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Attempting to Fulfill the Plan: GDI Edition

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We can also just.... ration power expenditure a little bit for one single turn next turn. There's plenty of stuff we can work on that doesn't consume power, especially for one single turn, completing the tidal plants next turn gives us enough new generation to run one or two truly critical projects and the other stuff can wait a single quarter for the BZ grid to finish coming online (and there's always a chance that it rolls well and comes online next turn ANYWAYS but we're not even required to gamble).

It's getting more and more clear that we're way behind the curve on space, I don't want to cut the Union yards yet again they should've been done 2-3 years ago. We can always justify SOMETHING being more important, I'm sticking to my guns on the original Yellow Skies plan. We really need those spaceships and the things they help build, economizing on power expenditure for one single turn is an acceptable price.
 
If people are so worried about power then move the 4 dice for yellow zone power, a die from blue zone arcologies and a die from tidal power. Throw 4 dice onto blue zone power and finish it with 2/3 dice next turn.
 
[X] Plan Blue union
Infrastructure (5 dice)
-[X] Tidal Power Plants (Phase 1), 2 dice (20 Resources)
-[X] Blue Zone Arcologies (Phase 1), 2 dice (30 Resources)
-[X] Fiber-Optic Expansion, 1 die (20 Resources)
Heavy Industry (5 dice +2 Free)
-[X] Blue Zone Power Production Campaigns (Phase 2) 246/550 3 dice 30R
-[X] Yellow Zone Power Grid Extension (Phase 2), 2 dice (10 Resources)
-[X] Union Class Construction Yard, 2 die (40 Resources)
Light and Chemical Industry (3 dice)
-[X] Yellow Zone Light Industrial Sectors, 1 die (10 Resources)
-[X] Bulk Plastics Facilities, 1 die (10 Resources)
-[X] Security Review, 1 die
Agriculture (3 dice)
-[X] Perennial Aquaponics Bays, 2 dice (20 Resources)
-[X] Vertical Farming projects, 1 die (15 Resources)
Tiberium (5 dice)
-[X] Blue Zone Perimeter Fencing (Phase 2), 2 dice (30 Resources)
-[X] Chicago Planned City (Phase 1), 1 die (20 Resources)
Orbital (3 dice)
-[X] GDSS Philadelphia II (Phase 1), 2 dice (2 Fusion) (40 Resources)
-[X] Expand Orbital Communications Network (Phase 2), 1 die (15 Resources)
Services (4 dice)
-[X] Scrin Research Institutions, 3 dice (90 Resources)
-[X] Childcare and Preschool programs, 1 die (5 Resources)
Military (5 dice +3 Free)
-[X] Super MARV Reclaimator Fleet (RZ-6 South), 3 dice (60 Resources)
-[X] Toronto Apollo Fighter Factory, 1 die (15 Resources)
-[X] Shell Plants (Phase 3), 1 die (10 Resources)
-[X] Ablat Plating Development, 1 die (10 Resources)
-[X] Advanced Myomer Works, 2 dice (20 Resources)
Bureaucracy (3 dice)
-[X] Security Reviews (LCI), 3 dice

Resources Available: 520
Resources Used: 520
Resources Remaining: 0

I think this is the better way of modifing yellow skies it replaces 2 yellow zone power dice and the fusion dice that cant complete with 3 dice on blue zone power.
 
Hmm... there could be something to the idea of lowering the power draw by swapping one die on BZ Arcologies for a 3rd one on Tidal Plants. That would actually give it a good chance of outright completing, and would likely at least get us within easy completion range.

sunrise said:
I think this is the better way of modifing yellow skies it replaces 2 yellow zone power dice and the fusion dice that cant complete with 3 dice on blue zone power.
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This plan runs a much higher risk of coming up with a Power Shortage, given the low chance of BZ Power Production completing, and keeping all the options that need power.
 
Everyone please note: I have just made a slight edit to the original Plan Yellow Skies. I swapped out one BZ Arcology die for a 3rd Tidal Plant die, which will both reduce our power draw for this turn while also helping us get other power targets in range for next turn.

Note that this also let me trade a YZ Power Grid die for a BZ Power Production die, since now the overall power draw has been reduced to something our existing surplus can handle.
 
