- Occult
- You get it as you enter the church, it's going to be a bit trippy there with insights flying in
Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Crossover Fantasy
[X] Agree to meet with the Librarian
-[X]Ask Michael along
[X] Lydia earns 1/4xp of what Molly does seperately. So If Molly earns 20xp, Lydia earns 5xp, which is not subtracted from Molly's pool.
[X] Plan Know thy Enemy
-[X] Empathy 4, 4 XP
-[X] Awareness 2, 5 XP
-[X] All Things Betray, 8 XP
-[X} Naked Wicked Souls, 3 XP
-[X] Lydia
--[X] Willpower 6, 5 XP
--[X] Charisma Excellency, 3 XP
Ok, reasoning:
1) Empathy 4 and Awareness 2 - both are preparations for Mab
2) All Things Betray - preparation for Mab, plus useful when dealing with all situations where the truth is hidden, like socials. And synergies with buying Awareness 2.
3) Naked Wicked Souls - definitely useful when dealing with a shady government goon, useful in general to save the Crown questions, it rolls Perception + Empathy against the difficulty of target's (Wits + Subterfuge). So, synergies with Empathy buy.
4) Lydia - Willpower useful in general, and super useful for Lydia, as it boosts her excellency. I was tempted to buy Authority of the Psychopomp (-2 social DC when dealing with dead and undead, speak with all ghosts regardless of language barriers), but excellency synergies better, I feel. Maybe I'll switch it, I'm open to suggestions.
Why not:
1) Rendered Villain Dispersal - very tempted, but we have plenty to do in the city and it's vicinity for now. Save it for later
2) Prince of Ruin attitude - same as above. I might switch Naked WIcked Souls for it, if convinced that it'll help us more in the short term
3) Law instead of awareness - father Forthil is there. Law is useful, we'd probably want to have when signing stuff, and I almost went for it. But the fact that Winter Law is Occult, and that father Forthil is right there and is a trained lawyer swayed me.
4) Steel Skin - I don't see the need at this moment. Probably next time, when we will also buy alchemy, I think.
5) Touch of Frost - tempting, but can wait until school year starts
6) Raven or other familiar for Lydia - much better to acquire them via adventure / quest than to buy them with XP. One spends XP, the other generates it.
Something like this. I am definitely against Qiao and the familiar.
-[X]Ask Michael along
[X] Lydia earns 1/4xp of what Molly does seperately. So If Molly earns 20xp, Lydia earns 5xp, which is not subtracted from Molly's pool.
[X] Plan Know thy Enemy
-[X] Empathy 4, 4 XP
-[X] Awareness 2, 5 XP
-[X] All Things Betray, 8 XP
-[X} Naked Wicked Souls, 3 XP
-[X] Lydia
--[X] Willpower 6, 5 XP
--[X] Charisma Excellency, 3 XP
Ok, reasoning:
1) Empathy 4 and Awareness 2 - both are preparations for Mab
2) All Things Betray - preparation for Mab, plus useful when dealing with all situations where the truth is hidden, like socials. And synergies with buying Awareness 2.
3) Naked Wicked Souls - definitely useful when dealing with a shady government goon, useful in general to save the Crown questions, it rolls Perception + Empathy against the difficulty of target's (Wits + Subterfuge). So, synergies with Empathy buy.
4) Lydia - Willpower useful in general, and super useful for Lydia, as it boosts her excellency. I was tempted to buy Authority of the Psychopomp (-2 social DC when dealing with dead and undead, speak with all ghosts regardless of language barriers), but excellency synergies better, I feel. Maybe I'll switch it, I'm open to suggestions.
Why not:
1) Rendered Villain Dispersal - very tempted, but we have plenty to do in the city and it's vicinity for now. Save it for later
2) Prince of Ruin attitude - same as above. I might switch Naked WIcked Souls for it, if convinced that it'll help us more in the short term
3) Law instead of awareness - father Forthil is there. Law is useful, we'd probably want to have when signing stuff, and I almost went for it. But the fact that Winter Law is Occult, and that father Forthil is right there and is a trained lawyer swayed me.
4) Steel Skin - I don't see the need at this moment. Probably next time, when we will also buy alchemy, I think.
5) Touch of Frost - tempting, but can wait until school year starts
6) Raven or other familiar for Lydia - much better to acquire them via adventure / quest than to buy them with XP. One spends XP, the other generates it.
