- Pronouns
- He/Him
In the sense of "Grave Keeper chemically cleaned the bones and then left them outside for years on end so the best you could get genetically would be 'Yup, that's human bone alright'."
Age of Strife
In the sense of "Grave Keeper chemically cleaned the bones and then left them outside for years on end so the best you could get genetically would be 'Yup, that's human bone alright'."
- Pronouns
- They/Them
@Academia Nut
So I am going to go and hit a bar just want to say before I go love this quest and I hope to come back to a update that lives up to the hype.
So I am going to go and hit a bar just want to say before I go love this quest and I hope to come back to a update that lives up to the hype.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Tonight is my anime night, so unless I go home early (which is usually because I'm overly tired) I'm unlikely to update tonight, and if I do it will be several hours from now.
Sorry to disappoint
Dawn you well here hoping I black out till tomorrow afternoonTonight is my anime night, so unless I go home early (which is usually because I'm overly tired) I'm unlikely to update tonight, and if I do it will be several hours from now.
Sorry to disappoint
...
Anyway.
Can anyone remember any descriptions of what our architecture looks like. I'm sketching a background for my picture of Dia, cause pictures generally look boring on plain white. I'd just do trees, but I didn't paint her in protective gear, so that seems like it would be extremely out of character.
Anyway.
Can anyone remember any descriptions of what our architecture looks like. I'm sketching a background for my picture of Dia, cause pictures generally look boring on plain white. I'd just do trees, but I didn't paint her in protective gear, so that seems like it would be extremely out of character.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
It depends strongly on where you go. Greengraft and Amethyst Gardens are very open, where Glenshade Manor is like an overgrown hotel. The overriding themes would be a degree of corporate aesthetic and fewer large windows than might be used in modern architecture. Other than that there is nothing particularly defining, so it's hard to go wrong.
- Location
- somewhere
It's possible to extract a near complete Neaderthal genome from a single 50k year old toe bone with current day technology. Pretty sure the surface was chemically cleaned to avoid contamination with modern human dna, too.
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Is it possible to "tame" a Deathworld? Heavy deforestation, domestication and the like to turn it into the equivalent of a garden world? Or are we never going to get the chance to build skyscrapers and orbital elevators on this deathball outside of arcologies??
Because from what I've read of places like Catachan, it seems unlikely.
Because from what I've read of places like Catachan, it seems unlikely.
- Location
- National Capital Region, USA
If you're the Eldar or DAoT Humanity at large. Seeing as how were the tiny post-apocalyptic remnant of the planet that wasn't StarBombed earlier and the Eldar are still around and still actively messing with the planet and they are much much more powerful than we are, probably not.
Technically, a Deathworld is defined by it's inability to be widely colonized by humans. Therefore, by that measuring stick, we are more of a "potential" Deathworld than an actual one.
Neanderthal DNA is found in vanishingly small amounts in a vanishingly small amount of ancient bone (which itself is very rare - in all likelihood there were billions of Neanderthals alive over the total time of their race and only a few hundred individuals left any bones for us to find). i.e. it takes VERY unusual circumstances to preserve any DNA and even in those special, special circumstances it lucky to find about 30% of the DNA still readable. Chemically cleaning bone would indeed destroy any useful information in the DNA. Also, skulls don't have an awful lot of DNA in them in the first place. DNA is rich in active tissues, and adult skulls aren't very active.
Really, the achievement of being able to find Neanderthal DNA is so great as to be a sort of modern miracle. All the people involved deserve major respect.
fasquardon
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- Location
- somewhere
DNA decay is very much time dependent, what you say is certainly true of the oldest bones with successfully recovered DNA (close to half a million years old), less so for younger ones.
Given the apparently recent mutations deforming it that particular adult skull seems to have been "very active".
Amazing achievement definitely, miracle only for values of miracle of "happens once a year or so" given that we have half a dozen different Neanderthal genomes to various degrees of completeness (up to 99.9%) and the Denisova one on top of that.
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Why would we want to? It's an interesting and beautiful place as it is. If we want to survive out on the surface, we can alter ourselves to do so. Seriously, the first step, Medicinal plants II, is already a research option. AN's already said it can give us metal bones.
