FTFY.
I believe daikaiju is a more fitting term than natural disaster, and the Endbringers definitely deserve to be called daikaiju rather than just mere kaiju.
Hereafter [Worm x Fate/Grand Order]
- Thread starter James D. Fawkes
- Start date
- Crossover
I believe daikaiju is a more fitting term than natural disaster, and the Endbringers definitely deserve to be called daikaiju rather than just mere kaiju.
Isiri Pudireach
Predictive text can go duck itself
Maybe. Endbringers are actually kinda small on the Kaiju size scale.
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- Philippines
Honestly they're just the size of the typical run-of-the-mill mooks that some kaiju mass produce. It's just that they are overwhelmingly powerful since Wildbow's design basis for them was basically "Anything that you can imagine, but actually stronger (because they're just sandbagging)". I remember some rather egregious WoGs that came after someone asked "But can they defeat X" and Wildbow's response was yes every time.
It's only made Zion that much more ridiculous to be honest, because he's treated like he eats Endbringers for breakfast and the only reason he hadn't killed any before Behemoth was because he just didn't find any reason to.
Scion was supposed to be that ridiculous. He's the boss the game devs put into their game as a joke with stats so high he was never meant to be defeated until the players found an exploit to cheese him and change him from literally impossible to just barely possible.
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Pretty much yeah. Khepri throwing literally every parahuman at him was merely slowing him down and that's from across multiple parallel Earths. He wasn't killed so much as he was convinced to commit suicide when Taylor hit his trauma button so much that he just gave up on living.
That's not quite right during worm's writing wildbow had them as big bads but not that big you can see it in his wogs where he says things like the justice league beats them easily, Martian Manhunter beats and counters Ziz etc. Except then someone took the info Lisa's power gave her worked out from the materials what trait it was meaning, ran the numbers and got a crazy result. To this wildbow then went something oh lol didn't realise it would be that big and ran with it.
The size is correct though using Attack on Titan as a comparison point since people will be able to visualise it easily or as a reminder the Female titan isn't that much bigger than most of the buildings.
Colossal titan 60 m 196.85 feet
Eren titan / most of the nine titans 15 m 49.2126 feet
Female titan 14 m 45.9318 feet
Behemoth 13.716 m 45 feet
Leviathan 9.144 m 30 feet
Jaw titan 5 m 16.4042 feet
Ziz 4.572 m 15 feet
Cart titan 4 m 13.1234 feet
Taylor is going to need some serious gainz to be able to fight some weaker servants at some point or at least contribute, instead of being pretty much helpless and clawless 99.9% of the time, which is going to feel increasingly glaring as the Singularities get harder and she's reduced to a spectator at best, a burden at worst. I mean, she has mentioned that she's not good at staying within her 'supposed lane', though that hasn't happened yet. Yes, she's good for taccom right now, but her present mastermind/tactician role is very replaceable by servants that are much better and more experienced than she is at it, so her present niche can easily be phased out. I mean, this fic is focused on Taylor, power development to keep her relevant in a world of powerlevels is important, lest it just retread FGO, or make her offer little value as a protagonist by not having the ability to change things on her own. There's a reason why canon Ritsuka/Gudako are mostly hollow self-inserts, but Shirou isn't.
Summoning Chiron or someone with their teaching skills actually intact would be useful for rapid development. Hell. Just learn from him in the Singularity. I'm not asking for a super OP Taylor like in An Essence or Silver and Steel, but a happy medium would be nice, instead of Taylor being more useless than a Nero with a fragment of a Saint Graph and a sword, and always watching other people fight and essentially being a damsel in Servant combat, since she, for the most part, can neither contribute, nor defend herself entirely. Sure, she can use some cleverness sometimes so others can help deal with them, like with Altera, or briefly surprising someone with useless insects, but it's either something literally anyone could do, or distracting them and letting the real heroes deal with them. It's chafing.
She seems to be slowly escalating between singularities anyway, getting her powers back at the end of France along with Last Resort, and now it seems like she's getting an upgraded suit and insects back (age of gods insects?) in Okeanos. Meeting Matou Zolgen in London would be a godsend too. Here's hoping that trend continues so that by the time she's in the Temple she can actually hold her own against mid-tier Servants.
Summoning Chiron or someone with their teaching skills actually intact would be useful for rapid development. Hell. Just learn from him in the Singularity. I'm not asking for a super OP Taylor like in An Essence or Silver and Steel, but a happy medium would be nice, instead of Taylor being more useless than a Nero with a fragment of a Saint Graph and a sword, and always watching other people fight and essentially being a damsel in Servant combat, since she, for the most part, can neither contribute, nor defend herself entirely. Sure, she can use some cleverness sometimes so others can help deal with them, like with Altera, or briefly surprising someone with useless insects, but it's either something literally anyone could do, or distracting them and letting the real heroes deal with them. It's chafing.
