globalwarmth
ruining the weather.
- Location
- Polar ice caps
that sounds like a Zen Koan
A Finely Honed Blade [Worm/Kara no Kyoukai | Garden of Sinners]
...hm. So then just Death I suppose.
Vox De Harlequin
Consequences are for other people
- Location
- Hyalean Theoric World
Except having it was killing him, something which does not appear to be happening to Taylor.
Also, I seem to remember the author outright stating that Taylor had the same origin as Shiki, but I am currently less than awake so I might be wrong.
EDIT: HA! Suck it, disbelievers!
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ensou
Magical G̶i̶r̶l̶ Servant Mordred-chan
- Location
- NEW YORK CITY!??
- Pronouns
- She/Her
...Oh. Yeah, that makes sense.
Except... the way Taylor and Amy interaction was written sounded like a Death and Life duo, which kind of goes against the theory that everything was sprung from 「 」 and everything returns to 「 」. Theoretically, Shiki should be able to create life. It's just that her disposition is toward murder that she ended with MEoDP.
- Location
- Belfast
Scary/Funny idea. The Incubator does a stupid thing and contracts Mana Ryougi. Enter Shiki in full Mama bear mode.no no no! she'll figure a way to stab entropy in the face! (which currently is made of marshmallow and looks like a bunnycat ／人° ‿‿ °人＼ ) That or drill to the root and pump it like an oil rig
Arguably could end better than most PMMM crossovers, since Shiki could probably kill corruption and Touko would be there to
Olive
Silent Princess
Everything dies: Even if they don't want to, they can die at any moment. They'll break down, wear out, exhaust themselves... and leave you.
- Location
- NC
It was interesting to read about Bakuda's final thoughts. I especially liked the part near the end, where she throws her mask and weapons aside and appeals to Taylor's humanity.
Is Taylor's goal to become a leader like Marquis? Carol might die of rage.
I really really hope that at some point Taylor's story becomes public, if for no other reason than to see Emma's reaction to tonight's events. Hearing that Taylor was on the phone with a friend, heard that friend getting kidnapped by the ABB, dropped everything and ran to help that friend, then went on a rampage through the ABB would just burn Emma.
This fic seems really interesting so far, thank you for sharing it with us.
Is Taylor's goal to become a leader like Marquis? Carol might die of rage.
I really really hope that at some point Taylor's story becomes public, if for no other reason than to see Emma's reaction to tonight's events. Hearing that Taylor was on the phone with a friend, heard that friend getting kidnapped by the ABB, dropped everything and ran to help that friend, then went on a rampage through the ABB would just burn Emma.
This fic seems really interesting so far, thank you for sharing it with us.
globalwarmth
ruining the weather.
- Location
- Polar ice caps
with amy as enforcer to boot!
James D. Fawkes
Court Scribe
- Location
- Avalon (Isle of Mists)
Except what you mean here by "Avatar" is actually the same as "concept." In other words, like Scathach became the "concept of victory." You can't kill a concept. It took the World itself unraveling to kill Scathach in Fate/Grand Order. Ea might be able to do it, but since the Land of Shadows is like Avalon and Avalon no-sells Ea, I'm thinking not.
Alternately, you mean "Avatar of a Death God," which would make her like Tamamo-no-Mae, but the only Divine Spirit which canonically has any form of MEoDP is Balor of the Evil Eye, who can possesses the perfected form that can kill with nothing more than a glare, and Balor was killed by Lugh, IIRC.
Technically, dealing with entropy is the domain of the Fifth True Magic. Kinda. Not exactly, but close.
Plus, there's a line in Mahouyo where Touko says, about Aoko sending all of that energy into some random future point, "But you've just increased the burden shouldered by a future humanity!" or something to that effect. So...Entropy might not be something that falls directly under a True Magic?
Actually, no, it falls under the Second, also tangentially. Since Heaven's Feel route in FSN proves that the Second also involves moving energy between alternate realities, entropy technically falls under that umbrella, as well.
