Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

Oh I think it's perfectly in character for them though Michael is savvy enough to know this isn't always the most pragmatic enough he is down right an actual Saint by most standards. Any chance we will have the opportunity ask the monks what was it they were buying? If they refuse to answer that's fine I won't pry just I figure both in and ooc we are interested.

It will come up in the next update, there is no way it wouldn't with Molly's urge being what it is.
 
Is that actually true I thought a lot of Hells were stupid huge and often non Euclidean? Unless their far lesser than what they once were which I could see.
No idea. Never get a geographic size for say the wicked city.

It could be infinite or the size of a normal city.

Kakuri is explicitly a reflection of northern Japan. So is probably not all that large.

Of course whatever weird space effects might make things any variety of sizes. So who can say.

I can say with confidence. A planet is large. Very, very, almost mind bendingly large.
 
No idea. Never get a geographic size for say the wicked city.

It could be infinite or the size of a normal city.

Kakuri is explicitly a reflection of northern Japan. So is probably not all that large.

Of course whatever weird space effects might make things any variety of sizes. So who can say.

I can say with confidence. A planet is large. Very, very, almost mind bendingly large.
Yeah though we are talking about exalted I think the underworld was explicitly in some instances literally endless for example unsure if some hells werent like that. Exalted is a silly place where high level solars I think could parry something like the big bang.
 
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I suspect that the Hells are finite but may be, basically procedurally generated/fractal, so you can keep finding new horrors if you keep looking
 
Yeah though we are talking about exalted I think the underworld was explicitly in some instances literally endless for example unsure if some helps werent like that. Exalted is a silly place where high level solars I think could parry something like the big bang.
The Underworld was a mirror of Creation, as far as I know.

As to the parrying, yes.

Even if it does infinite damage (Godspear), is made by an infinitely large being (Cecelyne) or someone who could destroy or move the laws of the world (Theion).

I am not sure if the Big Bang is even infinite damage or "just" some arbitrarily large number.

Since its most likely embodied in Cytherea who has...no stats and barely any info.
 
The Underworld was a mirror of Creation, as far as I know.

As to the parrying, yes.

Even if it does infinite damage (Godspear), is made by an infinitely large being (Cecelyne) or someone who could destroy or move the laws of the world (Theion).

I am not sure if the Big Bang is even infinite damage or "just" some arbitrarily large number.

Since its most likely embodied in Cytherea who has...no stats and barely any info.
It also had layers I believe of universes that weren't born.
 
Maybe collectively.

The wicked city makes no mention of being larger than a regular metropolis, though it does go down quite a ways.

Cant find much about boiling oil or flayed alive.

Flayed alive is a desert, boiling oil is a large body of boiling fat but I cant say what size.
 
It also had layers I believe of universes that weren't born.
I don't quite remember that in Exalted, but in oWoD. I might be wrong though.

And infinite attacks aren't even that exclusive in Exalted, as crazy as it is.

E9 (E8 with Divine Transcendence of Melee) World-Scarring Solar Glory lets any Solar Melee user hit for "arbitrary" damage, which means you select how much it does. From zero to infinite.

And Perfect Attacks are, of course, much more common.
 
I don't quite remember that in Exalted, but in oWoD. I might be wrong though.

And infinite attacks aren't even that exclusive in Exalted, as crazy as it is.

E9 (E8 with Divine Transcendence of Melee) World-Scarring Solar Glory lets any Solar Melee user hit for "arbitrary" damage, which means you select how much it does. From zero to infinite.

And Perfect Attacks are, of course, much more common.
Sad quest is basically limited to a mere essence 5 we can probably kill some gods with essence 5 right? Well I guess we could possibly get more essence via conquering the nevernever or hells maybe.
 
Okay?
And the anima can continue carrying us for a while.
Its not going to work without Essence raising anyway as we want to turn it on at the start like Exce.

