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Palace of Greed, El Dorado (Library of Ruina)

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[X] Plan: The Best Defense.

I was waffling on voting for the original version of this one, but I'd rather have a permanent low numbers boost over a consumable. You can always upgrade things later. Something to increase Strength, Speed, Reaction Time or Toughness by even a small amount is a permanent edge, and a) doesn't need runoff votes later to decide when to use it and b) contributes over the course of the entire next mission. The more we do, the more we get paid and if it pays ITSELF off then we can get MORE augs (or upgrade it) after payday and our payments.
 
Bahumat said:
I was waffling on voting for the original version of this one, but I'd rather have a permanent low numbers boost over a consumable. You can always upgrade things later. Something to increase Strength, Speed, Reaction Time or Toughness by even a small amount is a permanent edge, and a) doesn't need runoff votes later to decide when to use it and b) contributes over the course of the entire next mission. The more we do, the more we get paid and if it pays ITSELF off then we can get MORE augs (or upgrade it) after payday and our payments.
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Yeah. That'd be true if we weren't going to battle with something way out of our league. We don't know what we can get with our budget because we never looked into it, so it's not really reasonable to say that a passive aug would have more utility in the upcoming fight. We're not at the level where we can definitely win the next fight, so it'd probably be more prudent to get something that'd better guarantee at least survival.
 
Crow said:
Dont recall that. And that seems greatly unwise. See all the first part of Ruina and various books talking at lenght about it.

What even is the rationale for not getting augmentations?
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Being piss poor or a naive idealist like Finn where "hard work will surely triumph!"

If somehow they do go over, that means some corp must have experimented on them during their sleep
 
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Crow said:
Dont recall that. And that seems greatly unwise. See all the first part of Ruina and various books talking at lenght about it.

What even is the rationale for not getting augmentations?
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It was this section:
SoothingCoffee said:
[Instinct Check: Hard. Pass.]

Her eye brushes over you, quick as lightning. "… I'll keep that in mind," she nods, frowning.

Prosthetics, and cybernetics, huh. With a groan, you stiffly lean back to your sofa. Just gotta sign the report, and you're done. You glance up to the clock, just a few minutes away from lunch, and then down to your arms, before closing your eyes. Eventually, you're well fucking aware, that this shit is inevitable. Up to a certain point, you'll hit a wall, and you gonna have to replace bits, and pieces of yourself, and add bits and pieces of other shit into yourself. Implants. Tattoos. Some less, and some more than others.

It feels wrong.

[Endurance Check: Easy. Pass.]

This body has never failed you before.

And to replace it...

Feels like you're the one who's failing it instead.

"I know what you're thinking, Lily," you crack an eye open. There's a look in his eyes – something about his smile. "Lotsa people do, really," he continues. "But there's nothing wrong 'bout augmentations – well, guess willingly lop your arm off for a fake one's a bit extreme," he admits, chuckling. "And I'm not saying you should be like those idiots replacin' their entire body – and on that note, you shouldn't. But flesh is just flesh, and flesh alone won't cut it. Believe me. And between you, an' me," he leans in, smirking, 'whispering'. "Even our future-captain is filled to the gills with implants," he breaks away leaning back. "So there's nothing wrong about it."

You frown. "Wasn't thinking about that," you grumble.

"Well," Mori shrugs, smiling softly. "Just keep it in mind, okay? Out there, you don't want your body to fail you."

[Empathy Check: Easy. Pass.]

Like it did him, the words go unsaid.

[Endurance Check: Very Hard. Fail.]

Waves of pain assault you from every side and corner of your body. In your chest, something lodges itself, and you suddenly can't breathe. Molten steel goes through your body, head to toe, in seconds, and you're left reeling – vomit forming in the back of your throat, swallowed immediately; the cuts, and wounds, even the scars riddling your body throb, swelling. A bead of sweat trails down from your temple, and a shiver runs its finger down your spine.

"You're bleeding."

At Kai's word, you open your eyes, glancing down – and grimace. Blood seeps through the bandage. Your wounds just reopened.

"It'll stop," you grunt, grumbling under your breath.

Flesh is flesh. It's going to rot away –

[Endurance Check: Very Hard. Pass.]

—and metal is metal. It's going to rust as well.

They're both gonna fail you, in time.

So which one would you rather fail you insteadss?

It's damn obvious, right?
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That said considering Lily is in fact a freak of nature I do want to see how far her natural Endurance will take her. Perhaps that's not the smartest move but its the one I find most interesting.
 
It was she more resistant to the idea, not resolved.

SoothingCoffee said:
Prosthetics, and cybernetics, huh. With a groan, you stiffly lean back to your sofa. Just gotta sign the report, and you're done. You glance up to the clock, just a few minutes away from lunch, and then down to your arms, before closing your eyes. Eventually, you're well fucking aware, that this shit is inevitable. Up to a certain point, you'll hit a wall, and you gonna have to replace bits, and pieces of yourself, and add bits and pieces of other shit into yourself. Implants. Tattoos. Some less, and some more than others.

