-
Going forward, links to content from Twitter (now X) will no longer be embedded. Pre-existing links should not be affected.
The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up
- Thread starter Durin
- Start date
Hm... might be worth giving plan #1 a shot and seeing how it goes initially. Seems like it would give us a decent chance to win the whole thing straight off and still give us a chance to go to strategy #3 if it fails non-catastrophically.
As I understand it, the general rule of thumb is that the larger and more dangerous the biomorph the more intelligent and important they are to the swarm. When they're active they grant 'synapse' to nearby creatures, giving them greater purpose and efficiency while when they are out of range of a synapse creature they have to resort to whatever is hardcoded in the onboard thinking element (which is usually pretty minimal, so they will often revert to animalistic instincts). If you manage to kill a synapse creature, the results can vary depending on proximity and strength of the synaptic bond, ranging anywhere from 'every Tyranid in the area suddenly has a stroke and keels over/their head asplode' to a sudden loss of coordination followed by subsidiary synapse creatures picking up the slack (though less effectively, resulting in worse aim, more simplistic tactics or the like) or every Nid in the immediate area panicking and dispersing like wild animals.
How that translates to space battles I'm not sure, though I would assume most of the generalities hold true (though the exact details can and often do vary from splinter fleet to splinter fleet. It's one of the reasons that Nids are the threat they are; with Orks and Eldar you more or less know what you're getting. They're old enemies with thousands of years of doctrine advising you how to fight them. With the Tyranid you've got important differences with every splinter fleet that can have serious effects on doctrine. What if this fleet uses a significantly more sophisticated infiltrator's doctrine? Or if their warrior forms have evolved las-resistant carapace? Or they have introduced a flying artillery form? etc.
We should be on the lookout for genestealer cults in the area, either spreading to find new targets for the fleet or in position for decapitation strikes on vulnerable infrastructure. We should also be count on an enemy that fields troops more disposable than Guardsmen, with melee troops able to best Terminators armed with relic weapons, and tunneling units. Beyond that? Anything's fair game.
- Location
- Australia
1/3 chance of it being catastrophic.
Also, if it's non-catastrophic failure there will be less of our ships for the weeks-long attrition battle, which means reduced probability of success.
I don't think it's worth it.
- Location
- Russia
In space it is slightly different. Instinctual behavior is more complex, but Hive ships need to check Command each round for each ship to override it.
Instinctual behavior in space works like that:
1) Is ship going to collide with dangerous terrain (celestial phenomena and the like) if it continues normal movement?
If yes - "Burn retros" order(turn on the spot, less firepower) and turn away from danger. If no, go to 2
2) Is nearest enemy in front fire arc and no more than 15 cm(single move) away?
If yes - move into contact and board. (You may skip this instruction if you have bioplasma (15 cm range weapon)). If no, go to 3.
3) Is nearest enemy in front fire arc and more than 90 cm away?
If yes - "Full speed ahead" order(extra speed, less firepower). If no - go to 4.
4) Is nearest enemy in rear fire arc (only check for escorts)?
If yes - "Come to a new heading" order (extra maneuverability, less firepower). If no(or you are not an escort) go to 5.
5) Is enemy in front fire arc and in range of operational bio-weapons?
If yes - "Lock on" order (cannot turn, but reroll misses). If no - go to 6.
6) Does ordnance need reloading?
If yes - "Reload ordnance order" (reloads ordnance (torpedoes and attack craft), no drawbacks). If no - go to 7.
7) None of the above conditions apply? Than you must end your movement closer to the planet if you are able, otherwise move ahead at half speed.
Hive ship can roll command checks (Ld tests) for ships if it want them to do something different. It can do so unlimited times per turn, but only until first failure. Maximum Ld for Hive ships is 9, and that is 1/6 failure chance, so you can expect roughly 9(number of hive ships)*6(expected number of successful Ld tests per ship)=54 ships(maybe twice that number if fleet has all the fancy hive mind upgrades) of this fleet do something other than instinctual behavior each turn.