Edit: Comparatively not much is going to carry against being shot by a lot of people because we don't have Fivefold Bulwark Stance. We do have a Skinned Alive equivalent, but that'd be a lot of EXP.
My main concern is Essence. Boiling Sea is good and cheap, Hellscry is good to get as we don't have Sight anymore and Opened Eye of the Hurricane is...not good for a good while. It rolls Dex + Athletics...
Her anima carries her when its active. Its only active after she spends 4 Essence.
Usum gives a -2 DC reduction to Awareness rolls, giving her the equivalent of a mortal dice pool of 4 against physical danger.
But thats it.

Like I said, Molly is pretty bad at noticing things.
  1. Knights are not Exalts, they do not have blanket immunity to things, if someone were trying to mess with their heads and force them to do things sure they get to fight it will against magic even if the spell does not normally allow it. If someone is just trying to walk way... someone not a demon, not fey just old and wicked but very much human sword's not going to ping
  2. He knows what is in that bag and by any reasonable code of ethics it is theirs by right, it only ended up in Marcone's possession by a combination of malice and random chance over the years. Michael does not enforce contract law with gangsters over the sanctity of holy things to be in the proper keeping. He is not fey and there is a reason the Knights never signed the Accords because those might force you to do just that
These are my opinions, at least.

-Yes, they arent Exalts.
That said, they DO have blanket immunity to attempts to mess with their heads, and even to hostile magic. Fidelacchius gave Dresden immunity to Nicodemus shadow when he was strangling him. But it didnt stop the Leanansidhe transforming its bearer to a dog in Changes in order to get them to Chichen Itza, because that magic was beneficial.

The Swords level the playing field. Whatever it takes.
Remember that the Denarians are mortals, just with a Fallen angel riding along. If plain mortal mojo in a combat scenario was enough to give the enemy cover to run away, they would have been exploiting this loophole hard to escape.

-Knights work on trust among humans and entities with free will. Their word, and the appearance of their word, matters.

-Yes he does respect contract law even when the other side is shady.

After Shiro exchanged himself for Dresden, Michael and Sanya did not stage an immediate rescue to get him out of Denarian hands. When the Leanandsidhe got her hands on Amorrachius in Grave Peril because Dresden grabbed it and attempted to use it, Michael wasnt able to just walk up and take it back as stolen goods. Not even when she gave it to the Red Court.

In Skin Game, he was part of the heist team into Hades vault alongside Nicodemus, with Uriel's approval and aid.
He didnt attack him, but kept the terms until Nicodemus broke the deal.

In a situation where Marcone didnt actually steal the goods involved, but came into possession of them, amd was willing to return them in good faith as part of an agreed financial deal, I dont think Michael or Sanya would be able to condone just walking off.
Especially since his reputation, and that of the Knights was used to guarantee the deal.

And the monks are not big enough supernatural players to be able to survive the reputation hit from being known to screw people on contracts on a technicality. Else they wouldnt need Michael as a guarantor.
There's a reason everyone is on their guard around Sidhe.

Thats my opinion at least.
 
Sad quest is basically limited to a mere essence 5 we can probably kill some gods with essence 5 right? Well I guess we could possibly get more essence via conquering the nevernever or hells maybe.
Probably.

We can get up to like 140 combined HLs using Shintai forms and self-res, and do 5 attacks per turn at full dicepools of 27, dealing Agg and use Murder is Meat as Spirit-killer.

Without using situationals like -1 diff from being wet, dice from Without Honour etc.

Whether that is ENOUGH to kill a god...who knows, probably. At least some.

Her anima carries her when its active. Its only active after she spends 4 Essence.
We can turn it on even after spending one mote as per the Ebenezer battle.

Its Anima Control not leashed anima.
 
In Exalted 2e, the underworld is the size of the normal world (which in the present (of 2ed) day has a similar size that the surface of earth, but with more land and less ocean). Malfes/Hell/the Yozis are weird, they are probably at least as big, but for many their size is not just non-euclidian but just weird, conceptual and subjective, like Cecylene being so big you need 5 days to cross, regardless of how fast you move, or Qafs height being both infinite and determined by how enlightened and wise the viewer is. And lets not start on Oramus, whos defined by being impossible to define.
 