It feels wrong.

[Endurance Check: Easy. Pass.]

This body has never failed you before.

And to replace it...

Feels like you're the one who's failing it instead.

"I know what you're thinking, Lily," you crack an eye open. There's a look in his eyes – something about his smile. "Lotsa people do, really," he continues. "But there's nothing wrong 'bout augmentations – well, guess willingly lop your arm off for a fake one's a bit extreme," he admits, chuckling. "And I'm not saying you should be like those idiots replacin' their entire body – and on that note, you shouldn't. But flesh is just flesh, and flesh alone won't cut it. Believe me. And between you, an' me," he leans in, smirking, 'whispering'. "Even our future-captain is filled to the gills with implants," he breaks away leaning back. "So there's nothing wrong about it."

You frown. "Wasn't thinking about that," you grumble.

"Well," Mori shrugs, smiling softly. "Just keep it in mind, okay? Out there, you don't want your body to fail you."

[Empathy Check: Easy. Pass.]

Like it did him, the words go unsaid.

[Endurance Check: Very Hard. Fail.]

Waves of pain assault you from every side and corner of your body. In your chest, something lodges itself, and you suddenly can't breathe. Molten steel goes through your body, head to toe, in seconds, and you're left reeling – vomit forming in the back of your throat, swallowed immediately; the cuts, and wounds, even the scars riddling your body throb, swelling. A bead of sweat trails down from your temple, and a shiver runs its finger down your spine.

"You're bleeding."

At Kai's word, you open your eyes, glancing down – and grimace. Blood seeps through the bandage. Your wounds just reopened.

"It'll stop," you grunt, grumbling under your breath.

Flesh is flesh. It's going to rot away –

[Endurance Check: Very Hard. Pass.]

—and metal is metal. It's going to rust as well.

They're both gonna fail you, in time.

So which one would you rather fail you insteadss?

It's damn obvious, right?

Grumbling, you try to catch Mori's gaze, away from your blood-seeped bandages. He looks like he's gonna fucking jump you.

"I'll keep it in mind."
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Long quote aside, she knows her body will fail her but augments will too. It feels like she is grappling with her own pride about her body and understanding augments are not infallible.

Edit: Quote got Ninja'd.
 
Thebigpieman said:
It was this section:

That said considering Lily is in fact a freak of nature I do want to see how far her natural Endurance will take her. Perhaps that's not the smartest move but its the one I find most interesting.
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Not taking what advantages can be taken would invite disaster. and when the wall inevitably stops Lily in her tracks regret would do a hit on the sanity, leaving aside the other consequences.

Since its the most dangerous business, where Lily jumps headfirst into danger as a Cyberpunk bodyguard. Not having the Cyber leaves you as just a punk. The setting is ruthless if you're naive about it. If you look at the top Fixers most of them have special traits and skill and will....and all the best equipment and augmentations money can buy. Even those money dont, because it also involves favors and reputation to get the very best of the best gear. But you get my point.

And sure Lily may have a revive but if everything else she cares about dies then thats also a big consequence. Mostly I consider augs as a boost to help one's own capabilities.
 
A question for the thread, what upgrades/augmentations are we looking to give Lily as her spending money increases in the future?

Something like a gap-closer to avoid being picked on from range? A Knock (the debuff that gives -1 to enemy rolls) effect on her clothes that affects the enemy when they hit her? Something that protects her Sanity since that stat is currently the lowest?
 
Islanderninja said:
A question for the thread, what upgrades/augmentations are we looking to give Lily as her spending money increases in the future?

Something like a gap-closer to avoid being picked on from range? A Knock (the debuff that gives -1 to enemy rolls) effect on her clothes that affects the enemy when they hit her? Something that protects her Sanity since that stat is currently the lowest?
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There's mentions of Grade 9 and 8 Fixers taking augs that let them blitz down a street in an eyeblink. Or improved muscles to lift impossible weapons, reaction enhancers, Cane Office has better organs and enhancements to use Charge attacks including defilbrators if their hearts stops. Liu have some stones that help preserve their sanity.

Smoke builds include enhancer drugs that make you hit like a truck while at the same time hurting the enemy. Liu uses equipment to wield flames with their attacks and not be hurt. etc.

Personally I like the lifesteal gimmick so if we increase our speed its gonna work even better.
 
Crow said:
Personally I like the lifesteal gimmick so if we increase our speed its gonna work even better.
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I'd guess a strength enhancer or smoke-like would be best for our current stuff? I imagine speed, other than...speed itself, would improve dodging in combat, but we don't really use that. Enhanced strength may boost melee, which is both attacking, so killing and lifestealing faster, and "defense" due to clashing with the enemy.
 
