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Hmmph... this junior is a good seed [Cultivation Management Quest]

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    • occipitallobe said:
    Manuel gnashed his teeth in frustration.

    The problem with carefully preplanned notions and ideas when suffusing oneself with the pure essence of contempt was that once you left the script, even partially, the whole thing fell down, and one reverted to more crude refusals. He'd ended up simply refusing several times in a humiliatingly obvious way. He personally wasn't obsessed with the notion of face, but it impacted how people saw you. How they treated you. Lady Jiao had evidently felt she had gotten the better end of the exchange, even if he had been forced to disagree with her offer entirely. He'd ended up making a small concession as well, allowing Jiao doctors to move along the Scorpion road for ten years tariff-free.

    Not the most costly of mistakes, but it made him look weak in front of an Early Nascent Soul, and that would embolden Jingshen Clan to take liberties. Contempt would work for combat, he thought. For diplomacy, it was probably unworkable.
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    So, that appears to be a disaster. In summary, we came out even worse then if we'd just straight-out refused?
     
    I think building the scorpion road and investing in disciple growth are key. I am open to maybe doing some lecturing too?
     
    [ ] Plan Rebuild and Grow
    -[ ] Intrigue(Devil Bee Sect)
    -[ ] Lecturing
    -[ ] Invest in Colonisation (10 Wealth)
    "Archegetes, our new lands hold great potential, yet we must realise it. Let us colonise en masse, and spend lavishly to raise new cultivators and to encourage mortals to have more children. If we can populate them sufficiently, they can be well-fortified and we will be difficult to dislodge in a hundred years."'
    -[ ] Build up the Scorpion Road (5 Wealth)
    "Archegetes, with another Demon-Annihilating War beginning, we are well off to make friends with the Righteous powers who do not overmuch hate us. Making the Scorpion Road more accessible will increase our income in future, but will also allow us to facilitate trade with a grateful Strength Purity Sect. Given they are the ones who must approve any Righteous expedition through the mountains against us, their goodwill is most valuable.'
    -[ ] Regain Full Strength (6 Wealth)
    "Archegetes, regaining our full strength before the Hundred-Year Trials is paramount to avoiding decline. For a modest investment, I can ensure we reach that goal over the next 40 years, rather than a mere 90% of it.

    Ok so, spy on the bees, I dont want to be caught unaware is they attack, though I'm open to training or forting up again
    Lecture-for one big boost for all the people were recruiting and for the coming trials
    I want to buy colonization and regain strength since I think they work well together with lecture to make us stronger
    Scorpion road because it makes money, and with core cultivators coming through for healing, we're going to get more traffic anyways
     
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    That Golden Eye Array is definitely tempting, especially since the situation with the Bee sect seem to be favoring us with that assassination they just got.
     
    Gore17 said:
    So, that appears to be a disaster. In summary, we came out even worse then if we'd just straight-out refused?
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    That does happen sometimes. You go into a negotiation and get hedged in, and somehow end up worse off than your initial BATNA. Manuel just negotiated disastrously - he gets some nice boosts to these rolls (especially relative to Lady Jiao), but sometimes you just lose at things.
     
    occipitallobe said:
    Philoctetes makes more sense to me. Giving weak Clan cultivators the ability to use Poison Qi en masse seems like the sort of thing the Clan might see as useful to teach.
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    Thanks for the Feedback! I will go for Philoctetes as the formation developed! Hmm, i can probably work at adding better poison to it when improving it to a higher tier. @Katana1515 @LordEdric It looks like the time for Jolly Cooperation is upon us!

    For this turn, i would go for

    [ ] Fortifying Earth Bounty City Spirit Mine

    To secure our only source of wealth besides our road. I would have went for Training Soldiers but was worried the buff would wear off before the invasion

    [ ] Lecturing

    To better prepare our current crop since the Trials are coming

    Purchases wise, i would go for

    [ ] Build up the Scorpion Road (5 Wealth) Less for the wealth and more for the Goodwill. Don't think we have any direct grudge against the Strength Purity sect, so being able to get them to appreciate us would be very useful in cutting down the amount of foes we face + lowers the chance of an attack when we're down.

    [ ] Regain Full Strength (6 Wealth) Syngerizes with lecture and allows to be fully ready for the Trials.

    Not going for any of the other purchases now because while useful, they seem offensively orientated. And i rather focus on building up on defenses.
     
    I like the eye. Knowing what the people in the north is up to sounds useful.

    How did the Eye array get destroyed in the first place?
     
