- Location
- Brazil
[X] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed
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The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up
- Thread starter Durin
- Start date
Enerael
We Shall Wake to Sanity
[X] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed
"It will take many years to implement the knowledge exchanged here, making it very unlikely that many new powerful technologies would be invented or discovered in that time. Chaos will likely unify more should the power degree our unity be known to it. Thus, I propose that we meet here again in a century or two to exchange new discoveries, and reconsider asking the Eldar to pass them along more swiftly then. Of course, once Chaos does discovered the threat we pose to it, which it will inevitably do sooner or later, we can start sharing knowledge immediately with no downsides other then the cost of Eldar couriers. This would, for the small cost of receiving the likely relatively few new discoveries some decades later, weaken Chaos noticeably galaxy wide, by letting it spend more of itself on internal strife."
Gave the argument a try.
"It will take many years to implement the knowledge exchanged here, making it very unlikely that many new powerful technologies would be invented or discovered in that time. Chaos will likely unify more should the power degree our unity be known to it. Thus, I propose that we meet here again in a century or two to exchange new discoveries, and reconsider asking the Eldar to pass them along more swiftly then. Of course, once Chaos does discovered the threat we pose to it, which it will inevitably do sooner or later, we can start sharing knowledge immediately with no downsides other then the cost of Eldar couriers. This would, for the small cost of receiving the likely relatively few new discoveries some decades later, weaken Chaos noticeably galaxy wide, by letting it spend more of itself on internal strife."
Gave the argument a try.
- Location
- The internet
@Durin
1. While the Eldar aren't willing to support major troop movements, are they willing to occasionally support movement of select elite for high impact missions?
2. In that vein, would it be viable to use Ridicully's undetectable, protection ignoring scrying, and Corax's Hax sneakiness to allow Ultramar to raid and steal a major Tau data/tech repository and make off with all their STC equivalents? Sorta like what Turoq hoped to do to us, except we have the tech advantage, a multi paragon diviner and a transcendent intrigue primarch. Oh, and the Tau don't expect us to have any of those.
3. If its viable, when would be the time to propose it?
4. Also, would it be possible to use a diplomacy action to set up an Auxiliary Office that auto canvasses the People of auxiliaries whenever we are about to fight Chaos?
1. While the Eldar aren't willing to support major troop movements, are they willing to occasionally support movement of select elite for high impact missions?
2. In that vein, would it be viable to use Ridicully's undetectable, protection ignoring scrying, and Corax's Hax sneakiness to allow Ultramar to raid and steal a major Tau data/tech repository and make off with all their STC equivalents? Sorta like what Turoq hoped to do to us, except we have the tech advantage, a multi paragon diviner and a transcendent intrigue primarch. Oh, and the Tau don't expect us to have any of those.
3. If its viable, when would be the time to propose it?
4. Also, would it be possible to use a diplomacy action to set up an Auxiliary Office that auto canvasses the People of auxiliaries whenever we are about to fight Chaos?
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Why bother? The Tau are going to ally with Ultramar soon enough and causing more bad will between these groups sounds like a waste of everyone's time.
- Location
- The internet
Because ally doesn't mean share tech database. And there's an excellent argument for ensuring that Ultramar has as good a hand as possible going into those negotiations anyway. Also, a single tech raid isn't going to generate horrible badwill considering their history.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
No, but I'd say close military alliance fighting against the biggest bad in that part of the galaxy does.
I'd also say there's an excellent argument for ensuring they're as evenly matched going into negotiations as possible so nobody does anything stupid as both are wont to do, even then its not a great argument seeing as we're about to boot Ultramar above the Tau in tech level.
Then there's a big difference between nicking and scavenging bits of tech and out right stealing everything.
+ Again there's better things to be doing, while Corvus and Rids are putsing around with the Tau, Corvus could be assassinating a level 3 boss or even a level 4 and Ridcully could be scanning for almost anything else...like say Ahra or the Patsy.
Either of those are better uses of their time.
- Location
- UK
@Durin Is it possible to suggest a compromise? I think avoiding discovery is important, but I don't want us to handicap ourselves either. Would something like this be acceptable as a write-in?:
[] Argument to support future meetings and periodic technology transfer, but upon discovery have the Eldar immediately begin passing on future advances.
Or, if we're discovered, will we reconvene immediately and begin having the Eldar pass on tech advances anyway?
[] Argument to support future meetings and periodic technology transfer, but upon discovery have the Eldar immediately begin passing on future advances.
Or, if we're discovered, will we reconvene immediately and begin having the Eldar pass on tech advances anyway?
williams1996
Alba gu bràth
- Location
- Scotland
[x] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed
- Location
- va
[X] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed
- Location
- Lowton
Inserted tally
- Location
- Canadia
[X] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed
To be honest I'm fine with this being a rare occurrence, the threat of chaos sharing tech and joining forces is way too high. Imagine if all the major chaos nations suddenly had Turoq's psyker cloning capabilities, it'd be chaos (pun intended).
To be honest I'm fine with this being a rare occurrence, the threat of chaos sharing tech and joining forces is way too high. Imagine if all the major chaos nations suddenly had Turoq's psyker cloning capabilities, it'd be chaos (pun intended).
Enerael
We Shall Wake to Sanity
Chaos would work together a little more, thats all. Still concerning, but nothing like this.
As for the psyker cloning, that wasn't exclusive to Turoq, all Tzeechian with sufficient favor can do it. Other gods couldn't, its not compatible with their domains.
- Location
- Leeds
Hang on, wasn't Durin prompting us for our arguments in favor and against? Not for that to be voted.
We can provide arguments, but it's not needed.
