An Extra Primarch

Should the Quest switch to a Narrative Base?

  • Yes, it will streamline things.

    Votes: 345 40.6%
  • No, I prefer the current system.

    Votes: 127 14.9%
  • Yes, but not until the Crusade begins/Prologue ends.

    Votes: 378 44.5%

  • Total voters
    850
Yeah, especially for civilian transport, due to not needing a navigator. Not to mention it's in system uses.
Mass Relay equivalents,
Yeah, this would be neat. Some kind of stabilized wormhole technology? Tyranids use something similar? Maybe we could figure out how to create webway gates? All kinds of options.

QM cut down the requirements to research the subspace drive, and I want to convince people to vote for more ftl types, while still giving a bonus to our combat rolls.
 
That's about 7300c in speed, or, by the original series speeds, about Warp 19.4 (using the original series' cube root rule)
Crossing the galaxy in a year requires about 150K to 200K c, or about 21-27 times as fast.
So that hard cap is probably considerably better than the Warp for any jumps within a couple sectors, for reliability if nothing else.

So I recommend wormholes, or Mass Relay equivalents, then getting the other tech too.

Warp stops at around ten (ten being infinite velocity) and it get exponentially faster the closer you get to 10 that is if we follow star trek on this.
 
Warp stops at around ten (ten being infinite velocity) and it get exponentially faster the closer you get to 10 that is if we follow star trek on this.
There are 2 different warp scales. The original series scale and early comic had one, and the next generation scale had a different one. Next gen scale is stupid. In his post. You can see that he added the qualifier twice.
the original series speeds, about Warp 19.4 (using the original series' cube root rule)

Google it to find out the difference between the scales. Here's something from the wiki.
In 24th century warp theory, warp factor 10 had been redesignated to correspond with infinite velocity. A vessel traveling at warp 10 occupied all points in the universe simultaneously.
 
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Can someone clarify for me whether or not there'll be any penalty for having more power than control once we've maxed out our stats? Not sure if the QM has been asked this already :p
 
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Plan components, feel free to critique, comment, review, and suggest changes:
[X] Plan component: Perfectionism
-[ ] [Perk] Forging Gear 180: Garbage to Platinum
-[X] [Major] Find and bond with a Gyrinx. If that fails, get a Psyker Death World Pet.
-[X] [Major] Chat with Alpha+ planet, check for Chaos corruption
-[X] [Major] Build Safehold Torus Ring around Alpha+ planet (joint project with planet)
-[ ] [Minor] [Training] Control x4
-[ ] [Minor] [Training] Combat x6
-[ ] [Minor] [Training] Intrigue x8
-[ ] [Minor] [Training] Power x9
-[ ] [Minor] [Training] Administration x28
-[ ] [Minor] [Training] Learning x41
-[X] [Minor] [Training] Divine Education General x7
-[X] [Minor] [Training] Divine Education Culture x7
-[X] [Minor] [Training] Divine Education Esoteric x7
-[ ] Auto double tag all 3 Psyker skills (2nd tags from Education)
-[ ] [Minor] [Training] Psyker Ritualism x26
-[ ] [Minor] [Training] Psyker Soul x26
-[ ] [Minor] [Training] Psyker Mystic x26
-[X] [Minor] [SL] Hydaelyn x2
-[X] [Minor] [SL] Mehtrya x2
-[X] [Minor] [SL] Rogal Dorn x2
-[X] [Minor] [SL] Gerald Newton x4
-[X] [Minor] [SL] Herman Jerun x4
-[X] [Minor] [SL] Percy Clements x3
-[X] [Minor] [SL] Emily Watts
-[X] [Minor] [SL] Lily & Ithera Salnus x2
-[X] [Minor] Party with all friends/family on Thernus
-[X] [Minor] Meet Hanzsel Calloway. Maybe a joint project?
-[X] [Minor] Cybertron builds Necron-derived tech. Could they teach you?
-[X] [Invention] Artificial/refined Dust x5
-[X] [Invention] Artificial/refined Lyrium x5
-[X] [Invention] Psyker workshop/tools for general use x5
-[X] [Invention] Advance 5 Crystals/Runes
--[X] [Advance] Purity
--[X] [Advance] Protection
--[X] [Advance] Accuracy
--[X] [Advance] Gravity
--[X] [Advance] Electricity
-[X] [Invention] Mental shielding x5
--[X] Base idea: Mind + Protection + Concealment + Warding + Willpower
--[X] Limit high-grade Concealment to trusted personnel
-[X] [Invention] Singularity manipulation x5
--[X] anti-gravity + subspace tech, Space + Gravity Crystals
--[X] Goal: ready to implement but locked away as per "Dreams of Destruction"
--[X] tell no one that you even had the idea
-[X] [Integration] 30 Hive Worlds, each with 250+ billion inhabitants, hold over 2/3 of the Bastion's population. Offer terraformed colonies, redistribution, arcologies, order runes, ... x50
-[X] [Integration] Post scarcity society x50
--[X] Consumption could drift into excess and give power to Slaanesh. Rapid change can leave people adrift, especially on feral/feudal worlds. Power may encourage a mindset of superiority. Learn from the fate of the Eldar and preempt the emergence of darker traits like excess, purposelessness, arrogance, and dominance/supremacism.
--[X] Use your expertise in psychohistory to subtly nudge your citizens away from all four Chaos Gods. Introduce unobtrusive long term projects so that the problem won't crop up later.
-[X] Survey focus: Fill out and reinforce the Thernus-Inwit line.