- Location
- Wales
I think that counteracting entropy falls under the first true magic, the denial of nothingness, it is sort of like the creation of all things in Naruto, just shaping magic directly into mater instead of just changing the state of something that already exists
Vox De Harlequin
Consequences are for other people
- Location
- Hyalean Theoric World
Pissing on entropy is part of every true magic we've seen, since every true magic has given the user some method to gain unlimited amounts on energy.
Vox De Harlequin
Consequences are for other people
- Location
- Hyalean Theoric World
The way it's explained on the wiki, is that it's not even that.
It is simply saying 'Of course thing X was here, everything is here but thing X is here especially' and having the world listen.
This is probably a really bad explanation, but look up the wiki if you need more.
James D. Fawkes
Court Scribe
- Location
- Avalon (Isle of Mists)
Let's just be completely honest, here. Entropy makes no friggin' sense in Nasuverse, because not only does more energy get added every time a mage casts a spell (because Od is from the soul, which comes directly from the Root, which means energy is not being conserved in any individual reality), but the laws of physics as we know them are "laws mankind has created to shape the surface of the Earth." That they are broken by Servants in Fate/Zero means that there's no way to know exactly how they begin or end in outer space, outside of Gaia's influence.
Strictly speaking, even Denial of Nothingness is not truly "creation from nothing." That is, even though you're not directly transforming energy or matter, you're still expending energy to decide to use it, to decide how you're going to use it, and then to use it. The matter comes from "nowhere," but you're still expending energy to make it. If that makes sense?
No...? Magic is made by injecting Prana into the magical foundation. Spells are specially shaped clumps of ether. That is, simply by casting a spell, you are turning "magic" into "matter."
Strictly speaking, even Denial of Nothingness is not truly "creation from nothing." That is, even though you're not directly transforming energy or matter, you're still expending energy to decide to use it, to decide how you're going to use it, and then to use it. The matter comes from "nowhere," but you're still expending energy to make it. If that makes sense?
Except not really? "The World" is Gaia. True Magic is altering the Root directly. In a manner of speaking, you're right, but not "technically correct, the best kind of correct."
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IIRC, we don't know what the First Magic does. The only thing we know is its name. The notion that it creates matter or whatever mostly comes from a mistranslated/awkwardly translated scene in the F/Sn VN where it looks like Rin's comparing Shirou's abilities to the First (she, in fact, didn't mention any sort of True Magic in the scene), hence "something from nothing". The wiki's also know for hosting fanon here and there.
For my part, I remember reading a theory that pointed out that "nothing", in the context of the Nasuverse, is a big frikin' deal. Anyone on this thread, of all threads, should be capable of catching the implications of what this Nothing is. It would certainly be more impressive than the UBW 2.0 that the more widespread interpretation makes it sound.
For my part, I remember reading a theory that pointed out that "nothing", in the context of the Nasuverse, is a big frikin' deal. Anyone on this thread, of all threads, should be capable of catching the implications of what this Nothing is. It would certainly be more impressive than the UBW 2.0 that the more widespread interpretation makes it sound.
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Vox De Harlequin
Consequences are for other people
- Location
- Hyalean Theoric World
That was ~sorta~ what I meant, but thanks for clarifying that for me.
- Location
- Mountains and rivers
Except mana is specifically an imaginary form of energy and od is life force; without od, a human being would die. Read how they cast from HP.
Sorta.
fallacies said:
fallacies said:
fallacies said:
ensou
Magical G̶i̶r̶l̶ Servant Mordred-chan
- Location
- NEW YORK CITY!??
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I write in Markdown. Pandoc converts it to an ODT for fanfiction.net, HTML for AO3, and then I have a tiny custom Ruby script I wrote that runs over the HTML and formats it so that I can load the file in a web browser and just copy-paste the entire thing into SV's rich-text reply box. Much easier than messing around with BBCode.
