Dragging on shouldn't be too much of a risk, because X is already on a definite timer and answering the question of what happens to her when she "dies" is an appropriate stopping point. The looming City thread is "Overthrow the Head", I just don't think a narratively satisfying amount of progress can be made on that in the final act with the time left. Though if we stay in Mitakihara, I'm not sure how the stakes can be risen again in a natural way. I know Lepi wanted to face us off against a peer pinnacle for the final act...
“Human Resources” Shouldn’t Be This Literal: A PMMM/ProjectMoon Quest
- Thread starter Lepidoptera
- Start date
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- Tags
- library of ruina lobotomy corporation project moon puella magi madoka magica eldritch horror magical girl crossover eldritch protagonist female protagonist fluffy gore non-human protagonist suffering violence discussion is always good civ good decisions identity crises nuclear moth detected parenting powers activate
[x] Stay in Mitakihara
Because I wanna focus on The Childes, and figuring out "Uh yeah, friendly question, what the F U C K is a Mark of Qliphoth!?". We know it's important, and probably how The Daughter stabilizes itself enough to stave off Ruin, but the specifics of it? What sort of equivalent Realizations exist for Lilith and Gomaliel and Tagimron and all the others? It is unknown.
The City is important, yes, vital even! But It is an importance that can and has waited, despite everything. It is one that I believe can wait a bit longer, until X has all her ducks in a row and can wield her full authority without compromising her Shell.
Because I wanna focus on The Childes, and figuring out "Uh yeah, friendly question, what the F U C K is a Mark of Qliphoth!?". We know it's important, and probably how The Daughter stabilizes itself enough to stave off Ruin, but the specifics of it? What sort of equivalent Realizations exist for Lilith and Gomaliel and Tagimron and all the others? It is unknown.
The City is important, yes, vital even! But It is an importance that can and has waited, despite everything. It is one that I believe can wait a bit longer, until X has all her ducks in a row and can wield her full authority without compromising her Shell.
Lepidoptera
Mother of Monsters, Unverified Impuritas Civitatis
- Location
- Indeterminate Unknown
Act 3 will be the end of this story no matter what, it's just a matter of what happens in it. X's mental state and self-image always has been and always will be the central conflict of this story, this is just a matter of whether or not the City will be involved in that conflict. As Suleverf brought up, there's still a couple different timers hanging above X's head. Two and a half weeks until Walpurgisnacht, and around a year before her physical integrity breaks down and she turns fully into an Abnormality. Whether the City gets involved or not, these will be the deadline.
- Location
- N/A
Prisoner's Dilemma is fundamentally flawed; it cannot account for power imbalances in its players to my knowledge, which prevents it from accurately simulating the kinds of interactions that lead to exploitative practices.
[x] Stay in Mitakihara
- Location
- Nowhere
Why tho?
There is no fear. I trust you, Lepidoptera. Let's walk to the city and win.
[X] Explore the City
Also, I think we don't have a lot in encounter of Mitakihara
[X] Explore the City
Also, I think we don't have a lot in encounter of Mitakihara
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Power imbalances doesn't change the reality of life not being a zero sum game.
Also, didn't remark on it before but:
This is a false premise, *I am a susbset of everyone, therefor improving everyone's condition improves mine* doesn't require someone to be a hardline utilitarian.
I'm not a hardline utilitarian, yet I still think I would benefit from improving everyone's life, simply because making life better around me means life is better around me, and I live around me, strangely enough.
Gatcha, meaning, no end of story since it would stop the money, among other things.
Still thinks the city is very unnecessary, it is too likely to lead to too many plot bloat too easily.
Like, we have barely interacted with the gaggle of magical girls we sent to the library, have not talked to NT since we beat her, I am sure there is more than enough in Mitikahara and the library without risking any interactions with the head or things like it.
- Location
- Earth
Personally, Project Moon has earned enough goodwill to wait and see on that. The way the story is set up, there is an organic end point in it.
And also, if they keep producing quality content like they have so far, I will not complain about getting more of it. Seriously, Limbus Company delivered far, far beyond expectations for its current runtime. And they somehow keep one-upping themselves.
questioningmeme
Just be yourself
- Location
- River of Light
With NT, I'm sure we can ask for it the next time we get to visit Angela.