[X] Plan component: Annihilation
-[X] Fortify blockade around Waagh
-[X] If you have Magnus & Jack or divine psykery:
--[X] scramble Waaghlok divination
--[X] try to scry & die the ork leadership, e.g. Force choke, remote knives, antimatter creation
-[X] use superior speed and range for repeated blitz raids
--[X] smash counter raids until they send their battle moons, leaving the war world unprotected
--[X] Rogal leads defense against the battle moons
-[X] simultaneous strike: 18 Exterminatus warheads with Waagh field suppressor
--[X] if possible, annihilate the incomplete War World
--[X] planets with fleet bases secondary
--[X] Battle Moons likely shielded and may evade, don't try without divination
--[X] don't reveal teleport countermeasures yet, only boarding countermeasures
-[X] retreat, try to bait significant fleet into chase/counterstrike
-[X] If leadership survived, be ready to counter them personally with Silver Sentinel support
-[X] defensive battle with active teleport jamming
-[X] battle remaining fleet, mop up Defense Monitors
-[X] defend Gandiva dreadnoughts while they scour planets
-[X] How big a firestorm can Serras create from orbit?
--[X] try with and without psychic choir
--[X] crystals: Fire + Energy + Control + Power + Psyker
--[X] fuel: psychic batteries, lyrium, fire dust
--[X] use mental shielding arrangement
-[X] Check for ships hiding in subspace
-[X] Ask Hydaelyn to check for ork-made crystals you need to collect
-[X] Keep entire area quarantined for years

Turn 18:
-[X] [Minor] Birthday party. You're turning 18 at the end of the year!
-[ ] [Minor] Ask Jack whether he would develop a martial art for psykers.
-[X] [Invention] 5 Crystals/Runes
--[X] [Create] Range
--[X] [Create] Combination
--[X] [Create] Connection
--[X] [Create] Disbelief
--[X] [Create] Individuality
-[X] [Invention] Range extension for teleporter, Warp Buoy, Willpower Gauge x5
-[X] [Invention] Galactic communication transmitter x5
--[X] Base idea: Accuracy + Connection + Communication + Control + Range
--[X] Apply mental shielding arrangement to both your end and the channel
--[X] Luxury: triple specs
-[X] [Invention] Waagh field suppressor x5
--[X] Base idea: Range + Disbelief + Individuality + Order + Concealment
--[X] Disbelief and Individuality against collective belief
--[X] Concealment against perception, divination, and analysis (blackboxing)
-[ ] [Invention] Advance 5 Crystals/Runes
--[ ] [Advance] Fire
--[ ] [Advance] Water
--[ ] [Advance] Ice
--[ ] [Advance] Air
--[ ] [Advance] Earth
-[ ] [Invention] 5 Crystals/Runes (Project Omnissiah)
--[ ] [Advance] Metal
--[ ] [Create] Motion
--[ ] [Create] Machine
--[ ] [Create] Soul
--[ ] [Create] Life
-[ ] [Invention] Alcubierre Drive x5
--[ ] Base idea: Space + Gravity + Energy + Motion + ?
--[ ] Distort space via two zones of positive/negative energy and gravity
--[ ] Fifth slot: Warding to keep zones contained? Balance or Connection to ensure equilibrium between zones?
-[ ] [Invention] Soul Creation: Machine Spirits x20
--[ ] Base idea: Machine + Mind + Heart + Soul + Life
--[ ] Morality compass: Wisdom + Integrity + Morality + Compassion + Purity
--[ ] insights from soulstones and soul surgery




I just noticed that our Innovation tutor Gerald Newton is still at SL 6. We need SL 8 to get his mentor bonus up to Advanced 200.