Something like this. I am definitely against Qiao and the familiar.
True Metal Power
Lisa: The Hintful
- Location
- Russia
[X] Agree to meet with the Librarian
-[X]Ask Michael along
[X] Lydia XP: All companions get 1/4 of the total XP spent on Molly, rounded down. Molly can spend XP on companions but not the other way round. The 1/4 does NOT reduce what Molly earns.
[X] Plan Know thy Enemy
-[X]Ask Michael along
[X] Lydia XP: All companions get 1/4 of the total XP spent on Molly, rounded down. Molly can spend XP on companions but not the other way round. The 1/4 does NOT reduce what Molly earns.
[X] Plan Know thy Enemy
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- Location
- Germany
Not quite free XP, you would no longer get companion deeds in the shared pool, only things you did together.
Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
Votes are s mess.
Xp share i.e 1/4 is winning but the plan NOT using that is winning.
@DragonParadox would you mind holding the xp share/not share vote first? As people are being forced to choose between that anc the plan they want.
Xp share i.e 1/4 is winning but the plan NOT using that is winning.
@DragonParadox would you mind holding the xp share/not share vote first? As people are being forced to choose between that anc the plan they want.
I think the least confusing way to do this would be to let the current system stand for this arc and any new method to start from next arc. If I'd been less forgetful we could have had that vote last update, but I rushed to get the update out since it was almost 1 AM when I posted. Sorry for the mix up.
Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
Yeah. It would be a lot less confusing to do that.
Though you could make a thread mark and add the xp vote. That way once the vote is over you can delete it and continue with the plan votes.
Either way, you probably need to make a announcement one way or another.
XP vote Announcement
The XP voting method selected will be used starting next arc
The XP voting method selected will be used starting next arc
- Pronouns
- She/Her
The problem is that splitting just straight up isn't viable when we get more companions.
Just to demonstrate what I mean, consider the scenario where we get 3 more companions in addition to Lydia, for a circle of 5. This was about average circle size during the age of legends. Now imagine that at the end of the arc we get 20 XP, about average for what we've been getting per-arc in-quest. If we split that evenly 5 ways, each person gets only 4 XP, barely enough for a single 1-dot charm. Say instead that we give Molly 8 XP and split the rest evenly among our companions. We can get a whole 2-dot charm, just shy of getting 3 dots if it's favored, but everyone else gets 3 XP and can't buy anything more than a single 1-dot charm, even though we're still getting way less than we're used to. Any other distribution of XP means at least one member doesn't get enough to buy even the piddliest of 1-dot charms.
Do you see what I mean about that not being viable as we grow? There's no way to get more companions without either their growth or ours slowing to a crawl. The only viable solution that avoids the problem is separate and independent XP pools for each member. And since tracking the contributions of each member and calculating XP accordingly is more work than DP can do, the simplest solution is to just set the XP gain of our companions to a set function of our earned XP, like Yzarc's plan that just has all of our companions grow at a quarter of the rate that we do, while leaving our XP untouched.
And it's not like we're the one getting any of our free XP. It's going to the growth of our NPC allies, we're just voting for how they spend it because it's easier on the QM.
Really, the old method was basically telling a party of adventurers "even though you're working together to accomplish far more than you could alone, I'm just going to give you the same amount of XP as I would a single adventurer doing an appropriate challenge for one person (our XP gain has not noticeably improved overall since Lydia joined the party, if measured on a per-arc basis), and have you split it between all of your characters." It's a patently ridiculous idea, and the only thing that keeps it from being idiotic is the quest format disguising that ridiculousness. More characters gain XP faster, as long as they're all still pushing their limits. That's just the only reasonable way to handle things.
So yeah, either we redo the XP system to something roughly along the lines of Yzarc's plan, or we just straight-up don't gain more companions, because this system is already showing strain under two people, and if adding a third person to this doesn't just straight-up cause the math to break down in a way that makes the quest very un-fun for everyone, adding a fourth will, and a fifth, as shown above, is completely untenable. So there you have it.
Well, okay, there are other ways to handle it that aren't completely idiotic when you break down the math, but they're all a lot more work for DragonParadox, so they don't work, either.
[X] Agree to meet with the Librarian
[X] Lydia XP: All companions get 1/4 of the total XP spent on Molly, rounded down. Molly can spend XP on companions but not the other way round. The 1/4 does NOT reduce what Molly earns.
