Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

If something like VEE could do it then the primordials would have been able to do it too. To my eye there needs to be a reason we can do something that they couldn't, even if the gods could with their biased exaltations and that didn't go bad in all the obvious ways we're not Lytek or Luna.
1) No sidereals to identify and oppose our Fate manipulation
2) Either no Lytek equivalent, or (if we can make one) Lytek equivalent loyal to us, unlike the Primordial War, where Lytek was a part of rebellion (and also a god Primrodials didn't know about until the start of rebellion).
3) No Autochton to oppose us
4) No ongoing Primordial War with an opposed Exalted Host messing up any prep and setup required for a sure way manipulation. Opposition got a say, after all. And exalted spies and assassins were good enough to murder Fetich Souls of Primordials at the start of the war.
5) Reality, and Destiny, are easier to manipulate in this latter age.

Like, let's look at this mechanically. Destiny Background lets you, to quote
Players can roll the character's Destiny to create lucky
breaks or coincidences. "Lucky" is a relative term, though.
For instance, a person with destiny whose ship sank could be
rescued before he dies of exposure… or he could be "rescued"
by pirates who then sell him into slavery. But even this rough
treatment could send the character where he needs to go.
The more successes a player rolls, the luckier (and more
improbable) the coincidence will be.
One use of VEE can give a person 1 dot in a background. You cannot use VEE on a person more than once per year (or unless you trick reality into believing that a year and a day have passed). I am fairly sure that exaltation is a legendary enough success that you need a legendary Destiny success to get it. Ie 5+ successes.
If we go by a very free interpretation of splendor mechanic, you can get up to +3 automatic successes by stacking 3 Invincible Assertions on top of each other. That would be a 5 dot splendor, by the way. Ie you'd need to kill at least three gods to power its creation normally in WoD (2 in this quest before we got the Forge). And it's likely to be destroyed after being used. This still leaves you one success short. So, you need to use 2 VEEs on a single person. And equip them with a 5 dot splendor. This gives the target 2 dice of Destiny + 3 automatic successes.

That hard enough for you? I full expect to have to use fae court favors, probably from both courts, to make this work. And, given that Mothers are mainlining surviving Maidens in this crossover, this seems appropriate enough.
 
Just to point out something in the exaltation bestowal discussion, dont know if someone already said it, i remember there being some gods who were in charge of giving out some of the exaltations. I could remember wrong. It could be that that wont work here. It could be that we cant make a minor god that can bestow an exaltation. I just want to put the info out there.
Hopefully its useful.


Im all for getting more people exalted, and all for making that safer, but ill just vote for it at some point.I already did my appeal to just try things, so i have nothing else useful to offer.

[X] Sigh... time to remove temptation, at least you can make yourself feel better by punching a fire monster in the face
 
Keep in mind that the Primordials may have had infinite power in their own ways, but were limited in far more ways than even mortals. The Primordials could not act beyond their themes, limits and tyrannies. The Act of Exaltation requires a human to become a Hero, to go beyond their limits and position whilst acting in a manner that is 'Virtuous'. The act of defying the Primordials is inherently Heroic, and by simple virtue of the fact that the Primordials saw it as their place and nature to dominate humans meant that they would have naturally winnowed out a great majority of those who would have had the capability. It would have been a case of going "Oh, I've heard chickens can fly? Okay, here's my coop full of chickens with clipped wings. Let's see if they can fly. Hmm, doesn't look like it."
That's not to say it would have been tautologically impossible-except for the Ebon Dragon, whose nature is utterly anathema to all concept of Heroism. The only Exaltations that occured around TED would have been Heroes rising up specifically to face him.
They could rebuild them once they had them locked down, generate curses that exploited their nature to force malicious updates, and depending on the edition figured out how to make their own.

My point is not that they're impossible to manipulate in all ways, but that it should always be incredibly difficult and some shouldn't be allowed without something genuinely novel.

