Shouldn't the possibility of that make you more keen to investigate?

It might have Plutonium, the Sixth Magical Material in it!

Its special power is cancer.
Well, like... I considered that? But then I thought...
it was six hundred metres underwater at the bottom of a flooded mineshaft that had been intentionally disguised as a shallow lake and had a seal covered in warnings that it wasn't a place where honourable people went
... I know it sounds crazy, but... maybe whoever made this didn't want people getting into the place for some reason? That possibility didn't occur to me at first, but I'm starting to think I might be right.
 
I am consequently less keen about investigating what is under the seal now.

Aleph is so untrusting.

Aleph for some reason suspects that I'd put something in the game which she'd have to put lots and lots of effort into breaking into, and when she successfully did it she'd release something horribly toxic which would poison everything downstream of the site and kill off several major Tengese cities along with ruining fertile soil and generally just making An Teng less useful and productive for anyone [1].

Honestly, some players. So consumed by their paranoia.

[1] Well, anyone who isn't an Abyssal.
 
Look, R2P Abyssal can prove to you, via figures, that her assertion is correct, and an undead population would be more equitable, productive, and democratic than a living population.

She's killing you because it really is better if you're a ghost!

Calesco will try to have a democracy in her lands where all demons are equal and anyone can propose a law and have it voted on and as long as it doesn't violate the fundamental demonic rights of each of her citizens, if they can get support it will be passed.

This will last about as long as it takes for Haneyl to realise she can just have her honestly-not-an-army move into Calesco's land and vote in lockstep, or for Echo to realise that if she leads the szelkeruby to have a party there, they can vote for whatever they like (which will probably be trolling, more sugar, or trolling by voting for more sugar).

And that will basically be the end of democracy in Keris' soul, as Calesco sulkily re-establishes an autocracy and reserves the right to reject the results of any vote she doesn't like.

The moral of this story is that demons are not well-suited for democracy, because higher circle demons will just sway everyone or sometimes just create lots of demons made to vote for whatever they want. Demoncracy, yes. But not democracy.
 
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The moral of this story is that demons are not well-suited for democracy, because higher circle demons will just sway everyone or sometimes just create lots of demons made to vote for whatever they want. Demoncracy, yes. But not democracy.
That's kind of common to all societies made large from Essence users with varying degrees of powers, isn't it? Higher circle demons can just sway the other demons, just as a Solar can easily get whatever he wants voted on if he decides to allow democracy and you'd probably get similar results if the gods ever decided to hold votes, with the UCS getting all of them because he's perfect in everything, which means he's perfect in being a politician so he gets 100% of the votes or something.

The moral of the story is that democracy doesn't work if some people can throw a bucket of dice/successes at convincing the others and it gets even worse if they have actual charms that do more than just add dice.
 
The moral of the story is that democracy doesn't work if some people can throw a bucket of dice/successes at convincing the others and it gets even worse if they have actual charms that do more than just add dice.
This is certainly a convenient excuse a lot of Exalts and spirits are likely to choose to believe.
 
Calesco will try to have a democracy in her lands where all demons are equal and anyone can propose a law and have it voted on and as long as it doesn't violate the fundamental demonic rights of each of her citizens, if they can get support it will be passed.

This will last about as long as it takes for Haneyl to realise she can just have her honestly-not-an-army move into Calesco's land and vote in lockstep, or for Echo to realise that if she leads the szelkeruby to have a party there, they can vote for whatever they like (which will probably be trolling, more sugar, or trolling by voting for more sugar).

And that will basically be the end of democracy in Keris' soul, as Calesco sulkily re-establishes an autocracy and reserves the right to reject the results of any vote she doesn't like.

The moral of this story is that demons are not well-suited for democracy, because higher circle demons will just sway everyone or sometimes just create lots of demons made to vote for whatever they want. Demoncracy, yes. But not democracy.
Calesco: *glumly* "I tried to make a fair, equal and democratic society."
Salina: "Oh, excellent! I knew there was hope for Keris, I'm so glad part of her sees the best in-"
Calesco: "My sisters ruined it." *pouts*
 
Actually, I do feel the need to point out that raising your DMDV value, in 2e, is much easier than raising your PMDV, so ignoring your oppoent's arguments and sticking stubbornly to your point is a mechanically optimal solution. >.>
 
Actually, I do feel the need to point out that raising your DMDV value, in 2e, is much easier than raising your PMDV, so ignoring your oppoent's arguments and sticking stubbornly to your point is a mechanically optimal solution. >.>

This is actually why I think that some of the MDV modifiers in 2e are supposed to apply to MPDV or DMDV separately, because PMDV is always lower than MDV.
 
Would anybody be interested in doing an Exalted civilization/intrigue quest? And by doing I mean 'co-qming' rather than merely playing because I probably need someone to keep me on the straight and narrow (though my chaos quest has actually survived for a while). I'm thinking of combining @Omicron's Exalted forum game system with a combination of @Imrix and @The Laurent 's systems for Kingdom of Ulthuan quest and Behind the Serpent Throne, respectively.

