Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

VOTE
[X] Normally, order a root beer


Can =/= Should.
Being a responsible grownup, being trustworthy includes knowing when to shut the fuck up.

To use a RL analogy? If you recognize or otherwise guess an LGBTQ person is passing irl, pointing and declaring their identity would at best be incredibly rude, and at worst be actively dangerous to their life and lifestyle. If you met an ex-addict or ex-alcoholic, or even an ex-felon, you wouldnt declare it to everyone you know.

Ditto an ex-angel, because think of all the fuckwits who would hear ex-angel and think magical reagent.
If Mac wanted people to know, he'd tell them.
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Lash has little reason to point that out, or even mention it if she did know Mac from back in the old days.
Buying cred with Dresden would be enough reason IMO.
I suspect it just isnt part of the memory download that Lasciel passed down to her Shadow.
Also noteworthy that Bob doesnt appear to know either.
 
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I just think finding out secrets big and small and sharing them out wether appropriate or not is just one of the fun things lore-focused Exalts can do, so let's do it.

Sonce so much of the supernatural world order is based on secrets, we can really have a lot of fun shaking it up. And then even more fun surviving attempts to silence us.
 
[X] Normally, order a root beer

Yeah, let's not mess stuff up for no reason.

Besides, knowledge loses value when more know it! :p
 
I just think finding out secrets big and small and sharing them out wether appropriate or not is just one of the fun things lore-focused Exalts can do, so let's do it.

Sonce so much of the supernatural world order is based on secrets, we can really have a lot of fun shaking it up. And then even more fun surviving attempts to silence us.
Thats just being an asshole.
Molly wouldnt consider it fun or amusing if someone did it to her, so why precisely would she do it to other people?

I mean, how would Molly feel if people at school walked in giving details of her juvenile criminal record? Or if someone walked in here and now to declared that she mindcontrolled her best friend and ex? Or to enumerate how many people she's killed? Or how she was kidnapped and hung on a tree by a (now dead) fetch?

What if people did it to her Dad's secrets?
Or her mother's? Or Dresden's?
Everybody has secrets, or stuff they'd prefer not be in general circulation.

Treating it as a fun game IC to reveal stuff just to stir shit up is just grossly irresponsible.
And makes people less likely to associate with you, or tell you stuff.
 
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Both that there's a flaw in his disguise, and that this is something he can do something about, instead of being a fundamental part of his nature. The fact that the Occult 5 Infernal Exalt rocking Perception buffs noticed does not mean anyone else did. Harry certainly didnt and he has Lash in his head.
There is a flaw in disguise. It's DC 9, but it's possible to notice. It is also something he can do something about - he just needs to add something to the diguise that will make it look like any of the Molly's discarded guesses.
And its precisely this sort of thing why I told people not to make that promise to Murphy.
And we are not in anyway obligated to tell Murphy about this.
You're not wrong, but this is our first meeting and we aren't exactly strongly linked to his circle as far as we know. He likes Harry enough to take an introduction from him positively, but they're not close in any real sense.

@Modus_Tollens had the right of it here; if we tell him* it should be privately.

I'd prefer to do it after we know each other a bit better too, just to avoid our observation sounding like a threat.

If we do have to do it here and now playing verbal subterfuge is silly. Write it on a napkin and hand it to him folded up. Let people wonder, we're weird and new enough that they'll be doing that anyway. Something more interesting about our weirdness will come up later to distract them, like the news that we'd like to grab a drink with Mab here in a little over a week.

* Which is itself probably a good thing, even if this apparently isn't a big deal most of the time. Probably because the only people good enough to see through him are wise enough not to screw with someone like him when he's not bothering anyone.
Hmm, that's a good point. Though I'll point out that the vote itself doesn't say "tell him". The subtle vote says "hint at what you noticed", nothing about verbal communication.

[X] Hint at what you noticed (Charisma+ Subterfuge)
-[X] Subterfuge excellency
-[X] Non-verbally, and concentrating on the flaw of the disguise, rather than his nature
 
There is a flaw in disguise. It's DC 9, but it's possible to notice. It is also something he can do something about - he just needs to add something to the diguise that will make it look like any of the Molly's discarded guesses.
It's not just difficult to see, but nearly impossible to interpret.

Noticing that his clothes are unnaturally clean is the easy part, being able to deduct that no commonly used magic can cause this effect without noticable side-effects and then having a list of beings with absolute effects who might do it Mac's way in your head, that's the real earity.
 
There is a flaw in disguise. It's DC 9, but it's possible to notice. It is also something he can do something about - he just needs to add something to the diguise that will make it look like any of the Molly's discarded guesses.
Being Grigori means he's been out in these supernatural streets since before recorded history was a thing.
The man has been around since before the Fae Courts were given sole responsibility for the Outer Gates. We're leaning well into arrogance to assume that this is something he doesnt actually know about, or which hasnt been pointed out to him before.