I've edited Sever 2.1: Now with 100% less Pandemic Amy, while still having the same great awkward teenage interactions!
...Also the opening scene isn't as different stylistically from the rest of Taylor's narrative, which felt weird to me when I was going over the chapter.
@HymnOfRagnarok, @Ronan O'Brien, @FinalPyre would you mind giving your thoughts on the edits since you brought up the issue(s) when the chapter was first posted here?
EDIT: Sever 2.2's changes are in progress.
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- Location
- North carolina
Well it was Bakuda's pov and she would use kami so...
James D. Fawkes
Court Scribe
- Location
- Avalon (Isle of Mists)
Right, but in order to cast a spell, you have to convert the Od into Prana via the magic circuits - which explicitly are part of the soul - and no matter how you slice it, the amount of Od any individual has can vary from insignificant to average to ridiculously huge without any apparent basis in lineage or ancestry. To whit, Rin and Sakura (pre-worm treatment) both have humongous amounts of Od, even though Tokiomi is, by all appearances, exceedingly average and Aoi...well, we don't really know about Aoi. Tokiomi describes her as having "a bountiful womb," which implies that Rin and Sakura's exceptional nature has something to do with her, but he could just as easily be referring to their large amount of high quality magic circuits.
The question, from whence does that exceptionally strong life-force appear? Though consumption of food and drink might conceivably help in the restoration of expended Od, it would be entirely insufficient to explain the origins of Rin's huge tank. Even if you say that capacity is an inheritable attribute, you must still account for the accumulation of such energy, and material sustenance doesn't work with the numbers. Furthermore, the body and soul are deeply connected, and it's been stated that a materialized soul would have basically infinite magical energy (or at least would recover it at an exceptionally accelerated rate), so it is not a strange thing to imagine that a person's Od is derived from the soul, even if his capacity is a trait inherited from one of his parents. (The wiki says the magic circuits are involved in the restoration of Od, implying the Od comes from the soul and is converted into life-force by the magic circuits, but that is a bit wonky because everyone can replenish expended Od and not everyone has magic circuits.)
Where does the soul come from? Akasha. Even if the soul eventually returns, any energy expended for the purpose of casting magic - for that matter, probably any Od expended for the body's daily upkeep - is added to the universe. Ergo, the rate at which entropy increases is affected with each life that is born on the surface of the Earth.
For that matter, I'm not sure what you're trying to clarify or dispute, here. Magical energy being "imaginary" doesn't mean it would simply disappear. My point was about how Od, Mana, and magical energy in general would have an effect on entropy to some degree.
First, defying entropy isn't Magic, it'd be magecraft, because entropy is just a statistical law anyway. It's hypothetically possible for entropy to randomly reverse, it just never happens.
Second, Denial of Nothing is "無の否定", which to me reads more like a denial of void. Rather than the creation of matter, it's more likely to be the creation of concepts and the arbitrary application of attributes.
True Magic definitely isn't going to modify the Root, because the Root is timeless and anyway if that were the case you couldn't "pull down" a Magic. Magic is far more likely to just be "things outside the Common Sense of Gaia".
Lastly, prana has almost nothing to do with energy. Energy is a facet of Gaia's rules of the world; prana is more like a measure of "processing time". The only reason it costs more prana to generate more energy is that randomly creating more energy is a greater defiance of Gaia. Neither energy nor entropy are real.
Second, Denial of Nothing is "無の否定", which to me reads more like a denial of void. Rather than the creation of matter, it's more likely to be the creation of concepts and the arbitrary application of attributes.
True Magic definitely isn't going to modify the Root, because the Root is timeless and anyway if that were the case you couldn't "pull down" a Magic. Magic is far more likely to just be "things outside the Common Sense of Gaia".
Lastly, prana has almost nothing to do with energy. Energy is a facet of Gaia's rules of the world; prana is more like a measure of "processing time". The only reason it costs more prana to generate more energy is that randomly creating more energy is a greater defiance of Gaia. Neither energy nor entropy are real.