Thanks to Mehtrya and Hydealyn, our Psyker tutor bonus goes all the way to Divine 200. Evasion is second with Divine 50, Combat and Tactics stop at Relic 150/100, Perception and Speech at Exotic 200.

Emps is useless as a tutor because he only teaches Education and Psykery, the boni of which we'll already have maxed out without him by the end of the turn.



Tenth-Tier Learning Crystal/Rune. This Rune enhances a person's ability to learn, reducing the amount of effort required to do so. +20 to Stat improvement rolls.
I forgot to include this in the spreadsheet. Fixed now, along with the number of training actions in the plan component above.



SLs of 4 and higher can reasonably be expected to choose you over their organization. SLs of 7+ will follow you into certain death. AN: SL of 10 would gladly sacrifice themselves to buy you an extra moment of life against a foe none of you had any hope of beating
... I doubt Emps would ever do that, so I guess there's a soft/hard cap on his SL?

If you were the luckiest of our number you've yet encountered, then it is likely at least one of us has ended up on a world hostile towards them.'
'Hence the relative urgency of finding and contacting you guys.'
Search For Brothers Actions may now be taken significant distances beyond Segmentum Solar without penalty.
[/] Looking For Your Brothers [...] cannot be taken, as none are currently in range and not in contact already.
Have Fulgrim, Vulcan, and Corvus not emerged from the Warp yet? Otherwise, according to the map, they would be in range thanks to the "Moderately Improved Psychic Choirs", right?



10 is the maximum if you aren't aligned with a concept to the point that you probably don't count as a sapient. An Ork Weirdboy could make a Combat Crystal up to 12, assuming no outside interference, such as Hydaelyn noping it.
So Emps being Order-aligned (and having a stick up his ass) probably isn't enough for him to unlock Order tier 12?

Connection should be available now. I think. I'm tempted to rule it as a derivative of Bond, as Bond represents a looser tie, but...
If it is only a difference in strength, not concept, I'd simply treat Bond as a lower tier of Connection.



world spirits and redirecting the brain/soul link to the weave are our anti chaos plans.
The only matches for "weave" I found were sempiternal weave (necron tech) and the weave of life and death (warhammer fantasy wood elves).
Do you mean an adaptation of the DnD weave? Would it circumvent direct contact with the Warp by establishing a degree of separation to make its use safe? Maybe through a combination of collective belief to imprint a pattern onto the warp and indirect casting through foci, e.g. crystals? Or something completely different?



each skill group beyond Advanced reduces Exotic/Relic/Divine training in other skill groups by 5/10/15 points, so basically 1/2/3 negative tags.
I really like that idea. Was it already discussed? Because flat exp system feels unbalanced.
The numbers I used may have been a little overzealous, so ilbgar123 decided to implement a less strict rule:
You get your rule. Exotics after the first set of Sub-Skills have -1 to training rate per Exotic.
I'd still suggest to make it -5 per Exotic skill group (other than the one being trained) to make calculations easier...
 
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Emps is useless as a tutor because he only teaches Education and Psykery, the boni of which we'll already have max
He's the Emperor. If he can't teach Psyker and Education, he'll probably change to Tactics, Medicine, Speech, or Combat.
... I doubt Emps would ever do that, so I guess there's a soft/hard cap on his SL?
If I recall correctly, didn't he hold back against Horus "Murdered Sanguinius and betrayed Mankind" Lupercal on the Vengeful Spirit? He would never choose Serras over all of humanity, but she could very well hold the position of "favorite person ever who is at least as respected and trusted as Malcador."
 
Emps is useless as a tutor because he only teaches Education and Psykery, the boni of which we'll already have maxed out without him by the end of the turn.

Still useful for traits.

Can someone clarify for me whether or not there'll be any penalty for having more power than control once we've maxed out our stats? Not sure if the QM has been asked this already :p

Meh, we can just wait to push power past 112, our current control max, until after we've started down the path of being a deity. I plan to make it so that we have no limits, so we can theoretically hit 350, the absolute max, in every stat anyway, so we might as well just wait until we can increase power and control in lockstep instead of race power ahead dangerously.
 
He would never choose Serras over all of humanity

Questionable. He didn't do so with Horus because (among other many reasons) he's known Horus for what... 1000 years? That's laughably little compared to how much time he's spent without knowing him.

Give Primarchs 20k-30k years to grow on him and I doubt he'll be able to smite them down easily. After all they are the only creatures who are somewhat close to his level. His loneliness must be insane.
 
weave of life and death (warhammer fantasy wood elves).
Kinda a fusion. I stole the name shamelessly, to show it's opposition to the warp.