- Location
- madison
ok so I think we might want to tap out for future tech sharing, we're tiny and unlike the rest will go pop with moderate effort. Unless the other powers really think they would benefit from our psytech, or we find something revolutionary, it might be best if we bow out so we have a better chance of living to find something really useful.
@Durin how useful is psyker stuff to the other human powers? since that is the one place we can keep up for future meetings.
ok, so he'res base arguments for the base choices, though I think a write-in of periodic meetings where we only show up if we find something game-changing since unlike everyone else, we are not a major power.
[] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed: the dealy in technology updates is of little cost, after all it will already take decades at least to implement the technology we have all already acquired. Better to delay or even stop chaos from realizing we are in contact than build up a larger backlog of technology to implement.
[] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed- chaos will likely notice eventually anyways, and by keeping everyone on the same page we avoid wasteful duplication or implementation of technologies that had been rendered obsolete. Furthermore, the simple act of constant contact could help build stronger ties between us. While their is little that could do today, given the turbulence of our times who can say what the future will bring?
[] Argument to support the trust tapping out of the tech trades baring something game-changing. - we are the smallest power here, and unlikely to be able to meaningfully contribute to further technological developments, and have the least capacity to survive any retaliation. While our psyker research is indeed useful, I doubt it would be of great use to most human powers. Should we uncover something that would be of great strategic value, then we would rejoin, but our odds of surviving long enough to find something of true value are much higher if we strive to avoid notice for now.
the above relies on durins answer to my question, if it turns out our psytech is super useful then we don't make this argument.
@Durin how useful is psyker stuff to the other human powers? since that is the one place we can keep up for future meetings.
ok, so he'res base arguments for the base choices, though I think a write-in of periodic meetings where we only show up if we find something game-changing since unlike everyone else, we are not a major power.
[] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed: the dealy in technology updates is of little cost, after all it will already take decades at least to implement the technology we have all already acquired. Better to delay or even stop chaos from realizing we are in contact than build up a larger backlog of technology to implement.
[] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed- chaos will likely notice eventually anyways, and by keeping everyone on the same page we avoid wasteful duplication or implementation of technologies that had been rendered obsolete. Furthermore, the simple act of constant contact could help build stronger ties between us. While their is little that could do today, given the turbulence of our times who can say what the future will bring?
[] Argument to support the trust tapping out of the tech trades baring something game-changing. - we are the smallest power here, and unlikely to be able to meaningfully contribute to further technological developments, and have the least capacity to survive any retaliation. While our psyker research is indeed useful, I doubt it would be of great use to most human powers. Should we uncover something that would be of great strategic value, then we would rejoin, but our odds of surviving long enough to find something of true value are much higher if we strive to avoid notice for now.
the above relies on durins answer to my question, if it turns out our psytech is super useful then we don't make this argument.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
I dunno mate i'd say song weaving alone is extraordinarily useful.
And nuts to us being too small and ducking out now.
We're not that weak nor do we have too little to contribute.
And nuts to us being too small and ducking out now.
We're not that weak nor do we have too little to contribute.
- Location
- madison
The thing is, they have way less psykers than we do proportionally. They would not get as much a boost out of runes and other such things.
As for being that weak, we very much are. Abaddon could just put a bounty on our head and we'd be in trouble.
Unless I'm wrong about psyker stuff not being useful, then we stay in.
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Ok the thing is we can provide a lot of help to the other polities is psyker research. If we keep going we should be able to hopefully get destructive frequencies for chaos. Which would be so helpful in fighting chaos that some of humanity will survive.
Now the thing to remember is that we have a quality advantage over most enemies. Two we control 1 percent of all human non chaos forces in the galaxy and that will continue to grow. Three armies may be hard to transport but elite units and hero's are not.
Now the thing to remember is that we have a quality advantage over most enemies. Two we control 1 percent of all human non chaos forces in the galaxy and that will continue to grow. Three armies may be hard to transport but elite units and hero's are not.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
They are massive the average strength of Psykers will be down, but numbers will be way up and increase even more in case you forget we're best suited to do the black ship research assuming one of them don't have the design.
Even then song weaving alone can be applied on a mass scale as can the runes and most of the powers. It's only the allhestry which has no use beyond avers and lets not forget those frequencies.
And i've already argued why I don't think tjat'd Be enough to take us down.
[X] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed
[X] Argument to support future meetings- periodic technology transfer, good chance of being noticed
Enerael
We Shall Wake to Sanity
What would be the point of ending us even if our participation was known? We are tiny and mostly inconsequential, Avernus and Ridcully aside. To prevent us from sharing our research? Outside of psytech we will have little to offer.
So the bounty on our head would be because of our power as a polity (negligible for we are tiny), our growth potential (Receiving new techs the big human powers research wouldn't change this that much, especially with the far greater concern of the big human players having that tech too), what we could do to strengthen the big human players (too late to stop that now, psytech and the relatively few techs Tranth invents aside, and we want to help the rest of humanity as much as we can).
So no, we will be part of the tech sharing. Chaos gains little from preventing us from receiving the tech, and the increased attention from making the rest of humanity even 1% stronger is more then worth sharing ours with as many as we safely can.
So the bounty on our head would be because of our power as a polity (negligible for we are tiny), our growth potential (Receiving new techs the big human powers research wouldn't change this that much, especially with the far greater concern of the big human players having that tech too), what we could do to strengthen the big human players (too late to stop that now, psytech and the relatively few techs Tranth invents aside, and we want to help the rest of humanity as much as we can).
So no, we will be part of the tech sharing. Chaos gains little from preventing us from receiving the tech, and the increased attention from making the rest of humanity even 1% stronger is more then worth sharing ours with as many as we safely can.