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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

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[X] Sounds like a plan, explain it to them here, behind the wards of the Caer Sindi

Tiffany causing Lasciel's downfall is peak irony and is a worthy goal. Just imagine her face when her shade comes back as a demigod to hunt her down, she might even swear off using shades again.
 
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I think I'll change, a year is a long time for an Exalted, especially an essence 4 like Molly, we could really create a gigantic trap, worthy of becoming a legendary nightmare. We just have to use the time they served Lydia to increase their trust in us to follow our orders when the time comes.

If anyone can write a stun and think if we have any excellence to help even more I will vote for it.

[X] Sounds like a plan, explain it to them here, behind the wards of the Caer Sindi
 
Vanguard_D said:
Huh, I guess part of the whole Shroud of Turin plot line did get thrown out with Tiffany helping that girl out.
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All the stuff with the Shroud in Dresden Files came up in book five (Death Masks), and this quest's origin is in the finale to book eight (Proven Guilty), so its plotline happened ~3 years ago and was entirely unaffected by anything Tiffany might have done.
 
[X] Sounds like a plan, explain it to them here, behind the wards of the Caer Sindi

Degorium said:
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The established party and donor support are ultimately necessary for campaigning, which is necessary for getting the votes. Supernatural charisma means you can get the ball rolling by just stepping up to give a speech in some pub or a town square. And if you then get invited as a quest to some radio/TV show as the rising local star... And that's all while assuming he would have no starting capital, through selling some hidden treasures or Fae favors.

Also, all democracies that allow the change of constitutional order with enough votes are potential autocracies. Not that Arthur would even need to go that far. A parliamentarian system doesn't actually have a proper separation of powers between legislative and executive. A prime minister, who is the head of the ruling party, has the supreme executive power as the head of government, while having the power to get laws that they want passed through their party.

The reason European prime ministers aren't dictators, is that they are being kept in check by their party, and the party is being kept in check by the voters. But what if the party is so in awe of their head, that they will always vote for what he wants and would never replace him? And what if the people are so in awe of him, that they will always vote for their party?
 
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Iron Roby said:
[X] Sounds like a plan, explain it to them here, behind the wards of the Caer Sindi



The established party and donor support are ultimately necessary for campaigning, which is necessary for getting the votes. Supernatural charisma means you can get the ball rolling by just stepping up to give a speech in some pub or a town square. And if you then get invited as a quest to some radio/TV show as the rising local star... And that's all while assuming he would have no starting capital, through selling some hidden treasures or Fae favors.

Also, all democracies that allow the change of constitutional order with enough votes are potential autocracies. Not that Arthur would even need to go that far. A parliamentarian system doesn't actually have a proper separation of powers between legislative and executive. A prime minister, who is the head of the ruling party, has the supreme executive power as the head of government, while having the power to get laws that they want passed through their party.

The reason European prime ministers aren't dictators, is that they are being kept in check by their party, and the party is being kept in check by the voters. But what if the party is so in awe of their head, that they will always vote for what he wants and would never replace him? And what if the people are so in awe of him, that they will always vote for their party?
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Supernatural Charisma isn't actually mind control for a start. Another reason is the fact that there are just malices to situations. Mostly from enemy action being able to start a Grassroots movement through your Supernatural Charisma doesn't actually make you a better candidate nor does it actually spontaneously generate funds necessary to contain. Every time he shows any level of ignorance or to be frank just fails to appeal to a lot of people's intimacies and motivations he'll suffer major setbacks. The brexit movement despite having hundreds of millions of dollars poured into it and people parroting outright false claims about it working directly to push people's wallets and ideology still only managed to get 51%. Arthur no matter which party he goes with is going to be working along those lines the Charisma that isn't actually mind control it cannot be more effective than 24/7 advertising not to mention the fact that people when they have the ability to record your speeches can dissect and find out everything that's wrong with them and it doesn't matter how charismatic you are in the moment when everyone has played by play Playback to why you're wrong.
 
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[X] Sounds like a plan, explain it to them here, behind the wards of the Caer Sindi


if you meet the status quo on the road,

kill it.
 
I'm seriously happy with those who went for the Crown question. Let's fucking go.