I think the issue with Lily and augments comes more from character gen, or at least makes it more understandable. Her favored stat is Fortitude and has two of the three skills talented to boot. The one thing that let her get to where she is now, that let her survive, is her body. Not her ability with others, not her sense of self, and especially not her mind. It was her body that roared in defiance of the odds and gave her the shot to be more. It has never let her down so why would she let it down? That feeling is why she is somewhat apprehensive about anything replacing any piece of her body because she thinks it might count as admitting that she was not good enough.

It is not a strong feeling though, more like idle musing on the subject. I consider it a good example of Disco Elysium's skills, in which they are flaws as anything else. Higher Endurance seems to be shaping Lily to be more prideful about being able to take a hit, possibly to her future detriment. However, it is what allows her to take hits that would down anybody else and gives her the wisdom that a fancy toy is not all there is to a person. Look at L corp agents using Ego versus Kali/Gebura using Ego for a live example of that.

It is good ramifications from character gen if you consider that someone that favors Prudence, or with a talent in Technology, might be all for stuffing them selfs with shiny things. Cyberpunk magpies, I have not thought about that one before.
 
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Crow said:
There's mentions of Grade 9 and 8 Fixers taking augs that let them blitz down a street in an eyeblink. Or improved muscles to lift impossible weapons, reaction enhancers, Cane Office has better organs and enhancements to use Charge attacks including defilbrators if their hearts stops. Liu have some stones that help preserve their sanity.

Smoke builds include enhancer drugs that make you hit like a truck while at the same time hurting the enemy. Liu uses equipment to wield flames with their attacks and not be hurt. etc.

Personally I like the lifesteal gimmick so if we increase our speed its gonna work even better.
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I mean.

Why is it that we haven't seen any of that shit from Grade 8 or 9 Fixers yet then if it's basically mandatory to compete?

More importantly, how do they afford this shit?

Let's be fair, 'Some form of boosts' are mandatory, nobody dismisses that. That being said, they come in a lot of forms, and only some of them involve physical surgery or implants. Case in point, the only difference between Roland as a washed up Grade 9 Fixer and the fucking Black Silence is whether he has his gloves with him or not. Given that, I'm pretty sure Lily's drip qualifies as a fairly beefy tool in itself.

Actually, on that topic, @SoothingCoffee , when we're referring to 'Augs', are we just straight up looking at surgery or implants and all that, or is that just a catchall for "How much money is your drip worth and is it enough to operate at the level you're at?" Because that would absolutely be worth ridicule if Mister Victim thought he could get by with a mass produced uniform and hand-forged sword.

Because if that's the case, we've got roughly 12 mil invested into Lily's swag between her uniform and the Knockbar, which is damned respectable for a Grade Eight Fixer who's only been on the job for a month now. Mao is a Fifth Grade and her bigass rifle's just worth 20 mil.
 
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I mean, augments are extremely common?

I don't know if this quest has a difference, but even low level Grade 8 Fixer like Eri has them, and even people like Stray Dogs use augment tattoos. It just doesn't look obvious.

Eri said:
"Just look at me, though! It took a teensy little procedure for me to lift this humongous weapon with one hand. This is the kind of power you can get, you see?"
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Valkhir said:
I mean, augments are extremely common?

I don't know if this quest has a difference, but even low level Grade 8 Fixer like Eri has them, and even people like Stray Dogs use augment tattoos. It just doesn't look obvious.
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I'm not talking about the game, I'm talking about this story. Logically, if this shit was cheap and easy to get, we'd see Lily constantly getting speedblitzed and brute forced down.

Instead, she's pretty consistently been a dominating force in battle.
 
Alectai said:
the only difference between Roland as a washed up Grade 9 Fixer and the fucking Black Silence is whether he has his gloves with him or not.
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The only difference being that Roland was sandbagging.

You know? playing the jester and playing up the "Uh im just a grade 9 really. totes." as per Iori's suggestion. Else he talks at lenght how everyone gets augs.

The gloves are just him stopping fucking around and serious face on. their strict functionality is as a hammerspace for his and his wife's weapons and the dampening effect.
 
Alectai said:
I'm not talking about the game, I'm talking about this story. Logically, if this shit was cheap and easy to get, we'd see Lily constantly getting speedblitzed and brute forced down.

Instead, she's pretty consistently been a dominating force in battle.
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I am...pretty sure that this was called out? That she was somehow just getting stronger for seemingly no reason without augments, when raising the corresponding stats.

I think in the previous Fortitude stat description.

Edit: Lily also does shit like tearing a person in half with a blunt crowbar. And this wasn't a function of the knockbar. Tearing a person in half casually like that IS pretty superhuman.
 
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Alectai said:
I'm not talking about the game, I'm talking about this story. Logically, if this shit was cheap and easy to get, we'd see Lily constantly getting speedblitzed and brute forced down.

Instead, she's pretty consistently been a dominating force in battle.
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Like. Dominating rats ? The ones so poor they dont get the augs? thanks to her Office equipment?

And how it was said Mao's up to the gills with said Augs?
 
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