Before this, CENSORED, WN, etc were more important for our quest to understand our nature.
Even the assumed "NT" colors we got recently were apparently..."War"?
Dunno who that's supposed to stand for out of Apocalypse Bird itself.
With the gaggle of magical girls...
Well X wants to spend time with her friends and family more. I mean, between voting to interact with them or to interact with say, Netzach, Geburah, Binah, or Angela, I'm sure everyone would choose our friends and families over the girls who are...basically strangers.
There is an advantage to their storytelling I suppose.
Since having 12 "main" characters means that they are free to write a stupendously long story without a need to keep the length down.
I can't imagine getting such the intensive multi-part story of Limbus without it being a live-service honestly.
It's like the One Piece in that sense I suppose? If the story is decades long, and the world is as big to match it, is it really a story with "no end" or is it just a really big world they have to build?
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I am extremely skittish about this kind of situation, sure, the company has no problems now... but they could attract the attention of shareholders, and the moment they sell, the studio's as good as dead.
That happened to Bioware around the time of Mass Effect, that happened to Blizzard when they fused with Activision, that is the reason Call of Duty is the same game recycled every year since the creators of the franchise where kicked out of the studio after making Modern Warfare 2 so their boss could take advantage of a clause in the contract that gave the studio control as long as said creators where still working for them....
And even the best can end up making bad games, just look at Redfall, or to a lesser extent, Deathloop (so much squandered potential for this game).
That's isn't really a change to my point that we have a lot of things we can do without ever involving the city though....
Edit:
That reminds me, here is another reason I don't like live service:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqrVdTacPSg
As long as it is still possible for games to be removed from access just because the studio doesn't want to pay the server, I will not be a fan.
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questioningmeme
Just be yourself
- Location
- River of Light
That is a big question. But I feel like not enjoying the current because of the fear of a potentially "bad" future is a bit sad tbh.
Mind you, I'm talking more about the story, and not the game itself. You don't really need to engage with the game itself to enjoy the really well written story of Limbus Company (definitely up there with the best of PM stories imo).
Personally speaking, I'd tell you to not invest too much into a gacha game. Even if PM is a bit more generous than normal gacha games.
You can go F2P or invest a minimum amount of cash to make yourself a Fish or a Dolphin, but at the end of the day, it's still a gacha game.
The game is fun mind you. Really fun. I would recommend trying to stick to the F2P route instead of trying to get any IDs if you try it out.
Since the game is balanced around base IDs with its content. And grinding as a F2P player isn't too bad either.
I don't think Lepid or any of the other Mita voters are trying to make a case for the City. It's mostly just presenting the options and showing an alternative path so we do know that it is possible.
And the Madoka exclusive path is winning anyhow.
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There are other factors than the pure *potential bad future* and two of them are inherent to Gatcha by its very nature.
First factor is that I don't tend to like too much randomness... or, more precisely, I do not like randomness I cannot manipulate inherently in the game system or outside because I get very interested in some particular strategy and want to try it (without having to pay).
For example, let's see... I am currently playing a tabletop named Kingdom death: Monster intensively, you control survivors that can have philosophies that decides a number of things they can do in it.
I have no problems with the fact that you can't have all the philosophies in a game normally (you get only part of them each campaign) but it doesn't change the fact that I am going to simply choose the tier 3 (the *bests* you get, but you only obtain one of two) myself instead of drawing it randomly because I took a peek at what the two were and fell in love with this one while feeling *meh* at the other.
My favorite collectible card game is also VTES for the simple reason that due to the game being out of print, players are very accepting of proxies (cards you printed yourself), meaning if I want to try a stupid deck I made myself, I can simply print it. (And I make my deck lists to manipulate the odds of having the correct cards in hand, by the way).
I can't do that in a gatcha, if I want to try a special stupid strategy, I have to hope I pull the correct character, and probably won't because those are made to prey on this kind of behavior.