The orkish WAAAGH field hasn't been corrupted by chaos, ever. That's a very good track record. I want to copy that, and attach it to the souls of every citizen.

Even in the most ideal situation, there will still be honor and hope, which will flow from people, into the associated warp gods. By moving the brain/soul link from the uncontrolled warp, into some kind of bounded area, a "lake of souls" if you would, we can remove that source of feeding. If we want to use those forces of honor and hope, we can create our own Gods in our own personal warp.

It could be constructed in many ways. It could be a portion of the warp that is sealed off from the part filled with demons. (Webway model) It could be a separate dimension, similar to the warp, but with no naturally occurring brain/soul links. (WAAAGH model) It could be a physical realspace device, like an infinty circut or unimatrix. (??)

Think of it as a massive infinity circut, crossed with the orkish WAAGH field and the Borg hivemind.

The goals of such a field
  1. Protect the souls of non humans/alternate afterlife for humans.
  2. Redirect backround emotional energy away from chaos.
  3. Provide a method of safe psyker powers
  4. Communication through the weave, gesalt swarm intelligence?
It's a place to put your soul without having it become a snack for demons. It also removes your backround emotions from the dinner table of chaos. The other advantages are cribbed from the orkish WAAGH and are not strictly needed.
Such a prodject should not be attempted untill
  1. we have a perfect understanding of the brain soul link, and the ability to alter it
  2. Have a destination to construct our new "lake of souls".
  3. Have the ability to protect the newly formed weave from chaos, who is sure to be pissed about the redirection of thier foodstuffs.
 
Questionable. He didn't do so with Horus because (among other many reasons) he's known Horus for what... 1000 years? That's laughably little compared to how much time he's spent without knowing him.

Give Primarchs 20k-30k years to grow on him and I doubt he'll be able to smite them down easily. After all they are the only creatures who are somewhat close to his level. His loneliness must be insane.
I never said he would do it easily. In the end, he would choose the human race over his children, but I have no doubt that it would be devastating for him. Like "weeping for the century afterwards" devastating.
 
Kinda a fusion. I stole the name shamelessly, to show it's opposition to the warp.

The orkish WAAAGH field hasn't been corrupted by chaos, ever. That's a very good track record. I want to copy that, and attach it to the souls of every citizen.

Even in the most ideal situation, there will still be honor and hope, which will flow from people, into the associated warp gods. By moving the brain/soul link from the uncontrolled warp, into some kind of bounded area, a "lake of souls" if you would, we can remove that source of feeding. If we want to use those forces of honor and hope, we can create our own Gods in our own personal warp.

It could be constructed in many ways. It could be a portion of the warp that is sealed off from the part filled with demons. (Webway model) It could be a separate dimension, similar to the warp, but with no naturally occurring brain/soul links. (WAAAGH model) It could be a physical realspace device, like an infinty circut or unimatrix. (??)

Think of it as a massive infinity circut, crossed with the orkish WAAGH field and the Borg hivemind.

The goals of such a field
  1. Protect the souls of non humans/alternate afterlife for humans.
  2. Redirect backround emotional energy away from chaos.
  3. Provide a method of safe psyker powers
  4. Communication through the weave, gesalt swarm intelligence?
It's a place to put your soul without having it become a snack for demons. It also removes your backround emotions from the dinner table of chaos. The other advantages are cribbed from the orkish WAAGH and are not strictly needed.
Such a prodject should not be attempted untill
  1. we have a perfect understanding of the brain soul link, and the ability to alter it
  2. Have a destination to construct our new "lake of souls".
  3. Have the ability to protect the newly formed weave from chaos, who is sure to be pissed about the redirection of thier foodstuffs.
i vaguely recall there being some khornate orcs, a demonthompa or something

edit: Oops, Tuska Daemon-Killa
 
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i vaguely recall there being some khornate orcs, a demonthompa or something
Yes, there are khornate orks, but the WAAAGH field has remained outside of chaos, especially considering the sheer amount of khornate activity that occurs in your average WAAAGH.

If an ork falls it is generally to Khorne but said ork will likely get krumped for being "unorky" pretty quick. The WAAAGH remains uncorrupted

You guys seen r/40korkscience? Funny stuff
 
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You know that once we've achieved All 75, technically we will have achieved something that the Emperor hasn't... also, i think we're actually the better diplomat.
 
