- Location
- Toronto, Ontario(occasionally)
Soo, Shroud VS Tyranids, who wins?
I'm leaning towards Shroud, but its hard to be sure.
I'm leaning towards Shroud, but its hard to be sure.
Shroud (Grey Goo game Shroud SI / Warhammer 40k)
Not enough info about how well the Shroud handles void combat. The nids don't do great, but if the Shroud is also pants then it could lose to bioplasma bombardment.
Though if it is backed up by pre-fall tech humans with men of stone opperated ships then the nids are fucked. The imperium can fight off nids in the void with half blind ships that use couriers with letters to send orders. A proper ship with good sensors and internal controls should wreck them.
- Location
- USA
The sensors that the Federation had were able to shoot backwards in time by several seconds. I think it was in a mechancus book? I mean a Imperum ship would be considered almost totally blind compared to a Federation ship.
I think that was one specific ship. It shot black holes from a spinal mount and when it missed it was easier to reverse time and fire again than reload.
Drich
Von Neumann Writing Machine
Fairly similar to pre-fall Age of Technology states.
So, basically non-existent large-scale. Primarily atheistic population, though the experiences of this particular planet have created a sizeable maltheist and antitheist populations.
- Location
- Toronto, Ontario(occasionally)
I don't think it actually helps with anything if they do, and would upset the Imperium even more, potentially losing a food source, so I'd think the shroud would try to discourage it.
jwolfe_beta
Semi Genre-Savvy Overlord
- Location
- Canada
Won't matter if they worship the Shroud or not. By the time the Horus Heresy is finished, any belief system that isn't Emperor worship is heavily frowned on. And later outright illegal and probably punishable by death and/or servitorization in multiple areas.
A few people worshiping isn't a problem. It's when millions do it then it gets the Warp churning.
Neruz
Rogue Spiderbanana
- Location
- The Land of Fire and Poison
The Speranza, an Ark Mechanicus class capital ship, notable for not only predating the Dark Age of Technology but also possessing such remarkable features as graviton beams; weapons that create black holes at the target location and a gun that rewinds time, causing its target to destroy itself as its past version tries to occupy the same space\time as its present version and the two collide in a violent explosion. Especially notable for having a Machine Spirit that is actually a full AI (or possibly even a shard of the Void Dragon itself) and in possession of a complete STC Database, the Mechanicus are just unaware of this because the AI couldn't give a shit about the Imperium and prefers to lay low and memory wipe anyone who interfaces with it and learns its secrets.
It is also the size of a continent and its personal gravity field is so massive that approaching it in anything less than a destroyer is suicide, its takeoff from the Forge World it was found on slagged the entire planet thanks to the tidal forces.
See those teeny tiny ships to the top-left? The one that is closest to the Speranza is a Battle-Barge. The Speranza is quite probably capable of punching out a Blackstone Fortress if it feels like it.
Last edited:
- Location
- Nice try
There was a event in cannon that a AI actually hack a Imperial ship, even go so far to hack the Servitors, the program lament the state humanity fallen.
There is a Men of iron or UR-27(?) that still alive in cannon, interesting enough it worship a religion similar to the Cult of Mars, although he state that has met the true Machine God and the tech-priest would be disappointed if ever met said god.
- Location
- Australia
AS far as Shroud Vs Tyranid, I'd say it depends on whether or not the Tyranids can digest the Shroud into something useful.
I've never dug that deep into Warhammer or goo lore but from what I understand both the Shroud and the Tyranids can adapt/evolve their forms and multiply themselves exponentially. With both those being equal the species with the greater resources to fuel that adaption and growth wins and while the Tyranids are primarily biological the Shroud has a far wider range of things it can eat.
In a fight, the Tyranids can eat the ecosystem and their own dead to help recoup their losses but the shroud would be able to eat absolutely everything to expand their own numbers faster
I've never dug that deep into Warhammer or goo lore but from what I understand both the Shroud and the Tyranids can adapt/evolve their forms and multiply themselves exponentially. With both those being equal the species with the greater resources to fuel that adaption and growth wins and while the Tyranids are primarily biological the Shroud has a far wider range of things it can eat.
In a fight, the Tyranids can eat the ecosystem and their own dead to help recoup their losses but the shroud would be able to eat absolutely everything to expand their own numbers faster
Hell, pre-fall humans could have probably held off the Nids for a damn long time, they would also be very likely to catch and eliminate Genestealer cults pretty quickly as well, Catacha was probably a research outpost looking into the genetics there initially which makes it even more impressive that they managed to survive.
Arimai
Curmudgeon
Quite the opposite actually. The Shroud was stated to be capable of completely hiding human souls. Drich does not because he has to eat and if he hides the humans completely in the Silence he will eventually starve.
