Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Crossover Fantasy
It can't have novel memories and identity of its own, have human level intelligence, and not be an actual person.
The charm specifies that they have enough distinct identity to isolate and recreate or to destroy. It says nothing about it fundamentally staying the same except by implication of them starting out with our memories.
I don't care about storing and recreating them as we please or any other work around, I don't care for the idea of them existing in the first place.
So, to post reasoning for why I think Alchemy is worth investing in up to at least 2 dots, and hopefully 3:
If all these are allowed, then for 13 XP we'll be getting equivalent of multiple charms that can also be shared with others. Even just "only one hour of sleep per day" and the access to magical material for crafting should be worth it. If we also get polymorph, healing and stat-boosting potions, ability to make weapons deal aggravated damage (Lydia seriously need magical weapons), and ability to see past veils, that would be a great investment.
Plus, you know, perfect hangover cure. We could probably make it in industrial quantities and sell it at McAnally's Pub.
From Sorcerer Revised:
•• A form of prophecy-bearing super-LSD. When ingested, the user will be able to see things that were not previously obvious to him or will be granted a vision of the future. These messages will always be cloaked in symbolism and analogy, but will be correct... to the limits of the user's understanding.
•• A potion that doubles the user's running speed for one scene. After using this potion, the user must make a Stamina check (difficulty 6) or be totally out of breath and shaky (-2 on all physical die rolls) for the next hour.
•••A metal alloy that is lighter and stronger than titanium (but easier to work), retains an edge almost forever and stays more resilient than the finest blade. Armor produced with this alloy gets an extra dot of bashing and lethal soak, and melee weapons made of it do one more die of damage and are -1 difficulty to hit with (due to their light weight and fine balance).
From Sorceror's Companion:
• A powder that, when combined with an alcoholic beverage, immediately recovers them from the effects of alcohol, both intoxication and hangovers alike. (Sorceror's companion)
•• A liquid that allows the drinker to go for an entire week with only one hour's sleep per night.
•• Metal that can be crafted into a blade with an ultra-keen edge, one that never needs to be re-sharpened.
•• An adrenaline-boosting "energy drink" that improves the user's Strength by one (to a maximum of five) for a scene. After it wears off, the imbiber takes 1 bashing damage from the exertion of their body.
••• A salve which heals three non-aggravated Health Levels worth of open wounds in a matter of minutes. This must be applied by moonlight by one who loves the wounded. Each success creates one application of the balm.
••• Metal that can be made into a handful of bullets that will inflict a single aggravated level of damage in addition to any other wounds.
••• A lotion that unnaturally hardens the skin where applied, granting the user 1 die of Lethal soak that stacks with Armor.
From Sorcerer: Path to Power (assuming it's allowed in):
• Speed-Healing: a "potion" that halves healing time for bashing and lethal damage.
•• Enhance Ability: an elixir that can enhance a specific ability in a person who drinks it. The drinker gains a specialty in that ability for the duration (or +2 dice when it is relevant if they already have one) for one hour per success on the creation.
•• Healing: In addition to the effects of Speed-Healing, this potion heals up to two bashing or lethal levels immediately.
•• Polymorph: a potion that allows the drinker to take on a different form, restricted to simple changes within a human framework, and they cannot perfectly duplicate another person.
••• Dust of True Sight: A dust that can reveal invisible, hidden and disguised objects or beings, and disrupt illusions.
••• Hunter's Blade: A treatment for a small weapon to cause it to do aggravated damage against supernatural beings.
•• A form of prophecy-bearing super-LSD. When ingested, the user will be able to see things that were not previously obvious to him or will be granted a vision of the future. These messages will always be cloaked in symbolism and analogy, but will be correct... to the limits of the user's understanding.
•• A potion that doubles the user's running speed for one scene. After using this potion, the user must make a Stamina check (difficulty 6) or be totally out of breath and shaky (-2 on all physical die rolls) for the next hour.
•••A metal alloy that is lighter and stronger than titanium (but easier to work), retains an edge almost forever and stays more resilient than the finest blade. Armor produced with this alloy gets an extra dot of bashing and lethal soak, and melee weapons made of it do one more die of damage and are -1 difficulty to hit with (due to their light weight and fine balance).
From Sorceror's Companion:
• A powder that, when combined with an alcoholic beverage, immediately recovers them from the effects of alcohol, both intoxication and hangovers alike. (Sorceror's companion)
•• A liquid that allows the drinker to go for an entire week with only one hour's sleep per night.
•• Metal that can be crafted into a blade with an ultra-keen edge, one that never needs to be re-sharpened.