Scarecrow said:
Unless I'm mistaken, you will go into -2 power with that plan. The reason the original Yellow Skies plan put 4 dice into YZ power is to keep us power positive in case all the power drain projects finished.
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Blue Zone Arcologies (Phase 1) 304/450 2 dice 30R 45% so that is a 55% we have enough power due that project not completing
Blue Zone Power Production Campaigns (Phase 2) 246/550 3 dice 30R 3% chance of providing power and we dont have a power shortage( max for 3D100+15 is 345 and 303 is needed with a optional +15 omake reward so the odds feel like they should be higher then 3%
Yellow Zone Power Grid Extension (Phase 2) 101/275 2 dice 10R 26% is another chance of getting enough power.
Apollo Fighter Factories Toronto 18/70 1 die 15R 76% is another 24% chance of having enough power.

The odds all of those end up a way that we end up with -2 power is very low and -2 for a single turn is not the end and something a am willing to risk for the potential rewards( if BZ completes we can start on Boston and do the military refits once that is done).
 
I should point out that it's not as if there wasn't already a plan that broadly speaking follows this shape- something that puts two dice on Blue Zone Power so we can finish it up next turn with reasonable confidence and ease, and that as a further benefit fully activates our Tiberium dice on mitigation at a time when we pressingly want to get as much of it as we can under our belts. See here.

[X] Plan Power, Military and Consumer Goods

Chimeraguard said:
For all of you who have voted for Plan Yellow Skies, concerns have been raised over the issue that it likely leaves us with no or next to no power for actions next turn, and all the actions that could give us power have a long progress required, which would in turn mean either a major commitment of dice, or a gamble that it doesn't complete and we get a power shortage.

With that in mind, I would like to propose an alternate plan that I think is better than the original Yellow Skies, at least in terms of "We can actually do the stuff we want next turn."

[] Plan Yellow Skies, Blue Power

Resources Available: 520
Resources Used: 510
Resources Remaining: 10

The primary change in this Plan is that the two Union Yard Dice are swapped out for 2 BZ Power Production Dice. This sacrifices the chance of getting our 3rd Fusion Die this turn (though I plan to push for it next turn) in exchange for getting BZ Power Production closer to completion, and therefore we get closer to being able to complete it without as much of a chance of failure next turn (without dumping literally our entire pool of dice on it.) This in turn also saved the resources to let me go from 1 Fiber-Optic die to 2. But it keeps things like 3 dice on Scrin Research.

I am personally changing my vote to this plan rather than the original Yellow Skies. Alternatively, if there's enough support raised for the overall change, I could swap the original Yellow Skies Plan to this configuration, whichever one people find more convenient.
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To be quite candid with you, this effectively converges your preferred plan onto @Void Stalker 's

[] Plan Power, Military and Consumer Goods

(one of two that I approval-voted myself, alongside of... @Vehrec 's plan)

In the interests of having something that credibly resembles your new favored plan win, it might be best to lobby for Void Stalker's plan, which has enough votes that a handful of switches could at least bring it within shouting distance.

Speaking from experience, trying to start a new fork of the winning plan at such a late time almost never works unless the new version is a very clear upgrade over the old one.

EDIT:

I still like your plan, @Vehrec , so throwing in my approval vote

[X] Plan Green is Not Tiberium
 
Simon_Jester said:
To be quite candid with you, this effectively converges your preferred plan onto @Void Stalker 's

[] Plan Power, Military and Consumer Goods

[...]

Speaking from experience, trying to start a new fork of the winning plan at such a late time almost never works unless the new version is a very clear upgrade over the old one.
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Void Stalker's Plan has 2 dice on Scrin Research instead of 3, which is a no go for me.

But I've just removed my support for Yellow Skies, Blue Power in exchange for just reducing BZ Arcologies to one die in favor of a 3rd Tidal Plant die, along with trading one YZ Power Grid die for a BZ one on the original Yellow Skies plan. Not as close to the (Temporary) solving of our power problems, but it still has things like the commitment to getting Unions and as much of a push on Scrin Research as possible.
 
[X] Plan Yellow Skies, Blue Power

Crazycryodude said:
I voted for it because it has the Union yards and I like it better than the other Union plan. If the Union yards disappeared by planmaker fiat after I had already voted for the plan on the basis of it having the Union yards I would be pretty annoyed, this kind of thing is why I don't like plans getting edited in major ways after they've gotten a bunch of votes.
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Plans shouldn't be suicide packs. If a previously chosen option turns out to be bad as new information comes to light or is realised, the planmaker is under no obligation to blindly stick with it just because some other people have voted for it. If other voters disagree with the planmaker over that change, they can vote for a different plan or make their own rather than trying to force the planmaker to obey their will.
 
