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“Human Resources” Shouldn’t Be This Literal: A PMMM/ProjectMoon Quest

Would you Distort or manifest EGO?

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Carmen is someone who failed at the path to save everyone
Ayin is someone who shows how much is needed to pay to save everyone
And X is someone who is easy and fun saves everyone, even if his path is built on bones of his parents

...

After writing it, I am sure that we must make Madoka meet him in that order, even if Madoka can distort
Also, probaly there is distort risk with Ayin too
so

[X] The Sun
 
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Trexfromants said:
fter writing it, I am sure that we must make Madoka meet him in that order, even if Madoka can distort
Also, probaly there is distort risk with Ayin too
so
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Given how bad Madoka had it under the Adult's tender care, plus the current circumstances, I don't think there is so much a risk of distortion as a certainty of it, and the talk isn't about influencing that in particular.

For example, it could be about the specific way the distortion goes.

Or it could just be what member of X's family Madoka meets.

But I think the moment to stop her from distorting was the vote on whether or not to go save her right now.

I said it at the time, and I've yet to really see a strong indicator I was wrong on that one.
 
Trexfromants said:
Carmen is someone who failed at the path to save everyone
Ayin is someone who shows how much is needed to pay to save everyone
And X is someone who is easy and fun saves everyone, even if his path is built on bones of his parents

...

After writing it, I am sure that we must make Madoka meet him in that order, even if Madoka can distort
Also, probaly there is distort risk with Ayin too
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I'm not quite sure what your point is supposed to be.

Madoka meeting X in that Order for?

First, where did you get that idea?
Second, why would she need to meet them in such an Order?

Carmen being someone who failed at saving everyone, Ayin being someone who knows the sacrifices required to save everyone, and X being someone who saved everyone she cared about. That part is understandable why she would need to meet all three of them due to their themes.

But there are three assumptions made here.

1. The Stars are/is Madoka.
2. The vote will continue after the first meeting twice.
3. That the order of the meetings somehow is crucial to Madoka not distorting/distorting in a way that doesn't involve ending the world.

So I would like you to clarify a bit more about your reasoning.
 
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Trexfromants said:
help Madoka, Madoka character realization, potential for EGO manifestation
Madoka is strong, perhaps she can withstand Carmen's persuasion
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I suppose it would depend on Carmen herself.

Whether she keeps Madoka in pieces while she talks to her, or reform her body in the light during the talk.

However, I believe that putting the Sun first instead of the Earth first would be the wrong way of going about this Order you are building up.

Carmen will challenge Madoka's belief immediately, which should be reserved for the final opponent (ala Adam to Abel and Abram).

If we were to do it per Order, The Earth (X) in this assumption should be first, as the Earth would be most familiar to Madoka, and also align with her ideals the most.

She would prepare Madoka, and calm her down from her panicked state when she exploded. Preparing her mind for the boss gauntlet.
Then it would be Ayin, The Moon, who would warn Madoka, of what lies ahead on her path. Supporting, but also cautious.
And finally, the Sun, Carmen, who opposes her ideals of sacrificing herself in order to save everyone.

Since you clearly framed it in a similar way to the Floor Realizations/Sefirot suppressions, the order should be from the easiest boss to the most difficult one.
 
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questioningmeme said:
1. The Stars are/is Madoka.
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I mean, one of the problem is:

You have another candidate?

X is too busy with the adult.

Angela is not associated with stars.

Sayaka and Kyoko already have EGO (and are not really associated with stars either).

Mami is not associated with stars and has no reason to encounter Carmen or Ayin.

Meanwhile, Lepi confirmed there is light shenanigans going on with Madoka, she is seemingly dead, which blue star would refer to *meeting again, as stars*, and her ultimate form does have association with stars:


 
Nyarky said:
She is seemingly dead, which blue star would refer to *meeting again, as stars*, and her ultimate form does have association with stars:
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That's the only time you actually made sense during this whole discussion.