And we are not in anyway obligated to tell Murphy about this.
Yes we are.
We made a commitment that we didnt have to; I quote:
"I didn't become a cop to try to pray my problems away Miss Carpenter." There isn't much heat left in the words. "You've made your point, I'm not going to ask you for more details on this case, but I'd like your word at least that when some trouble comes into town, even if it's the kind SI can't handle you'll give me a call. Harry is better about that than he used to be, but that does not mean he's all good."
What do you reply?
[] Promise to give a heads up of any major supernatural happening in Chicago in exchange for Murphy listening to your advice in such matters carefully
Letter and spirit of the promise we made.
A freaking ex-angel setting up shop in the Chicago area is very much germane to the letter and spirit of the promise.

We're also obliged to tell Murphy that Mab is coming to town by the letter and spirit of that promise.

EDIT
We had the opportunity to refuse. To request caveats and carve outs. We didnt take it.
That brings us down to breaking our word or potentially pissing off supernaturals.
Or going back to renegotiate or tell her we cant keep it.

This isnt a surprise.
I pointed it out during the vote.
 
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It's honestly not much of a weakness in his disguise. I mean, Molly knows he's an angel because of unnatural insight, but in all honesty most people would assume things are just absurdly clean because Mac has brownies working for him or a minor talent or something.

But again, MOST people who notice are too polite to pry, or if they know they keep it to themselves.

I'll point out our promise was to inform Murphy 'when trouble comes to town'. Mac has been living here forever, and has not caused trouble. If she honestly thinks we promised to out the secrets of every harmless supernatural in the city for zero reason, that's her problem.
 
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[X] Normally, order a root beer

I think the spirit of the promise to Murphy is just that we're supposed to warn her before something major happens that might spill over into mortal affairs -- a big fight, a new player trying to move in, any of the events that're the center of a Dresden Files book, etc. There's a lot of things that're just business-as-usual that she doesn't have to be told about. Mac's a fixture of the Chicago supernatural scene and explicitly isn't causing trouble. A diplomatic meeting with Mab on neutral ground, even, is something that's not necessarily trouble... though it might well result in a follow-up event that we'd be obligated to tell Murphy about.
 
We are required to tell if Mab the destroyer is coming to town, not Mab the negotiator.
Thats just sophistry, and trying to rules lawyer a freely-adopted promise with the most juvenile middle school shit.
After the fact, at that.
By that reasoning you could replace that name with anyone from Nicodemus to He Who Walks Behind.

I warned people that making promises is Serious Business.
We made one. We keep it.
Or we decide we cant keep it and acknowledge that we cant.

Not weasel word this shit barely two weeks after making it and burn our fucking credibility to the ground when it eventually comes out. That will hurt us far worse in a setting where your reputation is only as good as your word.
 
While we are obligated to tell Murphy when Mab is around, because She is big disruptive news, we are in no way required to mention that there is an angel peacefully running a pub and not doing anything else.

Murphy wants a heads up about supernatural trouble, even things she can't do anything about. Mac isn't supernatural trouble, just like Porter and anything else that has been living in Chicago without being a problem.
 
Thats just sophistry, and trying to rules lawyer a freely-adopted promise with the most juvenile middle school shit.
After the fact, at that.
By that reasoning you could replace that name with anyone from Nicodemus to He Who Walks Behind.
It sounds more like you are just angry we made the promise, and trying to shoehorn in a definition of the promise that we can't keep because of that. So yes, sophistry? Look in a mirror. Better yet, look at Murphy's speech prior to us making the promise.

"I would try to reason with you over it," she replies carefully. "And if you were not amenable to reason I'd leave you be as long as I had some assurance that broken pipes is all you would do. Look," Her left hand twitches as though she'd like to run her fingers though her hair or some other nervous gesture. "I get that the full rigor of the law is not an option out here, it's the Wild West, but even the Wild West had sherifs and they did not have one for part of the town and another for the other part. For cases of clear and present danger to the people if Chicago I either act or I am not doing my job." In other words 'I'm abandoning my duty'. The good detective is making a lot more sense than you would have given her credit for even if it is by sheer stubbornness.

Clear and present danger to the people of Chicago. Mac? If Murphy is so completely childish as to disregard the spirit of the promise for an arbitrary definition that doesn't even fit the letter of what we promised, that's not on us, period, and if anything any minor supernatural players will think we were silly to try cooperating with the cops in the first place, and the major ones will likewise think we were silly to try but applaud any wordplay to weasel out of a promise.

You will find little sympathy for most of Chicago's finest throughout Chicago, and less in the circles we travel in.
 
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Letter and spirit of the promise we made.
A freaking ex-angel setting up shop in the Chicago area is very much germane to the letter and spirit of the promise.

No? He isn't there as a major happening in Chicago, so we have no obligations to talk about him to her.

He's a bartender, she asked us to talk about invaders and conquerors, shakers and movers, he isn't in any of these categories.

It sounds more like you are just angry we made the promise, and trying to shoehorn in a definition of the promise that we can't keep because of that.

It very much does sounds like it.
 
First line of the accords "There is no spirit of the law, only its letter." In dresden files nobody cares about the spirit of a deal, only the letter, and save for the Fey the latter is optional as well.
 
[X] Normally, order a root beer

[X][Stunt] "Ah heavenly, this tastes divine".

@DragonParadox : Shouldn't we get back 2 essence for finding out a supernatural secret?
 
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