Another possibility, strange as it might seem, is that the other four Chaos Gods are now more actively interfering with the Abomination's attempts to create cultists on Avernus. The other four types of Chaos don't manage to get cults on Avernus anymore since people pretty much realize that it's suicide to convert to them from what durin has told us, with only a few psykers getting corrupted by them. As such, rather than attempt to get cults fruitlessly they might be trying to deny the Abomination cults in the Imperial Trust. The reason for this would be that they definitely know we have the DAoT military and naval tech (you can't really keep secrets from Chaos, because of what they are and where they live) and want to deny the Abomination the chance of gaining control of the Imperial Trust. That's not to say they won't make their own attempts, either as Chaos Undivided or individually, but they certainly would be willing to try to stop him from getting his followers the technology.
I actually disagree; I think Alexander or Vajra is one we should keep.
If you look at Parnell's list, it is pretty clear that he is a quintessential Imperial Navy commander, using ordinance and small crafts to harass and pin the enemy, then smash it in close-range gun duel; Carriers and lance-boats are something he is not comfortable with if not outright dislike.
While this is probably best strategy using equipment Imperium had available, we are in different position here and something more flexible would be a better choice.
I actually disagree; I think Alexander or Vajra is one we should keep.
If you look at Parnell's list, it is pretty clear that he is a quintessential Imperial Navy commander, using ordinance and small crafts to harass and pin the enemy, then smash it in close-range gun duel; Carriers and lance-boats are something he is not comfortable with if not outright dislike.
While this is probably best strategy using equipment Imperium had available, we are in different position here and something more flexible would be a better choice.
The Alexander and the Vajra are his second and third choices respectively. It might help if @durin would explain why Parnell has the preferences he does, though.
Ensure that Avernus and the Nine Worlds at least survive and thrive until the Emperor's reborn. Getting those other non-Chaos/Abomination groups close to us on our side would be great, especially the one with all the Space Marines, but if they fall and need to be eliminated, so be it.
Some advice to this quest:
1) As sweet as those DA battleships are without sufficient mass of lesser ships to guard them in combat they are just really expensive XP pinata. So before you get all crazy heavy on the most expensive ships... build up the more disposable ships first. Particularly as your looking at the ones that will take decades to fix as they are half destroyed. (Remember the Yamato.)
2) All these shiny trophies of DA fleet tech are basically sitting there undefended. Your actual progress on doing something with them is just drawing attention to them. They are actually in orbit around a planet with no infrastructure last I checked. This is like putting a giant neon blinking sign above them that reads 'Steal Me!!!'
3) Related advice is to take the dirt cheap two year project to build more tugs. It lessens the amount of time to bring them somewhere you can guard them. One two year action makes it take a half century less time to drag those shiny prizes behind defenses (according to last turns posting). Also, those extra tugs mean that it takes far less time to clean up after future battles.
For the last two years Archmagos Explorator Tranth and his team have been doing a quick survey of the ship graveyard in order to determine how many ships of each class there are remaining. There are two that seem intact, fourteen mostly intact, forty-eight half destroyed and a hundred and twelve nearly totally destroyed.
15 Legate Class Battleship- 2 Mostly Intact, 7 Half Destroyed, 17 Mostly Destroyed
20 Champion Class Battleship- 2 Mostly Intact, 11 Half Destroyed, 20 Mostly Destroyed
15 Hero Class Battleship- 1 Mostly Intact, 8 Half Destroyed, 20 Mostly Destroyed
15 Berserker Class Battleship- 1 Intact, 2 Mostly Intact, 8 Half Destroyed, 17 Mostly Destroyed
15 Saint Class Carrier Battleship- 2 Mostly Intact, 6 Half Destroyed, 15 Mostly Destroyed
5 Martyr Class Fast Carrier Battleship- 1 Mostly Intact, 2 Half Destroyed, 6 Mostly Destroyed
10 Mongol Class Fast Battleship – 2 Mostly Intact, 4 Half Destroyed, 12 Mostly Destroyed
5 Hun Class Fast Battleship-1 Mostly Intact, 2 Half Destroyed, 5 Mostly Destroyed
Darkness Class Stealth Battleship - 1 Intact, 1 Mostly Intact,
What's the numbers in front of the Battleships and Battlecruisers? They're not the total for that class.