•• An adrenaline-boosting "energy drink" that improves the user's Strength by one (to a maximum of five) for a scene. After it wears off, the imbiber takes 1 bashing damage from the exertion of their body.
••• A salve which heals three non-aggravated Health Levels worth of open wounds in a matter of minutes. This must be applied by moonlight by one who loves the wounded. Each success creates one application of the balm.
••• Metal that can be made into a handful of bullets that will inflict a single aggravated level of damage in addition to any other wounds.
••• A lotion that unnaturally hardens the skin where applied, granting the user 1 die of Lethal soak that stacks with Armor.
From Sorcerer: Path to Power (assuming it's allowed in):
• Speed-Healing: a "potion" that halves healing time for bashing and lethal damage.
•• Enhance Ability: an elixir that can enhance a specific ability in a person who drinks it. The drinker gains a specialty in that ability for the duration (or +2 dice when it is relevant if they already have one) for one hour per success on the creation.
•• Healing: In addition to the effects of Speed-Healing, this potion heals up to two bashing or lethal levels immediately.
•• Polymorph: a potion that allows the drinker to take on a different form, restricted to simple changes within a human framework, and they cannot perfectly duplicate another person.
••• Dust of True Sight: A dust that can reveal invisible, hidden and disguised objects or beings, and disrupt illusions.
••• Hunter's Blade: A treatment for a small weapon to cause it to do aggravated damage against supernatural beings.
If all these are allowed, then for 13 XP we'll be getting equivalent of multiple charms that can also be shared with others. Even just "only one hour of sleep per day" and the access to magical material for crafting should be worth it. If we also get polymorph, healing and stat-boosting potions, ability to make weapons deal aggravated damage (Lydia seriously need magical weapons), and ability to see past veils, that would be a great investment.
Plus, you know, perfect hangover cure. We could probably make it in industrial quantities and sell it at McAnally's Pub.
A reminder that we craft at x10 speed. Crafting Paths/Fortune/Summoning trifecta are absolutely obscene when added on Infernal chassis, yes.
That said, if we are planning on purchasing Hell-realm with advanced civilization, Alchemy becomes something that we could easily off-load on someone else. We probably couldn't get 5-6 dot effects that way - which is a strong argument to purchase it regardless, imo - but Advanced Civ-tier Hell-realm should be capable of supplying everything below 5 dots easily.
Oh, certainly. As soon as we are getting our kingdom, any sort of common use crafting should be offloaded to it, and we should switch to either combat crafting, ie making objects for the situation in the field, and making legendary quality artifacts of power that we need exalted dicepools for. And even those should be made in great factory cathedrals of our hell realm, with centuries and millennia old superhuman devil smiths working as our assistants.
But we are far away from our kingdom. We would need 36 XP just to get it, and then we'd need summoning path, which we would want to push as high as possible, which is 49 XP max. So I think we should stick with alchemy (maybe enchantment) and fortune for now.
That's two arcs worth of XP, though. And we are nearing the resolution of one. Given that we are mostly done with the basics of basics, aiming for Key and Kingdom next is a viable progression strategy. Good, even, given how many problems it would solve - and create - at the same time.
Possible, yes. Depending on how much XP we get this arc, I think I'll try grabbing Alchemy 2, to partially solve our action economy crisis. The next arc is probably a timeskip / some kind of faster time progression one, as we deal with the Dragon's Nest / Elemental's layer reconstruction. We need to overcharge our craft as much as possible for that one, I feel.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I think even in E2, the CoD tag was mostly for Solar charms that worked especially well against them. Most non-Solars don't care if you're a CoD. That's why ExWoD had to have a block specifying what was and wasn't a CoD, because other splats don't interact with that rule. Think it's even in the Solar chapter, too, but my phone spontaneously decided not to load the thing when I went to check, so can't confirm right now.
We have to have a tutor first for sorcery. Harry could do it, but I don't think we can commit exp at a buy point before we receive the training for something.
- Location
- Germany
I still prefer spending XP to increase our base stats/skills, buy more Charms and get the Shi-Arts that we are already training in.
Splintered Gale Incarnation might look like different people and it might look like aspects of the same person and both are true at the same time because the nature of the Primordials of which you draw your power is not limited to puny mortal understanding in much the same way as VEE's wish granting can look like it breaks causality when someone who asks for a job receives a letter asking them to start tomorrow even though the letter is dated a week before they made the request.