Oshha said:
Plans shouldn't be suicide packs. If a previously chosen option turns out to be bad as new information comes to light or is realised, the planmaker is under no obligation to blindly stick with it just because some other people have voted for it. If other voters disagree with the planmaker over that change, they can vote for a different plan or make their own rather than trying to force the planmaker to obey their will.
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The flip side of this is, of course, that if I throw my support behind you because you promise to do XYZ, then you arguably lose your claim to my support if you turn around and do ABC instead.
 
Simon_Jester said:
The flip side of this is, of course, that if I throw my support behind you because you promise to do XYZ, then you arguably lose your claim to my support if you turn around and do ABC instead.
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Then the voter can stop voting for that plan and support a different plan that does include what they want. Which I already mentioned in the post you quoted.
Oshha said:
If other voters disagree with the planmaker over that change, they can vote for a different plan or make their own
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Oshha said:
[X] Plan Yellow Skies, Blue Power


Plans shouldn't be suicide packs. If a previously chosen option turns out to be bad as new information comes to light or is realised, the planmaker is under no obligation to blindly stick with it just because some other people have voted for it. If other voters disagree with the planmaker over that change, they can vote for a different plan or make their own rather than trying to force the planmaker to obey their will.
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I mean, the plan hasn't turned out to be bad. As has been said, we can ration power for a turn if we need to without going into the negative or stopping us from doing what we need to.

I would also like to leave the reminder that the Union plant flat discount for space operations needs a few turns to come into effect. Meaning that the earlier we do it the earlier we get the bonus and we need that bonus because we will be getting pushed into space sooner rather than later.
 
I know people are worried about not having enough energy, but my error means it'll actually take less dice to do BZ Power than we expected. Not more. And now Plan Yellow Skies is even closer to Plan Power, Military and Consumer Goods, with the change adding 1 die on BZ Power this turn.
 
[X] Plan Yellow Skies
[X]Plan Unionizing

So, I also think the panic over Energy consumption is a bit overblown. Here's the power breakdown for Plan Yellow Skies, with probabilities:
Fusion Power Prototype, 1 die (20 Resources) 0% +1 Energy
Yellow Zone Light Industrial Sectors, 1 die (10 Resources) 0% -2 Energy
Tidal Power Plants (Phase 1), 2 dice (20 Resources) 8% +4 Energy
Blue Zone Arcologies (Phase 1), 2 dice (30 Resources) 45% -2 Energy
Toronto Apollo Fighter Factory, 1 die (15 Resources) 76% -4 Energy
Yellow Zone Power Grid Extension (Phase 2), 4 dice (20 Resources) 96% +2 Energy
Shell Plants (Phase 3), 1 die (10 Resources) 98% -2 Energy
Vertical Farming projects, 1 die (15 Resources) 100% -2 Energy

Probability distribution:
Max energy drain (YZ power fails, all -energy projects succeed, -2 Energy at turn end): 01.3%
Probability floor of 30%: BZ Arcologies succeed, 0 Energy at turn end: 32.17%
Probability floor of 75%: BZ Arcologies fail, +2 Energy at turn end: 71.5%
Probability floor of 90%: Toronto Apollo factory fails, +6 Energy at turn end (or +4 if Arcologies succeed): 22.57%

And, of course, we will be able net turn to focus on Blue Zone Power Production Campaigns (Phase 2) :
3 dice 30R 3.42%, 4 dice 40R 33.5%, 5 dice 50R 72.68%, 6 dice 60R 93.08%

However, more importantly, here are a bunch of projects which provide what we with with little or no Energy usage:
There's a lot, quite enough to do a turn with little to no Energy expenditure, and still make quite good progress. We can do a quite acceptable plan next turn while not spending Energy.