Ancient Sorcery and Splendors are aping the power of the primordials, fate bending is operating a system they built and could similarly command. They were alien, but alien doesn't mean stupid; by the time acausal WMDs are getting deployed it can be assumed that all "one neat trick" options have been explored.

Which is why I'm using the great curse as a standard. The solar sparks were not captured or redirected until after someone with the authority to do so turned them off and put them in a box, despite all the effort that we can see and infer went into going after them.

We're an outside power, so to follow this to a reasonable conclusion I see a couple hypothetical ways to influence but not personally select exalted candidates:


1) Work out a great curse tier act of techno-sorcerous engineering nobody from the primordials all the way down the ages to now could possibly have ever accomplished that manipulates them once deployed.

2) Emulate the Yozi in full by learning enough deep exalted lore to rebuild them in our image and adding the chains that let them pull the plug on undesirable candidates.

Fate manipulation and isolated dimensional regions are kiddy shit in comparison to what the primordials could do. By default they had isolate pocket dimensions as organs. The question of what happens if an exalt dies in a sapient and hostile alternate reality which wants to steal or destroy the spark is one that had to be answered as a basic part of their design.

1) No sidereals to identify and oppose our Fate manipulation
2) Either no Lytek equivalent, or (if we can make one) Lytek equivalent loyal to us, unlike the Primordial War, where Lytek was a part of rebellion (and also a god Primrodials didn't know about until the start of rebellion).
3) No Autochton to oppose us
4) No ongoing Primordial War with an opposed Exalted Host messing up any prep and setup required for a sure way manipulation. Opposition got a say, after all. And exalted spies and assassins were good enough to murder Fetich Souls of Primordials at the start of the war.
5) Reality, and Destiny, are easier to manipulate in this latter age.

Like, let's look at this mechanically. Destiny Background lets you, to quote

One use of VEE can give a person 1 dot in a background. You cannot use VEE on a person more than once per year (or unless you trick reality into believing that a year and a day have passed). I am fairly sure that exaltation is a legendary enough success that you need a legendary Destiny success to get it. Ie 5+ successes.
If we go by a very free interpretation of splendor mechanic, you can get up to +3 automatic successes by stacking 3 Invincible Assertions on top of each other. That would be a 5 dot splendor, by the way. Ie you'd need to kill at least three gods to power its creation normally in WoD (2 in this quest before we got the Forge). And it's likely to be destroyed after being used. This still leaves you one success short. So, you need to use 2 VEEs on a single person. And equip them with a 5 dot splendor. This gives the target 2 dice of Destiny + 3 automatic successes.

That hard enough for you? I full expect to have to use fae court favors, probably from both courts, to make this work. And, given that Mothers are mainlining surviving Maidens in this crossover, this seems appropriate enough.
The sparks of exaltation had to be designed to enter a hostile jotun body to assault the supreme god of local reality where fate is by no means ensured to be the dominant force.

The Maidens couldn't oppose the primordials and I don't see E1 sidereals stopping them from picking up a shiny object if they wanted it under those conditions either.

The scale I'm using is the Yozi's desecration of the solar sparks and the great curse, so stuff like this doesn't move the needle from my perspective.
 
[X] Sigh... time to remove temptation, at least you can make yourself feel better by punching a fire monster in the face
 
The sparks of exaltation had to be designed to enter a hostile jotun body to assault the supreme god of local reality where fate is by no means ensured to be the dominant force.
Primordial War Sidereals didn't care about "Outside Fate" stuff (from Return of the Scarlet Empress):
FATE IS ALL THINGS
Cost: 5m, 2p; Mins: The Sorcerer 2, Essence 4;
Type: Simple
Keywords: Fate, Shaping
Duration: One day
It is unseemly for the Princes of the Earth to rec-
ognize any boundaries upon their power and folly to
recognize the sovereignty of Princes of the Green Sun.
Beings outside fate are not considered so for the purposes
of all the Sidereal's astrological effects and Fate-keyword
magic for the duration of this Charm.
The scale I'm using is the Yozi's desecration of the solar sparks and the great curse, so stuff like this doesn't move the needle from my perspective.
Directing a solar (or some other) exaltation shard to a specific suitable host is a far lesser task than altering the shard itself.[/QUOTE]
 
They could rebuild them once they had them locked down, generate curses that exploited their nature to force malicious updates, and depending on the edition figured out how to make their own.

