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An Extra Primarch

Should the Quest switch to a Narrative Base?

  • Yes, it will streamline things.

    Votes: 345 40.6%

  • No, I prefer the current system.

    Votes: 127 14.9%

  • Yes, but not until the Crusade begins/Prologue ends.

    Votes: 378 44.5%
  • Total voters
    850
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Sundered(Noncanon)(+10 to roll of your choice)
  • Sidestory
    • shade argost said:
    So, two omake prompts here, the first which i have more for is a Metroidvania style game called Sundered and it ends up with Hydealyn's first worshippers because she saved their asses from some chaos cult/s, premise is that it's set on a modernish world where they have just had their first such Cult be found (all their psykers before now have been minor latents with a unique personal soul regeneration/healing and cleansing ability, though the cleansing only works if they don't let things in) and have sent people in to try to negotiate without knowing what's going on

    The place is too large and weird by that point to get rid of by normal methods and more are popping up all over the world but humanity is holding out, especially with the help of the Sundered, people who have gone in and maybe come out changed (not all of them make it out but still consistently cause problems for Chaos) but somewhat sane and on their side, though they are slowly going crazy from being made artificial perpetuals and Chaos eating at their minds/souls, one or the other and they would be fine, even recover over time thanks to a quirk of their souls, but not both.

    Serras showing up in orbit and/or on planet really screws up the cults, mostly by dragging the world away from the warp and driving Chaos itself off which means the caverns are no longer shifting/rearranging nightmare realms.
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    Bleargh, wrote this while tired.

    The problem with Serras showing up is that the planet is on the other side of the galaxy, instead Hydealyn finds it and seeds it with crystals.

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    "Shit, shit, shit, shit, why'd I have to poke that bloody swarm for, oh yeah, didn't know it was a swarm and to save some guys" Hi there dear watcher, not, my names Jonac Amar Sundered, that last one is a title as much as a name though.

    "SKREEE" And that is the call of a delightful, not, swarm of monster after my ass, like usual when I get into these things, been fighting these thing for 5 years now, never gets any easier.

    "OH, FUCK OFF ALREADY" "Wumph, wohm" And that's my beautiful blaster going off behind me, killing some of them and propelling me forwards "Take that you assholes", I love that thing, saved my life a number of time

    "RAAAGH" Wait what, oh fuuu, gotta move FASTER!

    "Fizz, Thump" Well fuck, something just hit my shield and bounced off, lets see left, right, left again "WALL!", well shit that wasn't there before, hang on, ledge above, I can reach that, would be a decent place to fire from too.

    "SKREE", "Wumph, wohm", "RAAAGH", "fizz", "GRRRAAA", "BOOOM", well, I'm still alive, found another ledge above me, and they don't seem to see me anymore and the big one's dead, they also don't seem to like coming up here for some reason, can't blame them really, this area feels weird even compared to the rest of it, almost like it's trying to reject something.

    "Right, enough resting, lets go and explore this place" you learn in my line of work to trust your instincts, and mine are saying to find the thing causing this phenomena, because anything they are scared of and/or don't like has to be good for me.

    "Well, this is different" this place is... static, ordered, stable, so different from the rest of the caverns even if they have their own rules it's not like this, I'm closing on the heart of this anomaly within an anomaly, it's very easy in part because it's not shifting around but also there's nothing here stopping me, oh there's are creatures around but they don't get in my way or try to stop/kill me, they seem to have some sort of crystal and/or bone growth on and even in their bodies, there are some which are made of crystals despite how weird that sounds.

    "OH, wow, that's beautiful" I think I'm at the centre of this place and it is amazing, the entire room, which is far to large to fit where it is, is covered in crystals, there's also this bone like stuff growing around the place only it's purple coloured, though I feel as if I'm being drawn to the centre of the place, did I mention that this place is FAR to big to be where it is.

    "CRACK" "RRRROOOOAAAAAA" "OH FUCK" "Weeaan, crack" "REEEEAAAA" "The hell, doesn't matter, it just makes it easier to kill" well I got near the centre, there was a much smaller room there but before I get in one of those giant bastards showed up, course then there was a weird sound and some purple crystals exploded out of its body violently, they made good foot holds that's for sure.

    "Amazing" with that thing dead I could make my way into the room, which was again larger on the inside than it should have been, and doing so was like a breath of fresh air, I felt a scratching at my mind that I hadn't even noticed disappear, only made noticeable by its absence, in the centre was a statue of a young woman who looked nothing like the Dancers forms, she was beautiful in a way that the Dancer wasn't, just the slightest imperfections to make her seem real, probably helped along by the fact that she wore decent clothing unlike the other.

