Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

Yeah, that's our job.
(who were the people who did a lot of the finance stuff in ASWaH?)
Let's not do that again. While I greatly enjoyed ASWAH, even the bookkeeping I assisted with, that often involved more work in spreadsheets than I do at my actual job.

This is another reason to get very rich. Most purchases become much easier to handwave with minimal effort toward tracking expenditures when they effectively amount to rounding errors against your total wealth.
 
we realy need to make the whole zone bbetter as a permanent residence zone also i wonder could we make a better stroller using exelency?
 
[X] Yog
Small note, Molly dos not have the power to send anyone to a good hell since she does not have a hell at all. That's a charm you can take, but until you, the players, take that charm Molly only has the barest hint of the potential, one she does not understand IC
I didn't mean Directly, more "knows what behavior will lead to what specific Hell after death".
Basically the information already detailed in The Big Book Of Yomi Wan.
 
Sorry about the wait. Had to run errands.

VOTE
[X]Plan Codex
-[X] Rules: Governance
--[X]Golden rule. Dont be an asshole
--[X][Internal]: Guest right principles towards other members. Disputes adjudicated by mutually agreed arbitrator or random lot drawing of three people. Penalties are financial, duties and restitution where possible.
--[X][Vampire Feeding]: If necessary, then nonlethal . Exception may be made in fight for ones life
--[X][Leadership]Election. Meetings may be called by three people or Diplomat. Molly reserves right to intervene
--[X][Exit Procedures]: At-will, peacefully. Lethal or premeditated harm to a member, or willful subversion of a standing order is grounds for expulsion
-[X] Other
--[X][Medical] Medical screening by Molly and Lydia. Free and lowcost clinics for routine care, ER for emergencies. All else ask Molly, including hard to obtain/expensive pharmaceuticals.
--[X][Reintegration]Have Sarah get personal details from those who want it so we can work on establishing/reestablishing legal ID trail
-[X]Jade Dogs Financials: $100,000
--[X][New <Recruits/Infrastructure/Medical/Entertainment> Spending]: $10,000
--[X][Fund transfer]: $15,000 cash + $75,000 checking account, debit cards with treasurer. $3000 daily ATM withdrawal limit: $90,000.
--[X][Personal Allowance]: 9x ghouls + 3x Whampires @ $200/month(100 base, 100 hazard) + 6x others @ $100/month: $3000/month
--[X][Food]: 9x ghouls (x2 multiplier) + 3x Whampires (x1 multiplier) + 6x mortals(x1 multiplier) at 300/month: $8100/month
--[X][Transport]CTA monthly bus/rail passes for 18: $75x18: $1350/month.
--[X][Communication]Cellphones: $550/month


RATIONALE
Molly Starting Cash: $460,000
Bulk Cash Spend This Month: $10,000
Jade Dogs Cash Reserve: $90,000
Estimated Ongoing Expenses: $13,000/month

Molly Cash Reserves: $360,000


We have enough cash to bump up some things, including spending on entertainment that we ommitted last turn, some more cellphones, and an actual monthly cash allowance.
Monetary and other benefits provide additional incentive for good behavior.

New Whampire recruits are Malvora.
They feed on fear. Should be easy enough, hopefully.
 
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Worried that the vote might be too close with too few vote so it might be a good idea if some lurkers join in.
 
My thoughts are why do we need to calculate the amounts we need to divide between Molly and the people? By leaving it blank, we are not locking it in and can assign as much or as little as possible.

Besides which, I really do not want to micro manage to give DragonParadox room to interpret.

