We MUST take one of the two actions above.

Notice that our position in the meetings has gotten worse than it was because we didn't take the action last turn to try and solidify it. Now we have to take it, or invite them to the capital.

Otherwise we won't be involved in the decisions at all.

We don't need to take one of those highly unlikely to succeed actions. It doesn't matter if we lose our official position as we got enough ability and unofficial clout to get things done. For example, by doing Appraisals we get ourselves into a position of influence with the Not!Chinese and if Potions for Sale goes well again, we might be able to get more sway with the Not!Chinese. Frankly, Xin Jin has dealt with us enough times personally and been impressed by us enough that I strongly doubt he will stop dealing with us just because the nobles take away our official position.

I also feel that the importance of having official secular position in this quest is often overrated. We have never used those to get stuff done and have only used them to get things done easier. When it comes to actually getting things done, we have always relied on our own ability and power to achieve our goals with our main authority to get things done coming from spiritual backing rather than backing from the local authorities.
 
I sttill have no idea whether passing the DC is a success or just not making things worse, cause it seems like the results are just more problems or the prior problemmakers keep doing the same thing.
 
I sttill have no idea whether passing the DC is a success or just not making things worse, cause it seems like the results are just more problems or the prior problemmakers keep doing the same thing.

It varies depending on the action in question. Some actions might be furthering something while others might just be damage control or trying to hold our own in face of enemy action.
 
I sttill have no idea whether passing the DC is a success or just not making things worse, cause it seems like the results are just more problems or the prior problemmakers keep doing the same thing.
Depends on the faction in question - convincing factions is never quite as easy as convincing one singular person to do something, after all.

That said, I'll throw this one out there as a freebie: even failing By A Hair will lower the DC going forward, since it at least makes you a player for your continued position as a representative - independent of whatever other authority you claim, after all.
 
[X] Plan Flip The Table
-[X] [Oil] Yes (1 Cash Flow immediately)
-[X] [Martial] Who's Who
-[X] [Diplomacy + Free] An Invitation
-[X] [Free] The Church
-[X] [Intrigue] Networking Opportunities
-[X] [Free] Some Long Delayed Questions

-[X] [Learning] Potions For Sale
-[X] [Stewardship] Appraisals
--[X] Use Potion of Clarity on Appraisals
-[X] [Piety] The Spirits Aboard the Ship
--[X] Use Incense Candles on Spirits Aboard the Ship


Okay, let's face the truth, we've been losing ever since we came to this city. Why? Because we had the Shi Anh show up and didn't have enough actions to deal with both them and the traitors, resulting in us getting behind in diplomacy actions. There are too many factions and not enough actions so we are behind the eight ball.

It's time to flip the table, because if we keep playing this hand we are going to lose.

So we take the Invitation action, and we spend a Major boon on it. That puts us at 28. which will pass the DC of 28. (20 Base, +2 Vestments +3 Major Boon, +3 Free Action).

That will get the Shi Ahn to the Capital instead of here where we have advantages (The Street) and formal authority, plus it allows us to delay another turn on the Mandates issue, which otherwise will probably be decided without our input.

Okay, so then we take other actions based around this. First we learn who the new nobles are (this is important set piece information because they are going to follow us to the capital), we take an action to try and get the local church onside so that when the church delegation gets here they hear favorable things and so when they turn around to head back to the capital they are already willing to work with us. We also take an action to set up a spy network in Cilli so that we have some eyes on the ship while entertaining the Shi Anh deligation in the capital, just in case they plan anything sneaky. Plus it will help if we manage to get back to the original goal of finding traitors. Meanwhile we also ask questions of all the nobles here, hopefully get some leads on where to head next after dealing with the Shi Anh, (but it's not essential to pass, so no spending boons on it).

We do Potions for Sale and Appraisals to get money, and keep the merchant houses happy and thus giving the other nobles a bone to compensate for the Mandate issue being taken away to the capital to be decided there.

And we also redo the Spirits Aboard the Ship to gain the actual knowledge we need - notice that with the Incense candles it should auto pass.

