what's is the current vote, or is there a vote currently?

if its the most recent one
[X] Plan Wallet

edited foms distrubution
 
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We have gotten more clarification on Penelope's builds. Her default stance is to take Seraph 8, Retributor 6 (?) with no further Truthseeker levels, and at least one level of the other Aspects. Basically Avenging Angel, but she intends to neglect Truthseeker. This is a pretty bad idea, Retributor doesn't work unless you know about the target's evils so she's only taking it for the passive scaling function.

I propose two alternate builds we can suggest to her - or strongly recommend, if Solomon can muster himself to do that. We have been told that Penny has a good amount of XP spare, I'm going to assume enough to buy four level 1 Aspects at 250 each.

1) Blind Justice v2

Seraph 8 (16,666 XP)
Take Blindness, Truthseeker 7 (5,250)
Retributor 5 (3,750 XP)
Lawgiver 3 (583)
Balance 3 (1750)
Four Techniques: As per original Blind Justice, as the Truthseeker + Retributor levels still make her a good candidate for social spec

This will allow her to actually use her Retributor levels to much greater effect than her proposed plan, which didn't have the information-gathering capacity to determine if a high-level target was evil in the first place. Relying on Sol to tell her that is cute, but would require effort of Sol - ridiculous outside the direst of situations.

2) Maiar

Seraph 8 (16,666 XP)
Lawgiver 7 (10,500 XP)
Other Aspects at between Level 1 and Level 3
Four Techniques: Maximize Seraph synergy with Lawgiver, like Eldritch boosting Arcanum. Strengthen the laws with Angelic authority.

This makes her a hybrid caster build that can still fight well. With this build we'd probably split up from her most of the time as both characters would be potent generalists, though their powers in conjunction would be formidable as well - Lawgiver buffing our magics and constraining the options of our enemies.

Personally I prefer Blind Justice v2 as it has much greater synergy with Sol in the "Penelope Frontliner, Sol Artillery" configuration. She will have higher stats for us to buff and can better hold her own in melee combat with Truthseeker allowing her to anticipate her enemies' reactions and intercept attacks meant for us. Good synergy.
 
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Relying on Sol to tell her that is cute, but would require effort of Sol - ridiculous outside the direst of situations.
I'm not sure it's that bad? So far, Solomon appreciates being asked in the first place. It's not like it cost him Will when Harrison asked about the field trip!
If Solomon was going to use big rituals for divination, sure, but probably our best method of divination will be Connections thanks to the Discount. Carry around some representation of evil or criminality and check if it's 'connected' to the target, done.
 
The proposed Blindess V2 build specifies to blind herself as part of Truthseeker. I like the idea of the build but wouldn't advise her to blind herself, that strikes me as an overstep

Edit: double ninja'd
 
so in the unlikely but certainly possible scenario we get the sc needed for a devotion what do people want? Personally I want sword as it fits sol the best though we do need to know more about how much it enhances our cognition. But I also like the fact its hermetic power as that involves hermes trismigestus and I love that would also probably pair stupidly well with the 25sc wrath of hermes level 1 power.
 
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The last time we spoke with Birdsie on the discord (join the discord!) we were at 11.7 - which was before one or two of Rihaku's gigachad posts amongst other things so I'm somewhat certain that we're good to go all in.
 
Birdsie is re-evaluating the Aspect stacking system and some mechanics are currently in flux. He's asked for some input so I'm consolidating my thoughts on system design into this effortpost:

I. What Is the Purpose of Mechanics in a Quest?

There are three main purposes in roughly descending order of importance:
1) A clear and unambiguous means of modeling the supernatural, superhuman, or complex elements of the quest's setting;
2) A quickly-understandable paradigm for detailing the capabilities of relevant characters;
3) A source of engagement and enjoyment for mechanically inclined players (this point is often underestimated; quests live and die on engagement and each marginal interaction has a chance of triggering its own responses, which leads to a positive feedback loop that can fuel activity for many updates; just as a long gap between updates can similarly lead to a death spiral in momentum)

A mechanical system that fulfills all three will reduce the burden on the GM to answer specific matchup and build questions, while also giving parts of the playerbase license to exercise their own creativity in making and planning builds.

For example, in Even Further Beyond I never had to answer if Yong Shen with the Form of Vehemence could defeat Zang Kong, or countless permutations and variations thereof; it was immediately obvious that Stage 8.9 could not challenge Stage 15.9 even with a +3.0 buff. Similarly, everyone was continuously and immediately cognizant of what Nameless could be expected to do in conflict against a Stage 1.0, Stage 5.0, and Stage 7.0 enemy.