    "Heh, that's a fierce expression there girly" Her face was set with determination but her eyes, they were filled with kindness and sorrow as well as anger, "Hmmm, what's this" the thing that most grabbed my attention though was resting, there was a pile of crystals much like the ones all over the walls, there was even instructions on how to use and make them as well as what they were "Well, thank you ma'am, this might just help A LOT".

    Even to this day I still carry that first Order crystal around with me, I would also later learn that these such places had been found in other cavern systems and that a religion based around the crystals and the woman who gave them too us would pop up thanks to their ability help us fight back and keep us safe, I'd also learn the apparent name of the woman that the statue was made to look like, Hydaelyn, fancy name, kinda like it myself.

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    Well, that came out of nowhere on my end, also Dancer is Slaanesh.
     
  • Sidestory
    • By the way, when we take the Build Ships option, does that mean we devote our attention to shipyards and speed up construction or do we actually just wave our hand and turn raw materials into cruisers?
     
    Shit. What was that cartoon called? Storm riders? They had flying motorcycle like things and they used crystals for everything, on of the main cast was a rhino guy...

    Anyway, that show seems like a great basis for a crystal/hydaelyn omake
     
    Ramble said:
    So human craftworld is out for reasons of real estate value sucking, but what about having it be a navy asset? Less craftworld and more battleship/fleet logistical base/mobile shipyard.

    Like, carrying spare crewmen, spare parts, manufactorum, advanced medical facilities, R&R facilities, civilian contractors providing non-military food, etc . . . spare escort ships maybe?

    Even then, orbital colonies might not be an entirely bad thing just in case something happens to the planet below. There's bound to be enough weirdos who would be fine with life in orbit to bring at least one to minimum operational capacity.
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    Sure. In a lot of ways, Super Space Hulks are this for Orks. Like, it's still primarily a battleship, but it's also a massive cluster of stirkecraft and repair bays.

    A lot of Deathworlds have orbital habitats as centralized nurseries under Bastion rule. Sometimes full hospitals. Otherwise, the space station that serves as a trading hub usually has a viable breeding population simply from the crew.
     
    cheesyme said:
    Actually, I just checked and we were both wrong. It is indeed 50K but the quest in question is The Shape of the Nightmare to Come, which amusingly enough is what inspired Embers in the Dusk. You can find Nex mentioned on TSotNtC's TV tropes page but not on EitD
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    Nightmares was a quest? I thought it was a fic, as its sequal is Age of Dusk in 60k. They are both on 1d4chan and tv tropes.

    60k is even crazier than 50k.

    I might be out of the loop, but can link to show I am not making stuff up, as I might just have misconceptions.
     
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    Embers has the Primordial Sea, which is what made Chaos Chaotic Evil instead of Chaotic Neutral. It's similar though.
     
    Zavvnao said:
    Nightmares was a quest? I thought it was a fic, as its sequal is Age of Dusk in 60k. They are both on 1d4chan and tv tropes.

    60k is even crazier than 50k.

    I might be out of the loop, but can link to show I am not making stuff up, as I might just have misconceptions.
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    You are correct. They are stories. Embers and War of the Krork are quests inspired by them.
     
    ilbgar123 said:
    Sure. In a lot of ways, Super Space Hulks are this for Orks. Like, it's still primarily a battleship, but it's also a massive cluster of stirkecraft and repair bays.

    A lot of Deathworlds have orbital habitats as centralized nurseries under Bastion rule. Sometimes full hospitals. Otherwise, the space station that serves as a trading hub usually has a viable breeding population simply from the crew.
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    Well, I still think Iapetian Titans would be that for humans roughly. In part, because it takes the minerals of an entire moon to make just one.


    Or

    Those things have gravity wells that large, they cause the tide of a planet to rise if they get close enough. Anything bigger would be not practical, as it would destroy the planet's eco-system just by being in the same star system. They are roughly 500km in length and 100km in size and packed to the brim with weapon turrets.
     
    When talking about gravity weapons, the Yuuzhan Vong Star Wars dovin basals, which could be used to de-orbit moons.

    but our own gravity ideas are much better.
     
    plus death-star Anti-hulk stations around moons or built into said moons, just as a way to keep K_rork as well as any other nasties out of the way.
     
    RandomDwarf said:
    plus death-star Anti-hulk stations around moons or built into said moons, just as a way to keep K_rork as well as any other nasties out of the way.
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    Why not just build a Dyson Sphere that focuses all the energy put out by a sun in a direction if needed and otherwhise collects the energy? You could glass entire systems that way. Much easier.
     
    @ilbgar123 could we build a Stargate Network with Subspace technology? That would let us essentially build a Webway in the Materium and Big E wouldn't have to create his own. They would act roughly like the ones in Eve Online (or Mass Effect Gates) and would allow instant travel between colonized systems. That would be a huge defender's advantage in mobility. We could get across the entire galaxy in as much as a couple of days.
     
