoner and having some noble jerk trying to give us an order. Ryza just jumps into the air and shouts down, "Sorry, can't hear you over the sound of me being a fucking dragon! Say, do you know where the nearest human-sized barrel of ketchup is?"
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
[X] You decide to wait. You still have a long life ahead of you, you don't need to rush into anything. You may not have an official place in the world, but Artemis likes you, and she'll be around for at least a few decades, enough for you to get settled and find out more about the world. Besides, being able to do things your way is kind of nice.
Anyway, the knight thing continues to be deeply problematic to me. If we can limit it to the lives of Artemis and her dad, it's a little improved. Anything involving binding any children we may have is a total nonstarter. I notice that Artemis said her father might negotiate these points, not that they were guaranteed, and we'd need to have that in writing. Or, y'know, not agree to be someone's servant in the first place and have to deal with a solid century of killing strangers in battle and political BS.
I have a mental image of us taking the third option to remain a commoner and having some noble jerk trying to give us an order. Ryza just jumps into the air and shouts down, "Sorry, can't hear you over the sound of me being a fucking dragon! Say, do you know where the nearest human-sized barrel of ketchup is?"
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
[X] You decide to wait. You still have a long life ahead of you, you don't need to rush into anything. You may not have an official place in the world, but Artemis likes you, and she'll be around for at least a few decades, enough for you to get settled and find out more about the world. Besides, being able to do things your way is kind of nice.
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I would like to also add that it was explicitly stated, becoming court mage is not a direct mandatory pipeline to going to the mage school ASAP. In fact, it was explicitly mentioned what kind of an issue it would be if we didn't; that other court mages might not take us seriously/kick up a fuss, but it wouldn't cause us any immediate issues if we just stayed here in Agrithe for a bit. We have no other noteworthy mages to talk to, and Ryza not trying for the position will very likely not cause one to appear out of thin air.
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
*Ryza and [Insert Name] attained support level C.*
Only three conversations to go until they're married.
- Location
- The Frozen North
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
I read through this for the first time recently. It's very enjoyable and I am looking forward to seeing how the story develops. I was split on the original knighthood vote so I abstained but for this vote I'm fully behind the magic vote.
I read through this for the first time recently. It's very enjoyable and I am looking forward to seeing how the story develops. I was split on the original knighthood vote so I abstained but for this vote I'm fully behind the magic vote.
- Location
- Internet
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
[X] You decide to wait. You still have a long life ahead of you, you don't need to rush into anything. You may not have an official place in the world, but Artemis likes you, and she'll be around for at least a few decades, enough for you to get settled and find out more about the world. Besides, being able to do things your way is kind of nice.
Didn't realize we could approval vote in this quest.
Edit:
Also, my understanding of this route is that Artemis already thinks we're good enough to graduate by human standards. We don't need to go attend lectures, we need one person to vouch for us so we can sit for the magical Bar exam and then bail.
No one knows what we are, and the rumors haven't circulated too far yet. Getting in and out quick is viable.
[X] You decide to wait. You still have a long life ahead of you, you don't need to rush into anything. You may not have an official place in the world, but Artemis likes you, and she'll be around for at least a few decades, enough for you to get settled and find out more about the world. Besides, being able to do things your way is kind of nice.
Didn't realize we could approval vote in this quest.
Edit:
Also, my understanding of this route is that Artemis already thinks we're good enough to graduate by human standards. We don't need to go attend lectures, we need one person to vouch for us so we can sit for the magical Bar exam and then bail.
No one knows what we are, and the rumors haven't circulated too far yet. Getting in and out quick is viable.
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[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
I did say that it would be a starting point, learning the basics of human magic might be necessary, but I'm not sold on having to mage town to do it.
I'm looking at this two ways, either A its a short trip we get certified and leave learning little, Or B we are there for months learning and I am thoroughly convinced that staying there for long is going to back fire. To me the mage academy is just a terrible place for Ryza.
For comparisons sake I love computers they are fun and extremely useful tools, that said my opinion and willingness to use them would be entirely different if I knew that every motherboard was made from the heart of a murdered human.
I understand we need to make progress on replacing the system, I just don't see the need to learn human magic beyond the essentials and how they manipulate it.
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Barondoctor
The things I chase come to me.
- Location
- The other side of the mirror
- Pronouns
- He/His/Him
Trouble is, their support chain only goes up to B.*Ryza and [Insert Name] attained support level C.*
Only three conversations to go until they're married.
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
[X] You decide to wait. You still have a long life ahead of you, you don't need to rush into anything. You may not have an official place in the world, but Artemis likes you, and she'll be around for at least a few decades, enough for you to get settled and find out more about the world. Besides, being able to do things your way is kind of nice.
My understanding is, unless someone specifically says "don't", the system supports approval voting and approval voting >> FPTP one vote.