To use a more complex example, in A Simple Transaction I Hunger had the three key mechanics of Attributes, Rank, and ISH Elevation (mostly from Praxis techs). Consider his fight against Procyon:

*Procyon obviously had a strong lead in Rank, an overwhelming advantage in the Might Attribute, and a strong advantage in the Agility Attribute whenever Refinement of Quickness was off
*Hunger had a strong lead in mental and social Attributes (Age and Treachery), intermittently greater Agility via ISH elevation, and competitive durability from high levels of the Protection Attribute generated by the Armor of Midnight

All Procyon's advantages are passive, most of Hunger's advantages are active and resource-intensive: save for his lead in mental Attributes. And it was by such means that he slowly, painfully steered the combat into the corridors of his advantage until finally the decisive moment could be manufactured. A quick glance at their respective stats can communicate all this in far fewer words.

When you have clear and competently-built mechanics, your playerbase will speak an inferential shorthand that allows them to engage much more deeply and accurately with your world. It allows for things like CYOAs built with your mechanics or "What If?" omakes with a great deal of verisimilitude.

II. Specific Mechanics of this Quest

It has become clear in Discord discussions that the previous Aspect Stacking system is unsustainble with Birdsie's view of high Aspect values: exponential cost and value go hand in hand. Permitting multiple Aspects to sum linearly breaks this system altogether.

In the Aspect 8-10 Range:
*An Aspect 10 is meant to crush an Aspect 8 well over 95% of the time.
*An Aspect 10 is meant to beat an Aspect 9 in most reasonable circumstances, though this is matchup-specific. A 9 that hard counters a 10 can certainly defeat them.

Additionally:
*No Enrolled has ever attained an Aspect above 21 for more than a few moments.

If a 2-Aspect gulf is meant to be overwhelming, then the "Hermes the Destroyer" Aspect clearly cannot stack with Arcanum by adding 2 full levels of Arcanum for every level of Hermes. But to be clear this is not a matter of powers being nerfed or buffed, merely how they are being represented.

People were unenthused with Eldritch's +1 bonus to Arcanum, because they weren't informed that this paradigm shift had already been percolating: that +1 bonus under this system is a huge deal, just like +0.5 Stages in EFB is a huge deal.

Given this new system, here are my thoughts on how Aspect stacking should work, in order to preserve the feeling and intended meaning of the old system while staying mechanically legible and resistant to exploitation.

Synergy-Type Aspects: These are Aspects which improve the effective level of another aspect via synergy. Hermes' power married to Arcanum's precision; Eldritch's otherworldly nature (with Techniques) making the use of magic easier. We want to incentivize people to keep these Aspects within 3-4 levels of the 'parent' Aspect that they're augmenting. We'd also like to keep these Aspects generally scarce, as rare and sought-after rewards. Each one represents a small rebellion against the tyranny of the exponential cost system. People who acquire Synergy Aspects rise head and shoulders above their peers.

My proposal is:
-For Synergy Aspects that are limited (example: "Hermes the Destroyer" - which raises Arcanum for combat purposes):
*If Hermes is 5 or more levels below Arcanum, then it provides minor and basically irrelevant gains
*If 4 levels below, then it grants +0.5 Level of Effective Arcanum in combat
*If 3 levels below, then it grants +1.00 such Levels
*If 2 levels below, then it grants +1.50 such Levels
*If 1 level below, then it grants +2.00 such Levels
*If equally-ranked or greater, then treat Arcanum as the Synergy Aspect instead, and apply an additional +1 level to represent Hermes' inherent power in battle.

-This was calibrated off Birdsie's recent statement that Arcanum 8, Hermes 4 can fight at the level of a median graduate. The Drone Villain is a highly experienced graduate and has a Drones Aspect Level of 10.
-For synergy Aspects that are broad (example: Eldritch with techniques, which not only grants physical stats but boosts Effective Arcanum level for all purposes), halve the relevant bonuses for each level and remove the equally-ranked bonus.
-This also covers Aspects that are circumstantially synergistic; i.e. Lawgiver 7 boosting Penelope's Seraph 8 by imposing 100x gravity on her enemies is worth +1 Effective Seraph level.
-All bonuses apply to the base level of the parent Aspect; treat Sol's Arcanum as 7 for purposes of calculating both the Hermes Synergy and the Eldritch Synergy. This keeps things easy and simply to eyeball, and you can simply calibrate the raw bonuses for game balance if needed.