My point is not that they're impossible to manipulate in all ways, but that it should always be incredibly difficult and some shouldn't be allowed without something genuinely novel.

Ancient Sorcery and Splendors are aping the power of the primordials, fate bending is operating a system they built and could similarly command. They were alien, but alien doesn't mean stupid; by the time acausal WMDs are getting deployed it can be assumed that all "one neat trick" options have been explored.

Which is why I'm using the great curse as a standard. The solar sparks were not captured or redirected until after someone with the authority to do so turned them off and put them in a box, despite all the effort that we can see and infer went into going after them.

We're an outside power, so to follow this to a reasonable conclusion I see a couple hypothetical ways to influence but not personally select exalted candidates:


1) Work out a great curse tier act of techno-sorcerous engineering nobody from the primordials all the way down the ages to now could possibly have ever accomplished that manipulates them once deployed.

2) Emulate the Yozi in full by learning enough deep exalted lore to rebuild them in our image and adding the chains that let them pull the plug on undesirable candidates.

Fate manipulation and isolated dimensional regions are kiddy shit in comparison to what the primordials could do. By default they had isolate pocket dimensions as organs. The question of what happens if an exalt dies in a sapient and hostile alternate reality which wants to steal or destroy the spark is one that had to be answered as a basic part of their design.


The sparks of exaltation had to be designed to enter a hostile jotun body to assault the supreme god of local reality where fate is by no means ensured to be the dominant force.

The Maidens couldn't oppose the primordials and I don't see E1 sidereals stopping them from picking up a shiny object if they wanted it under those conditions either.

The scale I'm using is the Yozi's desecration of the solar sparks and the great curse, so stuff like this doesn't move the needle from my perspective.
Sorcery may be aping the power of the primordials but it stands to mention none of them could actually use any sorcery like effect outside of their theme. The king cannot cast any solar level sorcery effect that isn't Total Annihilation or raise the puissant sanctum. While the primordials may have given or very least introduced the exalted to the principles of sorcery the exalted where the masters of it because they could cast any sorcery effect as long as it was in their Circle. The gods are similarly Limited to the primordials they can not cast sorcery effects that are outside of their mein. I will say this none of the primordials actually have themes that would allow them to spot things that are actively hiding working to hide from them in places where the primordials do not have eyes. The only one who might have the purview to do that was assassinated on the start of the war (The Lidless Eye That Sees/Sacheverell) Which means just having the box somewhere not in Yu Shan in a dimensional pocket would be enough.
 
[X] Sigh... time to remove temptation, at least you can make yourself feel better by punching a fire monster in the face.
 
Sorcery may be aping the power of the primordials but it stands to mention none of them could actually use any sorcery like effect outside of their theme. The king cannot cast any solar level sorcery effect that isn't Total Annihilation or raise the puissant sanctum. While the primordials may have given or very least introduced the exalted to the principles of sorcery the exalted where the masters of it because they could cast any sorcery effect as long as it was in their Circle. The gods are similarly Limited to the primordials they can not cast sorcery effects that are outside of their mein. I will say this none of the primordials actually have themes that would allow them to spot things that are actively hiding working to hide from them in places where the primordials do not have eyes. The only one who might have the purview to do that was assassinated on the start of the war (The Lidless Eye That Sees/Sacheverell) Which means just having the box somewhere not in Yu Shan in a dimensional pocket would be enough.

Technically there was at least one instance where the primordials acted outside theme, the making of Creation itself, each piece was in theme, but they were all meant to be part of a greater work which none of them could claim.
 