@Nachtigall dont forget theres a powerful Ork Warlock walking around and if everything Zogstruk does in War of The Krork is anything to go by, he can fuck up our fleets or try to counter anything Serras does. I would like to get Magnus and Jack first so we can psychically find the Warlock and pop his head.
 
everything Zogstruk does in War of The Krork
You're comparing Cogazog's head Waaghlok Lasha with Zogstruk, member of the inner circle of a quest MC? I haven't read that quest, but I'd say a lot of what you're worried about probably is protagonist bullshit which doesn't apply here.

The problem with getting Magnus is that IIRC ilbgar123 stated we need 2 turns to clear the Webway all the way to either Terra or Prospero - they're about twice as far as Inwit (see map). It's one turn if we focus solely on connecting, but that would mean ignoring most of the planets along the way.

Another hurdle is that we have 9 sector Waaghs incoming (8 if this one originally was part of the wave). If we don't reinforce the Thernus-Inwit line until it's more than a string of worlds without depth, we're extremely vulnerable. Expanding in a different direction will only add more weak spots in our defenses.

My guess is that Cogazog will either be on the unfinished War World, in which case we'd do everything we can to get him with the alpha strike, or on a Battle Moon, which would place him within a Waagh field too strong to psychically pierce from afar.

Still, if you have any other ideas on how to deal with the k_ork leadership, I'd be happy to discuss and add them. We definitely need contingencies for them.



Edit: Apparently we're at the 'N' of Necromunda, so Prospero is even farther than I thought, while Terra is closer:
Okay, for the map thing a page back? Thernus is 3 sectors away from Terra.
 
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One of the chapters from The Shape of the Nightmare to Come which I found the most interesting was about a kind of mageocracy known as 'the Cognate', whose society was exclusively formed from Psykers, and who were immensely skilled and disciplined. https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Story:The_Shape_Of_The_Nightmare_To_Come_50k_section23

They were strong enough to repell an attack from the forces of Magnus the Red through their powerful sorcery and psychic techniques.

Though I suppose that there are parallels between the Cognate and Prospero, the Cognate took things to a far greater extreme, and I think it would be very interesting to see something like it be discovered and integrated by the Bastion. As their society would not be democratic, their joining the Bastion could be in recognition of Serras's superior skills as a psyker.
 
This sounds about one tier down in stupidity
How so? Do you have a problem with the black hole part, or the clear insinuation that this problem should be solved by appropriate orbital bombardment.

Singularity weapons would be an appropriate response to the threat of a war world. I'd much rather have a slowly drifting black hole than a mobile war world. We don't have such a weapon though. And even if we did have some form of singularity weapon, it would definitely be designed to decay minutes after forming.

Any singularity weapon we did develop would have that effect. From the novels
One of the Arch Magos(Lexell Kotov) was able to connect to the Machine Spirit(a.k.a the AI of the ship) and basically went full god mode. The Speranza ended up deploying a dorsal mounted Black Hole Cannon capable of detecting and targeting an Eldar Cruiser with 100% accuracy in the middle of a space-time gravitational storm(normally, locating the cruiser would've been impossible) and wiping it out in a single shot.

What makes it even scarier was that the Eldar ship was guided by a Farseer(they can basically see the future) and thus, was actually able to dodge the shot. The Speranza basically gave that attempt the middle finger and followed up its shot with a chrono-gun shooting tachyons to send the Eldar ship back in time so that the shot would connect.
That's what a human black hole weapon would look like. It isn't simply dropping a singularity on a planet, and dealing with the resulting navigational Hazzard. It is something far more advanced.
 
I noticed that both Learning and Improvement Crystals/Runes add "+20 to Stat improvement rolls" and wanted to adjust the numbers in the spreadsheet and plan component...

However, plan "Pray for Crits" starts at Intrigue 66, adds 3 training actions, and reaches Intrigue 68. According to my spreadsheet, these training actions whould have had 100% success chance if the +40 bonus is included. Unless we crit-failed, I'm assuming that I missed something, like e.g. a hidden malus. So for now, I'll wait for the update and see how those rolls went.
 
How so? Do you have a problem with the black hole part, or the clear insinuation that this problem should be solved by appropriate orbital bombardment.

Singularity weapons would be an appropriate response to the threat of a war world. I'd much rather have a slowly drifting black hole than a mobile war world. We don't have such a weapon though. And even if we did have some form of singularity weapon, it would definitely be designed to decay minutes after forming.

Any singularity weapon we did develop would have that effect. From the novels

That's what a human black hole weapon would look like. It isn't simply dropping a singularity on a planet, and dealing with the resulting navigational Hazzard. It is something far more advanced.

I believe he had a problem with the whole "self propagating" part.
 
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