Synthetic diamonds are mass produced already. The only reason dimond mines are worth anything save space to grow crops, is the cartels.
Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Crossover Fantasy
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
You are really overthinking this. There is a reason why this is a popular scam. Also fairly sure those regulations came later.
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If we're paying our taxes and the locals aren't complaining about our business practices the feds aren't going to bother.
There is some law enforcement integration, but there's plenty of actual trouble to be found before you start spending thousands of dollars investigating a business that demonstrable has the product it claims to sell and isn't trying to short Uncle Sam.
You're dramatically overestimating how much of a shit anyone gives and the resources available for random fishing expeditions.
The extra complication isn't worth it; claiming a new industrial process is way too much heat. I'd rather give up the cash then deal with that.
That said, we don't have to.
Make one company that owns a diamond mine, and sell all our 10+ grade gems through it. Stockpile the rest in our basement.
Sell a few through the routes we already used, and in a few months set up a diamond wholesaler registered in the Cayman Islands for what are obviously tax reasons.
Wholesaler sells artificial diamonds to another we set up state side, and pays full tax on everything it imports.
It's highly unlikely anyone will give a shit as long as they're getting their money and we aren't lying to them about the parts of the business happening in their territory.
The first rule of a good deception is to be boring, and the second is to keep it as small as possible. Your vote is too flashy.
Realistically, both the mine and the synthetic diamond schemes require bribery and shenanigans. You can't set up a factory (and it would be a factory) without a lot of certification and inspections and safety regulations.
Yeah, that works, ok. Though, to point out: we are an exalt "Flashy" kinda comes with the territory.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
If artificial diamonds work in potions we can just give them all to Dresden. Let him do us the favor of taking them off our hands.
Or maybe just maybe he will sell them and actually be somewhat financially stable for once.
Or maybe just maybe he will sell them and actually be somewhat financially stable for once.
[X] A small mining operation, try to make diamonds that could pass for natural
It's not like we can't find uses for any artificial diamonds we accidentally make.
It's not like we can't find uses for any artificial diamonds we accidentally make.
- Location
- Germany
The point would be that we don't have a factory.
People can search as long as they like if there's nothing to find.
The law won't care that we haven't registered a factory, why should they investigate that? We don't claim to have one, just to produce diamonds and we pay taxes for those.
The costumers don't care where and how exactly artificial gems are made.
And anyone interested in our secret production methods can waste their time looking for a registration for our hidden factory, or for spikes in power-consumption or any other trace that won't exist.
As far as people can tell we might be hanging strings into sugarwater to make our stones, in termsof danger and energy-cost it's close to the truth, only the result speaks for itself.
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I mean you can translate it sure, it is just that it does not operate by the laws of physics that anyone would recognize
Regulations came in in 2003.
And the scam is a con like the Nigerian Prince con, as I understand it. There are no diamonds. The conman pretends there are, takes money from the marks on the basis that there are, and then vanishes with their investment.
[X] Plan Diamond in the Rough
-[X] Ask Thomas to set up the diamond mining company as an entity in his name, to be used to sell our highest quality diamonds.
—[X] Any diamond that isn't up to snuff should be stockpiled in Molly's room.
-[X] Ask Thomas to begin looking into the process of setting up a pair of jewelry supply companies, one somewhere outside the country that isn't interested in looking into foreign business and one in the US. The former of which at least should be as difficult as possible to trace to either of them.
—[X] Long term the goal is to launder the artificial diamonds through the overseas supply company to the local one, while very carefully paying all relevant taxes and avoiding lies on any part of the operation past the necessary deceptions on ownership and gem source. No need to invite trouble.
[X] A small mining operation, try to make diamonds that could pass for natural
-[X] Ask Thomas if he'd be willing to be the public owner of the company to reduce the odds of investigation from interest parties
It would be trivial to trigger an investigation into something like that.
Which is why we should buy them from ourselves abroad and shrug if anyone asks who's making them.
Edit: added approval vote
-[X] Ask Thomas to set up the diamond mining company as an entity in his name, to be used to sell our highest quality diamonds.
—[X] Any diamond that isn't up to snuff should be stockpiled in Molly's room.
-[X] Ask Thomas to begin looking into the process of setting up a pair of jewelry supply companies, one somewhere outside the country that isn't interested in looking into foreign business and one in the US. The former of which at least should be as difficult as possible to trace to either of them.
—[X] Long term the goal is to launder the artificial diamonds through the overseas supply company to the local one, while very carefully paying all relevant taxes and avoiding lies on any part of the operation past the necessary deceptions on ownership and gem source. No need to invite trouble.
[X] A small mining operation, try to make diamonds that could pass for natural
-[X] Ask Thomas if he'd be willing to be the public owner of the company to reduce the odds of investigation from interest parties
If we claim to be making stuff locally someone will care. It's not the Wild West anymore, and diamond synthesis requires stuff some dangerous equipment.
It would be trivial to trigger an investigation into something like that.
Which is why we should buy them from ourselves abroad and shrug if anyone asks who's making them.
Edit: added approval vote
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Daedalus CAN.
The FBI routinely send investigation teams to other countries to gather evidence.
There are nations with fulltime FBI attaches iirc.
If they wanted to, they'd show up and talk to the local cops and have them take the lead.
And most nations will generally help, especially in the Third World.
Its just not worth the trouble atm.
I cant see why he would bother.
Or risk a relationship with someone whose father he has known for at least five years. Thomas isnt stupid; the money is very nice, but it pales besides the independence and the control over his Hunger.