Neruz
Rogue Spiderbanana
- Location
- The Land of Fire and Poison
Pre-fall humanity created the Men of Iron, who had ships that consumed space\time itself. They would have considered the Tyranids to be a particularly irritating invasive pest, but not actually a very dangerous one beyond their sheer mass of numbers.
In short, to Pre-fall humanity, the Tyranids would be a swarm of alien locusts.
Last edited:
- Location
- Africa
The long standing presence of gene stealers , the kraken bio titan on fenris and the environment of catachan imply that the tyranids may have visited the galaxy before the long night during the golden age of tech which would go along way to explaining why the banblade was listed as a militia light tank in its stc when its was found after all necessaty is the mother of invention which when put in to context would imply that daot mankind encountered a lot of scary stuff to justify all the those terrifying weaponry they developed
- Location
- Lost to the Depths of the Deep Web
I find this funny because thus is basicly the entire M.O for OTL Tyranids
- Location
- Toronto, Ontario(occasionally)
So, back to discussing the update:
If they're trying to genetically engineer stronger psykers, is there anything they could learn from the Primarch to help that process?
I mean on one hand he's probably the stongest psyker in their population and was specifically engineered to be so, on the other hand they don't have much to compare him to and his gene code does so many odd things that it'll be hard to isolate functions, on the gripping hand geneseed is supposed to enhance psykic ability so it might be designed to be obvious, on the passing hand, they don't know what geneseed is or how to use it so they can't see it in action.
Hard to tell.
If they're trying to genetically engineer stronger psykers, is there anything they could learn from the Primarch to help that process?
I mean on one hand he's probably the stongest psyker in their population and was specifically engineered to be so, on the other hand they don't have much to compare him to and his gene code does so many odd things that it'll be hard to isolate functions, on the gripping hand geneseed is supposed to enhance psykic ability so it might be designed to be obvious, on the passing hand, they don't know what geneseed is or how to use it so they can't see it in action.
Hard to tell.
Last edited:
- Location
- united kingdom
Primarchs are, as a rule, more mentally capable then your standard human being. Therefore it is very possible that the Primarch will contribute directly in the psykers gene engineering with his vastafter learning how important that project is to there escape.
TheLastOne
Person of impeccable tastes (for destruction)
Yeah. I'm not sure if that's the specific area he'll help in, but right now he's a symbol. He's not going to stay a symbol, he's going to become a luminary and champion of this colony, the best of the best. That's sort of what they do. What form that takes will be interesting to see.
- Location
- USA
I just thought of this but what happens when the Shoud runs into the Necrons and the C'tan?
- Location
- Namek;Digital World
Green Food. So they would be the veggies for the Shroud meat(warp) diet
- Location
- Toronto, Ontario(occasionally)
It depends on what exactly the shroud actually is. If it comes from a source as far outside of the C'tan's experience as the Warp, then some variants of shroud energy might be able to harm a C'tan.
Necrons on the other hand are a pain, because they don't stick around to be eaten when defeated, and because a lot of their systems are either too high energy to easily eat from, or difficult to get at/find the energy source. On the other hand they don't seem like they would adapt their weapons and tech easily, so if the Shroud finds a weakness it'd remain widely exploitable for quite some time.
- Location
- Africa
C'tan vs shroud would be a coin toss as we don't know enough about either to make a judgment , but the shroud going up against the necrons now that is dangerous . some context : the necrons fought the old ones a race comprised of psykes were each one was at least as strong as the emperor and many times older and more experienced and the won another example they then turned on the C'tan beings that are onto the material universe what the chaos gods are onto the warp and they won that too .
the point I am trying to make is that the necrons have a track record of taking on godly beings, god like beings ,and beings so powerful as to may as well be gods and wining so I give them pretty good odds on taking on the shroud
3.2
Drich
Von Neumann Writing Machine
3.2
+++
Singleton named the baby 'Timaeus'.
He was a powerful little tyke, having taken only two days to reach stage two in Symbiosis.
It would have been quicker, but the relationship between his body and soul had slowed it. Adaptation had been careful, and the Symbiont's growth slowed in response. Still, even so, it was far faster than any other.
Normally, I left when they hit stage two. Pulled my bodies away, on account of their Symbionts. Grown, the Symbionts provided all the protection and assistance that a host would need.
Normally. Not with this one. Knowing what he was, I felt that he was a little too important to just leave alone.
Not that he'd be alone, of course. Singleton was there for him, and given Singleton's close connection with the other members of the council, most of them would be there for him, too.
He was in good hands. I just felt like I should maintain a greater presence.
Heh. Not like a body was much of a 'greater presence'. Kid put out enough energy for an army, and here I was with just a single body.
