Developing and building life eater torpedoes in less than 4 years is a big ask. If the Varangian Guard have a design for a boarding torpedo I suppose we could pack them with a dozen of the Deathstrike warheads. Even if they aren't ready in time for Garkill's invasion we still want to start on them now because the invasion is just the start of the Ork wars.
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The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up
- Thread starter Durin
- Start date
Godzillaslayer10
I am ready for this quest!
- Location
- Somewhere
I'm sorry Enjou but I'd rather not risk Rotbart's life on narrative qualities. If we end up facing Garkill than we do. However, that's no reason not to send gank squads at the bastard.
My main thing is that the groups Elder Haman is setting up aren't really suited towards an assassination - outside of harassment I don't think we'll be engaging the Orks on the field when we can just stay behind our walls. Xavier and the Infiltrator regiments are suited towards doing an assassination if an opportunity comes up, but Surt, Jane, and the Governor's Own aren't really suited towards trying to bypass a hoard of Orks to get into wherever Garkill is.
So Xavier, our Infiltration psykers, and any psyker teams we have are good for that, but not other groups. The Phase Tigers might work too. Jane could work, but she's not a member of our military and we shouldn't be having her take high risk battlefield actions during wars without it being absolutely necessary.
- Location
- To the left. No, not there, the other left.
I'm pretty sure he meant assassination as a simply surgical strike by elite kill team, rather than sneaky-style assassination. Though having Horatius for it may be even better, his whole shtick is challenging enemy leaders to duels and killing them, and if he was able kill multiple greater dae mons ork warbles should be within his capabilities.
Even in that case, the groups that I pointed out are preferable for that.
- Location
- Pale Blue Dot
Dangerous. The Space Hulks may very survive, warp out to somewhere else, and end up spreading the Life Eater Fungus to other biospheres.
Best way to get Garkill to come? Challenge him LOUDLY. The louder the better. Mind you, there
- Location
- madison
I'm not sure this is a good idea. We don't know how much damage the life eater will do the space hulk, and it means that the Orks may well begin spreading it around. We know for a fact it will do a lot of damage to any biosphere it gets loose on, and be very difficult to remove. Even if the Orks don't initially start using it I can see them spreading it around simply by being carless. Ork worlds will provably not be that affected by life eater fungal blooms, since they have cataclysmic detonations every so often anyways, but the human worlds they invade and spread it too are less likely to be able to shrug it off.
Then we make sure the Hulk doesn't get away. Life eater torpedoes would be combined with lots of more conventional fire. Also, our armours are sealed, most Ork Mega-armour still shows a fair bit of skin so we can combine LEF with strike teams to make holes for the spores, kill VIOs and blow up reactors.
Garkill is not dumb. He's quite capable of going "Wait yer turn!" and attacking Alfheim - where he also has prior history - first. He didn't show up in person at the battle of the Fens despite it being a roit gud barney.
- Location
- Berkeley
The idea here is to get Garkill's forces fully engaged if he attacks Avernus. Last time we beat him up pretty badly in the Void leading to him bugging out before he could have landed anything, and the time before he landed, but we managed to beat up any forces he had on the ground, as well as wrecking his beachhead.
On that front, we want to let a large portion of his forces get on the ground and tied up fighting before we get the Void assets in system to start really thrashing his fleet. With a day or two to land forces, odds are excellent Garkill himself will join the fight on the ground too.
I don't think we want to just turtle in our cities before everyone else shows up to the party though. We don't want to push them off the planet (yet!), but if we let the surround our cities, we won't be able to harass their forces in transit or start hitting their Gargants before they're in range of our walls. Also, Garkill would be much more likely to join in the 'fun' down on Avernus if there's more than just a bunch of boring sieges. I would certainly reserve our limited assets like the Deathstrikes to use only to prevent probable major breeches and the like, but tactical use of the rest of our army to disrupt Garkill's maneuvering seems like a good idea.
