bonuses towards training.. but at what cost?

The idea of Sol playing into a potential insidious manipulator who stacks supreme manifestation expy (?) brownie points just from interaction screams alarm bells for me..

Like, a 99 Manipulation Roll. That implies 5D chess play. As we saw with our own success with Harrison vision, a high roll like that is transcendent. Not only did we convince him but that, extrapolating with the situation at hand led to a whole chain of events dragging in the Educator, unlocking Structuralism, and Harrison being explained that Sol needs his rest to recover from this.

So what would a similar Manipulation Roll be? If the Master Baiter Roll was indeed Judas. This coinciding with Sol's vision of doom worries me. I'd rather we steer Sol from potential pitfalls or unpleasant Fated entanglement dynamics.

I know it's a pretty human reaction to feel guilty about witnessing grievous bodily injury. But I'd rather it was something like sadness or horror instead of something problematic like guilt arising from a sus situation. Rather for something legitimate like a true innocent getting hurt.

Horror perhaps, after looking into the Structure and seeing the chains of machination that someone could go to achieve their ends. Or if learning that it's not so, then embrace a directed guilt of not intervening. Not emotionless, but channeled into determination as a seeker of Truth.

It's a good narrative that plays well with Sol as we have seen so far. Sol values truth in all things.. To fall prey to manipulation would be to embrace the trappings of a falsehood.. In seeking truth, play into his Role as Magician, bearer of the mantle of Knowledge.
 
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bonuses towards training.. but at what cost?

The idea of Sol playing into a potential insidious manipulator who stacks supreme manifestation expy (?) brownie points just from interaction screams alarm bells for me..

Like, a 99 Manipulation Roll. That implies 5D chess play. As we saw with our own success with Harrison vision, a high roll like that is transcendent. Not only did we convince him but that, extrapolating with the situation at hand led to a whole chain of events dragging in the Educator, unlocking Structuralism.

So what would a similar Manipulation Roll be? If the Master Baiter Roll was indeed Judas. This coinciding with Sol's vision of doom worries me. I'd rather we steer Sol from potential pitfalls or unpleasant Fated entanglement dynamics.

I know it's a pretty human reaction to feel guilty about witnessing grievous bodily injury. But I'd rather it was something like sadness or horror instead of something problematic like guilt arising from a sus situation. Rather for something legitimate like a true innocent getting hurt.

Horror perhaps, after looking into the Structure and seeing the chains of machination that someone could go to achieve their ends. Or if learning that it's not so, then embrace guilt of not intervening. Not emotionless, but channeled into determination as a seeker of Truth.

It's a good narrative that plays well with Sol as we have seen so far. Sol values truth in all things.. To fall prey to manipulation would be to embrace the trappings of a falsehood.. In seeking truth, play into his Role as Magician, bearer of the mantle of Knowledge.
See, people keep talking about a Master Manipulation 99 role yet I cannot find anything like that on discord. Instead only a 94 role exists, and that was for the Metaphysicist. The highest after that was a 69.
 
Maybe Guilt Tripping was the end goal? :thonk:

Edit: Now you have to feel guilty. Now you owe me, whether you like it or not. :V
 
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bonuses towards training.. but at what cost?

The idea of Sol playing into a potential insidious manipulator who stacks supreme manifestation expy (?) brownie points just from interaction screams alarm bells for me..

Like, a 99 Manipulation Roll. That implies 5D chess play. As we saw with our own success with Harrison vision, a high roll like that is transcendent. Not only did we convince him but that, extrapolating with the situation at hand led to a whole chain of events dragging in the Educator, unlocking Structuralism, and Harrison being explained that Sol needs his rest to recover from this.

So what would a similar Manipulation Roll be? If the Master Baiter Roll was indeed Judas. This coinciding with Sol's vision of doom worries me. I'd rather we steer Sol from potential pitfalls or unpleasant Fated entanglement dynamics.

I know it's a pretty human reaction to feel guilty about witnessing grievous bodily injury. But I'd rather it was something like sadness or horror instead of something problematic like guilt arising from a sus situation. Rather for something legitimate like a true innocent getting hurt.

Horror perhaps, after looking into the Structure and seeing the chains of machination that someone could go to achieve their ends. Or if learning that it's not so, then embrace a directed guilt of not intervening. Not emotionless, but channeled into determination as a seeker of Truth.