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    A lot of eldar vehicles and walkers have this upward pointing arrow. Now shield your eyes, here comes the rune for slaanesh.
    Does anybody know the meaning behind all the triangular symbols on eldar vehicles? Does it symbolize good and evil, and if so, do they venerate thier vehicles?

    Also, the eldar have some sick hazard symbols. Definitely going to use those.

    Also number 2, any pictures of the craftworld?
     
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    Nachtigall said:
    I'm pretty sure something like that would be an invention check at Relic or Divine cap.

    That's a few million action points with our current boni (we're currenty at 4k-5k progress per AP), so it would take us centuries to research.
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    Then how about we get to improving our Invention stat to divine? I mean, even then it would be an excellent AP sink that promises massive return so we would obviously sink the points into it. But seriously, once you have subspace-drives, then Stargates aren't that far away. All they do is push you deeper into subspace to make the transit between systems instant. That should be pretty easy to accomplish.
     
    ilbgar123 said:
    In fairness to Moss, civilian ships are never given the same tech and resource investment as military ships unless they're purpose-built for evacuation. It's not impossible the military ships would have Wraithbone and Orichalcix, while the civilian ships (intra-system transports, cargo haulers, etc.) are made of more mundane materials. Wraithbone is hard to make in large quantities. Orichalcix is easier, but it just doesn't have the same durability.
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    Technically even military ships are only partly made out of materials like those. Canonically (or at least according to Gav Thorpe books), Eldar ships (and vehicles and architecture in general) only have Wraithbone as their 'skeleton' with everything else being made of different kinds of psychoplastic materials that aren't actually Wraithbone but can psychically connect with it for data feeds, power transmission and such (although it is common to also have Wraithbone add-ons like extra armor plating).

    I mean there's a reason Eldar Corsairs raid and loot shipping lanes apart for the fun of it and taking trophies/mementos, thus they logically have some use for the materials bulk haulers and such carry (I remember reading Path of the Outcast where a bunch of them raided some random xenos ships and mentioned trading away their contents to Webway trade hubs/cities like the one the protagonist visits earlier in the book for other necessities, because surprise, surprise Bonesingers are rare outside of Craftworlds).
     
    Mossconfig said:
    Ilbgar capped the speed to make warp drives better at strategic movement. Subspace simply dosen't have that ability.
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    Technically subspace-drives are better at defensive warfare while Warp drives are better at offensive warfare. I mean, as long as you have a functioning stargate networn, you can get across the entire galaxy in a matter of days. That would increase exponentially if you don't have a functioning stargate network. With subspace you can warp multiple AU/s in system, so you can get faster from planet to planet. While with the Warp drive you only get to the edge of a system. But how do you mean speed-capped? You can only warp like 1-2 AU/s with battleships in subspace anyway, which is why you really need a stargate network. Warp drives are better at strategic movement in the sense that they can drop out of Warp anywhere. But with subspace-tech you can just light a cynosural field as a beacon for jump-drives to lock on. That would be like instant teleportation, where you directly jump into combat/ between systems without need for a stargate from multiple lightyears away. In that sense, I can see that in unexplored regions, Warp drive would be better, bit then only for Escorts, Subspace simply outperforms the Warp drive in all other regards. It is also less dangerous.
     
    I read a post that said that speed was capped at 11ly per day, at the very maximum that Serras could research the tech. That is far slower than any warp drive.

    True, subspace drives have some advantages compared to warp drives. One could say that they even have a lot of them. I'm not saying that a Stargate/mass relay system is a bad thing, but we simply don't have the tech for it right now. Getting the webway back up and running is a higher priority.

    Edit:I'm trying to get us BSG jump drives, don't tell anybody.
     
    Mossconfig said:
    I read a post that said that speed was capped at 11ly per day, at the very maximum that Serras could research the tech. That is far slower than any warp drive.

    True, subspace drives have some advantages compared to warp drives. One could say that they even have a lot of them. I'm not saying that a Stargate/mass relay system is a bad thing, but we simply don't have the tech for it right now. Getting the webway back up and running is a higher priority.

    Edit:I'm trying to get us BSG jump drives, don't tell anybody.
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    11 LY per day is high end for subspace warpdrives anyway. That still doesn't touch Jumpdrives remotely or even begin discussing the topic of bridging your escort-fleet etc. Also, with stargates you only have to warp intra-system, which would be possible in a couple of seconds through the entire system.
     
    Xela63 said:
    @ilbgar123 could we build a Stargate Network with Subspace technology? That would let us essentially build a Webway in the Materium and Big E wouldn't have to create his own. They would act roughly like the ones in Eve Online (or Mass Effect Gates) and would allow instant travel between colonized systems. That would be a huge defender's advantage in mobility. We could get across the entire galaxy in as much as a couple of days.
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    Nachtigall said:
    I'm pretty sure something like that would be an invention check at Relic or Divine cap.