Sad quest is basically limited to a mere essence 5 we can probably kill some gods with essence 5 right? Well I guess we could possibly get more essence via conquering the nevernever or hells maybe.
Exalted host won the war with E5 being the max they had.

Now, we are not the whole host, not even close. But I would expect us to be able to meaningfully fight Uriel if we made preparations.
 
Malfes/Hell/the Yozis are weird, they are probably at least as big
I know that Malfeas is infinite, in that he has finitely large layers, but has an infinite number of layers.

Cecelyne is infinitely large, the 5 days to cross is due to Surrender Oaths making her, so she can't just trap people eternally or not let people into Malfeas.

Edit: Their geography is fucked though, yes.

Every layer of Malfeas connects to Cecelyne, has Ligier shine on it and touches Kimbery. No matter how deep or not or...you know.
 
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Her anima carries her when its active. Its only active after she spends 4 Essence.
Usum gives a -2 DC reduction to Awareness rolls, giving her the equivalent of a mortal dice pool of 4 against physical danger.
But thats it.

Like I said, Molly is pretty bad at noticing things.

These are my opinions, at least.

-Yes, they arent Exalts.
That said, they DO have blanket immunity to attempts to mess with their heads, and even to hostile magic. Fidelacchius gave Dresden immunity to Nicodemus shadow when he was strangling him. But it didnt stop the Leanansidhe transforming its bearer to a dog in Changes in order to get them to Chichen Itza, because that magic was beneficial.

The Swords level the playing field. Whatever it takes.
Remember that the Denarians are mortals, just with a Fallen angel riding along. If plain mortal mojo in a combat scenario was enough to give the enemy cover to run away, they would have been exploiting this loophole hard to escape.

-Knights work on trust among humans and entities with free will. Their word, and the appearance of their word, matters.

-Yes he does respect contract law even when the other side is shady.

After Shiro exchanged himself for Dresden, Michael and Sanya did not stage an immediate rescue to get him out of Denarian hands. When the Leanandsidhe got her hands on Amorrachius in Grave Peril because Dresden grabbed it and attempted to use it, Michael wasnt able to just walk up and take it back as stolen goods. Not even when she gave it to the Red Court.

In Skin Game, he was part of the heist team into Hades vault alongside Nicodemus, with Uriel's approval and aid.
He didnt attack him, but kept the terms until Nicodemus broke the deal.

In a situation where Marcone didnt actually steal the goods involved, but came into possession of them, amd was willing to return them in good faith as part of an agreed financial deal, I dont think Michael or Sanya would be able to condone just walking off.
Especially since his reputation, and that of the Knights was used to guarantee the deal.

And the monks are not big enough supernatural players to be able to survive the reputation hit from being known to screw people on contracts on a technicality. Else they wouldnt need Michael as a guarantor.
There's a reason everyone is on their guard around Sidhe.

Thats my opinion at least.
  1. Point on the swords leveling the field, I did not want to make them too strong because they are so ill defined and I do not want Sword to be the solution to everything. I think I may have fallen the other way
  2. The answer that springs to mind most readily with regards to the deal is that he is not the one who is going against his word here, he is simply not enforcing it, but if I take that position I am arguing technicalities so that is a contradiction by default.
Edits incoming, time to see if you can extricate those gangsters before the cops arrive.
 
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Edits done. Brother Divsimar is even more under the weather because he had to use even more magic to get the thugs to calm down, but you now have them with you as well. They are not fit to drive anyone anywhere.
 
Just noticed the edit, keep in mind that Marcone is some gangster in Chicago who happens to know about the supernatural, it does not seem likely that monks in Nepal would have much reason to do repeat business with him. At least she does not think they are buying smuggled guns, drugs the services of professional escorts etc...
You are misremembering.