I simply do not get why we need to make a budget. Why not say Molly spends on this and leave it at that? That would avoid unnecessary complications.
Ah, ok, yeah, that's reasonable. But I think
--[] Provisionally set 50% of the funds we have for this activity. Reevaluate the needed cash on the ongoing basis. The money will be in a separate account, accessed through a cyberdevil dedicated to managing it

Is about as much abstraction as reasonably possible. How would you write this part? I feel that we need to indicate something beyond "don't be stingy"

Suggestions:
1) In regards to feeding - we probably should encourage "done with consent to volunteers who are compensated monetarily and otherwise" behavior from vampires.
2) We definitely should do interviews and background checks, to see if anyone here now (or in the future) is a spy, or someone who intends to do harm to the community (a serial killer / rapist who is either unrepentant or can't control themselves)
 
Ok, so trying to incorporate suggestions and other votes into my monstrocity of a thing. See below. Changes are indicated in bold. They are:
1) Money are handled by the treasurer with help of cyberdevils.
2) I tried to fuzzy the money out as much as possible. If people want, I'll put in @uju32 budget, with the excess (that plan assumes less spending) going into stuff like looking for an above-ground property and such
3) As per Uju's idea, added Sarah Greene into looking at the people's details
4) Limited the number of cyberdevils. Not eliminated completely, but limited. Helping others vs. operational security and such.
5) Added a line to the sub-part where we try to involve the churches.

[X] Plan "I was made for this" v 1.1
-[X] Leadership excellency, and others as appropriate
-[X][Rules]
--[X] Golden rule. Don't be an asshole
--[X] (Definition) Molly's people include not just those who serve her directly but also those who are under her protection and any companies that she owns and the things or people that are under her control.
--[X] (General rules of behavior) Based on guest rights, those who seek Molly's protection should not seek to endanger themselves or others under her protection, should not seek to provoke or endanger others without a cause, should, as they can, work on imrpoving their lives
--[X] (Feeding/Addiction) Those who have special needs that harm others, are required to cause as little harm to others as is reasonably possible and may only cause permanent harm as a last resort. The exception is combat, where they may use their best judgment depending on the situation. If there is an alternative that does not cause harm to others or themselves, they are required to use that to feed. If at all possible, feeding on volunteers, with appropriate compensation, monetary or otherwise, should be prioritized
--[X] (Direct employment) Those people who want a direct employment with Molly will be obliged to honestly and sincerely work for the benefit of Molly and her people/Company. They must not betray Molly or her people. They can slack off, but not to the point that Molly and her people suffers for it.
--[X] (Leaving) If people are unhappy, they can always just leave, Molly will make no move to hold them and give them 3 months time to find an alternative, in which they must follow Molly's rules to avail the protection.
--[X] (Promotion) Institute a system of social credit, where initiative and self-organization are encouraged. The promotions to leadership positions should be based on a mix between competence and popularity, with as many democratic principles as possible
--[X] (Meetings) Meetings may be called by three people or Diplomat
--[X] (Interactions) encourage socialization, helping each other
--[X] (Exile) If they break the laws, they are kicked out and are no longer under Molly's protection. They may appeal this with Molly who acts as the final judge.
-[X][Means]
--[X] Put cyberdevils and Thomas on setting up an official charity with a mission statement of reintroducing those outside of mortal society into it.
--[X] Provisionally set 50% of the funds we have for this activity. Reevaluate the needed cash on the ongoing basis. Money is handled by the treasurer with the help of cyberdevils.
--[X] Do a census. Get information about who the people who join are. Have cyberdevils run down their details. Ask Sarah Greene for help too. Interview people with All Things Betray on, and running excellencies as needed to find if there are any unrepentant (or unable to control themseles) serial killers / rapists, or others who are willing and able to do those under your protection harm
--[X] Gather information on what the people need. Medical conditions, food allergies, who has lice, etc. Get someone to handle bulk purchasing necessary supplies: food, hygienic ones, clothes, heaters for the coming winter, entertainment
--[X] Check above ground to find closest warehouse that is still an area of urban blight. See about purchasing it for the charity.
--[X] Ask father Forthill and brother Devisimar if they, or other members of their respectful organizations will be interested in helping and/or ministering to the people in the Underground, under your protection and with your help, including monetary help. Churches have lone experience with charities.
--[X] Start purchasing cheap but sturdy mobile phones. They will be distributed around to those who accepted your offer of help
---[X] Put cyberdevils into the phones of those that need constant personal assistance, to act as minders. Don't use too many (limit to 3 at most)
--[X] Talk to Bob and Order of Cauldron practitioners about anti-withdrawal potions, and how one could bulk-produce them
 