It's a good narrative that plays well with Sol as we have seen so far. Sol values truth in all things.. To fall prey to manipulation would be to embrace the trappings of a falsehood.. In seeking truth, play into his Role as Magician, bearer of the mantle of Knowledge.
At what cost well the will? I don't want our character to be comfortable with this and further options are not gonna make us do something for Judas automatically. So the will is the cost. It doesn't matter if they bait us as the guilt option doesn't actually suggest doing anything for them.
 
It doesn't matter if they bait us as the guilt option doesn't actually suggest doing anything for them.
Well, if they bait us and we fall for it emotionally, it makes sense it might take more will to not fall for the bait in the future (or take less will to fall for it and not give will to not, I guess). If guilt is a leadin emotion to the next scam, presumably it will make the scam more effective if Solomon feels guilty when it happens.
 
Well, if they bait us and we fall for it emotionally, it makes sense it might take more will to not fall for the bait in the future (or take less will to fall for it and not give will to not, I guess). If guilt is a leadin emotion to the next scam, presumably it will make the scam more effective if Solomon feels guilty when it happens.
Doubtful considering we are gaining skill and have control over his actions.
 
bonuses towards training.. but at what cost?

The idea of Sol playing into a potential insidious manipulator who stacks supreme manifestation expy (?) brownie points just from interaction screams alarm bells for me..

Like, a 99 Manipulation Roll. That implies 5D chess play. As we saw with our own success with Harrison vision, a high roll like that is transcendent. Not only did we convince him but that, extrapolating with the situation at hand led to a whole chain of events dragging in the Educator, unlocking Structuralism, and Harrison being explained that Sol needs his rest to recover from this.

So what would a similar Manipulation Roll be? If the Master Baiter Roll was indeed Judas. This coinciding with Sol's vision of doom worries me. I'd rather we steer Sol from potential pitfalls or unpleasant Fated entanglement dynamics.

I know it's a pretty human reaction to feel guilty about witnessing grievous bodily injury. But I'd rather it was something like sadness or horror instead of something problematic like guilt arising from a sus situation. Rather for something legitimate like a true innocent getting hurt.

Horror perhaps, after looking into the Structure and seeing the chains of machination that someone could go to achieve their ends. Or if learning that it's not so, then embrace a directed guilt of not intervening. Not emotionless, but channeled into determination as a seeker of Truth.

It's a good narrative that plays well with Sol as we have seen so far. Sol values truth in all things.. To fall prey to manipulation would be to embrace the trappings of a falsehood.. In seeking truth, play into his Role as Magician, bearer of the mantle of Knowledge.

Again though, we have zero clue what that 99 was even for or who it was. We are extrapolating that it was Judas, we are extrapolating even further that the 99 involved manipulating our class. It's ooc information that is heavily influencing your opinion, that we have zero confirmation if it's even relevant. Sol had suspicions because things seemed weird. The thing is though that idk about you, but when I voted for a thief's justice I didn't think Judas would get literally scarred and tortured. Sol didn't assume that either, and that degree of brutality is what causes guilt. Things went further than Sol wanted or expected. Anything other than guilty makes zero sense for a teenage kid, how many 16 year olds have you ever met that are in complete control of their emotional responses?
 
My theory is that it was a coordinated effort between the engine and Judas. Judas gets pity points and engine gets fear and to scope out the morals and power of a lower class.
 
[X] Plan: Government Mandated Studying Tax
-[X] 3X Individualized Classes (-90 Will)
-[X] Use a Coffee Jello (+30 Will)
-[X] Guilty
 
[X] Plan: Stop thinking and study
-[X] 3X Individualized Classes (-90 Will)
-[X] Use a Coffee Jello (+30 Will)
-[X] Write in: Withhold Judgment
 
@Birdsie

As the main contention is now between Guilty and Withhold Judgement / Resolved / etc, can we get an exact idea of how much Guilty improves the benefits of training? I think for many that a 5% Guilty buff to this month's actions would be pretty irrelevant, whereas a 25% buff would be worth seriously considering.
 
@Birdsie

As the main contention is now between Guilty and Withhold Judgement / Resolved / etc, can we get an exact idea of how much Guilty improves the benefits of training? I think for many that a 5% Guilty buff to this month's actions would be pretty irrelevant, whereas a 25% buff would be worth seriously considering.

