On the other hand, having that much marketing might have some interesting effects. After all, Paragon industries isn't just a brand, it's a lifestyle.
Shepard Quest Mk VII, Age of Revy (ME/MCU)
- Thread starter tri2
- Start date
- Location
- New York
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Well, I did want to do a foreign legion type thing where sent out the call through council space for any all volunteers to be welcome at ParSec to guard the colonies. So 10 billion wouldn't be the worst thing, probably a truly over the top campaign, inescapable in all media.
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The Large Space Station is there to serve as a fleet base. Ideally the Alliance would use ours instead of constructing their own:
but even if they don't it gives our fleet a HQ. This will be important going forwards considering that we've unlocked Light Cruisers and Heavy Cruisers aren't far away. Neither of which can actually land on planets. Considering that with an 8 quarter construction time (5 base + 3 from Heavily Armed) we are two years away from actually having that space station it is likely to already be too late rather then too soon.
Aren't we? As I outline here there should be ~360 million human veterans. If we are just looking at people in the 22 (4 year contract) to 42 range (sufficiently fit for combat even pre-Peak Human) that still leaves 48 million human veterans. Even if the Alliance has gobbled up 95% of those we are still talking 2.4 million candidates. Considering that people want us to not just be hiring human veterans but also grabbing those from the Council races (who should easily be a 10 to 100 times larger recruiting pool) who want in on the action I strongly suspect we will see ParSec grow by millions over the next year.
Last quarter I went with 30 billion because we had no guidance what so ever so I just picked a small (for PI) number. That gave us a +10 bonus on a 1d100 vs DC80/100/120 roll. I can't really think of a clearer indicator that we massively under-budgeted there. Well either that or the test is intended to be nigh impossible. Since I can't actually do anything about the latter I'm assuming it was the former.
We can't upgrade and use Labs at the same time and upgrades take time. We don't know how long but presumably at least as long as the difference in construction time (so 2qtrs for I->III and 1qtr for II->III). If we can get confirmation from @tri2 on that I think it would be safe to try upgrading the Lab II on Mindoir to Lab III since we do currently have one lab spare. We can probably upgrade one of the Lab Is on Elysium as well since Hwan only needs 1 active to get the Lab bonus. Still that depends upon the upgrade times and costs (which we don't actually have as far as I can tell).
As for recruiting; we actually have a spare Lab on Mindoir right now (4xIII & 1xII vs. 4 Heroes) and three more Lab IIIs coming online in 2175-Q2. Given the odds of successfully recruiting a Research Hero we are likely looking at multiple turns of attempts. So we are better off starting right now and at worst letting them work slightly inefficiently for a quarter rather then waiting.
I already covered the Labs above. As for building more factories; there is a fairly minimal benefit. 20 extra Factory IIIs provide 600k Production and come online in 2175-Q3. Thing is we've already got 2 Space Factory IIs coming online in 2175-Q3 adding 6,000k Production which brings us up to 12,960k Production. Extra Production doesn't hurt but I don't see a need to fill all our ground slots with factories right now only to possibly have to demolish them later.
This is extra questionable in utility when the plan is to build dozens of Factory IIIs next quarter across Terra Nova, Eden Prime, and Bekenstein along with starting construction on several Space Factories.
Oh and since there seems to be some confusion; Shipyards are required to build anything larger then Frigates. They don't actually provide any Production, that comes from our Factories, they just provide a building (and repairing) location. For Frigates there is a 100% Production penalty to building them outside of Shipyards; which is why we are effectively loosing (after taking into account the opportunity cost of Production) money on the LLPs right now.
- Location
- New York
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I do think it was meant to be almost impossibleZ it's a galactic treaty and we're a megacorp, sure but we're only one, and the new kid at that in the new polity. And we only lobbied within our polity.
So in retrospect, I bet that money went towards convincing the SA modular was best, and the council very little.
TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
- Location
- Northeast Ohio, United States
Ah, that helps explain some things. I'll scale back my shipyard builds in my current plan, I think. And your argument for the station is a good one.