On that front, we want to let a large portion of his forces get on the ground and tied up fighting before we get the Void assets in system to start really thrashing his fleet. With a day or two to land forces, odds are excellent Garkill himself will join the fight on the ground too.
I don't think we want to just turtle in our cities before everyone else shows up to the party though. We don't want to push them off the planet (yet!), but if we let the surround our cities, we won't be able to harass their forces in transit or start hitting their Gargants before they're in range of our walls. Also, Garkill would be much more likely to join in the 'fun' down on Avernus if there's more than just a bunch of boring sieges. I would certainly reserve our limited assets like the Deathstrikes to use only to prevent probable major breeches and the like, but tactical use of the rest of our army to disrupt Garkill's maneuvering seems like a good idea.
I based this selection on durin's answer to my specific question of which forces would be best suited to a decapitation strike at Garkill.
Don't argue with me, argue with durin.
You are welcome to ask durin additional questions on the subject if you think there needs to be improvement here.
We already have boarding torpedoes. Not just the designs, we have actual boarding torpedoes.
We just haven't rigged up any Life Eater Fungus ones yet.
That's pretty much what I meant. For some reason durin did not mention Horatius as a good member of such a strike force, which surprised me, but I just figured I would accept the advice of the GM on who to include in this group.
If you would like to, please feel free to question durin more on the subject.
Not according to durin.
Which is why I am asking about the risks. I will obviously modify the plan depending on durin's responses.
Though frankly, if the LEF spreads to a few other planets, I don't think it's that huge of a problem. Those would just become Avernus colonies, why other systems get the other planets. I doubt the Orks will spread it anywhere else other than possibly their Ork homeworlds. But we will see what durin says.
I'm okay with harrassment strikes, I just meant that there won't be any large scale efforts like we did in the first campaign.
- Location
- Australia
1. This is the best team possible for assassinating Garkill, but what would be the minimum?
2. Can a Space Marine chapter with Imperial-era gear assassinate him?
3. We've trained soldiers of the other worlds in exchange for credits. In the next High Council meeting, can we ask the Varangians to train the Governor's Own in exchange for credits?
4. Do we know/can Ridcully see what would happen if we stabbed Valinor with the Black Crystal Sword?
5. Do various anti-daemon trait effects (Daemonbane's terror to daemons, Light of Victory's -10 to daemon stability, etc.) apply to daemon worlds?
6. Neighbouring Regions, Regional Powers, and Regional Descriptions are similarly enough named that they're confusing. I suggest changing them to something else. Changing Neighbouring Regions to Neighbouring Powers and Regional Powers to Distant Powers is my recommendation.
7. Is Ridcully a good enough diviner that he can do the whole "I can see it will be best if this one was our leader" deal to select a new Governor when the last one dies? There is precedence with the White Scars' Stormseers being the ones to select the Khan of the chapter.
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Valkur
The True Valkyria, Valkur!
- Location
- Fólkvangr
That master of sanctity would be a great pick due to his immense duel bonuses and if Garkill is willing to go one on one with him than it could be a win. During the duel I imagine his party will have to fight off Orks to keep the duel 1v1 or just stay alive. An IF he wins they'll have to teleport out again which may be tricky. I'm not sure if they have some kind of beacon or if some kind of insane dice roll is involved.
- Location
- Australia
The Master of Sanctity would be a bad pick specifically because of his immense duel bonuses. Our Governor's Own fight together, not separately, so a duelist is the wrong pick for teaching them. Furthermore, his duel bonuses come from a Paragon trait and that can't be taught.
What we want is to learn group combat from the Varangians as they've fought together for over a thousand years.
Valkur
The True Valkyria, Valkur!
- Location
- Fólkvangr
But if we fight in a group won't Garkill just go 'you know what lads? You get them i'll go get some more boys!'.