To add to this, could we get an idea of the mechanical impact of withhold judgment, if any?
 
As the main contention is now between Guilty and Withhold Judgement / Resolved / etc, can we get an exact idea of how much Guilty improves the benefits of training? I think for many that a 5% Guilty buff to this month's actions would be pretty irrelevant, whereas a 25% buff would be worth seriously considering.
It's somewhat hard to quantize, but assuming you're inputting 3x Individual Classwork, it'd be equivalent to stacking about 50% of another one on top of that.

To add to this, could we get an idea of the mechanical impact of withhold judgment, if any?
None significant, although maybe you could eke out a small progression bonus to Remedial.
 
[X] Plan: Government Mandated Studying Tax
-[X] 3X Individualized Classes (-90 Will)
-[X] Use a Coffee Jello (+30 Will)
-[X] Guilty

I have decided.
If only for no other reason that seeing someone in pain and feeling bad for not helping him is a sign of functioning conscience.
 

View: https://imgur.com/uYVzZPX

TABULA SMARAGDINA, THE EMERALD TABLET OF HERMES. THE SECRET WORKS OF CHIRAM, ONE IN ESSENCE, THREE IN FORM.
TIS TRUTH WITHOUT FALSEHOOD, CERTAIN AND MOST TRUE. AS ABOVE, SO BELOW; AS BELOW, SO ABOVE. BY THIS LAW, THE MIRACLES OF THE ONE ARE WROUGHT.
THE SUN IS ITS FATHER, THE MOON ITS MOTHER. THE WIND BORE IT IN THE WOMB. IT IS NURTURED BY THE EARTH, THE MOTHER OF ALL PERFECTION.
ITS POWER IS WHOLE IF JOINED WITH THE SPIRITUOUS EARTH.
SEPARATE THE EARTH FROM THE FIRE, THE FINE FROM THE COARSE, SWEETLY WITH GREAT INDUSTRY.
IT ASCENDS FROM EARTH TO HEAVEN AND DESCENDS AGAIN TO EARTH, RECEIVES YE FORCE OF THE VIRTUES OF BOTH THE ABOVE AND THE BELOW.
BY THIS WILT THOU PARTAKE OF THE HONOURS OF THE WHOLE WORLD AND THEREBY ALL DARKNESS SHALL FLY FROM THEE.
FOR THIS BY ITS FORTITUDE SNATCHES THE PALM FROM ALL OTHER FORTITUDE AND POWER.
FOR IT IS ABLE TO PENETRATE AND SUBDUE EVERYTHING SUBTLE AND EVERYTHING CRUDE AND HARD.
BY THIS MEANS THE WORLD WAS FOUNDED. THE PATH TO FOLLOW THIS ROAD WELL HIDDEN.
FOR THIS REASON, I AM HERMES, THE THREEFOLD SAGE. CHIRAM TELAT MECHASOT, ONE IN ESSENCE, BUT THREE IN ASPECT.
IN THIS TRINITY LIES IN SECRET, WISDOM OF THE WORLD WHOLE, I HOLD.
AND THUS ENDS THE REVELATION OF THE WORK OF THE SUN.
FIN, THE TABULA SMARAGDINA.



The powers of all things Below originate in the stars and constellations of the heavens. This celestial energy flows down through the circle Alaur, the first circle of the constellations, to reach earthly vessels. The crystallization of divinity in this descent depends on the transparency and brightness of these vessels. The more closely they mirror the celestial realms, the more wonderous their acquired powers become. Thus precious stones, revered for carrying celestial virtues within, hold a significant role in alchemical endeavors.

Alchemy is the segregation and unification of two facets of a stone. A superior part that ascends and an inferior part that remains grounded. This harmony between the earth-nourished inferior and the spiritually elevated superior is the key. The fundamental tenet of Alchemy is the interconnectedness of the cosmos and the transformative processes that occur both in the heavens and on Earth.

The stone is a Talisman, the word originating from the Greek word Telesma, which means completion of ritual. They mirror their prototype, embodying the original ideal form and condensing a spiritual state onto the subtle plane, beyond physical senses. This means that talismans can capture and transmit invisible influences, such as the forces of nature or the planets.


The Sun and the Moon play a pivotal role in the creation of the stone. The Sun is the Spirit (nous) the active and masculine principle. While the Moon is the Soul (psyche) representing the passive and feminine principle.