I think it's possible that we hit and exceeded the limit of what lobbying can do; you're assuming that +10 meant that we didn't spend enough, but +10 might just be the most that one corporation can influence a negotiation between numerous starfaring nations.
I need to do some math on the number of shipyards we can realistically support. We need to start building a lot of large space factories.
Edit: Do we have any idea how much production cruisers and line frigates are going to take to construct from scratch?
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Lets consider the scale here. As TaliesinSkye pointed out:
the US military spends 0.1 billion per year to recruit people from one country on one planet.
We are targeting advertisement towards a minimum 12 human worlds (planets with over 1 million people), at least 18 Turian worlds (Palaven + 17 Unification War colonies), at least 9 Asari worlds (planets with over 1 million people), and at least one Salarian world (Sur'Kesh is the only one we have population data for). That is a minimum of 40 worlds we are looking to advertise to. Even if each world was as cheap as advertising to the USA (again one country of ~200 on one world) that puts a floor of 4 billion right there. Considering that we'd probably want to tailor our advertisements not only to each species (4x the work) but also each world 10 billion might, if anything, be a low ball.
Not really. I'm currently working on a revamped Ship Design spreadsheet (whenever I think I'm finished I notice something else I need to update) which I'll run past the tri2 to make sure they agree with the numbers. As a rough guideline though using the LLP as a base (~60k Production with Shipyards) we are looking somewhere in the range of 300k for Light Cruisers, 3 million for Heavy Cruisers, and 15 million for Dreadnoughts. Of course they have construction times of 2/2/4 quarters respectively so the actual quarterly Production requirements are more like 150k, 1.5 million, and 3.75 million.
For reference that means by the time we can actually build Dreadnoughts we'd probably be able to build three in parallel and still have Production left over.
EDIT:
Forgot to address this bit:
That is certainly a possibility. There is a reason I included the line about running it past our political adviser first as a sanity check. After all Revy isn't an expect in the field; but she does employ one.
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TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
- Location
- Northeast Ohio, United States
Okay, here's my proposal for builds. It lets our expert tell us how much we should spend on lobbying, up to the original plan's budget.
Construction wise, the biggest difference is that this plan expands our production capacity far more. It fills up all our empty ground slots with Factory IIIs and invests a lot of money in huge, well defended production increases with space factories. It fills up all our empty space slots except for 4 in orbit of Mindoir and 1 each in orbit of Demeter, Elysium, and Benning in case we want to build large stations or whatever else there later. The focus is on maximizing production because production is money and ships. We're going to need a ton of production to make use of the shipyards we're building, in particular. And it will always go to use. Factories in Mindoir are well defended because Mindoir will have excellent defenses of its own. Factories in the other systems are heavily defended because they'll need to stand on their own to a larger degree if attacked.
I'm opting for the outer edges of Alliance space to avoid crippling our reputation gains with other races and to reduce oversight. I think we'll be doing some projects and militarization in the future that the Alliance might not want in their core space.
[X] [PIA] Plan Rapid Expansion and Upgrades
-[X] (Spends $1,263,515,000,000 leaving $173,567,580,556, minus variable lobbying budget)
-[X] Sell Things
--[X] 12 Hammerhead Tanks for the Alliance to test.
--[X] 35 Lite Laser Pyndas for the Alliance Navy.
--[X] Misc Military Equipment for the Alliance at market (Expense + 260,000cr/pr) prices. (All remaining 571,154.30 Production)
---[X] Coordinate with Hahne Kedar and Cord-Hislop Aerospace to maximize equipment delivers and avoid violating your non-competes
-[X] Builds and Upgrades
--[X] Begin the process of setting up Paragon Industries facilities on Bekenstein, Terra Nova, and Eden Prime.