Technically there was at least one instance where the primordials acted outside theme, the making of Creation itself, each piece was in theme, but they were all meant to be part of a greater work which none of them could claim.
That's interesting is it outside themes for them? Inherently all of the primordials are creatures of the real for lack of better way of saying it they are makers of Worlds and their selves and definition creating something together that essentially Acts an ultimately defining World that permanently changes and makes real something in the universe seems like it's perfectly in theme for all of them and the fact they did it together makes it greater than if they could have done it apart or alone. That and I think they might have learned from Zen mu (creation prototype) which apparently was made in a more thematic fashion but was kind of a massive mess and a massive disappointment so they chose to go for more cohesive image for their next creation or I guess their first true Creation.
 
Primordial War Sidereals didn't care about "Outside Fate" stuff (from Return of the Scarlet Empress):


Directing a solar (or some other) exaltation shard to a specific suitable host is a far lesser task than altering the shard itself.
[/QUOTE]
That's a shaping effect, which means it can be blocked with perfect defenses.

I think the scale here is different. Rebuilding requires vulnerability, knowledge, and leverage to apply the latter to the former. Hard to acquire but if the exaltation can't fight you then you can evidently do a lot to it.

Screwing with an exaltation abroad is screwing with it while it can do things. The exaltation isn't an exalted, but it's the source of their power and in the scope of the quest we've seen them act on their environments to facilitate getting their chosen host. Carving up someone rendered helpless is different than say stabbing them when they're able to use a perfect defense.

The primordials had access to these tools and put substantial effort into the actions we do see them take related to the exaltations themselves. I think assuming they and everyone who came after them didn't try even the most obvious options and/or failed to competently execute any plans they did implement is ridiculous. It's making the setting dumb so we can style on it like a self indulgent fix-fic.


Sorcery may be aping the power of the primordials but it stands to mention none of them could actually use any sorcery like effect outside of their theme. The king cannot cast any solar level sorcery effect that isn't Total Annihilation or raise the puissant sanctum. While the primordials may have given or very least introduced the exalted to the principles of sorcery the exalted where the masters of it because they could cast any sorcery effect as long as it was in their Circle. The gods are similarly Limited to the primordials they can not cast sorcery effects that are outside of their mein. I will say this none of the primordials actually have themes that would allow them to spot things that are actively hiding working to hide from them in places where the primordials do not have eyes. The only one who might have the purview to do that was assassinated on the start of the war (The Lidless Eye That Sees/Sacheverell) Which means just having the box somewhere not in Yu Shan in a dimensional pocket would be enough.
They could work together to perform actions none of them were capable of alone and did so with regularity. That's what Creation was in the first place.

I feel like there's a weird double standard here where the primordials are as immeasurably powerful as they are eldritch and the exalted impossible motes of reality defying perfection only when it advances our interests but are conveniently mailable when it wouldn't.

We're talking about the gods above the gods and the engines that killed them. They should get full billing regardless of how much it helps or harms what we're trying to do at the time.
 
[X] Sigh... time to remove temptation, at least you can make yourself feel better by punching a fire monster in the face
 
That's interesting is it outside themes for them? Inherently all of the primordials are creatures of the real for lack of better way of saying it they are makers of Worlds and their selves and definition creating something together that essentially Acts an ultimately defining World that permanently changes and makes real something in the universe seems like it's perfectly in theme for all of them and the fact they did it together makes it greater than if they could have done it apart or alone. That and I think they might have learned from Zen mu (creation prototype) which apparently was made in a more thematic fashion but was kind of a massive mess and a massive disappointment so they chose to go for more cohesive image for their next creation or I guess their first true Creation.

The things that differentiated Creation from the Wild were all inherent to the Primordial condition, but within Creation were contained things opposed to each Primordial. Yet all of that was of Creation was interconnected. So for instance SWLiHN contributed in some distant way to the concept of free will, Theion so the subtle fall of dewdrops etc...
 
I think the scale here is different. Rebuilding requires vulnerability, knowledge, and leverage to apply the latter to the former. Hard to acquire but if the exaltation can't fight you then you can evidently do a lot to it.