[X] Sounds like a plan, explain it to them here, behind the wards of the Caer Sindi
 
[x] Release them under the conditions previously agreed to, you have a year to observe them before deciding on if you want to go with Tiffany's idea of luring the Denarians in the open
 
[X] Release them under the conditions previously agreed to, you have a year to observe them before deciding on if you want to go with Tiffany's idea of luring the Denarians in the open
 
[X] Plan Layers of Deception
-[X] Give options for peaceful possibilities of restoring Arthur to life as possible compromises, should they prove themselves trustworthy, retrieving the Shroud only one of them, to obscure the Crown of Eyes
--[X] Subterfuge excellency
-[X] Sounds like a plan, explain it to them here, behind the wards of the Caer Sindi
--[X] Use the Crown on the prison cell to ask "who is observing this scene right now?" before speaking

This for now because it is currently the most sensible plan.
 
Artemis1992 said:
I'm a bit unhappy that only monsters are planning big, sweeping Changes and most good forces keep up the status quo,unless they are forced to act like the White Council by the Red Court.

I much prefer some insane schemes to restore King Arthur than no mad plans from the good guys at all.
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We are planning big sweeping changes, there's just a lot of juggling involved to make it work. Picking up insane schemes on the fly doesn't really help anyone.

Breaking things just to break them isn't good enough for big things that people rely on. You have to have some idea of where you're going and why you're doing it.
 
Degorium said:
Arthur no matter which party he goes with is going to be working along those lines the Charisma that isn't actually mind control it cannot be more effective than 24/7 advertising not to mention the fact that people when they have the ability to record your speeches can dissect and find out everything that's wrong with them and it doesn't matter how charismatic you are in the moment when everyone has played by play Playback to why you're wrong.
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You don't understand how supernatural charisma works, it basically a auto win in a democracy. When you can give 50 "I Have a Dream" level speeches a year, when your opponent can only give 1 speech like that in their life, you win.

And all those things you talk about don't really work for the vast majority 90%+ of voters. Most people blindly vote for the party that their parents did. A person able to get people to even think about voting for them over just rote voting along party lines, would quickly win out over all other candidates.
 
BronzeTongue said:
Breaking things just to break them isn't good enough for big things that people rely on. You have to have some idea of where you're going and why you're doing it.
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No.

I mean, if these were real people I might consider that, but generally speaking I prefer the setting being upset over stagnant, or even slow-moving.

And as a player of a game/story hybrid I can vote for things that look like fun to me, over things that would maximize the health and happiness of the sum of humanity within the setting.
 
Earth-Destroyer said:
You don't understand how supernatural charisma works, it basically a auto win in a democracy. When you can give 50 "I Have a Dream" level speeches a year, when your opponent can only give 1 speech like that in their life, you win.
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Yeah that sounds about right. Imagine what Molly could do, now apply that to someone with much more experience with ruling and politics.
 
This is such a clusterfuck.

I know this vote won't get any traction, but that's fine.

[X] Release then, but only if they swear they will not seek to restore Arthur without your permission. This includes not enacting plans that could eventually contribute to that restoration. We will decide if and when such actions are carried out and will tolerate no machinations they may undertake behind our back which could endanger a world they no longer understand or the people who inhabit it.
 
BoredMan said:
Yeah that sounds about right. Imagine what Molly could do, now apply that to someone with much more experience with ruling and politics.
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Earth-Destroyer said:
You don't understand how supernatural charisma works, it basically a auto win in a democracy. When you can give 50 "I Have a Dream" level speeches a year, when your opponent can only give 1 speech like that in their life, you win.

And all those things you talk about don't really work for the vast majority 90%+ of voters. Most people blindly vote for the party that their parents did. A person able to get people to even think about voting for them over just rote voting along party lines, would quickly win out over all other candidates.
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No amount of I have a dream will actually work unless you have something that's inspiring if you run on a deeply unpopular platform no amount of legendary speech writing will actually help you. You are correct that legendary charisma is powerful but it's still not mind control if he tries to run on a platform of religious unification he's going to fail simply because of a staggering amount of population is atheist or just not the right kind of Christian anymore.
Not to mention he could just have a bunch of social malices that really murder the benefits of super charisma. To be honest super Charisma is a very good power when you are saying what people want to hear but the second you start saying things they don't want to hear you start incurring negatives that allow people to easily ignore you because no amount of Charisma can force people to listen to you. If he tries to centralize government command there are fuck tons of people that actively benefit from the current state of the government they're just not going to listen no matter how convincing he might be.
No amount of speeches about how a camel is more likely to pass through the eye of a needle than a rich man to enter the Kingdom of Heaven is going to make any billionaire more likely to donate unless they were already inclined to do so because the super Charisma is still not mind control.
 
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