    Mochinator said:
    Thanks for the Feedback! I will go for Philoctetes as the formation developed! Hmm, i can probably work at adding better poison to it when improving it to a higher tier. @Katana1515 @LordEdric It looks like the time for Jolly Cooperation is upon us!

    For this turn, i would go for

    [ ] Fortifying Earth Bounty City Spirit Mine

    To secure our only source of wealth besides our road. I would have went for Training Soldiers but was worried the buff would wear off before the invasion

    [ ] Lecturing

    To better prepare our current crop since the Trials are coming

    Purchases wise, i would go for

    [ ] Build up the Scorpion Road (5 Wealth) Less for the wealth and more for the Goodwill. Don't think we have any direct grudge against the Strength Purity sect, so being able to get them to appreciate us would be very useful in cutting down the amount of foes we face + lowers the chance of an attack when we're down.

    [ ] Regain Full Strength (6 Wealth) Syngerizes with lecture and allows to be fully ready for the Trials.

    Not going for any of the other purchases now because while useful, they seem offensively orientated. And i rather focus on building up on defenses.
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    Give me a few hours, I'm going to write short Omake about starting my bombing puppet project, you can organize it into a usable formation, Katana can provide her scary powerful poisons @Katana1515

    also, no colonization? its a big cost, but its going to be a big gain soon
     
    Nordlending said:
    I like the eye. Knowing what the people in the north is up to sounds useful.

    How did the Eye array get destroyed in the first place?
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    The original Eye was in old Clan territory in the mountains - when the Clan was driven out it was ruined. There hasn't been a huge surplus of funds (especially when the Clan was previously maintaining two Nascent Souls, which meant raiding others for wealth and enforcing tributes), so it was never seriously reconsidered as a rebuilding candidate until now.
     
    @occipitalllobe is it only one living Good Seed per poster at a time. Or one ever? Mine is dead and I've been thinking about making a replacement
     
    []Plan: Build up for War
    -[] Increasing Wealth - More trade, more mines, more growth. Aim to find more Spirit Stones, tax more from traders, whatever works to increase your Clan Wealth. Increases Wealth by an average of 5.
    -[] Economic Activity - Carve arrays, scribe useful cultivation techniques onto scrolls, hunt down useful opportunities that might be dangerous to a Core Formation Elder. Make some money for the Clan.
    -[] Rebuild the Golden Eye Array (7 Wealth)
    -[] Regain Full Strength (6 Wealth)
    -[] Build Engines of War (5 Wealth)

    [] Plan Diplomatic investments
    -[] Increasing Wealth - More trade, more mines, more growth. Aim to find more Spirit Stones, tax more from traders, whatever works to increase your Clan Wealth. Increases Wealth by an average of 5.
    -[] Assist A Faction (Write-in Faction) - Use your personal strength to assist an ally of some kind. Potentially dangerous.
    -[] Invest in Colonisation (10 Wealth)
    -[] Build Engines of War (5 Wealth)
    -[] Rebuild the Golden Eye Array (7 Wealth)
    -[] Regain Full Strength (6 Wealth)


    With the focus on the economy, I think spending all the wealth on the ability to get a formation eye-spy, and the full militarization of the clan up as possible.
     
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    I think our best bets for diplomacy (barring trying to integrate our vassals) are the Sorrowfull Blacksmith sect to coordinate against the Devil Bees, the Strength sect to discourage a crusade, or the Magic Oak Sect to act as a counterweight to the Jingshen.
     
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    Do the Oasis Rebels still need to be dealt with? I don't know if the map I'm looking at is old or not.
     
    [] Plan Sound Investments
    -[X] Increasing Wealth - More trade, more mines, more growth. Aim to find more Spirit Stones, tax more from traders, whatever works to increase your Clan Wealth. Increases Wealth by an average of 5.
    -[X] Lecturing - You can simply lecture your many juniors on cultivation. Spend your time helping them grow, using less resources and ensuring better growth for the Clan.
    -[X] Invest in Colonisation (10 Wealth)
    -[X] Build up the Scorpion Road (5 Wealth)
    -[X] Rebuild the Golden Eye Array (7 Wealth)
    -[X] Regain Full Strength (6 Wealth)

    Cost: 28 Wealth, at the start of Turn 5 (Year 80) we should have around 7 Wealth.

    So what's the idea with this plan. Well I saw a bunch of juicy investment opportunities and wanted in. We seem fairly secure right now. The 100 Year Trial is coming up in 40 years, and the Devil Bees are free to attack where they like but that seems like it. To be ready for both the 100 Year Trial and the Devil Bees, Regaining Full Strength combined with Manual lecturing is non-negotiable. With the defensive investment last turn that seems like that should be all we can do this turn to effect things.

