[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
[x] Diplomacy - Bureaucracy
[X] Martial - Appointment
[X] Stewardship - Election
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Bureaucracy
 
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A little odd that we don't appear to have the chance to set up a legislature. The most appealing compromise with the Dragonflies was a hereditary executive and an elected legislature.

We can afford to encourage some militaristic attitudes. Heck, we probably cannot afford not to encourage some militaristic attitudes- this is the 40K Age of Strife. Achievement for the martial slot is a no-brainer.

Diplomacy is a prime candidate for Election. It is of medium desire, so it wins us points, and it is the role where the job of convincing people that one can do the job is very similar to the job itself.


[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
[X] Diplomacy - Election
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Election
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Bureaucracy
 
[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
[x] Diplomacy - Bureaucracy
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Election
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Appointment
 
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Electing diplomats is perhaps the worst idea I have ever heard for what part of government is elected.

Diplomats need to be subtle, think long term, be implicitly trustworthy, be able to keep secrets, and be able to take very unpopular decisions for the good of their country.

It's pretty much the exact opposite of what an elected system produces.

Has there ever been any state that's even tried this? I don't think so, as it's so obviously an incredibly bad idea.
 
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[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
Shit I'm not changing vote twice, I'll leave Diplomacy to the dudes that understand it.
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Election
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Appointment
 
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Yea I'm kind of shocked people are going for elected diplomats are they even reading the vote they bandwagon properly because that's a terrible idea.
 
Yea I'm kind of shocked people are going for elected diplomats are they even reading the vote they bandwagon properly because that's a terrible idea.
Why?
Electing diplomats is perhaps the worst idea I have ever heard for what part of government is elected.

Diplomats need to be subtle, think long term, be implicitly trustworthy, be able to keep secrets, and be able to take very unpopular decisions for the good of their country.

It's pretty much the exact opposite of what an elected system produces.

Has there ever been any state that's even tried this? I don't think so, as it's so obviously an incredibly bad idea.
Every single one which elects a head of state, so I don't know, half of them? For a quick answer I'll go with France.
 
Every single one which elects a head of state, so I don't know, half of them? For a quick answer I'll go with France.

The French Diplomatic Service, which is very good, is not elected at all. It's a prestigious civil service department.

The Head of State is not a diplomat. They have a different role in foreign relations.
 
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[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
[X] Diplomacy - appointment
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Election
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Bureaucracy
 
The French Diplomatic Service, which is very good, is not elected at all. It's a prestigious civil service department.

The Head of State is not a diplomat. They have a different role in foreign relations.
My impression was that their role included deciding foreign policy, making and accepting official state visits, and being able to completely ignore the foreign policy desires of the head of government. On the other hand, I really don't know that much about the french political system.

On the gripping hand, this is the nation which gave the world Talleyrand, it's not inconceivable that their foreign policy really is mostly separate from the political system.
 
[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry

Any future Administrators will be of noble descent, whether from Dia through her marriage to Maxwell or from the planetary nobles which make up the Dragonflies. However they must be elected by election with all valid citizens casting a vote. The only potential citizens ineligible to vote will be those who have been sentenced to prison or slavery as a punishment for major crime, or those who do not satisfy the requirements for citizenship. This will satisfy the Dragonflies' demand for noble rule, and also satisfy the 504's desire for democratic elections.

[X] Diplomacy - Bureaucracy

While it may sound appealing to have our Diplomatic advisor chosen by the masses we need someone who doesn't just wear his heart on his sleeve and act honest. We need someone who can follow the orders of the Council and express that opinion rather than his own in the course of negotiations - it is written that 'the most valuable gift a diplomat can possess is the ability to treat an absolute son-of-a-bitch like his best friend if that's what the interests of his nation call for.' People tend not to vote for those they don't trust, and they tend not to trust people who can lie to them at the drop of a hat, but that's exactly what a diplomat has to be able to do. And the best way for him to learn those skills is by working his way up the ranks of the bureaucracy.