Dueling him and refusing is something that an Ork won't ever do. While running away is something that a whole tribe of greenskins are known to do and I theorize that Garkill is from that same tribe. For those wondering what 'tribe' thing I mean it's from the Ork codex where tribes like 'snakebites' and such will have a description of their orks. Each tribe has a bit of fluff with some liking squigs and choppa over guns while others like raiding for loot and than just leaving while refuising to fight larger foes for very long.
- Location
- Estonia
There is a pretty good chance that he wont come to ground on avernus guys (he stayed on ship for the 1st invasion btw).
And there is a point to invading ork world to have definte location to fight him on and durin implied that he might actually land if we let him while not risking no damage to our planets. He might not attack avernus 100% btw
Waiting for update for more info.
And there is a point to invading ork world to have definte location to fight him on and durin implied that he might actually land if we let him while not risking no damage to our planets. He might not attack avernus 100% btw
Waiting for update for more info.
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Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Burn the Nexx, but I'm all up for Sahaar diplomacy.
- Location
- Australia
So exactly one opportunistic xeno race who is not only willing to (and probably has) conquered humans if it were easy enough, it has likely stolen and perverted human technology for their own ends. It's no contest, it's better to gear ourselves towards good relations with humans rather than xenos.
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- Location
- Somewhere on Earth
Wait, are you saying the Dark Eldar have gone extinct?
Or the Tau, for that matter?
We don't have a perfect map of the galaxy, dude, Durin actually asked for Polity Omakes and he got about three that involve alien sentients, I doubt Durin is going to stop at just Orks and Necrons.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
And somehow still only as bad as most humans.
I'm not, but I rather not waste time fighting highly fortified positions when we could just get them to be barriers to our enemies, hell we may even be able to pay them to be that.
Well if you define the Dark Eldar by they're constant soul drain then yes they are extinct
.Only something worse is in they're place
- Location
- Australia
The dark eldar are not xenos we diplomance, they are xenos we exterminate without question and without hesitation.
The tau are on the literal other end of the galaxy. There is no chance we will meet any tau.
So a maximum of three alien races compared to dozens of human civilisations. That is not enough to justify a xeno-tolerant policy.
We're not operating on the rules of more optimistic sci-fi setting like Star Wars or Star Trek where we consider non-humans to be the same as humans. In 40k and in this game, if a human kills an alien, that's fine. If an alien kills a human, that's unacceptable. It doesn't matter if they're not any worse than humans on an absolute morality scale, the fact that we're humans and they're attacking humans means they need to die.
For the love of all that is good, please remember what happened to the Dark Age humans. Instead of annihilating violent xenos, they dominated them and used them. Then when they weren't as powerful, the xenos turned on them. These aliens have been aggressive towards humans, thus they do not get a second chance and they don't get the opportunity to get used. They get the chopping block. Hell, our human neighbours make better barriers so it's only logical that we kill these xenos to get those better barriers.
The Quartok live because they're not inherently aggressive and because the war they fought against the Imperium was purely defensive. If a xeno species is naturally aggressive or they've ever fought an aggressive war against humans, they die. Anything else is waiting for a knife in the back.
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- Location
- madison
really? by my reckoning if an alien kills a human that's not our fucking problem. Now if they kill humans were allied with, or who's continued existence was in our best interest that's different, but why should we care if a xeno race and a pretty imperium get into a fight?
the Sahaar go after easy targets, if we get beat up enough that we fall under that category they will be the least of our problems. A treaty where they agree not to do any raiding bullshit in exchange for use not blowing them away is a lot faster and cheaper than an extended campaign of extermination.
- Location
- Somewhere on Earth
Okay, that's not what I meant, I mean that Durin isn't going to stop at just canon races, he's going to make more, and I don't doubt that a lot of them are going to be at the very least okay with our presence.
Actually, I think that's your philosophy, total genocide in response to interspecies murder alien to human doesn't sound like the best of ideas, and I don't think WH40K as a universe has some sort of objective moral system in which killing humans is the worst sin you can achieve.