It's my hope that all Dandriss natives will be able to walk around outside the walls without protective equipment, through sheer innate durability one day. And point and laugh at the Space Marines in their dinky power armor when they arrive.
On that note, I'd like to discuss what our requirements are going to be moving forward. I don't know what the damage to our economy is, though in my head someone rolled a 1 at a chemical refinery and there was an industrial accident. That said, operating under the impression that we'll be wanting maximum research coverage moving forward I suggest the following;
-establish universities in each of our settlements. Currently Greengraft and Glenshade Manor have one (as does Shattersaw), but Amethyst Gardens doesn't, nor will Librarian's Nook and Six Pillars. They're 200 C to build each, and after Improved Teaching Methods II is finished they'll require 60 instructors. That will take 1.5 turns of skilled labor production to accomplish at current rates, though as more get up and running that will go down. This will help with our skilled labor shortages and produce more Student Projects for research projects.
-An Industrial Fusion Reactor for Amethyst Gardens, Librarians Nook and Six Pillars. That takes 50 Artisans and 40 Laborers going forward (likely to go down to 40 Artisans once Artificial Intelligence I and Industrial Automation II are completed) per. At current production, it will take close to 2 turns to get the Artisans required to staff them, which conveniently is about how long it takes to build the reactors. I am assuming that the parts are prefabricated at a machine shop and assembled on site. This will help power things like the hydroponic farms and schools we'll be setting up.
-At least one more chemical refinery. We can argue about its utility as scientific or economic uses, but if applied as a research center it accelerate our Chemistry projects, and once Networking II is completed more will provide greater bonuses. They take 200 Laborers, 50 Artisans and 10 Academics per currently, which will take between one and two years of skilled labor production at current rates (though hopefully we'll have another school up and running by the time we get to this point).
-A Menagerie from the Roachrhino project. Staffing requirements are currently unknown, but something approximating the Chemical Refinery would make sense to me. Again, duplicates will likely serve as dedicated research centers, giving the learning bonus x3 +1d25 that will synergize nicely with the +20% research bonus from the Elders and the Hunting Lodge.
-Getting a computing research center will require Artificial Intelligence I (which we should be working on) and Miniaturization II (which would take some time to complete), but I presume we'll want some of those as well (because free research slots is something everyone can agree on, am I right?)
Can anyone think of other buildings that we'll want?
@Academia Nut now that we have the Solar Panel Design will we be able to make more of them? If so, how much will they cost?
-establish universities in each of our settlements. Currently Greengraft and Glenshade Manor have one (as does Shattersaw), but Amethyst Gardens doesn't, nor will Librarian's Nook and Six Pillars. They're 200 C to build each, and after Improved Teaching Methods II is finished they'll require 60 instructors. That will take 1.5 turns of skilled labor production to accomplish at current rates, though as more get up and running that will go down. This will help with our skilled labor shortages and produce more Student Projects for research projects.
-An Industrial Fusion Reactor for Amethyst Gardens, Librarians Nook and Six Pillars. That takes 50 Artisans and 40 Laborers going forward (likely to go down to 40 Artisans once Artificial Intelligence I and Industrial Automation II are completed) per. At current production, it will take close to 2 turns to get the Artisans required to staff them, which conveniently is about how long it takes to build the reactors. I am assuming that the parts are prefabricated at a machine shop and assembled on site. This will help power things like the hydroponic farms and schools we'll be setting up.
-At least one more chemical refinery. We can argue about its utility as scientific or economic uses, but if applied as a research center it accelerate our Chemistry projects, and once Networking II is completed more will provide greater bonuses. They take 200 Laborers, 50 Artisans and 10 Academics per currently, which will take between one and two years of skilled labor production at current rates (though hopefully we'll have another school up and running by the time we get to this point).
-A Menagerie from the Roachrhino project. Staffing requirements are currently unknown, but something approximating the Chemical Refinery would make sense to me. Again, duplicates will likely serve as dedicated research centers, giving the learning bonus x3 +1d25 that will synergize nicely with the +20% research bonus from the Elders and the Hunting Lodge.
-Getting a computing research center will require Artificial Intelligence I (which we should be working on) and Miniaturization II (which would take some time to complete), but I presume we'll want some of those as well (because free research slots is something everyone can agree on, am I right?)
Can anyone think of other buildings that we'll want?