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One more thing you might want to consider, are you leaving Adam as the boss? On the one hand he is the leader of the largest contingent, the ghouls and he has experience with the role, but on the other he is also an old ghoul, he might not be the most friendly when it comes to 'encouraging socialization'.
 
One more thing you might want to consider, are you leaving Adam as the boss? On the one hand he is the leader of the largest contingent, the ghouls and he has experience with the role, but on the other he is also an old ghoul, he might not be the most friendly when it comes to 'encouraging socialization'.
I figured ghat we were the boss and we're appointing people for various jobs?

--[] (Promotion) Institute a system of social credit, where initiative and self-organization are encouraged. The promotions to leadership positions should be based on a mix between competence and popularity, with as many democratic principles as possible
 
I figured ghat we were the boss and we're appointing people for various jobs?

--[] (Promotion) Institute a system of social credit, where initiative and self-organization are encouraged. The promotions to leadership positions should be based on a mix between competence and popularity, with as many democratic principles as possible

Someone still has to be in overall command when Molly is not around and right now it is Adam by default.
 
Suggestions:
1) In regards to feeding - we probably should encourage "done with consent to volunteers who are compensated monetarily and otherwise" behavior from vampires.
2) We definitely should do interviews and background checks, to see if anyone here now (or in the future) is a spy, or someone who intends to do harm to the community (a serial killer / rapist who is either unrepentant or can't control themselves)
1) Every vampire here that's fledged has almost certainly killed someone, intentionally or not.
And its kinda impossible to get consent for things like terrifying people. Its not like sex and lust.
And they arent exactly rolling in cash either.

Thats why Im much more willing to let judgement come into play. At least until we buy the Maggot charm.

At least they are Malvora.
They can go to a horror movie showing showing and browse off the clientele, or stuff like rollercoasters.
Skavis are going to be much harder.


2)Serial killer/rapists dont really have the shame to retreat here.
Survival in this sort of place requires at least some community, and attacking members of your ingroup is a great way to get shanked and left to bleed out in a ditch.

It occurs to me that the spy issue is going to solve itself when new recruits have to meet Molly and try to beat her Perception + Empathy dice pool when Transcendent Lord of Flies + All Things Betray gives her a -6DC buff to social perception.
-8DC if the person is a creature of darkness.
3) As per Uju's idea, added Sarah Greene into looking at the people's details
Not Sarah Greene. Sarah the Diplomat ghoul.
Let her get details from new members; she has a phone, and with the amount we are giving them, they can afford a couple cheap laptops with a tethered cellphone to send those details to Molly for Clippy and the cyberdevils to get crunching on.

We might need to hire private detectives or lawyers in addition to cyberdevil work. Or just ask Thomas to do so for us.

As an aside?
We do need to remember to put cyberdevils in the Chicago police computers and the emergency response system.
Just get the appropriate phone numbers, call and use HMP over the phone.
One more thing you might want to consider, are you leaving Adam as the boss? On the one hand he is the leader of the largest contingent, the ghouls and he has experience with the role, but on the other he is also an old ghoul, he might not be the most friendly when it comes to 'encouraging socialization'.
Thats why we have Ghoul!Sarah to do that.
Thats her job as diplomat/ombudsperson, and most recently person lowest on the totem pole before Molly showed up; she's the person with the most recent experience with how to approach people.