Blue Star's Stars quote and Madokami's association with Stars has more logic.

I'm still gonna vote for the Earth or the Moon in that case though.

If this vote will make Madoka distort no matter what like the circumstances suggest, I'd rather she be similar to Kyoko instead of being a bigger and deadlier Pianist.

X already has a lot to worry about.

And also, it's been like...a whole ass year since we last see Ayin.

Anyway, since this is the most active the thread has been in a while, here's a tally.
Adhoc vote count started by Abstract Ideas on Jul 22, 2024 at 6:44 AM, finished with 42 posts and 25 votes.
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questioningmeme said:
And also, it's been like...a whole ass year since we last see Ayin.
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The difference in time between in-story and out of story is a tad disorienting, the whole Emerald City event is happening over the course of a day but it's been in writing for more than half a year now. It might be over this month, depending on how much productivity happens.
 
Look, I wouldn't worry about the consequences of this vote too much. Madoka's in no danger of manifesting EGO anyway. Per Word of QM:
Lepidoptera said:
It's still not entirely clear what makes someone worthy of manifesting EGO rather than Distorting, and I think I prefer it that way. What I've been able to piece together is that there needs to be some resolution made about oneself, one that involves a person's own faults and recognises them as faults, but doesn't become dominated by them.
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With the important corollary that you'd have to have some faults to begin with. You can see how that might be a problem here, yes?

In fact, this is what happened to Homura too. She's just too perfect for all this stuff, so Carmen didn't even do the usual spiel, only offered power because their goals happened to coincide for the moment.

/s
 
questioningmeme said:
That's the only time you actually made sense during this whole discussion.

Blue Star's Stars quote and Madokami's association with Stars has more logic.
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I find it distasteful that you are treating my deduction of the vote being about Madoka thanks to context clues and pattern recognition as if I pulled it out of my ass.

The vote is supposed to be about the current situation, like all votes are.

X just deduced something is going on with Madoka.

There is not really anyone else than Madoka that could be having a discussion with people in the light right now.

All clues points out to the stars being Madoka in the vote.

Plus, your insistence that it was stars plural and thus can't be a single person isn't convincing, when a character is associated with the stars, they tend to be associated with, well, the stars, plural, except if there is a moniker to what star it is, which there isn't there.
 
questioningmeme said:
the final opponent (ala Adam to Abel and Abram).
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I don't recall if I've mentioned it earlier, but an older draft of this Quest had an equivalent trio for X as the main antagonists. In the end it didn't pan out, and I'm more happy with the way things have gone instead. The three-Act structure stuck around though, as did most of the internal conflicts they were supposed to represent.
 
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Nyarky said:
Plus, your insistence that it was stars plural and thus can't be a single person isn't convincing, when a character is associated with the stars, they tend to be associated with, well, the stars, plural, except if there is a moniker to what star it is, which there isn't there.
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Honestly if "The Earth" was instead "The World" I would have automatically assumed it was one person because of Tarot Major Arcana, not that it has a huge influence on either of these worlds, but it would make the singular more of an logical step rather than the two options of
1. Madoka
2. In another place something else is happening with many people
Either of these interpretations are on some level rational without the further information given by Lepidoptera. After that information, it is almost undoubtedly Madoka. So in full honesty thinking that stars means multiple people is not a far fetched idea, and your catch all of stars being for one person all the time (baring a few exemptions) has zero bearing on what is going on, other than mentioning that Stars has previously been used to represent one person.

My point in all of this is that trying to hammer something into someone's head isn't going to work when you phrase things this way, and being a little less adversarial might be a good idea.
 
Shadowlord1003 said:
Either of these interpretations are on some level rational without the further information given by Lepidoptera.
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No, the second isn't really something that makes sense, because as said, a vote is supposed to be about what is happening here and now, which automatically remove the possibility of *something is happening somewhere that has nothing to do with what is happening there* from among the likely hypothesizes. That's before the precision from Lepi.