@Academia Nut now that we have the Solar Panel Design will we be able to make more of them? If so, how much will they cost?
I think ink we may want to focus on general purpose research buildings rather than specialists, given that we're going to want to do the psyker research at some point. Pure theoretical research also seems to need to be done in them.
Have you wondered why it is that a completely alien biochemistry just so happens to be able to assimilate human tissue and hybridise with them without killing them.
It's impossibly unlikely that this is a coincidence, and I personally don't want to start encouraging the process.
If we did, next thing we know we'll be blue and have stupid tails.
I feel it's a much better option to get our research capabilities to the stage when we can start recovering the human tech tree, rather than trying to become something 'other'. We've seen from the Authority that human cybernetics can be pretty amazing anyway.
Have you wondered why it is that a completely alien biochemistry just so happens to be able to assimilate human tissue and hybridise with them without killing them.
It's impossibly unlikely that this is a coincidence, and I personally don't want to start encouraging the process.
If we did, next thing we know we'll be blue and have stupid tails.
I feel it's a much better option to get our research capabilities to the stage when we can start recovering the human tech tree, rather than trying to become something 'other'. We've seen from the Authority that human cybernetics can be pretty amazing anyway.
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Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
To be completely fair, Dandriss is Hilariously lethal by default, even the closest thing to an earth-native substance that's basically just a cluster of sugars will Fucking Explode like a grenade if you're not careful in growing it, and I'm pretty sure it's still also made of horrible poison metal.
By the time our biochem is good enough that we can start cribbing on local adaptations for our own use, it's not really so much "We're just copy-pasting Dandriss genetics onto our own gene code", and more "We already know that it's possible for this to be applied to a carbon-based lifeform, and we have enough of an understanding of it to duplicate the outcome for our own people using our science".
Isn't one use of Medicinal Plants II something similar to one step in the creation of Space Marines?
In this case the part where Ceramantium is incorporated into the Space Marines skeleton. By administering an enzyme extracted from Dandriss plants that deposits metals in the skeleton in the same way that the plants form their bark. At least I think that was what they do.
In this case the part where Ceramantium is incorporated into the Space Marines skeleton. By administering an enzyme extracted from Dandriss plants that deposits metals in the skeleton in the same way that the plants form their bark. At least I think that was what they do.
The problem is it's not that. According to the description, if you have the right pieces of Dandriss' flora put inside you, it converts parts of you into some organometallic flesh/bone. It somehow does this without being hillariously lethal as the body tears itself apart from the immune response or the converted tissue no longer functioning as they should . The fact that it can hybridise at all is impossibly unlikely to the degree of being intensely suspicious. The fact that it can do it safely and reliably is pretty much proof that it's been engineered or controlled to be compatible with humans.
This is basically some form of alien nano or warptech. Putting it inside our bodies when we don't know who made it and don't understand why it works, or what other things it might do, is not advisable.
I think we're much better off redeveloping our own pharmaceuticals, cybernetics and medical science. Later, we can study what the effects of the local biosphere has, but we shouldn't use it medically until we understand it from first principles and have incorporated it into our standard science and technology.
It's not as if we don't have plenty of potential places to recover pre-Fall technology from.
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SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
Aye, I'm with Alratan on this one. Some of the local adaptation techs are very clearly not something to persue until we have a clearer understanding of what is going on. Keep in mind that time skips are something that can happen in this quest per word of AN and at some point the grand crusade launched by the emperor will occur, if we are to far off baseline human then we will end up being destroyed.
Obviously that isn't a great reason not to look into things but the point I am making is we need to have a greater understanding of the local wild life before we start going to that level of integration. Keep in mind the Proto Exodite Eldar are having problems with the wild life here and this was supposed to be a planet they were turning into a maiden world and that it seems the Flora is psycho active this should be a big hint that we need to be cautious.
Obviously that isn't a great reason not to look into things but the point I am making is we need to have a greater understanding of the local wild life before we start going to that level of integration. Keep in mind the Proto Exodite Eldar are having problems with the wild life here and this was supposed to be a planet they were turning into a maiden world and that it seems the Flora is psycho active this should be a big hint that we need to be cautious.
I'm somewhat less paranoid about the adaptation techs, but any applied biomods/genemods are off the table until we know all the hows and whys of it.