Ah well.
Nothing to do but wait, now.
+++
Time passed quickly. Some things changed.
Some things didn't.
+++
My Silence grew strong. I wasn't willing to just play around, anymore. Not with that baby here. When the night came and no Daemons arrived, even at the peak of the Daemontide... People had been enthused.
Resourcing efforts started the very next day. Stone Drones, designed with the latest of anti-Warp technologies, were deployed en masse to the uninhabited and mountainous northern part of the island.
Three weeks later, Collector Drones had stripped it flat. In the place of mountains and hills was a silver sheet, the beginnings of a megafactory that would be the center of the future efforts for Project Moth.
By the end of the second month, Geomanipulator Devices had rent the ground asunder. The mantle had been breached, forcing the molten blood of the world to the surface, where scores of refining machines drank it in and spat out containers full of pure atomic elements. They were supported by banks of Nucleo-Synthesizers, taking in the useless materials and transforming even that into a steady supply of productive materials.
It wasn't Iron Technology. There were no great Mechnivores, with the strength to rip continents from planets and the power to absorb the raw data of aetherial space-time. It wasn't the most powerful of Federation Technology, either. No weapons systems that could rearrange local reality, flick things through the cracks in time to ensure a set of relational circumstances.
This planet had been a fairly normal world, all considered. This technology was civilian-scale, at most.
But it was intact. The ideas behind it were intact. The STC, though civilian-grade had never been corrupted, thanks to me.
And perhaps even more importantly, the people were scientifically inclined and intelligent enough to transform mere civilian technology into greater tools.
+++
It could have started earlier. Resources had never been the reason; neither in acquiring them or putting them to use. Technology had never been the reason; not in a civilization that spent its spare time developing ever more ways to say 'Fuck the Warp'. Even population hadn't really been a reason; autocubators could produce incredible amounts of Humans more or less on command.
The reason was will.
Because where would that leave them? Who would they be, if they did that?
Having lost everything, not knowing if anyone was out there, and still reeling from a pair of catastrophes, focus had turned inwards. Establishing the self, preserving millennia of morals, ethics, culture, and more aside.
And that was fair.
It wasn't enough to win. Or, rather, it wasn't enough to just win.
You had to win, and stay yourself. Winning, but in the process discarding what made them the people they are?
That was anathema.
So they didn't. They held what they valued close. Built the walls that kept them safe, guarded against the depravations of the outside, and in the meantime... Population grew naturally, not with abandon through their greatest technologies. Cultures stayed, were passed from parent to child. Ethics and morals were codified, carefully taught. Hell's invasion hadn't broken them, despite the evil unleashed. They refused to be twisted like that. They'd die before they broke.
It was a refusal that would kill anyone else.
Among all the people of the galaxy, their luxury was they had me. I was the foundation they could stand on, when they planted their feet and spat in Chaos' eye. I was the shield that kept them safe for long enough for them to build their armours to keep themselves safe. Truth was, if I were to vanish tomorrow, then things would get worse, but they would survive it.
I too would survive, if they were to suddenly vanish tomorrow. But much like them, things would get worse for me. Without them, without what they gave me, I wouldn't be much more than a parasite, wandering a dangerous galaxy in search of food. I'd find it, fighting for my life to do so, doubtlessly. Perhaps I could limit myself to just Chaos, devour nothing but the energies of the Warp, but that would leave me in the same position, afterwards.
Hungry.
And, perhaps even worse, alone. I'd been born a social creature, and I still was one, despite everything. I needed it less, now, yes, but I still needed companionship on some level. Lest...
I didn't want to know what time, hunger, and loneliness could twist me into.
That was a life without devoid of greater purpose. When the only reason to survive and grow was survival and growth itself. Utterly meaningless.
So I helped them. Protected them. And eventually, started Symbiosis with them. I gave them strength, they gave me food.
I gave them protection, they gave me direction. A reason to fight, a reason to refine my shapes further and further, a reason to exist for the sake of something more than existence itself.
They gave me people to care about.
We were much stronger together than we were alone. We could accomplish so much more.
The Warp Storm kept us physically contained, but that was a prison with rusted bars.
It was will that was the true chain.
But the moment we wanted to get out... The moment that chain broke?
The Warp Storm could not keep us forever.
+++
Singleton named the baby 'Timaeus'.
He was a powerful little tyke, having taken only two days to reach stage two in Symbiosis.
It would have been quicker, but the relationship between his body and soul had slowed it. Adaptation had been careful, and the Symbiont's growth slowed in response. Still, even so, it was far faster than any other.
Normally, I left when they hit stage two. Pulled my bodies away, on account of their Symbionts. Grown, the Symbionts provided all the protection and assistance that a host would need.