Screwing with an exaltation abroad is screwing with it while it can do things. The exaltation isn't an exalted, but it's the source of their power and in the scope of the quest we've seen them act on their environments to facilitate getting their chosen host. Carving up someone rendered helpless is different than say stabbing them when they're able to use a perfect defense.

The primordials had access to these tools and put substantial effort into the actions we do see them take related to the exaltations themselves. I think assuming they and everyone who came after them didn't try even the most obvious options and/or failed to competently execute any plans they did implement is ridiculous. It's making the setting dumb so we can style on it like a self indulgent fix-fic.
The exaltation is not the source of exalted power. It's a catalyst and mechanism of their spiritual growth. Exalted are the source of Exalted power.

And I strongly, and fundamentally disagree with your position. I don't agree that exaltations being directable makes the setting dumb. Exaltations were the masterpiece of Autochton, the Primordials suffered an unexpected blow, and weren't allowed to recover by the exalted host.

In fact, your insistence that no controls / guidance of exaltation shards should be possible also break the lore of the setting. How would the gods prepared the exalted host in secret if they couldn't control who exalts? How would they have hidden the first host from view if the exaltations happened all over Creation, with no care for the host's allegiance?

No, it makes sense that one can direct who will exalt. Not with certainty, unless truly great effort is made, and it would require either access to tools of Autochton, or to exalted own abilities, and understanding of exaltations. I don't see a contradiction here.
 
The exaltation is not the source of exalted power. It's a catalyst and mechanism of their spiritual growth. Exalted are the source of Exalted power.

Eh... I would not go that far, it is the template for their growth. Solars grow in the likeness of Sol (though they can surpass him). Without that template there is no way a human soul could do the things a Solar can do.
 
They could work together to perform actions none of them were capable of alone and did so with regularity. That's what Creation was in the first place.

I feel like there's a weird double standard here where the primordials are as immeasurably powerful as they are eldritch and the exalted impossible motes of reality defying perfection only when it advances our interests but are conveniently mailable when it wouldn't.

We're talking about the gods above the gods and the engines that killed them. They should get full billing regardless of how much it helps or harms what we're trying to do at the time.
Exaltations have never been completely sacrosanct that's just not the case. The only thing that must be true about exaltations as far as Canon goes they are indestructible and they cannot be lessened they must go to humans and the being that wields it must be free willed. These constraints exist across all forms of exalted or people who exalt though they may later lose their free will. The process is a miracle the actual Soul fragment is a miracle but it's not by it's very nature against rigging. Exaltations if we follow the Abyssal and infernal scheme still must follow creature must be free willed must be human and the exalation cannot be lessened or destroyed. The fact of the matter is I'm not even sure the targeting criteria can be completely changed either considering infernals and Abyssals still Target people who could have been solars provided the situation just been a bit different though that might just be Sol's lingering influence.

The Titans were powerful that's true but they weren't omniscient nor were they omnipotent nor were they particularly insightful to things that weren't themselves. This is always been true. Theion at the height of the war could have wrenched the entirety of creation from its base and destroyed everything this is true that will require throwing away a small Infinity of work from both himself and his subjects so he didn't. Now he cries bitter tears of hateful acid that scorches Basalt bones as they crash against each other.
When it comes down to it the realities of the primordials changes depending on what you think they are. I'm of the belief that they were Overdeities not omniscient or omnipotent or particularly concerned with the well-being or even wants or needs of anything below them including parts of them like first Circle demons. They hated Auto they thought him lesser than that crippled and sick lesser in all ways. To engage with exaltation as an exercise in anything other than Annihilation is to acknowledge a working of the great maker that they so spurned is beyond their ability to spawn behemoths, demons and general massive monstrosities, that they definitely made the acausal weapons, the destruction that could be wrought by their power to deal with. Which is an instant deal breaker for a bunch of them. You think the Mountain and the Beast upon is going to say the cripple is more than him in any way you think the King of Kings is going to say the stunted sibling is more than him in any fashion you think the principle of hierarchy is going to to raise creatures from their perceived rightful place you think the principle of law is going to allow these things that have no legal precedent for representation to matter on a primordial scale. This is before we get into the ones that just didn't particularly care about the war and still don't like Qaf. Hell there were multiple primordials that left creation entirely when the war broke out in earnest only one of them bothered to come back.