The solar force requires a suitable receptacle for its seed and tincture—the moon of the philosophers. The moon, associated with water, receives the light and heat of the sun. The prima materia is generated by fire, born of water, brought down from the sky by wind, and nourished by earth.

Distillation, solution, separation, and fermentation. These processes serve to purify and refine. The stone, holding within every element, is born when the chaotic mass is subjected to Alchemy. Heating and distilling the mass within an alembic, rendering it lighter and more subtle.


The wind, or air, carries the material in its belly, evaporating and condensing into a liquid imbued with elements. The wind is also life and spirit, and it carries the seed of the stone, which is the sulphur. The sulphur comes from the sun and the moon, which are the father and mother of the stone. The stone is fire carried within the belly of the air or a child about to be born. The mercury, which is another component of the stone, is composed of vapours, or water and earth, that rise and fall in the air. It is also the vital breath, which is a substance that exists between heaven and earth.

The wind that receives the sulphur and carries it in its belly. The stone changes into its own substance by assimilating food that is similar to it, just as nature does. The food is the ferment of the earth, which nurtures the stone. The earth contains a juice that transforms the colours the stone into sap and blood. In metals the moisture is not separated from the dryness, but is dissolved in it. and being so dissolved, it moves about there as if it had been swallowed by the Earth and were moving about in its bowels. The mother of metal is Earth that carries it in her belly.


The material of the stone is composed of two. The Spirit and the Body. The spirit is the volatile principle, which means that it is light and airy, and can easily change.

The body is the fixed principle, which means that it is heavy and solid, and can resist change or decay. The perfection and completion of the stone depends on the balance and harmony between these two principles.

The spirit must be embodied, or captured and contained in a material form. The body must be turned into earth, or fixed and stable. The soul of the stone, which is its essence or spirit, must become one with nurturing earth.

This entire process leads to the conversion of the entire stone into ferment, a substance that initiates growth and change, producing stability by removing the volatile principle. This also produces the seed of gold - the essence of perfection that must be sown on the earth. The raw material to produce the stone.


The stone is the light of the spirit, the glory of the whole world, or which stands for lapis philosophorum or philosopher's stone. Product of the union and balance of the three principles. The mercury the spirit, the sulfur the soul, and the salt the body.

The stone is able to conquer every subtle thing and to penetrate every solid thing. The stone possesses all the powers concealed in nature, not for destruction but for exaltation and regeneration of matter, in the three realms of nature. The mineral kingdom, the vegetation kingdom, and the animal kingdom.

The creation of the stone is not only a physical but also a spiritual achievement - a Miracle. The stone represents the unity of all things, which is also called the one thing or the arcanum.

The arcanum reveals the essence and origin of everything, which is also called the first cause. The contemplation and study of the stone elevates the mind to Divinity removing all ignorance, deception, uncertainty from consciousness. Purifying the body and the soul.

The body becomes a spirit and takes on fineness, lightness, extensibility, and coloration. The spirit becomes a body and acquires resistance to fires of entropy, immobility, and duration. The soul becomes a light substance that takes up a middle position between the two extremes. The stone thus grants complete mental and physical wholeness without any diminution of its inexhaustible well.


All things flow from the one thing, which is the goodness of the One. The unconditioned One is an invisible light that is refracted into multiplicity by the prism of the Spirit, which manifests the many-sided All. As Creation is one, all created objects come from one thing, an undifferentiated primal matter. The little world created according to the prototype of the great world, when the human realizes their original nature is the image of Creation. This way is traversed by the sages, so Hermes spake.

He is the fabled Mercury of the philosophers — the solvent capable of dissolving and coagulating all things. He is the Serpent, embodiment of knowledge and wisdom. The Thrice-fold Sage that hold dominion over three realms of nature, embodying the spirit and essence of everything, extracted and purified through alchemy. The three parts of his Wisdom are the three great divisions of the universe, the spiritual, psychic and corporeal realms, whose symbols are heaven, air and earth.

Him who is called Chiram, the green one of Life. Who is eternal life and resurrection in the grain of corn or the seed of gold, which must die and be reborn to bear fruit. To multiply infinitely. He is also called the stone or the light of the spirit, which illuminates and transforms. He is thus the ultimate goal of alchemy — to create a Sun that unveils and manifests divine will to all things Below.


 
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