-Exceptionally great or potent Aspects and Techniques can break these rules in proportion to how exceptional they are.
-A 7 SC Aspect might grant an additional +.25 Levels at all stages.
-A 25 SC Aspect might have the breadth of Arcanum, yet grant Synergy bonuses like Hermes, while also yielding a different major benefit such as a potent ally, lump-sum XP, or a floating +2 Level bonus in narrow circumstances.
-A Role that costs 25 SC may have several Aspects or Techniques that break the rules in various ways. For example, Retributor grants a Synergy bonus that scales without limit proportional to the injustices committed by one's opponent, even if Retributor is more than 5 levels below the relevant Aspect; higher levels of Retributor scale more quickly.

Constraint-Type Aspects and Techinques: These are Aspects or Techniques which modify another Aspect, limiting its purview or adding some drawback in terms of use, upfront cost, etc. Blindness' 25% cost refund and 50% cost reduction basically translates to +1 Aspect level and change.

This is a fine way to handle an upfront cost drawback, but for ongoing ones my proposal is:

Moderate Drawback: A sensory Technique that deprives the character of a major sense, which they won't need anyway once the Aspect is highly leveled. A specialization Technique that limits a Wizard to effects of the Conjuration and Transmutation schools. Drawbacks that basically aren't real problems for the creative and determined. +1 Aspect Level, a small flat cost in XP. Moderate Drawback options should be rare and the province of high-tier Roles or quest rewards, as they are the closest thing to 'free levels' one can get.

Heavy Drawback: A Technique that turns the Sharingan into generic eye lasers. An Aspect that forces you to fall unconscious for 12 hours a day. A specialization Technique that limits a Wizard to effects of the Evocation and Abjuration schools. Drawbacks that are real and serious problems which usually require allies or tremendous effort to route around. Up to +2 Aspect Levels, spread across multiple Technique levels with a moderate cost in XP. The drawback is imposed immediately; the bonus starts at +1 and must be improved with further purchases.

Very Heavy Drawback: A Technique that turns the Sharingan into generic eye lasers, and also causes each use to modestly but irrevocably injure your body and sanity. An Aspect that causes everyone you meet to hate you. A specialization Technique that limits a Wizard to effects of the Divination school. Drawbacks that are crushing and brutal problems which alter your life priorities. Up to +3 Aspect Levels spread across multiple Technique levels. The drawback is imposed immediately; the bonus starts at +1.5 and must be improved with further purchases.

-Exceptional Aspects and Techniques can break these rules in proportion to how costly they are.
-For example, Arcane Focus (Devotion) was stated in Discord to be worth 25 SC in a vacuum, had we not upgraded KoM to unlock it. Thus it can yield the benefits of a 'Very Heavy Drawback' Technique while only imposing the downsides of a 'Moderate Drawback' Technique, and also provide a major additional benefit.*

*For reference, my intended specialization bonuses under this proposal would quantify to:
Air - +3 Arcanum Levels for purposes of defeating or undoing the supernatural effects of others. Before the unraveling of the Logos, no magic may stand. (The Air bonus is the most powerful because its Drawback is the most limiting)
Fire - +2 Arcanum Levels. This bonus degrades by .1 for each spell cast and recovers by 1 per day. Burn briefly, but brightly. You may choose not to use the bonus for any given spell, preserving its current level. You may fully restore the bonus for 100 Will; this Will cost is not exacted until the end of the scene, but may only be invoked once per month.
Water - Reduce all Will costs by 25%. Be water, my friend. (The Water bonus would be 30%, but its Drawback is the least limiting in practice - being 'limited' to 'all spells of a transformative nature,' which includes all buffing and debuffing spells, is hardly a real issue)
Earth - So long as you spend at least 30 Will (or equivalent effort, if the Will mechanic is ever obsoleted) on magic-related endeavours each month, Arcanum also counts as a non-supernatural physical augmentation Aspect. This bonus becomes permanent after one year of such efforts. A magnificent physique, stronger than iron and eternal as marble. This offers an appropriate Synergy bonus to other physical Aspects like Eldritch.

But one can easily nerf or buff these to fit by adjusting the numbers.

---

All these numbers are calibrated with the understanding that, once you get to Level 8+, a +2 Aspect Level gap is an overwhelming difference comparable to a Cultivation Stage; if the intent is that another number is meant to stand for that gap then simply multiply all the +modifiers in the proposal above to compensate. For example, if +3 Aspect Levels is meant to represent such a gap, then multiply every modifier by 1.5. Heavy Drawbacks would give +3 Levels max, Very Heavies +4.5 Levels max, and so on.
 
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Honestly I have no idea what's going on with the mechanics in this quest but I trust people to buy their way to power and create big brain plans so I'm fine with any changes.
 
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