In the end the Titans were the makers of reality they were also not actually an army or really even a faction they were worlds that kind of floated together through chaos and then made an Omega world that they could play on. The creations of the chains to bind Hegra the Typhoon of Nightmares occurred Before the War started, the planned assassination of the lidless eye that sees, the infiltration of the starborn into heaven as the maidens assistants, the Assembly of War equipment by the dragon Kings and the Mountain Folk, The Accelerated training of the exalted by the Unconquered Sun and the Maidens of Fate, The seduction of Gaia, the Five elemental dragons and their creation of the dragon-blooded. The primordial war was a hard fought battle from start to finish a period that is anywhere from 150 to 500 years. It was a hard fought battle because they were the makers of the world not because they were ready for a fight the raw might and the near inexhaustible armies of the primordials is nothing to scoff at or make any kind of fun up but the game was rigged from the start they did everything in their power to make sure that the primordials were blind and deaf at the start and they kept pushing killing destroying and taking any and everything they could from start to finish entire species died under the boot of the exalted armies in return the dragon Kings and the first Elementals and who knows how many Mortals all died to the primordials might and Wrath but the war was on.

Despite your insistence there is no evidence that the exalted ever died on Mass. There's plenty of the contrary including the fact that there are people who lived from the beginning to the end of the war. Solars dying of old age not even half way through the age of dreams, the text of fixed life times on Sidereals having been met before, the limitations of the Dragonblooded on both speed of reproduction and number, the training of the incarna mattering.

The primordials did just have weird limitations and that's okay. Auto unlike all the siblings needs outside things to live or very least be moderately healthy otherwise he falls into senescence. She who lives in her name despises free will. The shadow of all things is the antithesis of heroism and the principal of antagonism. The river of Torment before they became the wind loved being injured and injuring drinking the screams of Untold billions of wyld things. They were worlds unto themselves and it's only by working together they can actually surpass their themes. The King by himself could not make creation one at that point he was still the ephemeral Tyrant so he lacked any material component that would make a world that wasn't just Stars screaming into an endless void like him. Neither could oramus, the Ebon dragon, she who lives in her name, Cycelyene ect. So they just did have weird limitations they weren't omniscient omnipotent or Omni capable at all if it was outside of their purview they almost literally couldn't do it.
 
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@DragonParadox I'm sorry if I'm being annoying but could you ban the subject of exaltation until the damn vote to deal with it wins the vote? This discussion was repeated more than ten times with the same people and the same arguments in addition to having completely gone beyond the scope of this quest and entered pure Exalted RPG. This is seriously affecting my enthusiasm for this quest and I'm sure other people's as well.

As a QM, could you please control this?
 
@DragonParadox I'm sorry if I'm being annoying but could you ban the subject of exaltation until the damn vote to deal with it wins the vote? This discussion was repeated more than ten times with the same people and the same arguments in addition to having completely gone beyond the scope of this quest and entered pure Exalted RPG. This is seriously affecting my enthusiasm for this quest and I'm sure other people's as well.

As a QM, could you please control this?

Oh, I did not realize it was upsetting people, sorry about that

Guys I think it is time to table the metaphysics especially as they are not very relevant to to the current vote. I don't want to make this a hard ban or anything since it is broadly relevant to the quest, but until something related to the First Age comes up in quest you guys are going to have the same limited information to work with especially when it comes to the big questions like what the Primordials were.

Thank you for your understanding.
 
The exaltation is not the source of exalted power. It's a catalyst and mechanism of their spiritual growth. Exalted are the source of Exalted power.