Sir_Braazmiir
Tiefling Paladin
- Location
- Wherever I am
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
For all that we may walk into the lion's den here, we're also getting a chance to meet Apollo (would his stats and growths lean more towards Merric or Linde?) and we might even be able to start planting the seeds of doubt upon the old Imperial stories in people's minds.
For all that we may walk into the lion's den here, we're also getting a chance to meet Apollo (would his stats and growths lean more towards Merric or Linde?) and we might even be able to start planting the seeds of doubt upon the old Imperial stories in people's minds.
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- He/Him
If the Cartese dynasty is still ruling Agrithe when Ryza's children inherit her duties and titles, they'll be doing better than most, I'd be more concerned about Artemis's children.
Same conclusion, though.
Point 1: I think people are more concerned about being caught by the mercenary group that A. nearly TPK'd the last group going from Agrithe to the Marble Hall and 2. we have personally cheesed off.
Point 2: A tween taking the Mage-BAR and passing will raise a new set of rumors. Probably of the "artificial mage" variety before the "secret dragon" variety, but getting out quickly will be trickier than getting in quickly. (Unless we wipe out the Talons on the way in—that would both prevent further problems heading out and get the rumor mill started early.)
What, because they use tools made from dead dragons there? Yeah, that's true everywhere. Healer Clara does the same thing.
Plus, I'm not convinced that Ryza would need to spend months there just to get accredited. If we're spending time there, it's to learn more about magic directly relevant to our interests. While we don't know much about the Marble Hall at this point, it's a fair bet that the place where they train and test mages has really, really good libraries and tutors, plus some scholars who find the idea of participating in a revolutionary project like this exciting.
Maybe this is my aromantic showing, but wouldn't it be nice if Fire Emblem characters could get S-rank supports without needing to get hitched? As it stands, everyone's most important relationship—as specified by the game's mechanics—will always be their spouse. Parents, siblings, children, mentors, childhood friends, etc etc are all mechanically second-rate to the person you're allowed to bone legally, not just for waifus and wife guys, but for everyone. Among other things, that's just kinda boring.Trouble is, their support chain only goes up to B.*Ryza and [Insert Name] attained support level C.*
Only three conversations to go until they're married.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
This seems like a more dangerous and tricky course, but it also is the one that sets us up to actually start progressing our long term goals.
This seems like a more dangerous and tricky course, but it also is the one that sets us up to actually start progressing our long term goals.
That's what an S support is though? Getting hitched isn't a requirement, it's the result. Your best friend may not necessarily be less important than your spouse but you're not going to have a baby with them.
And that's the thing really, S supports were only introduced after they decided there should be a child mechanic. It's the whole point. Three Houses is an outlier in that it stuck with the dating sim thing the series had become known for since Awakening but all it does is change some text at the end.
- Location
- Not the asylum anymore
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
[X] You'll follow through on Artemis's suggestion. You love magic, and you like to think you're good at it. Besides, you'd been planning on talking to Mistress Flarestone anyways. If you can become friends with her and the other Revisionists, they could probably help you get to the Marble Hall and get accredited, which would give you legitimacy in the world. You might even get to meet Apollo, and you think Artemis would like that. It'll all just take a while.
Can't solve the dragonstone problem by avoiding it.
Can't solve the dragonstone problem by avoiding it.
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- He/Him
S-class supports were introduced as an extra step in the support mechanic to fit the baby-making mechanics, but that's not all they are. They are quite explicitly an additional upgrade above normal relationships, as established by both the increased mechanical bonuses for fighting together and the fact that it's called S-rank and not, like, "Husband/Wife" or something.
So no, you're straightforwardly wrong. An S-rank support is a support with someone you marry, but it's also explicitly an additional rank of support beyond anything you can achieve with anyone else. The fact that these two things are the same thing is the entire thing I'm criticizing.
Okay...? I really don't understand your point. A rank is the peak of most supports, S rank is a couple extra stat bonuses and a child. Why would you need an S rank for anything else?
So I just want to give an OOC clarification: the bolded/underlined statement is not true. If you were to combine all of the Southern Kingdoms, (each an independent state), into one group and make Archduke Letoro the ruler, he'd probably be the fourth most powerful noble on the continent, maybe third. On paper, the Emperor is the single most powerful person, followed by either the Sun-Father of the Divine Realm (a theocratic nation in the north-east) or the Sky Marshal of the Whitewings. There is, of course, the inevitable squabbling and jockeying that make paper-power not 100% accurate, but it's pretty close.
This is not to say the Marble Hall is going to cause problems. According to Artemis, they are explicitly autonomous from the rest of the Empire, and she would explain that their creed is that they will teach any student, no matter the quarrels or even wars going on outside the walls. How exactly that's going to affect Ryza since she's a manakete is a bit up in the air, but OOC I will again stress that I don't give trap options.
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