Actually, by crunch this fleet is highly irregular. Most Tyranids fleets in BFG have much higher Hive ship/cruiser ratio (0-2 cruisers and 6-12 escorts per hive ship). Maybe Durin just made it that way, but maybe it is the result of some plan#1-type action in the fleet's past(somebody successfully took out most of its Hive ships).
@durin - which is it? Do our admirals see any indications of such prior engagements?
Last edited:
- Location
- Alice Springs, Australia
It looks like someone tried to take out the Hive Ships before, most likely Necrons judging by a few scars
I will also be giving all Tyranids a -20 to all rolls if you take out all of the Hive Ships
Last edited:
- Location
- Russia
It is a pity that our battleships are Emperors and not Nova-equipped Apocalypses. This fleet is like all-you-can-eat buffet for Nova, because ships must be pretty close to each other with such deficit of Hive ships (to be in synapse range).
Actually, against such a godawful mass of cruisers and, especially, escorts fire ships would be super-effective! Do we have any?
(Although their crews must be pretty heroic - usually crew evacuates after locking ship on collision course and no one tries to kill them because of their insignificance, but I'm pretty sure Tyranids will omnomnom any ejected crew)
Actually, against such a godawful mass of cruisers and, especially, escorts fire ships would be super-effective! Do we have any?
(Although their crews must be pretty heroic - usually crew evacuates after locking ship on collision course and no one tries to kill them because of their insignificance, but I'm pretty sure Tyranids will omnomnom any ejected crew)
Or if Atlas had sent some reinforcements. Because the BFG Mechanicus lists can replace the torpedo tubes of anything cruiser sized and upwards with a nova cannon.
- Location
- Russia
And what about fire ships?
.
- Location
- The Void
[X] #1
-[X] Switch to #3 if #1 goes badly.
-[X] Switch to #3 if #1 goes badly.
[X] #1
-[X] Switch to #3 if #1 goes badly.
-[X] Switch to #3 if #1 goes badly.
[X] Launch a Major attack to try and take out 2-3 hive ships.
-[X] Fall back to plan 3 afterwards.
Rationale being that taking out 1/3 of their hive ships will reduce their coordination meaning it will be easier for our ships to achieve a higher kill ratio against them.
I'm not comfortable committing to 1 entirely or falling back if it goes awry. And full 3 is not an option as long as our governor is on the planet.
-[X] Fall back to plan 3 afterwards.
Rationale being that taking out 1/3 of their hive ships will reduce their coordination meaning it will be easier for our ships to achieve a higher kill ratio against them.
I'm not comfortable committing to 1 entirely or falling back if it goes awry. And full 3 is not an option as long as our governor is on the planet.
Last edited:
What?
You all are going to risk the quest on a 66% chance, with only a 33% chance of achieving anything worthwhile?
@durin What do the other Generals think of the probability of our ground forces being able to hold out if we take option #3?
If we pick option #3 will the fleet be able to give us any orbital bombardment in the first couple weeks?
Can we propose a plan between #2 and #3? Such as most our ships being organized to get the best kill ratios while one squadron is beefed up to primarily target cruisers?
All the more reason to pick #3, a plan that does not depend on reinforcement.
You all are going to risk the quest on a 66% chance, with only a 33% chance of achieving anything worthwhile?
@durin What do the other Generals think of the probability of our ground forces being able to hold out if we take option #3?
If we pick option #3 will the fleet be able to give us any orbital bombardment in the first couple weeks?
Can we propose a plan between #2 and #3? Such as most our ships being organized to get the best kill ratios while one squadron is beefed up to primarily target cruisers?
All the more reason to pick #3, a plan that does not depend on reinforcement.
- Location
- Russia
What "switch to 3" are you talking about? If #1 goes badly we will not have a fleet to implement #3 or anything at all, really.