This gets us away from the situation where the nobles are going to shove us out of the delegation (which will happen even if we do Appraisals, there is nothing in that action which says we will still be part of the delegation, that's wishful thinking), and allows us to move the debate to the capital where we know the actors and don't have to spend as much effort on Diplomacy (as in we only need to spend three actions a turn on it instead of the six actions we've needed when in Cilli).

People need to pay attention to what the actions actually say and then read between the lines. It's pretty obvious the GM is throwing us a lifeline in this Invitation action, we ought to take it.
 
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[X] Plan Six-Eyes, All Seeing. Eight-Legs, Connecting Webs. (Alt Title: The Auction of the Decade)

So we take the Invitation action, and we spend a Major boon on it. That puts us at 28. which will pass the DC of 28. (20 Base, +2 Vestments +3 Major Boon, +3 Free Action).

Incorrect maths. Enchanting Vestments only applies up to 25 so it would count if you go over that. You would only get up to DC26 using the Major Boon and I refuse to support any plan that uses a Major Boon to only get an +1 bonus instead of the +3 that it can provide.
Enchanting Vestments
These vestments appear to carry a slight suggestion that the person wearing it carries themselves with a little more grace, a little more poise, a little more everything to make the other person feel as though the wearer is a good person. +2 Diplomacy up to a Base Stat of 25.
Minor boons and cooperation are considered Base Stat for the purposes of item bonuses, so, for example, combining Intrigue of 22, Cooperation of 3, and a minor boon would result in Tools of the Trade acting on a Base Stat of 26.
 
Incorrect maths. Enchanting Vestments only applies up to 25 so it would count if you go over that. You would only get up to DC26 using the Major Boon and I refuse to support any plan that uses a Major Boon to only get an +1 bonus instead of the +3 that it can provide.

I thought Free Action bonus applied after other bonuses? Vestments and Major Boon are only 25, so the limitation should not apply.

Did I get that wrong?

@huhYeahGoodPoint

If that is the case I'll switch out the Major Boon for a Minor Boon.
 
I thought Free Action bonus applied after other bonuses? Vestments and Major Boon are only 25, so the limitation should not apply.

Cooperation is what we call using a Free Action to boost another action. As you can see in the quoted below bit, using a Boon and a Free Action both get counted before our item bonuses.
Minor boons and cooperation are considered Base Stat for the purposes of item bonuses, so, for example, combining Intrigue of 22, Cooperation of 3, and a minor boon would result in Tools of the Trade acting on a Base Stat of 26.
If that is the case I'll switch out the Major Boon for a Minor Boon.

Minor Boon wouldn't give any bonus. The Enchanted Vestments will nullify up to +2 from both a Minor Boon and a Major Boon, leaving the former giving an effective no bonus while the latter would only give an effective +1 bonus.

You could switch out the Free Action for the Major Boon to get to 25, but it is really hard for us to get our diplomacy above 25 even as we can easily get it up to 25. The only way we can get it above 25 is to use a Major Boon like how you are currently using it.

Until we can upgrade the limit of the Enchanted Vestments bonus, we got something of a soft cap on our Diplomacy stat.
 
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So... what are the chances of failure with 26 vs DC of 28?
I'm not fundamentally opposed to the idea of using a Major Boon that way, when it's for something game-changing (like this would be) but chance of success or failure kind of matters on this one.
 
Cooperation is what we call using a Free Action to boost another action. As you can see in the quoted below bit, using a Boon and a Free Action both get counted before our item bonuses.



Minor Boon wouldn't give any bonus. The Enchanted Vestments will nullify up to +2 from both a Minor Boon and a Major Boon, leaving the former giving an effective no bonus while the latter would only give an effective +1 bonus.

You could switch out the Free Action for the Major Boon to get to 25, but it is really hard for us to get our diplomacy above 25 even as we can easily get it up to 25. The only way we can get it above 25 is to use a Major Boon like how you are currently using it.

Until we can upgrade the limit of the Enchanted Vestments bonus, we got something of a soft cap on our Diplomacy stat.

I don't understand this math.