Best to import artificial diamonds from a foreign company. Importing real diamonds would be a regulatory and compliance horror show, as I say above.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[X] An innovative diamond creating start up, make high quality but obviously artificial diamonds
The problem is that we can't reliably make 10+ success diamonds that pass as natural yet, and won't be able to until we get Craft up to 4 or 5 at least, and we need money now for all of the plans we're already putting in motion. That means that we have to go with the more suspicious of the two options. At least this gives us an easy way to also sell any high-tech stuff we make after we finally get that Technology Excellency. "Reclusive tech genius" is something that we can roll with, after all.
The problem is that we can't reliably make 10+ success diamonds that pass as natural yet, and won't be able to until we get Craft up to 4 or 5 at least, and we need money now for all of the plans we're already putting in motion. That means that we have to go with the more suspicious of the two options. At least this gives us an easy way to also sell any high-tech stuff we make after we finally get that Technology Excellency. "Reclusive tech genius" is something that we can roll with, after all.
- Location
- United States
[X] An innovative diamond creating start up, make high quality but obviously artificial diamonds
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
[X] An innovative diamond creating start up, make high quality but obviously artificial diamonds
And even if they understood it (hey, motonic science is still science!), it would work 5 to 10 times slower than it does for us.
I mean, mystically, these are Exalt-made artifacts. Natural diamonds wish they had the kind of mystical oomph these should have.
That's... arguable, to say the least. Zimbabwe in 2006 is "one of the states in outposts of tyranny[296" according to Condoleezza Rice, and under sanctions from USA. Most african countries lack extradition treaties with USA. You overestimate the reach of USA there.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
I am not ascribing any sort of malice. Many bosses insist on being given choices and he is effectively asking for a vacation on our power.
I am stealing most of it, and adding checking for magical properties of the land he'll be buying via the crown. Even if you don't want to combine diamonds and, say, mining Black Jade, we'd still be wise to check which property has some ancient burial ground or something, if only to avoid buying it.
[X] Plan Magical Diamond in the Rough
-[X] Ask Thomas to set up the diamond mining company as an entity in his name, to be used to sell our highest quality diamonds.
--[X] Have Thomas gather the list of properties for sale, then use the Crown on the list to arrange them starting from the one that has the most unclaimed and undiscovered supernatural power within its borders, including buried underneath it. Use the sales announcements of the properties to check what kind of magical power each one has.
—[X] Any diamond that isn't up to snuff should be stockpiled in Molly's room.
-[X] Ask Thomas to begin looking into the process of setting up a pair of jewelry supply companies, one somewhere outside the country that isn't interested in looking into foreign business and one in the US. The former of which at least should be as difficult as possible to trace to either of them.
—[X] Long term the goal is to launder the artificial diamonds through the overseas supply company to the local one, while very carefully paying all relevant taxes and avoiding lies on any part of the operation past the necessary deceptions on ownership and gem source. No need to invite trouble.
The problem as I see it is that this isn't so much risky as it is practically guaranteed to explode.
It's interesting, valuable, and unusual news coming from an unexpected direction. People love that, we couldn't arrange a more attention grabbing scheme without adding parade floats or overt supernatural powers.
We're sketchy - we can't stand up under serious or long term scrutiny, our friends can't, and neither can most of our associates.
We do not want reporters looking for Molly, or news articles putting Lydia's name in the paper while she's still trying to get emancipated.
If the options are pretend to be a genius chemist or bust then we should go bust and try something else.
- Location
- United States
[X] An innovative diamond creating start up, make high quality but obviously artificial diamonds
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
I think that we only need 6 success of "better than humanly possible" to appear natural. But with the current workshop vote we are much more likely to hit 10 successes then not.
DC reduced by 4 which should bring the DC down to 2, but PD might decide it only goes to 3.
16 dice (4 int + (3 craft -1))*2 +2 stunt +2 cold
Means that at we should have a average of 11 successes assuming PD does not give us anything for going under DC 3.
Also assuming that there isn't any bonus for all things betray perception.
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taovkool
Forever Gone
- Location
- The Library, Department of General Works
[X] Plan Magical Diamond in the Rough
Alright, fine. I didn't like the plan diamond mine in Africa but I liked the thought of snoopy government agencies meddling even less. And this one is solid anyway, so it gets my vote.
Alright, fine. I didn't like the plan diamond mine in Africa but I liked the thought of snoopy government agencies meddling even less. And this one is solid anyway, so it gets my vote.
Not really.
Zoning regulations do not require you to reveal trade secrets. They just make sure you arent breaking any environmental rules.
You arent dumping stuff in the water, no emissions, arent drawing industrial amounts of power, no people harmed? Sure it might look strange, but noone actually has any grounds for complaint.
The Africa option might be useful if we move into transmutation of those precious platinum-group metals I mentioned earlier.
But for diamonds, its probably a lot more straightforward to just deal with US shit.
I mean, to be clear here, the last batch of diamonds sold at 33 carats/6.6 grams for 50,000 dollars.
Roughly 7500 dollars a gram. A kilogram is 5000 carats. A kilogram of stones at the same price is 7.5 million before taxes. Assuming 12 kilos a year and a third on taxes and expenses, that's 60 million. 10% to Thomas still leaves you with 54ish million.
Which is enough of a revenue stream to hide a lot of other stuff.
The obvious is that they are a front group for someone else.
Maybe one of the existing synthetic diamond groups is using a different store front for some reason.
Thats kinda why Thomas is the front person. And Whites do that kind of thing very well.
As for the rest, well:
How tax dodging and corporate secrecy found a home in Delaware, with Hal Weitzman (Ep. 94)
Scholar examines how the wealthy, global corporations exploit tax loopholes in the tiny U.S. state
Yes, this is in the US.
Sell some stones in the US, sell some abroad. Thomas can travel.
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