Plus the fact that X did have a reaction to learning about Madoka's current state in the update, that's a pretty strong indicator of what the recipient of the talk from someone in the light is. Once again, that's before the precision by Lepi.

Might as well not vote at all if it's the second, because that means we're completely blind, and blind votes are not a good thing, at all.

Edit:

My last sentence is part of my reasoning, in a way, I trust Lepi enough to not put a blind vote, so I automatically dismiss the hypothesis that requires just that.
 
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In the Light the Stars meets...
I would like to point out that by your logic that this vote wouldn't even make any sense, because it somewhere else. Also given the structure of this arc, a differant location related to what is going on is entirely valid, and I specificly did not say unrelated to what is going on. Furthermore, I do not think you are wrong, I am just saying how someone could reach the conclusion that The Stars is not Madoka.
 
Shadowlord1003 said:
In the Light the Stars meets...
I would like to point out that by your logic that this vote wouldn't even make any sense, because it somewhere else. Also given the structure of this arc, a differant location related to what is going on is entirely valid, and I specificly did not say unrelated to what is going on. Furthermore, I do not think you are wrong, I am just saying how someone could reach the conclusion that The Stars is not Madoka.
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The biggest indicator here is the *In the light*.

Who can be in the light right now is also a factor, and I don't really see how someone else than Madoka could work on this part.

Not without going for completely unrelated to the current situation at least, which is probably why it cropped up in my reasoning there.

Because even in a different location, no one among our allies are in position to talk to someone in the light and be a plural and be related to stars.

At most, you can get two, I think, and related to stars isn't among those.

Trexfromants said:
Lepidoptera said that it is how we save Madoka.
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They specifically said that Lepi's precision did confirm it was Madoka.

They're talking about conclusions made beforehand.

Edit:

Oh, and on the *in the light isn't here and now*, well, not if it's about Madoka, I am using the term about something that can be deduced about what is seen in the update, and Madoka's situation does appear in it.

The dreams of someone that is in a coma right next to the main character when the vote is about watching dreams counts as *here and now* in my mind, if that make sense.
 
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Adhoc vote count started by Lepidoptera on Jul 23, 2024 at 3:59 PM, finished with 60 posts and 27 votes.
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The tie has been broken, and the decision has been made. We are coming up on the end of this arc and of Act 2 as a whole.

I haven't been adding much music as I did in the previous Act final arc, so let's change that up a bit.

View: https://youtu.be/Ap1urwpMMRc?si=76nt3cWC7pwgzoUa
 
Also I took a look back and a similar thing for Madoka happened with Sayaka with the Nothing There fight, her text was blue, anyone else remeber if this happens with anyone else?

Furthermore, I just kind of assumed that the Adult picked up Madoka in between scene breaks in Victory Without Sacrifice, but seeing as how there's been no mention her when Minou and co. teleport in, is there actually two Madokas or am I over thinking this?

This is going to bother me, but when the heck does "On The Other Side" play in Ruina?
 
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Shadowlord1003 said:
Also I took a look back and a similar thing for Madoka happened with Sayaka with the Nothing There fight, her text was blue, anyone else remeber if this happens with anyone else?
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Reviewing that fight I believe that was just telepathy text, which is always coloured regardless of Light-relation. The exception to that is Kyubey, whose telepathy text is uncoloured.
 
To be fair, it hasn't been used in a while. Most people just talk normally by now.
 
Lepidoptera said:
the bizarre weapons she summoned from nowhere still had limited ammunition. Their firing mechanisms looked ordinary from a Distance, but like X's own rifle they became utterly impossible under closer inspection
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Huh, I thought those weapons were real weapons from accumulated stockpiles (and why is Distance capitalised here)?

Edit:
Lepidoptera said:
Her voice wasn't the mechanical monotone she had grown used to. Just the exhausted, unconscious sound of an instinctive answer.
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And I wonder if this is just exhaustion, or if this is partway to Homura's EGO manifestation/Distortion resolution (but it will be incomplete this Arc)?
 
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