-[X]Ask Michael along
[X] Lydia earns 1/4xp of what Molly does seperately. So If Molly earns 20xp, Lydia earns 5xp, which is not subtracted from Molly's pool.
[X] Plan Know thy Enemy, member of the coven
-[X]Molly: 16xp
--[X]Empathy 4: 3xp
--[X] Awareness 2, 5 XP
--[X]All Things Betray: 8xp
-[X]Lydia:7xp
--[X] Willpower 6, 5 XP
--[X] Occult 2, 2 XP
Ok, so this is a modification of my previous plan. It's more Lydia heavy, yes. Basically, it does three things:
1) Incremental preparation for Mab - Empathy, Awareness, All Things Betray
2) Preparation for meeting the Librarian - ATB, awareness. I I would have taken Law instead, maybe, but Winter Law is Occult, and father Forthil is right there. @DragonParadox do we need to specify that we want father Forthil with us for the meeting, or is that the default assumption?
3) Maximizes Lydia's occult and excellency scores, so we can make grander workings, since we joined the coven. This is +2 dice for the problems. In general I want both Molly and Lydia to have occult 5.
We could switch Occult 3 for awareness 2. I am open to this. What do you people think is more important?
[X] Lydia XP: All companions get 1/4 of the total XP spent on Molly, rounded down. Molly can spend XP on companions but not the other way round. The 1/4 does NOT reduce what Molly earns.
-[X]Ask Michael along
[X] Lydia earns 1/4xp of what Molly does seperately. So If Molly earns 20xp, Lydia earns 5xp, which is not subtracted from Molly's pool.
[X] Plan Know thy Enemy, member of the coven
-[X]Molly: 16xp
--[X]Empathy 4: 3xp
--[X] Awareness 2, 5 XP
--[X]All Things Betray: 8xp
-[X]Lydia:7xp
--[X] Willpower 6, 5 XP
--[X] Occult 2, 2 XP
Ok, so this is a modification of my previous plan. It's more Lydia heavy, yes. Basically, it does three things:
1) Incremental preparation for Mab - Empathy, Awareness, All Things Betray
2) Preparation for meeting the Librarian - ATB, awareness. I I would have taken Law instead, maybe, but Winter Law is Occult, and father Forthil is right there. @DragonParadox do we need to specify that we want father Forthil with us for the meeting, or is that the default assumption?
3) Maximizes Lydia's occult and excellency scores, so we can make grander workings, since we joined the coven. This is +2 dice for the problems. In general I want both Molly and Lydia to have occult 5.
We could switch Occult 3 for awareness 2. I am open to this. What do you people think is more important?
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
[X] BronzeTongue
[X] Agree to meet with the Librarian
-[X]Ask Michael along
[X] Lydia XP: All companions get 1/4 of the total XP spent on Molly, rounded down. Molly can spend XP on companions but not the other way round. The 1/4 does NOT reduce what Molly earns.
[X] Agree to meet with the Librarian
-[X]Ask Michael along
[X] Lydia XP: All companions get 1/4 of the total XP spent on Molly, rounded down. Molly can spend XP on companions but not the other way round. The 1/4 does NOT reduce what Molly earns.
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- Pronouns
- She/Her
Hey, uhhh, everyone voting to increase Lydia's Occult, why are you specifying paying the XP rate for favored abilities? Lydia doesn't have favored Occult. We do. Lydia has favored attributes. It costs 2 XP to get her to 2 dots of Occult, and 6 XP to get her to 3 dots.
So, unless I missed something, none of the plans that buy Occult for Lydia are actually viable? Did I miss something?
So, unless I missed something, none of the plans that buy Occult for Lydia are actually viable? Did I miss something?
FriedIce
The Authentic Fake
- Location
- Hyperreality
[X] A portion of all XP gets partitioned to her automatically
-[X] 50%
Ok - hear me out. Allocating xp to Lydia is never going to be the most efficient use of it. She just grows more slowly than we do. It's always going to be more efficient to use it for ourselves.
But, if we want a circle - and Lydia is our best bet at having one - and we like Lydia's character, we need to set things up for us to have to invest in her too.
Because otherwise we won't and she'll be rapidly outpaced by us and we'll no longer have any benefit from her. Anything less than half the xp on a continuous basis and all we're doing is delaying the inevitable.
So it decreases our personal xp pool.