Adam is more the "keep them alive" guy, in an area that still has its own risks.
And in a group thats at least half ghoul and two thirds supernatural, its not currently a demographic issue.
If the veteran is able to keep up, we might get a start on putting mortals in the security arm, but that remains to be seen

When there's more people, and we get a better feel for everyone, we will probably just put someone in overall control above Adam and the other section heads.
But at the moment, its still Adam/Security, Bones/Housekeeping and Lockjaw/Treasury, with Sarah as ombudsperson.
 
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I feel like the "Don't be an asshole" rule is overly vague here, and somewhat SV leaking through.

That rule can work for people who are already well off and relatively homogenous (for starters, all being humans), and so have an easy time both thinking what someone else would consider to be "assholery" and acting on that, particularly when the stakes are low as on SV.

With people of different magical types of nonhuman, some of which (used to) feed on each other, it's going to be much harder. Much of their experience thinking about each other is "threat modeling".
For a new group formed out of different subgroups with different previous norms and goals, it's going to be even harder. It's going to be a while to train them out of judging "asshole" by previous group standards.
For people who have had their lives at stake in a marginal environment for a long time, it's likely going to be even worse than that - people who are raised with "this is going to suck, but the alternative is death" and snap decisions in the face of supernatural predators are going to need time to get in the habit of thinking how to treat that supernatural predator nicely.
 
I figured ghat we were the boss and we're appointing people for various jobs?
--[] (Promotion) Institute a system of social credit, where initiative and self-organization are encouraged. The promotions to leadership positions should be based on a mix between competence and popularity, with as many democratic principles as possible
Nobody has time for this in an 17-person(+ 1 baby) group
Even in a group ten times that number it would be too complex.
And frankly, probably counterproductive; you probably dont want to be picking your security or health guy, say, on the basis of popularity.

I feel like the "Don't be an asshole" rule is overly vague here, and somewhat SV leaking through.
It kinda has to be vague.

Its a general directive, in addition to whatever actual standing orders Molly gives(keep an eye out for whamps, for example)
You cant do minutaie in this sort of situation, just tone and general thrust.
And the community isnt big enough to require US legal code levels of fuckery.

Also, quest.
 
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Current tally:
Adhoc vote count started by uju32 on Feb 4, 2023 at 5:54 AM, finished with 95 posts and 8 votes.