@durin, may we propose our own plans? The thing is, according to BFG, Nova cannon maximum range is greater than Tyranid synapse range+weapon range. Nova-equipped cruisers (Dominators, I believe) can try to snipe Hive ships from beyond the range of synapse-controlled ships. Any fleet element that will try to go after Dominators would be forced to revert to instinctual behavior (and thus can be destroyed by flanking maneuver (Nids cruisers on instinct ignore threats to their sides)). Such snipe-shots are difficult (because of scatter and the sheer mass of the Nids between Dominators and Hive-ships). But it is virtually risk-free and rewards are great. For greater effect we should probably couple Nova-barrage (which is instant hit) with torpedoes launched beforehand (which have flight time) and have them hit with very small time interval.
Actually, since Cobra-class destroyers have the same speed as torpedoes they can start at considerable distance and pump salvo after salvo, moving slightly behind torpedo wave and breaking off when they are not comfortable with how close Tyranids are.
[X] Plan Lockedmind
Plan summary:
Torpedo-equipped cruisers launch several torpedo waves on closing course, then break off (torpedoes will not become a single salvo, but will hit much closer to one another (in time, I mean))
Cobra-class destroyers, using their superior speed and maneuverability, move after last wave and pumping more salvos, then also break off.
Dominator-class cruisers close to the Nova maximum range (which is huge) and wait until torpedoes hit(somewhat clearing line of fire), then start firing Nova cannons trying to bring down Hive ships.
Lance- and macrocannon-equipped ships are ready to flank any instinctual-behavior detachment sent after Dominators.
If entire blob moves instead all that guys flee and do not engage.
Pros of that plan:
-Relatively low risk
-Achieves #1 and #3 objectives while being safer than #1 and faster than #3
-Greater effect on ground combat than #3 (because it is faster and death of Hive-ships will probably give penalty to ground-based tyranids, not only fleet)
Cons:
-Lesser initial effect on ground combat than #2 or successful #1 (because it is slower than both and more tyranids can deploy)
@durin, may we propose our own plans? The thing is, according to BFG, Nova cannon maximum range is greater than Tyranid synapse range+weapon range. Nova-equipped cruisers (Dominators, I believe) can try to snipe Hive ships from beyond the range of synapse-controlled ships. Any fleet element that will try to go after Dominators would be forced to revert to instinctual behavior (and thus can be destroyed by flanking maneuver (Nids cruisers on instinct ignore threats to their sides)). Such snipe-shots are difficult (because of scatter and the sheer mass of the Nids between Dominators and Hive-ships). But it is virtually risk-free and rewards are great. For greater effect we should probably couple Nova-barrage (which is instant hit) with torpedoes launched beforehand (which have flight time) and have them hit with very small time interval.
Actually, since Cobra-class destroyers have the same speed as torpedoes they can start at considerable distance and pump salvo after salvo, moving slightly behind torpedo wave and breaking off when they are not comfortable with how close Tyranids are.
[X] Plan Lockedmind
Plan summary:
Torpedo-equipped cruisers launch several torpedo waves on closing course, then break off (torpedoes will not become a single salvo, but will hit much closer to one another (in time, I mean))
Cobra-class destroyers, using their superior speed and maneuverability, move after last wave and pumping more salvos, then also break off.
Dominator-class cruisers close to the Nova maximum range (which is huge) and wait until torpedoes hit(somewhat clearing line of fire), then start firing Nova cannons trying to bring down Hive ships.
Lance- and macrocannon-equipped ships are ready to flank any instinctual-behavior detachment sent after Dominators.
If entire blob moves instead all that guys flee and do not engage.
Pros of that plan:
-Relatively low risk
-Achieves #1 and #3 objectives while being safer than #1 and faster than #3
-Greater effect on ground combat than #3 (because it is faster and death of Hive-ships will probably give penalty to ground-based tyranids, not only fleet)
Cons:
-Lesser initial effect on ground combat than #2 or successful #1 (because it is slower than both and more tyranids can deploy)
Last edited:
[X] #1
-[X] Switch to #3 if #1 goes badly.
-[X] Switch to #3 if #1 goes badly.
- Location
- Alice Springs, Australia
They think that you will most likely be able to but not without heavy losses, also it is only plan 2 that depends on reinforcement