But on the other side it doesn't allocate enough xp for Lydia and other companions to keep pace. There's no way Lydia will be able to keep pace with us if we have literally 4x the xp she does.
And we don't get a viable companion out of it.
Either split the xp equally per companion or don't bother.
-[X] 50%
Ok - hear me out. Allocating xp to Lydia is never going to be the most efficient use of it. She just grows more slowly than we do. It's always going to be more efficient to use it for ourselves.
But, if we want a circle - and Lydia is our best bet at having one - and we like Lydia's character, we need to set things up for us to have to invest in her too.
Because otherwise we won't and she'll be rapidly outpaced by us and we'll no longer have any benefit from her. Anything less than half the xp on a continuous basis and all we're doing is delaying the inevitable.
This option is literally the worst of both worlds, because if you think dp isn't just going to adjust total xp grants down by 20% per companion to account for this I have a bridge to sell you.
So it decreases our personal xp pool.
But on the other side it doesn't allocate enough xp for Lydia and other companions to keep pace. There's no way Lydia will be able to keep pace with us if we have literally 4x the xp she does.
And we don't get a viable companion out of it.
Either split the xp equally per companion or don't bother.
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Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
You do realize that in the 1/4 option we CAN do that as well? We are Also not BOUND to do so.
The idea is that all contribute to a main xp pool that is used directly by Molly. So Lydia, Bob and Molly's actions contribute to a total of say 22 xp.
What happens is Molly spends 11xp on herself and 11 on Lydia.
So Molly 11xp
Lydia 5xp + 11xp (1/4 of 22 + 11 from Molly)
Bob 5xp (1/4 of 22).
So companions get a fixed 1/4 of Molly and what she transfers to them.
So it would allow steady progression with option to boost them from the main pool.
Meaning 1/4 does what your plan does and more.
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... Ok, this might be a mistake on my part. Thanks.
[X] Agree to meet with the Librarian
[X] Lydia XP: All companions get 1/4 of the total XP spent on Molly, rounded down. Molly can spend XP on companions but not the other way round. The 1/4 does NOT reduce what Molly earns.
[X] Agree to meet with the Librarian
-[X]Ask Michael along
[X] Plan Know thy Enemy, member of the coven
-[X]Molly: 16xp
--[X]Empathy 4: 3xp
--[X] Awareness 2, 5 XP
--[X]All Things Betray: 8xp
-[X]Lydia:7xp
--[X] Willpower 6, 5 XP
--[X] Occult 2, 2 XP
And we bank one XP for later. Or we could change empathy for etiquette here.
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FriedIce
The Authentic Fake
- Location
- Hyperreality
Except this will never happen in practice.
Questers are massive efficiency bunnies and it will always be more efficient to invest in the Solaroid than the pseudo-Terrestrial.
If we don't bind ourselves to invest an equal amount in our companions we never will in practice.
So all your plan does, is it decreases the amount of xp Molly has by 20% per companion in exchange for outpacing our companions by 4x
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Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
This has already been addressed.
So if our companions are given "Screen time" and actively work with Molly that gives us xp. This is to prevent us from putting them in a box to generate xp.
It is designed so we go out and get more companions to actually work with.
FriedIce
The Authentic Fake
- Location
- Hyperreality
@DragonParadox
In the 1/4 plan are we going to have our total xp allotment decreased by 20% per companion (by, say losing access to the xp for companion deeds) compared to what we have now?
In the 1/4 plan are we going to have our total xp allotment decreased by 20% per companion (by, say losing access to the xp for companion deeds) compared to what we have now?
I won't, because people have voted by plan name, but I will vote for it myself.
[X] Lydia XP: All companions get 1/4 of the total XP spent on Molly, rounded down. Molly can spend XP on companions but not the other way round. The 1/4 does NOT reduce what Molly earns.
[X] Plan Ballroom Blitz
-[X] Molly: 17xp
—[X] Rendered Villain Dispersal 4xp
—[X] Wind Borne Stride 8xp
—[X] Qiao 1: Steel Skin 3xp
—[X] Touch of Frost 2xp
-[X] Lydia 6 xp
—[X] Ox-Body 3xp
—[X] Background: Familiar 1: Raven 3xp
Roughly yes, it is not going to be perfect 1 for 1 since what companions do when they are not with you is roll dpeendent, but you are not suddenly going to find yourself with either a massive glut or a great loss of XP