And I strongly, and fundamentally disagree with your position. I don't agree that exaltations being directable makes the setting dumb. Exaltations were the masterpiece of Autochton, the Primordials suffered an unexpected blow, and weren't allowed to recover by the exalted host.

In fact, your insistence that no controls / guidance of exaltation shards should be possible also break the lore of the setting. How would the gods prepared the exalted host in secret if they couldn't control who exalts? How would they have hidden the first host from view if the exaltations happened all over Creation, with no care for the host's allegiance?

No, it makes sense that one can direct who will exalt. Not with certainty, unless truly great effort is made, and it would require either access to tools of Autochton, or to exalted own abilities, and understanding of exaltations. I don't see a contradiction here.
I think we've not so much best this horse to death as ground it to slurpy like paste.

How about we put a pin in it till later? I disagree with your position almost entirely, but I don't have anything new to say and it's unlikely either of us will convince anyone we haven't already at this point.

Better to focus on stuff we're more aligned on for now, like what to make using the fire spirit and its domain if we end up killing the thing.

I'm in favor of using it for our murder mansion, but there's something to be said for making something to enhance our circle to harvest more reagents latter. Like making an irresponsibly large magical flamethrower/fire evocation tool for Harry:

Assuming 3 dots of reagent value and our forge for a 4 dot splendor
Form of Crackling Fire (1 pt. Form Element)
The Splendor takes the form of something that is hot, or brightly-colored, or energetic. It might
be decorated with flame-like markings, it might actually be on fire, or it might simply be a free-
standing flame which does not burn its owner. This Element defines the Splendor's physical
form and gives it a character, and that character is aligned with the elemental power of fire.
Other Elements may draw upon this fact.
The Splendor cannot be burned. As an Adornment, it lowers the difficulty for its user to soak
damage from heat or fire by two, or allows them to soak their Stamina to soak such damage if
they're not normally able. As the basis for a Fascination, it may generate the creator's choice of:
sufficient warmth to provide protection from freezing weather; sufficient light to see for
(Splendor's rating) x 10 yards around the Splendor; or may be literally ablaze with the intensity
of a bonfire.
Form of the Keep (4 pt. Form Element)
This Element can only be incorporated into Fascinations.
The Exalt touches a spot of land, or building or collection of buildings about the size of a manor
house, high school, or large local park when summoning the Splendor. It exists as an
enchantment cast over the entire structure or a large defined outdoor area ("this entire street and
both of the sidewalks"). The Splendor is coded with conditions and instructions on how to
interact with the affected region. Root Elements such as Beautiful Lie (see p. XX) can then go to
work upon any valid target in the area. Realizing that there's something weird about the
enchanted area requires a Perception + Awareness roll against difficulty (4 + Splendor's rating).
If this is the only Form Element a Splendor has, the difficulty of rolls to resist it are lowered by
one, and it manifests in the form of a feature that would make sense in the environment (a tree or
bench in a park) but is slightly out of date or out of fashion.
Private Idaho (3 pt. Root Element)
This Element creates a mystical "pocket" realm, accessible only through the Splendor. The
Splendor must possess at least one Form Element with a character, which both defines the style
and possibilities of the private realm, and defines the shape of the object which serves as means
of entry to the realm. The Splendor must also possess a location-type Form element, such as
Form of the Hearth. This dictates the size of the pocket Realm, rather than causing the Splendor
to affect a widespread area as it normally would.
As an Adornment, only the user may enter this pocket realm. They must pay a point of
Willpower while wearing the Splendor to do so. They leave a faint mystical imprint upon the
world while in their pocket realm, and must spend another point of Willpower to return to the
world at the point of that imprint.
As a Fascination, the Splendor itself serves as a doorway into and out of the pocket Realm, at
least for those who know the trick of triggering Private Idaho to admit them. Those already
inside may leave at any time through an obvious doorway, unless other Elements are used to
confound such attempts.
If the Splendor is destroyed or banished (or, in the case of Adornments, removed) while anyone
is inside the pocket realm, they are violently ejected back into the real world at their point of
departure, taking (Splendor's rating) in levels of lethal damage.
Sovereign Elemental Sway (1 pt. Mystic Element)
The Splendor manipulates and reshapes that which resonates with its character, as defined by
Form Elements such as Form of Crackling Fire and Form of Ash and Dust. The benefits
provided depend on whether the Splendor is an Adornment or Fascination, and on which Form or
Forms it has incorporated.
Incorporated into an Adornment, this Element allows the Exalt to use Craft actions to sculpt
wind, water, and fire as though they were clay, creating impossible works of art or short-lived
elemental tools. Living wood can be induced to grow into patterns the Exalt desires in the same
fashion, while the difficulty to work with stone or metal is reduced by two. The difficulty to craft
dead flesh into Arcana may be reduced by two as well. The Exalt can raise or lower the Gauntlet
by one degree per success on a Crafts roll to modify it, and can rework the chimerical identity of
things.
Incorporated into a Fascination, this Element allows the Splendor to rewrite the details of
landscapes and objects, rerouting the paths of a graveyard, changing the appearance of a corpse,
repairing a rundown wooden shack, or making a barren landscape green and verdant.
To the mundane eye this splendor appears to a mote of fire, like someone stole the flame off a candle's wick. The owner may manifest it anywhere on their person without fear of it causing them or their possessions any harm, most commonly in a pocket as the name suggests, but to anyone or thing else it acts as natural fire.