You have a character sheet, based on Omicron's system, and you can choose the kind of civilization you want to start with. You get to choose tribe, in which you're pretty much the supreme ruler right off the bat. Kingdom, in which you're not the ruler, but becoming such is the work of months rather than years, and finally Empire (not the realm). With Empire you will have both a massive empire to take over, but you have lots of actual meaningful opposition to taking over, like other Exalted. Then you would have five categories of action; based on the Solar castes. You get a certain number of influence actions to spend between all of them, and certain actions require greater numbers of influence actions to do. For instance, holding a party only costs one influence action, whereas reforming the military so that it answers only to you requires a great deal more. You're starting influence is based on your stats, and its cap is based on your resources.
 
... I know it sounds crazy, but... maybe whoever made this didn't want people getting into the place for some reason? That possibility didn't occur to me at first, but I'm starting to think I might be right.

Aleph is so untrusting.

Aleph for some reason suspects that I'd put something in the game which she'd have to put lots and lots of effort into breaking into, and when she successfully did it she'd release something horribly toxic which would poison everything downstream of the site and kill off several major Tengese cities along with ruining fertile soil and generally just making An Teng less useful and productive for anyone [1].

Honestly, some players. So consumed by their paranoia.

[1] Well, anyone who isn't an Abyssal.
First thing first: the warning about the un-honorable place made me remember about a MLP FiM fanfic/real life rediation disposal proposal with probably the same premise. (There was a big honking building in the middle of the desert: surpise, It was full of radioactive material from the past!)

Secondly: if the water is the problem, why not take the water away and make a working to stop eventual contaminations of the countryside, and then investigate? If the thing inside is bad and unusable, then you search for a way to seal it up again(maybe in a more secure/less contaminating place than at the bottom of a lake); if it is bad for you but usable/good but not useable by you, you can search for someone inside Malfeas/insert another place here with an interest in that thing; if it good and usable then you found loot!
 
Or I could just cover the plug again and rebuild the false bottom to the lake - which was originally made to hide even the existence of the place.
This lake is not a natural formation. Keris is sure of it. They dug it out. The centre of the lake simply drops off, in a nearly vertical fall which goes down four, six, eight hundred metres. The low bit is maybe fifty metres wide, but... no wonder they made a hillock here. There used to be a barrier perhaps twenty metres from the top, but it's broken. Its debris litters the bottom, along with hundreds of years of sediment.

And the bottom isn't the bottom. Oh, it's a bottom. A bottom which is tens of metres thick. But when she swims deep, deep, deep down - so deep there's no light at all and puts her ear against the bottom, she can hear the things in the white stone at the bottom, below the thick sediment. The hissing things in metal cylinders. The sound of water boiling. The clattering and clanking.
I mean, "eight hundred metres underground at the bottom of a flooded mineshaft with a false lake over the top that anyone exploring wouldn't find any evidence of the old mineshaft in, plus a stone seal 30+ metres thick and covered in warnings to keep anything from breaching it" is, actually, a pretty good hiding place. Draining the place and taking the potentially-explosive nuclear material out would be a major project that would risk contaminating the countryside no matter how careful I was about it.

Better to just seal it up again and make sure the false lakebed won't break this time.
 
But then you won't find the really awesome treasure down there. You know, the ultimate weapon that a E10 Elder Solar hid away for his next incarnation. :)
 
Cunning of them, disguising it as a Shogunate site like that. :p

You never know.

Maybe it's a Solar tomb! With a really nice spear in it.

Sure, they might have put "No honourable dead are buried here. This is not a place to find the champions of old" on the seal, but maybe they were lying! I mean, when you're building a Solar tomb to stop some fuckwit from awakening a pissed off Enlightement 10 hungry ghost, you don't want some idiot breaking in.

(... honestly, a Solar tomb is probably more dangerous than many nuclear waste dumps, if disturbing it risks letting out an Enlightenment 10 hungry ghost. We're talking "unleashing something that could go toe to toe with Ligier and would have a good chance of winning as it's more combat focussed".)
 
(... honestly, a Solar tomb is probably more dangerous than many nuclear waste dumps, if disturbing it risks letting out an Enlightenment 10 hungry ghost. We're talking "unleashing something that could go toe to toe with Ligier and would have a good chance of winning as it's more combat focussed".)
So this would force Keris to *shudder* Join Battle? And then presumibly run away to avoid getting ganked?

... I think this would be a new experience for Keris. Maybe. I haven't read all of the Kerisgame, maybe she already had a similiar experience.
 
So this would force Keris to *shudder* Join Battle? And then presumibly run away to avoid getting ganked?

... I think this would be a new experience for Keris. Maybe. I haven't read all of the Kerisgame, maybe she already had a similiar experience.

She fought an Enlightenment 9 ex-Lunar hungry ghost in a Solar tomb after she stole its armour and its spear.

It nearly killed her. She was basically mote-tapped when she managed to finish it off.
 
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