So is SGI a person whom you would be killing if you get killed and reincarnate? Well no, that paradigm would depend on the entity being able to exist as something other than an aspect of Molly Carpenter, there is no button marked 'let the clone loose', anymore than there is a button to make two plus two make six. Does someone/something die as part of the imperfect reincarnation, yes a part of you, but that is inherent to the themes of the Hell of Being Skinned Alive. Freedom Lets Go literally rips off a piece of your soul with a curse or transformation attached and hurls it into the depths of hell.
So, basically, weird in-between - clones got enough autonomy to think, but not enough to think for themselves and genuinely change. Although they are not directly mentally linked, they are still a part of a spiritual gestalt.
Just to narrow it down a bit more; is Annie scenario theoretically possible?
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They can change, they just cannot change beyond the bounds of what it is to be Molly Carpenter
That's kinda like saying you could pull versions of yourself from alternate timelines that diverged a few days or weeks ago, and if you killed one to survive it's fine since it's still you.
[X] Try to question the dead (Lydia rolls Empathy+Charisma at -2 DC; Obvious)
Interested in seeing this.
Interested in seeing this.
- Location
- Georgia
It is not you in a material and deterministic way, it is you in a metaphysical sense, they are literally aspects of your beings which are the product of charms. A charm is not a spell it is not something you do like 'pulling versions of yourself out of alternative timelines' it is something you are. Splintered Gale Incarnation does not manifest another person, it grows another head for the hydra that is the Infernal Exalted, only the people on this plane of existence cannot see the body so they think the heads are two snakes. If that comparison sounds eldritch inhuman that is because Infernal Charms are inhuman, made in the image of the Yozi who never were and never sought to understand humanity
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I mean, they are capable of, theoretically, betraying us. Intentionally. With full awareness. Metaphysical oneness or not. That is a litmus test that definitively says that yeah, they are their own people.
At that point, probability of us actually getting Splintered Gale is close to zero, as we got a definitive confirmation that we are not sacrificing particularly well-developed fingers or flesh robots, but actual people.
Sad, but such is life. I was looking forward to seeing Charity deal with five Mollies.
At that point, probability of us actually getting Splintered Gale is close to zero, as we got a definitive confirmation that we are not sacrificing particularly well-developed fingers or flesh robots, but actual people.
Sad, but such is life. I was looking forward to seeing Charity deal with five Mollies.
We are getting a bit in the weeds of what charms are here, but just to be clear. The sequence of events that leads to SGI is not 'Molly Prime decides to replace Molly 2 rather than die'. The process is an automatic part of the charm, which is an emanation of the same gestalt as both Molly Prime and Molly 2. There is no decision point between someone hitting Molly Prime hard enough to kill her and Molly 2 being undone in a gust of eternally flaying wind. The iteration that survives would regret that it happened and would almost certainly gain a negative intimacy towards the person who made it happen due to the feelings of the gestalt as a whole, the higher consciousness which 'Molly who still thinks of herself as a human' cannot access., but there will not be a moment where another Molly thinks 'why did you let me die' because both of them contain the charm Splintered Gale Incarnation and its again inhuman perspective on separation and sacrifice.
I mean, Primordial's third circle demons are distinct individuals from the Primordial, and yet aspects of Primordial's personality / self. Infernal Exalted is a primordial larvae. Five dot charms are the point where you start the metamorphosis - obtaining a world body / soul, manifesting parts of your personality as distinct, and yet connected entities, transitioning to functioning on your own mythos rather than the laws of the world, etc. It's possibly to manifest those changes early, but one should remember that a five dot essence Infernal Exalted is not a human being. They are a nascent Creator Deity.
[X] Use the Crown on the park itself to find out if they are still here or just passing through (-1 Essence)
Confirmation that they're part of Molly's soul-body mitigates some of my concerns, but I still think the quack like a duck rule applies to the social consequences.
Not just with other people but with our focus in that aspect of the quest. Whatever their metaphysical nature, we'd still need to deal with Molly's weird sister-daughters.
I suspect that even with charm backed loyalty that asking a teenager to observe her personality from the outside wouldn't exactly be a barrel of laughs. Especially since Molly's the type of person who probably couldn't stand some of her own behaviors coming from someone else; exhibit A being her mother.
Confirmation that they're part of Molly's soul-body mitigates some of my concerns, but I still think the quack like a duck rule applies to the social consequences.
Not just with other people but with our focus in that aspect of the quest. Whatever their metaphysical nature, we'd still need to deal with Molly's weird sister-daughters.
I suspect that even with charm backed loyalty that asking a teenager to observe her personality from the outside wouldn't exactly be a barrel of laughs. Especially since Molly's the type of person who probably couldn't stand some of her own behaviors coming from someone else; exhibit A being her mother.