--[X] Upgrade the three remaining lower ranked Labs to Lab IIIs (-1.5 billion)
--[X] 13 x Factory IIIs (-13 billion) on Mindoir
--[X] 1 x Academy (-15 million) on Mindoir
--[X] 9 x Small Shipyards (-4.5 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 3 x Medium Shipyards (-6 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 3 x Well Armed Space Factory IIs (-375 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 10 x Well Armed Space Factory Is (-125 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 1 x Heavily Armed Large Station for Fleet Basing (-200 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 5 x Factory IIIs (-5 billion) on Benning
--[X] 3 x Small Shipyards (-1.5 billion) in orbit of Benning
--[X] 1 x Medium Shipyard (-2 billion) in orbit of Benning
--[X] 2 x Heavily Armed Space Factory Is (-40 billion) in orbit of Benning
--[X] 1 x Heavily Armed Space Factory II (200 billion) in orbit of Benning
--[X] 2 x Factory IIIs (-2 billion) on Demeter
--[X] 3 x Small Shipyards (-1.5 billion) in orbit of Demeter
--[X] 1 x Medium Shipyard (-2 billion) in orbit of Demeter
--[X] 2 x Heavily Armed Space Factory Is (-40 billion) in orbit of Demeter
--[X] 1 x Heavily Armed Space Factory II (-200 billion) in orbit of Demeter
--[X] 3 x Small Shipyards (-1.5 billion) in orbit of Elysium
--[X] 1 x Medium Shipyard (-2 billion) in orbit of Elysium
--[X] 2 x Heavily Armed Space Factory Is (-40 billion) in orbit of Elysium
-[X] PMC Recruitment Campaign (-1 billion)
-[X] Lobbying Treaty of Firaxen (Variable)
---[X] Double check that extra funding at this point won't hurt our negotiating position with Laurence Freeman. Ask him what we can productively spend. Budget no more than $100 billion.
-[X] Edge of Alliance Space (Less Expensive, Less Safety, Less oversight, Greater relationship growth with Systems Alliance, Lesser relationship growth with Council Races)
Construction wise, the biggest difference is that this plan expands our production capacity far more. It fills up all our empty ground slots with Factory IIIs and invests a lot of money in huge, well defended production increases with space factories. It fills up all our empty space slots except for 4 in orbit of Mindoir and 1 each in orbit of Demeter, Elysium, and Benning in case we want to build large stations or whatever else there later. The focus is on maximizing production because production is money and ships. We're going to need a ton of production to make use of the shipyards we're building, in particular. And it will always go to use. Factories in Mindoir are well defended because Mindoir will have excellent defenses of its own. Factories in the other systems are heavily defended because they'll need to stand on their own to a larger degree if attacked.
I'm opting for the outer edges of Alliance space to avoid crippling our reputation gains with other races and to reduce oversight. I think we'll be doing some projects and militarization in the future that the Alliance might not want in their core space.
[X] [PIA] Plan Rapid Expansion and Upgrades
-[X] (Spends $1,263,515,000,000 leaving $173,567,580,556, minus variable lobbying budget)
-[X] Sell Things
--[X] 12 Hammerhead Tanks for the Alliance to test.
--[X] 35 Lite Laser Pyndas for the Alliance Navy.
--[X] Misc Military Equipment for the Alliance at market (Expense + 260,000cr/pr) prices. (All remaining 571,154.30 Production)
---[X] Coordinate with Hahne Kedar and Cord-Hislop Aerospace to maximize equipment delivers and avoid violating your non-competes
-[X] Builds and Upgrades
--[X] Begin the process of setting up Paragon Industries facilities on Bekenstein, Terra Nova, and Eden Prime.