Only 2 Darkness Class Stealth Battleships and both in good condition?
No other ships Intact, just lower escorts and a few BB's with the middle ones all busted?
To the rest of the thread we have 2 Intact Battleships which we may be able to fix here. With the damage the Navy took I'm thinking we send mostly Light Crusiers and Escorts at first with a pair of Command Battleships to Vanaheim to get fix. With the Intact Battleships how about sending the Brute type Berserker Class to the Navy and upgrade Klovis-Ultan's personal ride from that Overlord-Class Battlecruiser, Velvet Glove to the Darkness Class Stealth Battleship or just sell it to the Inquisition.
+10 additional bonus against known wildlife of Avernus
+15 additional bonus against Chaos forces
+5 additional bonus against Orks, Dark Eldar, Necrons, Heretics and Psykers, and in melee
+5 additional bonus when fighting in large numbers (20 or more regiments)
+5 addition bonus in sieges
+5 addition bonus against harassment
+5 addition bonus when conducting harassment
+10 addition bonus against insurgents
+10 additional bonus against known wildlife of Avernus
+15 additional bonus against Chaos forces
+5 additional bonus against Orks, Dark Eldar, Necrons, Heretics and Psykers, and in melee
+5 additional bonus when fighting in large numbers (20 or more regiments)
+5 addition bonus in sieges
+5 addition bonus against harassment
+5 addition bonus when conducting harassment
+10 addition bonus against insurgents
-10 PDF Bonus
+20 Military Traditions Bonus
+15 Equipment bonus
+65 Deathworlders Bonus
+25 Morale Bonus
+23 Officers Bonus
+40 Training Facility Bonus
+11 Training Bonus
+47 Militia Bonus
+23 Juvenat Bonus
+10 additional bonus against known wildlife of Avernus
+15 additional bonus against Chaos Forces
+5 additional bonus against Orks, Dark Eldar, Necrons, Heretics and Psykers, and in melee
+5 additional bonus when fighting in large numbers (20 or more regiments)
+5 addition bonus in sieges
+5 addition bonus against harassment
+5 addition bonus when conducting harassment
+10 addition bonus against insurgents
+55 to morale rolls
-2 PDF
+4 Military Traditions Bonus
+3 Equipment bonus
+5 Morale Bonus
+4 Officers Bonus
+12 Training Facility Bonus
+20 Trait Bonus
+5 Chaplain Bonus
+4 Juvenat Bonus
Require less upkeep then regular guard
Militia Combat Bonuses:
+131 to all actions
-40 Militia Bonus
+15 Military Traditions Bonus
+15 Equipment bonus
+65 Deathworlders Bonus
+20 Morale Bonus
+16 Officers Bonus
+32 Training Facility Bonus
+8 Training Bonus
+8 against known wildlife of Avernus
+4 against Orks, Dark Eldar, Chaos Forces and Necrons
+4 additional bonus when fighting in large numbers (20 or more regiments)
+4 addition bonus in sieges
+4 addition bonus against harassment
+4 addition bonus when conducting harassment
+8 addition bonus against insurgents
+40 to morale rolls
-8 Militia
+12 Military Traditions Bonus
+3 Equipment bonus
+4 Morale Bonus
+9 Training Facility Bonus
+20 Trait Bonus
Maximum Strength: 12 Mechanised Grenadier Regiments, 19 Infantry Regiments, 23 PDF Infantry Regiments, 27 Drop Infantry Regiments, 15 Light Infantry Regiments, 52 PDF Light Infantry Regiments, 46 PDF Heavy Infantry Regiments, 4 Armour Regiments, 29 PDF Armour Regiments. 134 Regiments total.
The Black Irons are an combined arms Division who get an additional +5 to all actions and +15 to morale checks. This is increased to +15 and +25 for their grenadiers.