Infra:
[ ] Fiber-Optic Expansion
(Progress 82/240: 20 resources per die) (+ Labor, +++ Consumer Goods, ++ Logistics)

LCI:
[ ] Personal Pharmaceuticals Plants
(Progress 0/180: 15 resources per die) (++ Consumer Goods, + Health)

[ ] Johannesburg Personal Robotics Factory
(Progress 0/250: 15 resources per die) (+++ Consumer Goods, + Logistics)

[ ] Bulk Plastics Facilities
(Progress 91/200: 10 resources per die) (+ Capital Goods, ++ Consumer Goods)

[ ] Furniture Factories
(Progress 0/150: 10 resources per die) (++ Consumer Goods)

[ ] Chemical Fertilizer Plants
(Progress 0/200: 15 resources per die) (+++ Consumer Goods, +++ Food, - Energy)

[ ] Superconductor Foundries
(Progress 0/200: 30 resources per die) (++ Capital Goods, +++ Energy)

Agriculture:
[ ] State Operated Breweries
(progress 0/125: 10 resources per die) (+++ Consumer goods, --- Food)

[ ] Perennial Aquaponics Bays
(Progress 0/350: 10 resources per die) (++++ Food over 8 turns, +++ Consumer Goods over 8 turns) (5 Political Support)

[ ] Expansive Aquaponics Campaigns
(progress 0/600: 10 resources per die) (++++ Food, ++ Consumer Goods, --- Labor)

[ ] Yellow Zone Aquaponics Bays (phase 4)
(Progress 44/160: 10 resources per die) (+++ Food, ++ Consumer goods --- Water)

[ ] Entari Deployment
(progress 0/200: 20 resources per die) (++++ Food, Increases efficiency of agriculture systems)

Services
[ ] Scrin Research Institutions
(Progress 65/350: 30 resources per die)

[ ] Fashion development houses
(Progress 0/225: 10 resources per die) (+++ Consumer Goods)

[ ] Ethnic Restaurant Program
(Progress 0/150: 10 Resources per die) (- Food, +++ Consumer Goods)

[ ] Game Development Studios
(Progress 0/300: 5 Resources per die) (+++ Consumer Goods)

Military:
MARVs

10 different Development projects.

[ ] Point Defense Refits
(Progress 15/250: 10 Resources per die)

[ ] Advanced Myomer Works
(Progress 0/125: 10 Resources per die) (Reduces cost of Walker development and progress required)
 
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Oshha said:
Then the voter can stop voting for that plan and support a different plan that does include what they want. Which I already mentioned in the post you quoted.
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Insofar as it is a reasonable expectation that all voters closely monitor ongoing discussion for any changes to the plan they voted for, this is a good point.

That "insofar as" does a lot of heavy lifting.

Derpmind said:
I know people are worried about not having enough energy, but my error means it'll actually take less dice to do BZ Power than we expected. Not more.
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This is true, but it'll still take several dice, and a lot of us want the hope of finishing the project in Q3 if not Q2. Because while constantly getting bottlenecked by power management concerns is very authentically #GDIProblems, it isn't a fun experience.
 
@Lightwhispers Your numbers are unfortunately inaccurate because @Chimeraguard modified the plan so that BZ arcologies only has 1 die and thus can't finish this turn.
Simon_Jester said:
This is true, but it'll still take several dice, and a lot of us want the hope of finishing the project in Q3 if not Q2. Because while constantly getting bottlenecked by power management concerns is very authentically #GDIProblems, it isn't a fun experience.
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"Several dice" in this case is between 3 to 5 dice next turn. The other plan only puts one additional die this turn meaning next turn would take 2 to 4 dice. I don't think that's an impactful enough difference to make up for not doing the Union Class Construction Yard this turn. (Neither plan uses enough dice to make completing the project even possible this turn.)
 
Simon_Jester said:
This is true, but it'll still take several dice, and a lot of us want the hope of finishing the project in Q3 if not Q2. Because while constantly getting bottlenecked by power management concerns is very authentically #GDIProblems, it isn't a fun experience.
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Energy and Logistics are some of the main bottlenecking tools I have. When you started to go deep on the Glacier mines which would pay themselves off in under a year (which I really don't mind at all) I started giving them a logistics cost, because otherwise the only optimal strategy was Turn 1: Shock RZ mining, Turn 2: Shock Glaciers. Because every other choice was suboptimal from a pure income perspective. So I needed to give you a reason to invest elsewhere. Same with energy. Energy is used everywhere, and so you need to keep building it, which is part of the balancing act to keep you from running away in some area. Without energy costs, you could have done all three of the Rapier Yards and finished zone suits, and deployed the Wolverines in one turn.
 
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