--[X] Upgrade the three remaining lower ranked Labs to Lab IIIs (-1.5 billion)
--[X] 13 x Factory IIIs (-13 billion) on Mindoir
--[X] 1 x Academy (-15 million) on Mindoir
--[X] 9 x Small Shipyards (-4.5 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 3 x Medium Shipyards (-6 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 3 x Well Armed Space Factory IIs (-375 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 10 x Well Armed Space Factory Is (-125 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 1 x Heavily Armed Large Station for Fleet Basing (-200 billion) in orbit of Mindoir
--[X] 5 x Factory IIIs (-5 billion) on Benning
--[X] 3 x Small Shipyards (-1.5 billion) in orbit of Benning
--[X] 1 x Medium Shipyard (-2 billion) in orbit of Benning
--[X] 2 x Heavily Armed Space Factory Is (-40 billion) in orbit of Benning
--[X] 1 x Heavily Armed Space Factory II (200 billion) in orbit of Benning
--[X] 2 x Factory IIIs (-2 billion) on Demeter
--[X] 3 x Small Shipyards (-1.5 billion) in orbit of Demeter
--[X] 1 x Medium Shipyard (-2 billion) in orbit of Demeter
--[X] 2 x Heavily Armed Space Factory Is (-40 billion) in orbit of Demeter
--[X] 1 x Heavily Armed Space Factory II (-200 billion) in orbit of Demeter
--[X] 3 x Small Shipyards (-1.5 billion) in orbit of Elysium
--[X] 1 x Medium Shipyard (-2 billion) in orbit of Elysium
--[X] 2 x Heavily Armed Space Factory Is (-40 billion) in orbit of Elysium
-[X] PMC Recruitment Campaign (-1 billion)
-[X] Lobbying Treaty of Firaxen (Variable)
---[X] Double check that extra funding at this point won't hurt our negotiating position with Laurence Freeman. Ask him what we can productively spend. Budget no more than $100 billion.
-[X] Edge of Alliance Space (Less Expensive, Less Safety, Less oversight, Greater relationship growth with Systems Alliance, Lesser relationship growth with Council Races)
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TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
- Location
- Northeast Ohio, United States
By the way, it might be a good idea if we figured out standard 'units' for the purposes of production and credit costs. Like costs per infantry battalion for all equipment, vehicles, etc. Otherwise the bookkeeping is going to get out of hand tracking all the individual bits.
- Location
- U.S.
Sales start next turn
- Location
- United states
[X] [PIA] Plan Tanks, Ships, and Misc Production
[X] [PIRA] Proposed Plan Peak Salarian First + Misc
[X] [PSD] Plan All in Colony Defense
[X] [ST] Plan BioTech + Biotics + Employees
[X] [PIRA] Proposed Plan Peak Salarian First + Misc
[X] [PSD] Plan All in Colony Defense
[X] [ST] Plan BioTech + Biotics + Employees
*sigh* @tri2, can we just ask our experts how much they think they can productively use? Before the cote goes through, I mean?
- Location
- Tarn-Vedra
[X] Plan Mobilizing For War.
Honestly I for one will only vote for a plan that has us buying our own planet in unclaimed space.
10ebbor10
DON'T PANIC
- Location
- Present
This would be one political hot potato.
1) Because the Asari have kept the whole AY issue kinda quiet for centuries
2) Because if you identify the genetic (if it is genetic) cause of AY'ness, you also likely acquire tools to induce it. Morinth believes that AY are the genetic destiny for the Asari, and this would give her the tools.
- Location
- New York
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Yeah, but it's not Revys hot potato. She just whips it up in a couple turns and dumps it on Benezia and company, and then it's her problem!
[X] [ST] Plan BioTech + Biotics + Liara Date
- Location
- Norway
Binge read the quest yesterday and it was a great read. Got a couple of questions though, which the FAQ didn't answer.
The repulsors got secretly patented with the SA if I remember right, and the SA is cagey about letting us patent it with the Citadel, but apparently we are building modular colonies with repulsors in them. Are we actually allowed to do that? Got the impression that repulsors were secret military tech and that we weren't supposed to use it on the civilian market.
Another thing was the data from the Batarian ship which we were given to decode. Did I just miss us doing that, was it forgotten or has it not been a priority? Sorta seems like the kind of thing you want done post haste.
EDIT: Found it, it's back in "Minor details+interludes" back after the Batarian attack on Mindoir in 2174 Q2 and wasn't in the research list at the start of this thread, so unless it got removed intentionally it seems to have been forgotten.