The Black Irons were originally the Garrison of Beta-1, Blacktyde, until in what would later be known as the Blacktyde massacre they were forced to wipe out the population of their own city, who had been driven mad by berserk fungus. After the Massacre, the survivors of the Blacktyde Garrison dyed their uniforms black and their gloves red so they would never forget killing their own people and swore never to fail their charges again, taking the name The Black Irons. Since then, the Black Irons have been involved in the some heaviest fighting on Avernus, from the Defense of Storm's End to the Invasion of the Sons of War. They also distinguished themselves offworld in both the First Siege of Midgard and the Jotunheim Civil War, during which they adopted a large potion of the Avernite Military on Jotunheim.
Unit History: Defense of Blacktyde – initial posting Massacre of Blacktyde – founding battle Defense of Storm's End – 15 Regiments over 24 years Carniflower Rampage – 15 Regiments acted as defensive line Hunt the Queen – 1st/1st Company involved in hunt Invasion of the Sons of War – 15 Regiments participated in the sortie and were awarded one Hammer of The Emperor; 12 Regiments participated in the Cleansing of Dis and were awarded a second Hammer of the Emperor, 1 Regiment fought the Sons of War Necron Invasion – Four regiments flanked the breaches in the first battle and were awarded a Hammer of the Emperor; five regiments flanked the main Necron force late in the second battle First Siege of Midgard- The 1st Regiment of Black Irons were led by Saint Lin in his attack on one of the Slaneeshi rituals. They carved a hole though the Chaos forces to the ritual despite suffering over 50% casualties. The Jotunheim Civil War- 2nd to 15th Regiments were part of the initial force sent to Jotunheim. They were in the thickest of the fighting until the Warp Storm covered Jotunheim and carried out several mission where they exterminated entire town and cities. Once the Warp Storm covered Jotunheim Governor Garp deployed half of the Avernite expeditionary force, including the Black Irons to hunt down the Cults and exterminate them with extreme prejudice. The Black Irons became the moral center of this force and within two years the entire force had taken to wearing their uniform variation and philosophy. This philosophy is based around duty and taken upon yourself hard tasks so that others do not have to take them.
Maximum Strength: 1 Regiment
The Phase-Tigers are a Light Infantry regiment that gets +10 to all rolls, enemies get -50 to attack rolls and any casualties the Phase-Tigers suffer are halved. They also gain an additional +20 to stealth rolls and +15 to ambush rolls.
The Phase-Tigers are the last purely Catachan Regiment on Avernus and probably the best survivors on the planet. They first made a name for themselves in the Carniflower Rampage where they avoided suffering any casualties despite being in the thick of the fighting. This trend continued into the Invasion of the Sons of War where they engaged the Traitor PDF Light Infantry with no casualties. In the aftermath of the invasion, Governor Fredrick Rotbart recognized their nickname of the Phase-Tigers and named a new medal after them. During the Necron Invasion they protected Psy-Unit 3 and escorted them close enough to deal heavy damage to the Necrons, once managing to sneak them past all the Necron scouts and sentries to attack the main force. Despite conducting some effective harassment, the Phase tigers avoided losing any men, earning themselves another Phase-Tiger. After the Battle, the Catachan 813th found two hundred and seventy abandoned Phase-Tiger Cubs and adopted them.
Unit History: Defense of Doriath – Initial posting Carniflower Rampage – Hunted down Carniflowers and suffered no casualties Invasion of the Sons of War – Fought to disrupt the Ritual and suffered no casualties Necron Invasion – Escorted Psy-Unit 3 to major Necron concentrations and prevented Necron Vanguard from finding them; once managed to get Psy-Unit 3 close enough to target main Necron concentration. In late second wave they engaged the Necrons forces and yet again avoided any casualties, earning another Phase-Tiger medal. They adopted 270 Phase-Tiger Cubs that they found abandoned after the battle. First Siege of Midgard- The Phase-Tigers came to Midgard with Saint Lin who they had been guarding on his pilgrimage across the Nine Worlds. Due to this they were on Midgard proper when the Chaos rituals begun and were dispatched to deal with the Tzeenchian ritual. They managed to successfully infiltrate past the Chaos defensive positions and simultaneously annihilated the guards and sorcerers at all nine locations. This was a collapsed the entire ritual and allowed the Phase Tigers to once again avoid suffering any deaths in combat.