She seems to be slowly escalating between singularities anyway, getting her powers back at the end of France along with Last Resort, and now it seems like she's getting an upgraded suit and insects back (age of gods insects?) in Okeanos. Meeting Matou Zolgen in London would be a godsend too. Here's hoping that trend continues so that by the time she's in the Temple she can actually hold her own against mid-tier Servants.
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- Location
- Philippines
Yeah, but in the end the final design did end up being just that ridiculous to the point where if an attack didn't have the potential to force maps to be redrawn then it just wasn't going to kill an Endbringer. And even then, as Phir Se found out too late, hope that they would let you build up that attack in the first place without being killed or having it turned against you.
I'm completely baffled by this statement. Especially when you go on to say you don't want a completely over-powered Taylor. This is never going to happen.
Taylor is human, just like the twins. They will have human limitations. And the servants that they have to deal with is never going to be baseline human. So expecting Taylor to become some servant killing machine is the most ridiculous suggestion ever.
Taylor is a Master. And just like in every Grail War, the master is the weak link because they are a lot easier to kill compared to a Servant.
So unless the author goes completely off the rails, Taylor is never going to go around fighting servants in combat and win as a regular thing.
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- Philippines
Considering even in Worm, Taylor was never really a direct threat to most that she fought as much as she always just survived by the skin of her teeth against increasingly ridiculous opponents with her wits, Taylor would really fit better as one of the Masters of Chaldea than as one of the frontliners. After all, that's what canon Fujimaru Ritsuka also did every time they went into a Singularity or Lostbelt.
I mean, Shirou is human and endgame Shirou can fight a lot of Servants straight up and win. It's just that most magi aren't combat focused monsters who leverage what they have hard enough to matter. Even Rin could body Medea with the only caveat that she has to get into punching range first.
Humans aren't irrelevant in a fight against Servants, they're just disadvantaged, get them a boost up and they can carry their weight in a fight. The reason Masters aren't supposed to get involved is because of how important they are, something happening to them completely screws their side over. The high end magi all have something that can at least slow a Servant down.
It's always going to be an uphill struggle, but it's one she can still win.
Humans aren't irrelevant in a fight against Servants, they're just disadvantaged, get them a boost up and they can carry their weight in a fight. The reason Masters aren't supposed to get involved is because of how important they are, something happening to them completely screws their side over. The high end magi all have something that can at least slow a Servant down.
It's always going to be an uphill struggle, but it's one she can still win.
But Taylor isn't exactly human, she's a parahuman, a mage, and someone who is literally already in the Throne of Heroes and a foreigner. If Shirou can do it, Kiritsugu can hypothetically do it, Zouken can do it, Zelretch can do it, Rin can do it, Lorelei can do it, both Shikis can do it, Ciel can do it, Sakura can do it, Sion can do it, Touko and her sister can do it, why the hell not Taylor?
It's a Nasuverse tradition for the protagonist to be able to eventually fight servant-level combatants and break all established rules. In F/SN (Shirou killing Gil / fighting Saber on equal ground / killing a nerfed Herc / beating his future self etc), Tsukihime (Shiki killing Arc, Roa, etc), Apocrypha (Sieg, transforming into Siegfried with his heart, becomes a fucking dragon). Even Ritsuka, despite being bad at magecraft or having bad circuits can maintain 300+ contracts with servants when the average is 1.
Why not her?
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- Pronouns
- He
Not to be pedantic, but most of the characters you mentioned have some absurdly op ability even in setting. Mystic eyes of death perception, true magic, stupidly good magic circuits, being linked to a DAA (and even then Ciel can only fight low tier servants).
On a sidenote, will we get into the Origin stuff with Taylor, or even more traditional Fate magecraft things?
This is the absolute worst examples you can provide because almost every single person in that list is not a baseline human. And Shirou? Did you forget all the times he got so severely injured that it was only because of Avalon that he lived?
Plus, at no point in this story has the author hinted about some over-powered skill allowing Taylor to be able to fight a servant and survive. She is a baseline human with insects. Insects that can't damage or hurt servants. And only a couple years of magic training. And if you somehow think that this is enough to make Taylor able to fight Servants, then you need to stop drinking the koolaid.
Taylor is not some memetic badass capable of winning every single fight against absolutely anything. She is human and has baseline human limits and she isn't a magical genius or an idiot savant with magic. Almost every single Servant that they fought has been stronger, faster, and tougher than a baseline human. There is zero chance for Taylor being able to fight a servant and win.
Unless the author somehow introduces something for the sole-purpose of making Taylor able to fight a servant, then at this point in time Taylor will lose in any fight with a servant. Especially for the types that they have to fight against in the singularities.
The point I'm making is that servant-tier protagonists and even some side-characters are common in the Nasuverse. Yes, they are rule-breakers for the greater universe, I mentioned it, but Taylor, as the protagonist, developing her own type of anti-servant bullshit is expected to stay relevant and not slowly become a glorified cheerleader like canon Ritsuka as her niche is encroached by better servants that are flat out better at strategy and tactics.