    That's a few million action points with our current boni (we're currenty at 4k-5k progress per AP), so it would take us centuries to research.
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    What Nacht said. You get decent progress per action, but you can only get so far at once even with maxed Education. You've got 55 Free Invention actions, 369 Majors, which convert 1->4 Invention Actions, and 468 Minors, which convert 1->2 to Invention Actions. That means if you ignored everything else to ultra-pump a single Invention, you could dump some 2467 into it. Assuming 20K per AP (generous), you'd get 49.34 million.

    Hey, getting to Relic would only take two Turns. That's about where you'd start making a stargate system actually useful on a scale larger than intra-planet (because I would kill for the ability to jump to any other point in the country as casually as taking a walk, and so would most cargo companies) instead of very minor improvements of a couple feet per rank. Like, even just significant intra-planet distances would be a massive tactical advantage. Steven Universe Warp Pads would probably be what they'd look like, if with machine guns pointed at them in case someone hijacks it.

    Mossconfig said:
    Ilbgar capped the speed to make warp drives better at strategic movement. Subspace simply dosen't have that ability.
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    Xela63 said:
    Technically subspace-drives are better at defensive warfare while Warp drives are better at offensive warfare. I mean, as long as you have a functioning stargate networn, you can get across the entire galaxy in a matter of days. That would increase exponentially if you don't have a functioning stargate network. With subspace you can warp multiple AU/s in system, so you can get faster from planet to planet. While with the Warp drive you only get to the edge of a system. But how do you mean speed-capped? You can only warp like 1-2 AU/s with battleships in subspace anyway, which is why you really need a stargate network. Warp drives are better at strategic movement in the sense that they can drop out of Warp anywhere. But with subspace-tech you can just light a cynosural field as a beacon for jump-drives to lock on. That would be like instant teleportation, where you directly jump into combat/ between systems without need for a stargate from multiple lightyears away. In that sense, I can see that in unexplored regions, Warp drive would be better, bit then only for Escorts, Subspace simply outperforms the Warp drive in all other regards. It is also less dangerous.
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    Mossconfig said:
    I read a post that said that speed was capped at 11ly per day, at the very maximum that Serras could research the tech. That is far slower than any warp drive.

    True, subspace drives have some advantages compared to warp drives. One could say that they even have a lot of them. I'm not saying that a Stargate/mass relay system is a bad thing, but we simply don't have the tech for it right now. Getting the webway back up and running is a higher priority.

    Edit:I'm trying to get us BSG jump drives, don't tell anybody.
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    Xela63 said:
    11 LY per day is high end for subspace warpdrives anyway. That still doesn't touch Jumpdrives remotely or even begin discussing the topic of bridging your escort-fleet etc. Also, with stargates you only have to warp intra-system, which would be possible in a couple of seconds through the entire system.
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    Right, gonna explain a couple things. The Warp Drive is faster, mostly because it's easier to research. To put it plainly, it's 'Get a workable system' threshold is rendered as a 10 Check in the current system, while even with the subspace expertise provided by working replicators, subspace has a first Check of 250 (as opposed to 500, 50000 in the original system). While this gap is not insurmountable currently, the Astronomicon will make it so, because that particular bit pf psychic tomfoolery will basically increase the speed of Warp travel by an order or magnitude. Subspace is still so much safer that you barely even need a Gellar Field (subspace anomalies are still a thing, but you'll barely encounter Daemons because Subspace is to the Materium what the Materium is to the Warp in terms of psychic energy) and is pretty much guaranteed to abscond with 90% of all merchant/supply ship FTL. Not to mention Subspace FTL caring so little about gravity that, as opposed to Warp FTL, you can literally scrape the upper edge of a planet's atmosphere and jump out, and a star's heat will be a problem before it's gravity will. Even black holes are less of a problem, though the Event Horizon is smaller in subspace, not gone, which certainly contributes because intra-system FTL has never really been a thing in-universe if you aren't a subspace user like the Necrons/C'Tan. Food for thought, Blanks find subspace travel fairly comfortable.

    Pretty sure that 11ly/day cap was before the Skill upgrades. Maxed Education increases all the techs you can research to their next Tier even if you don't use it for them, and the maximum Tier is the Tier your highest Skill used for it is on.
     
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    ok, so the next couple of turns we really need to build up a star-gate system if only to have a back up once the K_ork problem is finished...and then build up the bastion to be able to support the crusade even more massively, even if we have to jumpstart allot of colonies.

    also is it possible for us to migrate humanity from out-flung worlds into the core worlds? So we can condense humanity and thus keep the imperium from having to deal with long-distance travel? it would be helpful if we could also move planets and star systems around...

    the idea of moving all the forge worlds into a sector, and then having star-gates around to give them the capability to insure that their goods is sent to the right place and time? Very Orderly...
     
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