While it may seem like a sorcerer's party trick, the small flame is truthfully an aperture to an incandescent fortress of elemental fire. This endless flame has an unnatural loyalty to the Splendor's master, readily jumping to fulfill their whims and can even be drawn forth through its anchor in vast quantity.

Harry can draw energy from things in his environment, so seems to me that giving him a few acres of elemental fire in a bottle that should actively work to help his magic within the limits of SES would be a pretty hilarious power boost.

Edit:

My bad, started this before the ban and posted after finishing the splendor without refreshing.
 
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@DragonParadox I'm sorry if I'm being annoying but could you ban the subject of exaltation until the damn vote to deal with it wins the vote? This discussion was repeated more than ten times with the same people and the same arguments in addition to having completely gone beyond the scope of this quest and entered pure Exalted RPG. This is seriously affecting my enthusiasm for this quest and I'm sure other people's as well.

As a QM, could you please control this?
Oh, I did not realize it was upsetting people, sorry about that

Guys I think it is time to table the metaphysics especially as they are not very relevant to to the current vote. I don't want to make this a hard ban or anything since it is broadly relevant to the quest, but until something related to the First Age comes up in quest you guys are going to have the same limited information to work with especially when it comes to the big questions like what the Primordials were.

Thank you for your understanding.
I think we've not so much best this horse to death as ground it to slurpy like paste.

How about we put a pin in it till later? I disagree with your position almost entirely, but I don't have anything new to say and it's unlikely either of us will convince anyone we haven't already at this point.
My sincere apologies, I got carried away. If anyone wishes to continue the discussion, PMs are probably better for that.
Better to focus on stuff we're more aligned on for now, like what to make using the fire spirit and its domain if we end up killing the thing.
Manse foundations. The directions align with four of the elements, North being Wind / Air, West with Fire, East with Water, South either aligning with Earth, or Wood, if Porter's sanctuary aligns with Earth. We would probably need to control all of those in at least some way if we are to do large scale geomancy.
 
Meh, I thought the Exalted discussion was very interesting. Seeing as I'm not very familiar with it. To each his own.

In regards to the vote.. Harry's hangups aside he first met Molly when she was 12 and there's over a decade of an age gap. I never saw her crush as something to seriously pursue. Learning to take no for an answer (though I can't recall if Harry ever explicitly said no) is part of growing up.

[X] Sigh... time to remove temptation, at least you can make yourself feel better by punching a fire monster in the face

@DragonParadox Btw the previous errors are still present.
 
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