But we do need to research it because other factions on planet are likely to try some of that, and we need to understand even if we do not use.
But we do need to research it because other factions on planet are likely to try some of that, and we need to understand even if we do not use.
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SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
Well things like domestication projects and underground construction are fine in my view. It's things like Medicinal plants II which start integrating local organometallic structures into the human form via ingestion of food that has me leery.
I can think of a few things like this that can happen in real life. IIRC strontium can replace the function of calcium in the bones as a more dense material and it's actually slightly better for strong bones as long as the form of strontium being ingested is non-radioactive if you take to much however it inhibits the metabolism of vitamin D and causes problems.
Whilst I imagine that medicinal plants II likely identifies the short term issues it very likely doesn't identify long term issues.
The problem is that they can be applied as drugs based on what we know. It doesn't required genetic engineering or surgery or anything similar. That's partially why it's so suspicious.
Once we've taken the genie out of the bottle, how do we put it back in? The point of local adaptation the is that they aren't dependent on our infrastructure, which means once people know which fruit to eat to give themselves superpowers they can.
I also don't think we need to research it. The Authority are our major opposition, and understanding what they can do is a question of cybernetics and the warp sciences.
SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
Heres my list of local adaptation techs I feel is safe to persue, there are others which I feel may be reasonable as well but these are ones I feel we can persue with out having to worry to much about the long term side effects.
Local Adaptation
Dragonfly Domestication 191/350 - The dragonflies of Dandriss are mostly predatory fliers that your academics tell you fill ecological niches similar to Terran birds of prey, and they suspect that they could be used similarly to the ancient art of falconry, and could be a boon to your jaegers
Fissile Material Harvest 0/400 - Now that you understand the biology of pile trees, you should be able to figure out ways to draw forth fissile and fertile isotopes from them without risking a small nuclear explosion. This will give you access to isotopes that you could use to accelerate the growth of cultivated pile trees, for your own power production, or even for crude fission bombs if you so desired. WARNING: Requires a minimum of 50 RP a turn to avoid a catastrophe
Local Wildlife Carapace Armour 173/400 - Some of the local fauna is better described of as AFVs than animals, and if you can figure out which species would work best and how to work bits of carapace you could have additional armour for your troops that would likely be able to turn aside anything short of EM SAW fire
Roachrhino Domestication 220/300 - The roachrhino is a large herbivore that is relatively docile, all things considered, and should be a good first candidate for domestication as they would be useful as beasts of burden or as a reliable source of food.
Underground Construction 0/400 - Building underground has risks and problems but at the very least it should provide the protection of an armoured curtain wall, along with experience in digging down on Dandriss.
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Also something I've noticed which I missed in the past and others may have done so as well Fissile material harvest tech would speed the growth of the pile trees cultivation. That means it cuts down on the time it would take to add space to our settlements.
Local Adaptation
Dragonfly Domestication 191/350 - The dragonflies of Dandriss are mostly predatory fliers that your academics tell you fill ecological niches similar to Terran birds of prey, and they suspect that they could be used similarly to the ancient art of falconry, and could be a boon to your jaegers
Fissile Material Harvest 0/400 - Now that you understand the biology of pile trees, you should be able to figure out ways to draw forth fissile and fertile isotopes from them without risking a small nuclear explosion. This will give you access to isotopes that you could use to accelerate the growth of cultivated pile trees, for your own power production, or even for crude fission bombs if you so desired. WARNING: Requires a minimum of 50 RP a turn to avoid a catastrophe
Local Wildlife Carapace Armour 173/400 - Some of the local fauna is better described of as AFVs than animals, and if you can figure out which species would work best and how to work bits of carapace you could have additional armour for your troops that would likely be able to turn aside anything short of EM SAW fire
Roachrhino Domestication 220/300 - The roachrhino is a large herbivore that is relatively docile, all things considered, and should be a good first candidate for domestication as they would be useful as beasts of burden or as a reliable source of food.
Underground Construction 0/400 - Building underground has risks and problems but at the very least it should provide the protection of an armoured curtain wall, along with experience in digging down on Dandriss.
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Also something I've noticed which I missed in the past and others may have done so as well Fissile material harvest tech would speed the growth of the pile trees cultivation. That means it cuts down on the time it would take to add space to our settlements.
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