Maximum Strength: 1 Regiment
The 23rd Dis PDF is a PDF Infantry Regiment. They get +10 to all rolls, +20 to morale rolls and never fall back.
The 23rd Dis PDF Infantry Regiment stood against the Sons of War despite near total losses and killed half a company of Khorne Berserkers. In recognition of their courage they have been re-founded and made the banner unit of the Dis PDF.
Unit History: Invasion of the Sons of War – Founding battle. Unit was ambushed by the Sons of War and reduced to 28 Chimeras which continued to fight. Awarded the Adamantium Medallion of Courage and a Hammer of the Emperor.
Maximum Strength: 3 Wings
The Psyrodactyls are Lightning Fighter Wings with a +15 to all rolls and +20 against the Avernus wildlife.
The Psyrodactyls are the veteran pilots who survived the Invasion of the Sons of War unlike the rest of their comrades. These pilots are those with the skill to engage the deadly Chaos fighters of the Sons of War and the courage to keep fighting despite massive losses. During the Invasion, the Psyrodactyls lured a large flock of wild Psyrodactyls into the Chaos landing force causing massive casualties and earning them their name. They fought in the Necron Invasion and despite suffering over 80% casualties inflicted many losses on the Necron air force, achieving a better than 1:1 kill rate.
Unit History: Invasion of the Sons of War – Founding battle. During this Invasion the Imperial Fighters clashed with their Chaotic counterparts several times and suffered heavy casualties. Lured Psyrodactyls into Chaos landing force and earned the Silver Medallion of Courage. Necron Invasion – The Psyrodactyls fought the Necron air force for most of the campaign, until you pulled back the last eight pilots from the battlefield. They killed over half again their number of Necron fliers despite the Necrons' technological superiority and earned two more Hammers of the Emperor as well as another Silver Medallion of Courage.
Maximum Strength: 4 Wings
The Wings of Thunder are Marauder Bombers with +15 to all rolls and an additional +30 to attack runs. They are also never suffer negative modifiers from casualties or enemy numbers to their attack runs.
The Wings of Thunder are the veteran pilots who survived the invasion of the Sons of War. These pilots achieved incredible accuracy even when being slaughtered by Chaos Fighters and constantly killed large numbers of the heretic forces. During the Necron Invasion they inflicted massive casualties on the Necron armies, at one point killing 60,000 Necron Warriors in a single attack run.
Unit History: Invasion of the Sons of War – Founding battle. During this invasion the Imperial Bomber Wings were involved in three different battles and achieved at least ninety percent accuracy in all three. This was despite being under attack from Chaos Fighters and losing half their numbers in the first attack, losing a fifth of their numbers to AA fire in the second attack and a third of their numbers to Chaos Fighters in the third. They earned the Silver Medallion of Courage for these battles as well as a Hammer of the Emperor with two pins. Necron Invasion – During the Necron Invasion the Wings of Thunder continued to perform superlatively, killing over a hundred thousand foes and crippling the Necron AA capabilities at the loss of only a quarter of their own number. For their performance they earned no less than five Hammers of the Emperor and a Snake Hunters Medal for AA hunting.
Maximum Strength: 1000 Men
Total Bonus: +20 to all +55 to melee
Elite Advanced Power Armour, Advanced Weapons
The Governor's Own are a company of Kasrkin who get +20 to combat rolls which is increased to +40 in last stands. They never suffer penalties from morale as long as Governor Rotbart is leading them. They are equipped with advanced weaponry, with every man armed with a power weapon and one in three armed with plasma guns. This gives them +50 in melee combat.
They are equipped with Elite Advanced Power Armour, giving them an additional +20 to all combat rolls and an additional +5 to melee, greatly increased toughness and allowing them to carry Impaler Rifles, increasing damage output. This also allows them carry field modules that provide several other benefits.
Psyker Hunters get +276 to all actions and an additional +25 against psykers and +15 to resisting psychic powers.
Witch Hunters get +276 to all actions and an additional +50 against psykers and +40 to resisting psychic powers.
It was edited, but it hasn't been fully updated. Note that it says it hasn't been updated since Turn 54. It mainly appears that durin updated some of the costs to include new vehicles.