Also has the vote closed? Thought it were supposed to close on Sunday, but I haven't seen any announcements about it.
The repulsors got secretly patented with the SA if I remember right, and the SA is cagey about letting us patent it with the Citadel, but apparently we are building modular colonies with repulsors in them. Are we actually allowed to do that? Got the impression that repulsors were secret military tech and that we weren't supposed to use it on the civilian market.
Another thing was the data from the Batarian ship which we were given to decode. Did I just miss us doing that, was it forgotten or has it not been a priority? Sorta seems like the kind of thing you want done post haste.
EDIT: Found it, it's back in "Minor details+interludes" back after the Batarian attack on Mindoir in 2174 Q2 and wasn't in the research list at the start of this thread, so unless it got removed intentionally it seems to have been forgotten.
-[X] Divert our VI development company to hack what remains of the Sol invasion fleet's computers, and whatever other resources it takes (even RP from next quarter if necessary) to find out how the hell the Batarians managed to bypass Arcturus and invade Sol. This is a huge priority!
The Hegemony Fleet at Sol barely engaged the SA fleet before pulling out. None of the few ships that died there had salvageable computers. Many of the ships destroyed at Arcturus died to direct spinal shots from the three SA dreadnoughts there fresh from being refitted with new equipment. The SA commanders focused on making sure their targets were very dead, not wanting to risk the seat of the SA's government. However, one frigate that was mission killed by GARDIAN laser fire from a frigate wolf-pack has intact systems.
After attempting to access it on their own the SA intelligence service accepts your aid. The information has incredibly strong encryption which denies all of the common shortcuts to decrypt. It may devolve to pure brute force at this rate. Or maybe later spy work my reveal the key.
Research Project:
Hegemony Cryptography 200 (PI) + 50 (SA Intellegence) = 250/?
The Hegemony Fleet at Sol barely engaged the SA fleet before pulling out. None of the few ships that died there had salvageable computers. Many of the ships destroyed at Arcturus died to direct spinal shots from the three SA dreadnoughts there fresh from being refitted with new equipment. The SA commanders focused on making sure their targets were very dead, not wanting to risk the seat of the SA's government. However, one frigate that was mission killed by GARDIAN laser fire from a frigate wolf-pack has intact systems.
After attempting to access it on their own the SA intelligence service accepts your aid. The information has incredibly strong encryption which denies all of the common shortcuts to decrypt. It may devolve to pure brute force at this rate. Or maybe later spy work my reveal the key.
Research Project:
Hegemony Cryptography 200 (PI) + 50 (SA Intellegence) = 250/?
Also has the vote closed? Thought it were supposed to close on Sunday, but I haven't seen any announcements about it.
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Well we haven't actually sold any modular colonies so there is that. It is just a design @TheEyes put together that hasn't ended up going anywhere yet. Worst comes to worst we may be able to dodge around the issue by setting up Paragon Colony Administration Inc which owns the colony units and simply rents (or 99yr leases) space on the colonies out. Kinda like how ExoGeni owned the Feros expedition.
- Location
- Norway
Thanks for the answer. Hadn't really followed what exactly had been built, since that's a bit opaque when binging.
Another thing I wondered about, which might be getting a bit too into the nitty gritty logistics that haven't been considered to preserve QM sanity, is how Paragon Security ferries its fighter jets around. Can the Gladiuses independently fly through a mass relay or is the Dragon Lady and the Quadriga ferrying them around together with the troops as they drop them off? Neither ship has a carrier deck listed in their features so I presume that they can't take off in space and are kept in the cargo hold, so are they sitting ducks mid-transport? Don't really have a mental picture of how much cargo space there is on a frigate, but going by the Lite Laser Pynda just being 100m long I wouldn't think there is a lot of room for a Gladius on top of whatever else it is carrying. Might be that the Quadriga is larger, its size isn't mentioned anywhere that I can see.
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