Our base stat is 20, we add a Major Boon to that and we get 23. Then Vestments add +2 to make it 25. Adding a Free Action I thought would make it 28, but you're saying it would make it 26?

I guess because the Free action brings it to 26 , and only then are the Vestments applied?

Well then I guess we can go with the 25, which means we need to roll a 30 or better.

Better than the alternative which is a DC of 30 and means we'd need to roll a 50 or better.

And better than not taking either of the options, because if we do that, the Mandate exchange rate will be set without us, probably by the traitors, which means they get the Mandates and then use it to justify their treason.
 
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Our base stat is 20, we add a Major Boon to that and we get 23. Then Vestments add +2 to make it 25. Adding a Free Action I thought would make it 28, but you're saying it would make it 26?

I guess because the Free action brings it to 26 , and only then are the Vestments applied?

The Free Action/Cooperation and the Boon get applied before any item bonuses. Therefore we would have a Diplo stat of 26 when the Enchanted Vestments are applied and since we would have passed its limit of 25, they wouldn't give us any bonus.

Basically the possible combinations for our Diplo stay are the following:
20 (Agueda) +2 (Enchanted Vestments) = 22.
20 (Agueda) +3 (Free Action) +2 (Enchanted Vestments) = 25
20 (Agueda) +3 (Major Boon) +2 (Enchanted Vestments) = 25
20 (Agueda) +3 (Free Action) +3 (Major Boon) = 26

The first would require a roll of 60+ to pass An Invitation, the middle two would require a roll of 30+ and the bottom one would require a roll of 20+.
 
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I thought Free Action bonus applied after other bonuses? Vestments and Major Boon are only 25, so the limitation should not apply.

Did I get that wrong?

@huhYeahGoodPoint

If that is the case I'll switch out the Major Boon for a Minor Boon.
I don't understand this math.

Our base stat is 20, we add a Major Boon to that and we get 23. Then Vestments add +2 to make it 25. Adding a Free Action I thought would make it 28, but you're saying it would make it 26?

I guess because the Free action brings it to 26 , and only then are the Vestments applied?

Well then I guess we can go with the 25, which means we need to roll a 30 or better.

Better than the alternative which is a DC of 30 and means we'd need to roll a 50 or better.

And better than not taking either of the options, because if we do that, the Mandate exchange rate will be set without us, probably by the traitors, which means they get the Mandates and then use it to justify their treason.
Bingo.

Diplomacy: 20 (Base Stat) + 3 (Cooperation) + 3 (Major Boon) = 26

Since you've immediately hit 26 right off the bat, Enchanting Vestments doesn't help you past that point.
So... what are the chances of failure with 26 vs DC of 28?
I'm not fundamentally opposed to the idea of using a Major Boon that way, when it's for something game-changing (like this would be) but chance of success or failure kind of matters on this one.
20%. (strictly speaking, I think it's actually 19%, but who's counting?)
 
THE WEB OF TREASON MONTH 16 ROLL CALL
By a single vote, Plan Flip the Table wins, 9-8.

Roll me 15d100s.

Martial
Who's Who

DC: 20. Roll: 17 + 2 + 4.6.

Cost: 0 Budget.

Diplomacy
An Invitation

DC: 28. Roll: 20 + 3 + 2.

Cost: 10 Budget.

Diplomacy
The Church

DC: 22. Roll: 20 + 2.

Intrigue
Networking Opportunities

DC: 20. Roll: 22 + 2.

Cost: 2 Budget.

Intrigue
Some Long Delayed Questions

DC: 27. Roll: 22 + 2.

Cost: 8 Budget.

Learning
Potions For Sale

DC: Scaling. Roll: 23 + 5.8.

Gain: Profitable, Scaling.

Stewardship
Appraisals

DC: Scaling Low. Roll: 24 + 4.6 + 1.4 + 3 (Contingent).

Gain: Lucrative, Scaling

Piety
The Spirits Aboard the Ship

DC: 24. Roll: 23 + 2 + 2.

Cost: 4 Budget.

Event Chain 2A
Event Chain 2B
Event Chain 2C
Event Chain 2D

Event Chain 5A
Event Chain 5B

Random Event Roll
 
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