OG Skitter/Khepri/Weaver feels like they have some serious reality marble material at points not to dissimilar to a warped Emiya, not sure about now, though.
I said specifically by the Temple of Solomon. I'm not expecting her to fight servants this instant, but later down the line.
And how exactly does that make it into a good story? Instead of a story of FGO and Taylor's introduction and seeing how things work out. You instead introduce a dues ex machina just so that the special insert character can continue to be super special all because you want them to be super special.
Taylor doesn't need to fight servants to make her continue to be relevant. The masters aren't just their to provide servants with magic. The masters are to also provide assistance and guidance to the servants. Otherwise, the whole point of the Holy Grail Wars will turn into summoning the servants and just letting the servants run wild.
In this last singularity, Taylor was doing what the master's should be doing. Let the servants fight and the master's can analyze and determine weak points. Taylor doesn't need to be the super special character who is able to fight servants in hand to hand and win.
rafuki22
Anti-nihilist(maybe).
- Location
- Earth/Spain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Warped Emiya? If you are implying that he has a reality Marble, and implying Taylor should have one(Only Khepri could have one in my opinion), because of his "Distorted" mind then know that's fanon, he just has PTSD, survivor guilt, normal things, human things.
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- He
Having the protagonist get some super-special-powerup just because they are the protagonist isn't really appealing. Besides, the story we've seen so far is much more driven by character interaction than action scenes or even the greater FGO plot, and honestly, I'd rather it stay that way, since the canon plot is stale in of itself.
The part about other servants being better strategist/tacticians doesn't much apply, as the number of servants who could both lead a small group and both fight in battle is pretty slim. Since the number of servants being gotten will be kept somewhat low simply due to how horrible character bloat would get, i doubt it'll ever come up. Besides, making your main character useless is just dumb if you're writing.
TLDR: Taylor won't likely be getting that huge a powerup, and it's not really needed at all.
This is one of those things I disagree with. Humans being able to fight servants isn't a deus ex machina, or even unusual, difficult, yes but they aren't invincible monoliths you make them out to be. Even canon Rin killed Berserker a few times herself.
What I want is Taylor to be independent and be able to get involved herself, instead of becoming a glorified cheerleader. I want the Taylor that beat Lung despite being far stronger than her, that isn't an exactly high demand. Fundamentally, I want her to matter, or why not just read a novelization of canon?
Wrong Emiya. Taylor is not too dissimilar to Kiritsugu, committing warcrimes and doing shit like killing children for the sake of greater good, and sacrificing the few for the many in the desire for a brighter world, no matter how guilty she feels or what she's forced to do. By the end, whatever the fuck she was becoming as Khepri, she was on the verge of becoming a Beast of Humanity or something like it. No matter how far she degraded, she fundamentally loved and wished to protect humanity, but lost the ability to understand humanity. Hence, Beast. If she wasn't shot by Contessa...
Seriously, Taylor's sense of self, morality, or even humanity is fucked seven ways to sunday post-GM, ripe for a RM. She's better now due to the timeskip, but to what degree is the question...
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the main reason for taylor to not kill a servant is that she lacks the oomph, something she's always had an issue with, if someone can survive/ignore being swarmed by bugs she's got few options to deal with them, she's got last resort now, but she's no speedster, and most servants are, not saying it's impossible, but she'd need a setup like shirou, where she specifically counters the servant, shirou straight up countered gilgamesh, put him up against most other servants and he dies instead. same for taylor, if she finds someone she is litteraly built to counter, then she's good to go.
i am fairly certain she managed it once, just once, and he was holding her while she effectively just blew up a high powered magic grenade in his face, that was him being careless cause he's a berserker where dying is litteraly irrelevant, and also i am fairly certain illya was playing around or something
Heck if Gil had taken him seriously from the beginning Shirou would have died anyways, but it wasn't until he was backed into a corner he really took the fight seriously and by then it was too late.
As people have said, Taylor was never a heavy hitter beyond swarm them with insects. She does not appear to have any of the incredibly overpowered innate abilities that the people who've been seen able to compete with a Servant have, her role is that of a leader. The people who have thrown down with Servants (generally under extremely specific circumstances) are if anything the exception that proves the rule. You need something very special to compete with Servants.
In terms of Taylor's passivity, there is also the massive Chekhov's Gun that is Last Resort still chilling in the background. Unless I'm forgetting something really major, Last Resort has only ever been used as just a knife, not as a Noble Phantasm. Presumably, there will be a point where the reason Shakespeare named it Last Resort will be apparent (my bet is shortly after Arash goes boom).
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- Devouring a mass of thermonuclear gas
Unless Fawkes wants to go the extra heart wrenching route of Arash showing up in Camelot down the line with no memories of his summon, we can MOST LIKELY ignore Stella exists for a while.
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- He
Even without going that way in Camelot, Stella is a blant Chekhov's Gun in it of itself.