It was edited, but it hasn't been fully updated. Note that it says it hasn't been updated since Turn 54. It mainly appears that durin updated some of the costs to include new vehicles.
It was edited, but it hasn't been fully updated. Note that it says it hasn't been updated since Turn 54. It mainly appears that durin updated some of the costs to include new vehicles.
Well, looking closer the military numbers might be more up to date. The skill numbers definitely aren't though. And I really hope that durin will add the air force skill levels to that soon. It's annoying to not have that information.
So the STC for the bomber was a class that is meant for quick raiding actions, I think. Carrier comes in, sends its compliment of these out, bombs the crap out of the target, has the bombers come back, then retreats.
What makes you think the bomber is meant for raiding actions? The STC description says it's a jack of all trades bomber that works in space and atmosphere?
What makes you think the bomber is meant for raiding actions? The STC description says it's a jack of all trades bomber that works in space and atmosphere?
Because any carrier unit closer to home will use specialised bombers for abundance of carrying capacity. These are for carriers that need to operate away from berth for.a long time, where lots of cargo capacity has to be dedicated to supplies rather than specialized bombers.
What makes you think the bomber is meant for raiding actions? The STC description says it's a jack of all trades bomber that works in space and atmosphere?
I'm talking about the situation type it's most useful for. A dedicated attack or defense force would just use dedicated void craft and dedicated aircraft. A group of ships that are dedicated to raiding would benefit more from the flexibility that the Griffon offers - you can use it to attack ships or ground targets of opportunity. However, because it's inferior to the dedicated version, you're not going to want it involved in a mainline battle.
I'm talking about the situation type it's most useful for. A dedicated attack or defense force would just use dedicated void craft and dedicated aircraft. A group of ships that are dedicated to raiding would benefit more from the flexibility that the Griffon offers - you can use it to attack ships or ground targets of opportunity. However, because it's inferior to the dedicated version, you're not going to want it involved in a mainline battle.
Huh, that means we could perform Doolittle Raids on our enemies. They might not be able to do much in terms of damage, but it'll scary the shit out of our enemies who thought they were safe.
I'm talking about the situation type it's most useful for. A dedicated attack or defense force would just use dedicated void craft and dedicated aircraft. A group of ships that are dedicated to raiding would benefit more from the flexibility that the Griffon offers - you can use it to attack ships or ground targets of opportunity. However, because it's inferior to the dedicated version, you're not going to want it involved in a mainline battle.
Wouldn't that flexibility also be useful for a patrol carrier? They don't know if they are going to deal with pirates in space or enemy raiders on a planet, so the flexibility there will be useful as well.
Either way, neither role is something we're going to need to worry about until the Warp Storm is gone it seems like.
Wouldn't that flexibility also be useful for a patrol carrier? They don't know if they are going to deal with pirates in space or enemy raiders on a planet, so the flexibility there will be useful as well.
For anti-piracy, maybe. It depends on how frequently pirates decide to base themselves on the ground.
For raiders on a planet? Well, likely much less useful given the defense levels our planets will be required to have - anything that can bust through Medium or better DAoT defenses isn't likely to be a mere raider.
But that flexibility could mean that you only have to buy one flexible bomber for every 2 specialized bombers. If you're willing to take a hit to how many bombs you can drop at a time its a much cheaper alternative. Depending on how much smaller the bomber bays are it could definitely be worth it.
But that flexibility could mean that you only have to buy one flexible bomber for every 2 specialized bombers. If you're willing to take a hit to how many bombs you can drop at a time its a much cheaper alternative. Depending on how much smaller the bomber bays are it could definitely be worth it.
Unlikely. Flexibility like this comes with its own costs. The Griffon has to be able to both survive atmospheric re-entry and have the engine power to get back into space. The Dragon doesn't have to do either of those things, and the Phoenix only has to do the re-entry. It should also be noted that it's effectiveness as an aerial bomber is being compared to not one but two Phoenix Bombers (it's bigger than they are), and the Phoenix is a more advanced version of the Thunderhawk used by Space Marines. This is not by any means a cheap craft to produce in that case.
Pound for pound you're more likely to get greater cost-effectiveness out of the dedicated craft.