Marcone has been a contract signatory of Monoc Securities, run by the entity formerly known as Odin, for several years now.
Gard showed up on his payroll back in Death Masks, two books ago. He doesnt become a Freeholding Lord until White Night, which is the next book in a year's time, but he isnt just some gangster. Not anymore.

Dude is a Player.
A local player at the moment, but still a controlling independent player, in the same major city and crossroads where the White Court King and the Warden regional commander have their HQs.

He's a bad enemy to make when you are a minor magical player, nevermind that you may live in Asia.
Especially when its an unnecessary enmity for make for money you were willing and able to pay.


Besides, even if he was just a gangster, human monks are not immune to bullets, and planes and hitmen do travel.
They wouldnt need Michael if they had no physical security concerns.
It just seems like it would be a dumb mistake for the monks to make to attempt to cheat him for money.

At the very worst, they would bail with the artifact(s), and then send the money to Marcone's offices.
 
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Speaking of Freeholding Lords, as a question for people who know Dresden better than I do, should we be angling to get that instead when it comes up?

"Molly Carpenter, Dread Lady of Chicago" has an awfully nice ring to it…
 
Speaking of Freeholding Lords, as a question for people who know Dresden better than I do, should we be angling to get that instead when it comes up?

"Molly Carpenter, Dread Lady of Chicago" has an awfully nice ring to it…
Eventually, but probably not until we're fairly established as an independent party.

While we're still up and coming our proverbial attack surface is very small, and we benefit from the ability to screw people over for our benefit lack of obligations and restrictions inherent to the Accords. The extra protections aren't worth the lost opportunities for the most part, in my opinion anyway.

Once we have more stuff for other people to try to break or steal we should try to sign on to make it more difficult to come after us.
 
  1. Point on the swords leveling the field, I did not want to make them too strong because they are so ill defined and I do not want Sword to be the solution to everything. I think I may have fallen the other way
  2. The answer that springs to mind most readily with regards to the deal is that he is not the one who is going against his word here, he is simply not enforcing it, but if I take that position I am arguing technicalities so that is a contradiction by default.
Edits incoming, time to see if you can extricate those gangsters before the cops arrive.
The Swords are plot devices. Their power level essentially scales to threat. Amoracchius the Sword of Love has shanked a Dragon, been noselled by the Leanansidhe, almost stolen by a misguided priest, and had trouble dealing with a bunch of attacking mortals working for Nicodemus. And in canon would show up at the fall of the Red Court.

I dont expect they'll be playing much of a part in our story; they've always managed to be absent for most of Dresden's problems.
Speaking of Freeholding Lords, as a question for people who know Dresden better than I do, should we be angling to get that instead when it comes up?
"Molly Carpenter, Dread Lady of Chicago" has an awfully nice ring to it…
Signatories to the Unseelie Accords, basically.

It doesnt GIVE power, it is a recognition of your having power, and institutes protocols for diplomacy, conflict resolution and even sorta laws of war. It is an attempt to....institute a set of rules to govern and control conflict among major supernatural nationstates and players in order to limit conflict and unnecessary escalation.

It does provide some protection to small signatories as part of that process to avoid escalation.
It doesnt stop larger players going after smaller ones if they find it profitable, just like the Denarians went after Marcone.
It doesnt stop war breaking out, like between the Red Court and White Council, or the Fomor and everyone else.

Doesnt even stop people breaking the Accords, like the Denarians kidnapping Marcone, or attacking the Archive after requesting her as a neutral intermediary.
It just guarantees consequences, because its backed by the biggest supernatural nation around.

Freeholding Lords are single people signatories with the same power and influence as supernatural nationstates.
Odin is one but Hades, to the best of our knowledge, is not, nor are most other gods.

Thing is, we're playing an RPG not an empire builder.
As such, I dont think that we benefit from most of the provisions involved in being a Freeholding Lord. Even though it would make instory sense to become one.

We're just not going to pursue it, I think. Unless it shows up as a plot thing.
 
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