The second factor it simple time:
I don't have time to watch a thing that long, the way my attention works means that I will either do only that or not at all, and if I want to play a game that will last 400 hours, I want to be finished after it.
But I think we talked enough about all this, and this is getting off topic.
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questioningmeme
Just be yourself
- Location
- River of Light
Do note that you can literally just shard characters you want without having to rely on the gacha pulls.
It's one of the main reason Limbus is seen as "generous". You can just grind for an ID without needing to engage with the gacha system.
Images are broke.: You need not worry.
Except as they said, they don't have the time to do so. Shard grinding is not a fast affair, and you need to reach the end of the battle pass before they start really pouring in. And that's just for getting the ID's you want, there's still leveling and uptying the ID's so they work the way you want them to.
But yes, this is getting off topic.
questioningmeme
Just be yourself
- Location
- River of Light
Fixed it.
Strange that I've seen so many broken images these past few days.
Blame Discord. They've recently implemented a new policy preventing the usage of the service to host files. Discord file links shared outside of Discord automatically expire after a certain amount of time.
I think the implication is that, due to power imbalances, sometimes there's no [game-theoretic] reason to cooperate, because the other person simply has no ability to influence your "end" of the payoff matrix. Basically, if someone's moral patiency is literally defined by the extent of their ability to reciprocate in prisoners dilemmas, then it follows that people irrelevant to your ends don't deserve consideration at all. Case in point, in this very chapter, it's pretty clear the de Baviere girls would've been happy to leave Madoka in a mental torture chamber, had the implied threat of X not been around to loom over them. And obviously it's not that convenient for everyone. Isn't that state of affairs, I don't know, kinda fucked up?
I know there's all sorts of epicycles to add to this, like second-order reputational effects, or a Rawls-style veil of ignorance, but I think the basic arguments against them remain the same.
...Very very sympathetic to this, though. Bloat is awful.
Regarding sequels, I don't even like Library of Ruina's plot that much, for me it is mostly carried by its awesome gameplay. And these things only ever go downhill, so, uh, I can commiserate with the concerns about Limbus.
I'm still voting City here because the option being there at all indicates that the QM's got something cooked up, and I can't in good conscience pass that up.
[X] Explore the City
Lepidoptera
Mother of Monsters, Unverified Impuritas Civitatis
- Location
- Indeterminate Unknown
I apologize for the lack of substantial content in the past few days, I've just been going through some things regarding my writing and it's been making it difficult to put together even some simple scenes. I promise I'll get things back up and running in just a few days, though. If the next chapter's a little simple, that's why.
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Why though?
The city's hell, at least we can be in a pleasant place by staying in Mitikahara.
And more importantly, the problem of the city is that as soon as it is introduced as a place we are going in, it is likely to eclipse the PMMM part of the crossover entirely.
questioningmeme
Just be yourself
- Location
- River of Light
What? You don't enjoy the amazingly depressing architecture of a hopelessly dystopian backstreet?
"Look Kyoko, that guy is gonna get eaten by mechanical cannibals come midnight because he's a homeless person."
Their explicit cuisine?
"Look Mami, those locals are selling Fried Human Nugget samples at a discount for tourists!"
Their wonderful culture?
"Wow, I never knew we would look this dour and sad without color."
Their amazing environment?
"Damn, this beach is trashed, mom. You call this a vacation spot?"
I'll say that we should totally visit the City. It looks like an amazing vacation spot
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Lepidoptera
Mother of Monsters, Unverified Impuritas Civitatis
- Location
- Indeterminate Unknown
You're forgetting, X is technically a Wing Founder's daughter. She would at least get the nice beach.What? You don't enjoy the amazingly depressing architecture of a hopelessly dystopian backstreet?
"Look Kyoko, that guy is gonna get eaten by mechanical cannibals come midnight because he's a homeless person."
Their explicit cuisine?
"Look Mami, those locals are selling Fried Human Nugget samples at a discount for tourists!"
Their wonderful culture?
"Wow, I never knew we would look this dour and sad without color."
Their amazing environment?
"Damn, this beach is trashed, mom. You call this a vacation spot?"
I'll say that we should totally visit the City. It looks like an amazing vacation spot