  • [X] Plan "I was made for this" v 1.1
    -[X] Leadership excellency, and others as appropriate
    -[X][Rules]
    --[X]Golden rule. Dont be an asshole
    --[X] (Definition) Molly's people include not just those who serve her directly but also those who are under her protection and any companies that she owns and the things or people that are under her control.
    --[X] (General rules of behavior) Based on guest rights, those who seek Molly's protection should not seek to endanger themselves or others under her protection, should not seek to provoke or endanger others without a cause, should, as they can, work on imrpoving their lives
    --[X] (Feeding/Addiction) Those who have special needs that harm others, are required to cause as little harm to others as is reasonably possible and may only cause permanent harm as a last resort. The exception is combat, where they may use their best judgment depending on the situation. If there is an alternative that does not cause harm to others or themselves, they are required to use that to feed. If at all possible, feeding on volunteers, with appropriate compensation, monetary or otherwise, should be prioritized
    --[X] (Direct employment) Those people who want a direct employment with Molly will be obliged to honestly and sincerely work for the benefit of Molly and her people/Company. They must not betray Molly or her people. They can slack off, but not to the point that Molly and her people suffers for it.
    --[X] (Leaving) If people are unhappy, they can always just leave, Molly will make no move to hold them and give them 3 months time to find an alternative, in which they must follow Molly's rules to avail the protection.
    --[X] (Promotion) Institute a system of social credit, where initiative and self-organization are encouraged. The promotions to leadership positions should be based on a mix between competence and popularity, with as many democratic principles as possible
    --[X] (Meetings) Meetings may be called by three people or Diplomat
    --[X] (Interactions) encourage socialization, helping each other
    --[X] (Exile) If they break the laws, they are kicked out and are no longer under Molly's protection. They may appeal this with Molly who acts as the final judge.
    -[X][Means]
    --[X] Put cyberdevils and Thomas on setting up an official charity with a mission statement of reintroducing those outside of mortal society into it.
    --[X] Provisionally set 50% of the funds we have for this activity. Reevaluate the needed cash on the ongoing basis. Money is handled by the treasurer with the help of cyberdevils.
    --[X] Do a census. Get information about who the people who join are. Have cyberdevils run down their details. Ask Sarah Greene for help too. Interview people with All Things Betray on, and running excellencies as needed to find if there are any unrepentant (or unable to control themseles) serial killers / rapists, or others who are willing and able to do those under your protection harm
    --[X] Gather information on what the people need. Medical conditions, food allergies, who has lice, etc. Get someone to handle bulk purchasing necessary supplies: food, hygienic ones, clothes, heaters for the coming winter, entertainment
    --[X] Check above ground to find closest warehouse that is still an area of urban blight. See about purchasing it for the charity.
    --[X] Ask father Forthill and brother Devisimar if they, or other members of their respectful organizations will be interested in helping and/or ministering to the people in the Underground, under your protection and with your help, including monetary help. Churches have lone experience with charities.
    --[X] Start purchasing cheap but sturdy mobile phones. They will be distributed around to those who accepted your offer of help
    ---[X] Put cyberdevils into the phones of those that need constant personal assistance, to act as minders. Don't use too many (limit to 3 at most)
    --[X] Talk to Bob and Order of Cauldron practitioners about anti-withdrawal potions, and how one could bulk-produce them
    [X]Plan Codex
    -[X] Rules: Governance
    --[X]Golden rule. Dont be an asshole
    --[X][Internal]: Guest right principles towards other members. Disputes adjudicated by mutually agreed arbitrator or random lot drawing of three people. Penalties are financial, duties and restitution where possible.
    --[X][Vampire Feeding]: If necessary, then nonlethal . Exception may be made in fight for ones life
    --[X][Leadership]Election. Meetings may be called by three people or Diplomat. Molly reserves right to intervene
    --[X][Exit Procedures]: At-will, peacefully. Lethal or premeditated harm to a member, or willful subversion of a standing order is grounds for expulsion
    -[X] Other
    --[X][Medical] Medical screening by Molly and Lydia. Free and lowcost clinics for routine care, ER for emergencies. All else ask Molly, including hard to obtain/expensive pharmaceuticals.
    --[X][Reintegration]Have Sarah get personal details from those who want it so we can work on establishing/reestablishing legal ID trail
    -[X]Jade Dogs Financials: $100,000
    --[X][New <Recruits/Infrastructure/Medical/Entertainment> Spending]: $10,000
    --[X][Fund transfer]: $15,000 cash + $75,000 checking account, debit cards with treasurer. $3000 daily ATM withdrawal limit: $90,000.
    --[X][Personal Allowance]: 9x ghouls + 3x Whampires @ $200/month(100 base, 100 hazard) + 6x others @ $100/month: $3000/month
    --[X][Food]: 9x ghouls (x2 multiplier) + 3x Whampires (x1 multiplier) + 6x mortals(x1 multiplier) at 300/month: $8100/month
    --[X][Transport]CTA monthly bus/rail passes for 18: $75x18: $1350/month.
    --[X][Communication]Cellphones: $550/month


Anyone who wants to vote might want to do so now.
Needless to say, I have issues with Yog's plan, or I wouldnt have written my own.
 
[X] Uju32

I like some of the stuff Yog is doing, but it seems way too involved for the level we're playing at right now.

Future proofing is well and god, but trying to engineer complex social systems into a group this size just makes things awkward and clunky.

This is also entirely subjective on my part, but the social credit system bit sounds kind of culty to me.
 
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