Normally. Not with this one. Knowing what he was, I felt that he was a little too important to just leave alone.
Not that he'd be alone, of course. Singleton was there for him, and given Singleton's close connection with the other members of the council, most of them would be there for him, too.
He was in good hands. I just felt like I should maintain a greater presence.
Heh. Not like a body was much of a 'greater presence'. Kid put out enough energy for an army, and here I was with just a single body.
Ah well.
Nothing to do but wait, now.
+++
Time passed quickly. Some things changed.
Some things didn't.
+++
My Silence grew strong. I wasn't willing to just play around, anymore. Not with that baby here. When the night came and no Daemons arrived, even at the peak of the Daemontide... People had been enthused.
Resourcing efforts started the very next day. Stone Drones, designed with the latest of anti-Warp technologies, were deployed en masse to the uninhabited and mountainous northern part of the island.
Three weeks later, Collector Drones had stripped it flat. In the place of mountains and hills was a silver sheet, the beginnings of a megafactory that would be the center of the future efforts for Project Moth.
By the end of the second month, Geomanipulator Devices had rent the ground asunder. The mantle had been breached, forcing the molten blood of the world to the surface, where scores of refining machines drank it in and spat out containers full of pure atomic elements. They were supported by banks of Nucleo-Synthesizers, taking in the useless materials and transforming even that into a steady supply of productive materials.
It wasn't Iron Technology. There were no great Mechnivores, with the strength to rip continents from planets and the power to absorb the raw data of aetherial space-time. It wasn't the most powerful of Federation Technology, either. No weapons systems that could rearrange local reality, flick things through the cracks in time to ensure a set of relational circumstances.
This planet had been a fairly normal world, all considered. This technology was civilian-scale, at most.
But it was intact. The ideas behind it were intact. The STC, though civilian-grade had never been corrupted, thanks to me.
And perhaps even more importantly, the people were scientifically inclined and intelligent enough to transform mere civilian technology into greater tools.
+++
It could have started earlier. Resources had never been the reason; neither in acquiring them or putting them to use. Technology had never been the reason; not in a civilization that spent its spare time developing ever more ways to say 'Fuck the Warp'. Even population hadn't really been a reason; autocubators could produce incredible amounts of Humans more or less on command.
The reason was will.
Because where would that leave them? Who would they be, if they did that?
Having lost everything, not knowing if anyone was out there, and still reeling from a pair of catastrophes, focus had turned inwards. Establishing the self, preserving millennia of morals, ethics, culture, and more aside.
And that was fair.
It wasn't enough to win. Or, rather, it wasn't enough to just win.
You had to win, and stay yourself. Winning, but in the process discarding what made them the people they are?
That was anathema.
So they didn't. They held what they valued close. Built the walls that kept them safe, guarded against the depravations of the outside, and in the meantime... Population grew naturally, not with abandon through their greatest technologies. Cultures stayed, were passed from parent to child. Ethics and morals were codified, carefully taught. Hell's invasion hadn't broken them, despite the evil unleashed. They refused to be twisted like that. They'd die before they broke.
It was a refusal that would kill anyone else.
Among all the people of the galaxy, their luxury was they had me. I was the foundation they could stand on, when they planted their feet and spat in Chaos' eye. I was the shield that kept them safe for long enough for them to build their armours to keep themselves safe. Truth was, if I were to vanish tomorrow, then things would get worse, but they would survive it.
I too would survive, if they were to suddenly vanish tomorrow. But much like them, things would get worse for me. Without them, without what they gave me, I wouldn't be much more than a parasite, wandering a dangerous galaxy in search of food. I'd find it, fighting for my life to do so, doubtlessly. Perhaps I could limit myself to just Chaos, devour nothing but the energies of the Warp, but that would leave me in the same position, afterwards.
Hungry.
And, perhaps even worse, alone. I'd been born a social creature, and I still was one, despite everything. I needed it less, now, yes, but I still needed companionship on some level. Lest...
I didn't want to know what time, hunger, and loneliness could twist me into.
That was a life without devoid of greater purpose. When the only reason to survive and grow was survival and growth itself. Utterly meaningless.
So I helped them. Protected them. And eventually, started Symbiosis with them. I gave them strength, they gave me food.
I gave them protection, they gave me direction. A reason to fight, a reason to refine my shapes further and further, a reason to exist for the sake of something more than existence itself.
They gave me people to care about.
We were much stronger together than we were alone. We could accomplish so much more.
The Warp Storm kept us physically contained, but that was a prison with rusted bars.
It was will that was the true chain.
But the moment we wanted to get out... The moment that chain broke?
The Warp Storm could not keep us forever.