    Now the other stuff. Colonizing our new land is a good investment and should pay off economically in the long run, as well as giving it the defences it will need as the new frontline again the Blood Cannibal Sect. Building up the Scorpion Road is another investment that should pay off economically but also has a side benefit of improving diplomatic relations with the most important Righteous Sect. The Golden Eye Array is something that sounds incredibly useful, and so I think that we can afford the drop from 14 to 7 wealth to rebuild it.
     
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    occipitallobe said:
    That does happen sometimes. You go into a negotiation and get hedged in, and somehow end up worse off than your initial BATNA. Manuel just negotiated disastrously - he gets some nice boosts to these rolls (especially relative to Lady Jiao), but sometimes you just lose at things.
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    Allright. So I don't want to protest too much, but I really dislike how you implemented this. Whilst it's true that you can get argued round into bad deals in actual negotiations, there is no indication that this can happen in the original option, which basically just says that if we fail it defaults to refusal.

    occipitallobe said:
    [ ] Negotiate. Yes, but... Write-in what you want. Relies on a Diplomacy roll from Manuel to succeed. The more you ask for, the less likely it is to go through.
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    Secondly, whilst in general I would support your habit of not showing rolls for a lot of things I feel it is somewhat damaging here, since we can't see why we failed.

    Finally, the way in which the failure was presented.

    It doesn't lay out the results upfront (or summarise them after), making things harder to track in subsequent turns because I have to re-read the whole prose section each time.

    Secondly, the characterisation and flow on from the previous update seems lacking.

    Manuel is in a state of utter contempt. That can work for him refusing and booting her out unceremoniously. Or it can work for his contempt undermining his estimation of her abilities. The problem is we hit the walk away case, and by all evidence Manuel walked away. He didn't get suckered into signing something that seemed to favour him but actually favoured them. Giving the concession, rather than kicking them out in a massively rude fashion doesn't seem to make sense in that context.

    I feel like you either needed a much shorter sequence I.e. "Negotiation failed. Jingshen gain minor concession. *CONCESSSION*" or a much longer sequence showing actual interaction and negotiation. As is it feels a bit worst of both worlds.

    On the positive side, at least it was something small. Any patients wanting to use the Oasis still have to cross our lands and I really hope we're zealously checking the credentials of every "Doctor" who wants to pass through without paying.

    Edit: Clarity.
     
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    Hey I found a way of understanding the value of the new regions we received if they are colonized. In our clan sheet you can see that we have 50 cultivators at Core Formation. The new regions say that they are currently at 5% and 10% capacity respectively. But at full capacity they can support 3 Core Formation cultivators each. Which means that our Core Formation capacity will expand from 50 to 56, and each of those guys is a potential Nascent Soul Cultivator.
     
    Matthew Gates said:
    [] Plan Sound Investments
    -[X] Increasing Wealth - More trade, more mines, more growth. Aim to find more Spirit Stones, tax more from traders, whatever works to increase your Clan Wealth. Increases Wealth by an average of 5.
    -[X] Lecturing - You can simply lecture your many juniors on cultivation. Spend your time helping them grow, using less resources and ensuring better growth for the Clan.
    -[X] Invest in Colonisation (10 Wealth)
    -[X] Build up the Scorpion Road (5 Wealth)
    -[X] Rebuild the Golden Eye Array (7 Wealth)
    -[X] Regain Full Strength (6 Wealth)

    Cost: 28 Wealth, Remainder 7 Wealth
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    We only have 25 wealth available though? You might need to cut something on the investments. By the way, the clan hasn't been trying to make allies in a while. The Yuan Clan or the Magic Oak Sect could be good ally choices.
     
    If we assume the average increase of 5 Wealth you get 30-28=2. Although that is assuming we get the increased wealth during our turn to pay for the other stuff. Income I think only happens at the end of our turn, which might have already gone up due to our investments by that point. But if it remains 5 we will have 7 Wealth at the beginning of turn 5 Year 80.

    @occipitallobe Does Increasing Wealth give its wealth during the turn?
     
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    Matthew Gates said:
    If we assume the average increase of 5 Wealth and the current income of 5 Wealth you get 35-28=7. Although that is assuming we get the increased wealth during our turn to pay for the other stuff. Income I think only happens at the end of our turn, which might have already gone up due to our investments by that point.
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    What investments? Your plan intends to spend all available cash at the start of the investment attempt. We only have 25 wealth available at the start, which becomes 0 at the start, leaving at best 2 wealth for investment if the cash isn't tied up to mean the available cash is actually 0 sum.
     
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