[X]Martial - Achievement

Our world is a deathworld where a majority of the local survivors have already gone cannibal or have stolen from whoever can't fight back. We need to be able to fight back, defensively to protect our own and offensively to nip potential threats in the bud. We have to few people to risk major losses, so we need someone who can lead them well and who fights smart, not just hard. We need someone with experience in the role, to maximise our successes and minimise our losses.

[X] Stewardship - Election

With this person in charge of internal development they are the one that will be most responsible for building the communities in which our people will live, so people will feel more empowered by being able to choose this person. Also the results of this person's projects will be more apparent to the population, which should create a feeling of accountability.

[X] Intrigue - Appointed

[X] Learning - Appointed
 
My impression was that their role included deciding foreign policy, making and accepting official state visits, and being able to completely ignore the foreign policy desires of the head of government. On the other hand, I really don't know that much about the french political system.

This is a straw man. The President of France sets the strategic direction of foreign policy, within limits, and the diplomats execute it.

The Administrator, in this example, is the President. We very do not want a separately elected person with the only democratic mandate in our government to be at the heart of our foreign relations, which is probably the thing least suited for this.

I think people are voting for a polity they want to live in, not one that can survive on a 40K Deathworld while completely ignorant of the major threats that it faces.
 
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I think people might be choosing the government they want to live in, not what we can maintain in our current setting.
I think people are voting for a polity they want to live in, not one that can survive on a 40K Deathworld while completely ignorant of the major threats that it faces.
Now where have I heard that before?

Your right that a direct popular election of any single position is probably a terrible idea. I'd assume that elective positions will have a sub-vote to determine how they are chosen. Personally, making our lower house choose our steward and our upper house* choose our diplomat seems a reasonable compromise. With different compositions, different voting times and patterns, and different tools, a strong Administrator should be able to play the two off each other while a weak one should be limited enough to allow them to mostly run the polity.

*Which is likely to be far less democratic, and possible nearly not at all.
 
[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
[x] Diplomacy - Bureaucracy
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Bureaucracy
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Appointment
 
[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
[x] Diplomacy - Appointment
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Bureaucracy
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Appointment
 
[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
[x] Diplomacy - Election
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Bureaucracy
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Appointment
 
Honestly, electing the heads of executive power departments is not such a good idea. In fact, I can't remember a single instance of it being implemented at all. Typically, the only elected position in the executive branch of government is the head of executive branch, and that is no-go due to our treaty with Dragonflies.

Now, legislature and, possibly, judicary branchs are another matter.

Oh, and, @Academia Nut , what is wrong with the flag?

[X] Administrator - Hereditary
[x] Diplomacy - Bureaucracy
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Bureaucracy
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Bureaucracy


And to those fearing that achievment-based military will get us random wars, I don't think so. It is always either the head of the state (us) or legislature who have that right. It does tend to promote enormous spending on military, which is an issue in real word, but we are in freaking warhammer. We can't really overspend on military.

Edited: typos, typos everywhere
 
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[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry

This keeps us in power, but gives the people a way to get rid of heirs they really don't want. Reduces the revolution potential.

[x] Diplomacy - Election

Gives the people a way to infleunce our foreign policy. Will also make sure that if some foreign shit happens they at least authorized it and that we don't have revolution potential every single time a war happens.

[X] Martial - Appointment
[X] Stewardship - Election
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Bureaucracy
 
[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
[x] Diplomacy - Election
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Bureaucracy
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Appointment
 
The Diplomacy advisor does not determine foreign policy - his or her job is to act as ambassador and to advise on foreign policy, but it is the Administrator who ultimately determines foreign policy. It is the Diplomacy advisor's role is to carry out the foreign policy decisions. This is mentioned earlier in the thread.

At least there are some people who read and can pay attention :rage:
 
[X] Administrator - Hereditary
[x] Diplomacy - Bureaucracy
[X] Martial - Achievement
[X] Stewardship - Bureaucracy
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Appointment
 
[X] Administrator - Hereditary
- [X] Open Tannistry
[X] Diplomacy - Bureaucracy
[X] Martial - Appointment
[X] Stewardship - Election
[X] Intrigue - Appointment
[X] Learning - Appointment
 
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