So, how about this, just as an out-there suggestion we don't dominate and use them, we work with them, because we can't afford fighting a war against every other species in the galaxy when we're already fighting against the Orks, Chaos, Dark Eldar that one time, and doubtlessly more, we can't maintain that xenophobic outlook without burning too many bridges to be effective.
Okay, look, before we go any further, I need to ask you this question, and I'm not being insulting, I really want to know here, is this plan of yours born out of some sort of Xenophobia and concept of human superiority, or do you actually think exterminating the Quartok to curry some favor with the other Xenophobic extremists that may or may not even be out there? Because I don't think the plan itself would even do much, what, we suddenly turn around and exterminate those aliens we had given asylum and think that it would make all the other planets like us more? I think it'd just make us look kinda untrustworthy more than anything, especially since the rest of the Trust aren't actually that against Xenos.
Shard
One and Many
- Location
- Malaysia
Stahp it with the 'Genocide the Quartoks', we're not doing it. Because it's stupid and I shouldn't have to explain why.
Out of cold pragmatism of surviving, we aren't about to become a galactic blob any time soon, so we're not about to attack xenos that are there are far away, regardless of what they're doing (Paeticularly when we have orks and chaos at our doorstep). Like how we're not attacking DE outposts elsewhere in the galaxy.
Ugh.
Out of cold pragmatism of surviving, we aren't about to become a galactic blob any time soon, so we're not about to attack xenos that are there are far away, regardless of what they're doing (Paeticularly when we have orks and chaos at our doorstep). Like how we're not attacking DE outposts elsewhere in the galaxy.
Ugh.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Yes, because why give ourselves the headache.
So lets make sure they don't saves us both headaches.
Besides we are more optimistic
And if the situation was reversed we'd do the exact same thing.
Even then disregarding that you do realize that the warp storms cutting everyone off and mankinds weakness effected EVERYONE right?
If humanity didn't start lashing out randomly I'll eat my hat
The real idiots in this situation were the ancients for dominating them rather than integrating them so this could happen.
They're not aggressive, the biggest crime they can be accused of is trying to reverse engineer our tech which we forgot to tell them not to do and we then handled the fallout for quite well.
Hell they've been practically the perfect species and they're Rule of Gold idea is great for keeping things friendly so much so that Azyr a guy who literally saw humanity destroy his home with Exterminatus and hates us so much he has a trait is willing to work with us and put that aside.
Besides you seem to be forgetting a few things.
1. If aliens kill a human not of the trust WHO THE FUCK CARES, we're here to survive not dominate the xenos, when emps gets back maybe we start doing that.
2. The xenos are evidently strong enough to survive with all the ****ers around
3. @Durin is unlikely to just have three species in one sector.
4. Its been 1000 YEARS why are you making the dumbass assumption that all imperial remnants are still anti xenos. For them its been 1000 years of hardship and trying to survive with the imperium being nothing more than a myth now, there are no consequences for communicating , trading with and allying with xenos any and if any haven't I'll eat my hat.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
It isn't his argument is that our characters think it is, which they probably do, but again by that logic Fred should be leaping from his chair to skewer Azyr through the neck every time he sees him.
Its a practise that was discounted with the death of Emps so only the very oldest remember it as a constant part of they're life save on Vanahiem and probably Aflehiem.
It's just vanahiem aflehiem and Svartfulhiem only because they're afraid of tech stealing.
Asgard and Midgard are fine cause of us, Jotunhiem is good because Garp got open minded, Niflehiem and Muspelhiem are all for it and Byzantium we don't know, but I'm leaning towards in favor because Caesar isn't an idiot and has probably had to get his "hands dirty" if you will in the 1000 years since the Imperium's fall.
Edit: For that matter why are we still calling human polities imperial remnants, blood dragons and atlas this is understandable, but for the others not really.
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